An important addition needed - a realistic View

[machscnel]

With all the talk lately about what will/won't be added to GT5, I thought I'd put my ideas out there and see if they were held by others and if so, Polyphony might take notice.

My only real "problem" with GT5 Prologue is the lack of a realistic view. I still love playing the game, don't get me wrong, but a feel a simple addition is needed - a new view. In my opinion, this new view would be similar to those seen in Toca Race Driver 3 and more recently Supercar Challenge.
Basically, when the view is selected you see the top of the dash (you do not see the steering wheel), the front window and then the bonnet. I feel this view would be the most realistic, or atleast more realistic than the following _

In-car view - Wierd seeing the steering wheel in my lap, and then again on my screen
- Seems like your sitting too far back

Bumper view - Seems much too low

Roof view - Too high

3rd person - Do I need to explain?

So how to you guys/girls feel?

 

[Watevaman]

It'd be a great addition, and I don't know why they couldn't include it.

Thinking about it, I don't know why views are hard to add anyway, seeing as everything is modeled already and it would just be about camera placement.

 

[machscnel]

I never thought about it like that, but if that is in fact the case then the idea sounds like it could work. Even something similar to GTR2, where you can adjust your seat to whatever view you like

 

[Dave A]

I understand where people are coming from wanting views like that but from personal experience I don't like the camera right up to the windscreen because you only see whats directly infront of the drivers side. You lose too much peripheral vision and judging where the corner of the car you can't see is mch harder. Personally I have no issues seeing the track and hitting an apex with the current in car view which I have always preferred over a close up one. Also seeing the steering wheel on screen has never been a distraction to me. That said I see no reason why PD couldn't include two in car views or just allow you to adjust the camera position manually as machscnel suggested.

 

[slipp3h]

I use the sixaxis so seeing the steering wheel has never bothered me, but I don't see why they wouldn't add this.

Personally, the only "realistic" addition I'd like to the cockpit view is a little shake. It's far too static to appear realistic, I hope they add something like that but I HIGHLY doubt they will. I can't see damage being added either, the GT world is just too "perfect" to accommodate it

 

[kekke2000]

In-car view - Wierd seeing the steering wheel in my lap, and then again on my screen
- Seems like your sitting too far back

I think you sit far back because you squeeze in the mirrors on a flat TV. You could have a higher field of view but that would be unrealistic and harder to see in the distance.

 

[Jay]

I understand where people are coming from wanting views like that but from personal experience I don't like the camera right up to the windscreen because you only see whats directly infront of the drivers side. You lose too much peripheral vision and judging where the corner of the car you can't see is mch harder. Personally I have no issues seeing the track and hitting an apex with the current in car view which I have always preferred over a close up one. Also seeing the steering wheel on screen has never been a distraction to me. That said I see no reason why PD couldn't include two in car views or just allow you to adjust the camera position manually as machscnel suggested.

What Dave said word for word 👍

 

[Tenacious D]

I've been harping about driver views for a few years now, but more from a "what suits the player" than anything. I think all racing games should implement something like a four region set up like this:

Hood/bumper view
Cockpit view
Roof view
Chase view

And then give the player some basic parameters to set on how the camera behaves, whether fixed forward along the car's axis, free floating and how much, directable so you can peek around curves if you want and so on. This would give every player the driver view that suits them best. I think cockpit view would benefit from this the most, because most games look like you're driving from the back seat, Prologue included, sadly. I've really been grouching about this recently because I'm struggling with Ferrari Challenge, and the only reason is because they're using the same old driver views from the 90s, and I'm getting tired of it. I hope Polyphony implements my suggestion, otherwise I have a feeling Turn 10 might pounce on it.

 

[eMke3]

I don't see why PD couldn't add this to the full game. That could probably be added to the game within hours, a day longest to perfect it. I personally don't care much about that view, but it would make some players more happy. And that equals to more $$$ to PD so why not make both parties more happy.

 

[Dave A]

Well I don't think it would reallt equal more $$$'s to Polyphony really, they might sell a handfull of extra copies at most because of it, which wouldn't be enough to fund a couple of guys wages and work costs for a day. But a feature like that I should imagine would only need to be built from scratch once, I can't see it requiring complex code that would make it hard to convert for the GT on the PS4 if and when that happens. It should be done, not because it will sell more copies of GT5 because the chances are that it won't, but because it shows that they are catering for the gamers more.

 

[eMke3]

You would be surprised what little things make people buy and not buy games. For example I knew a couple of people that didn't buy GT4 because of some pretty silly reasons. One of them didn't buy it because there was no e30 BMW which he expected to be in the game, and other person didn't buy it because there was no interiors which for some reason he thought it would be in. So believe me there are some loopy people in the world. While I'm sure the view option wouldn't make a huge impact on the sales, It would give player more choices and make it a better game overall.

 

[Jay]

Well if thats the case PD have to include every tiny thing so everyone will buy it, if someone doesn't buy it because it doesn't have the E30 then they are not interested in the game in the first place.

 

[Tenacious D]

It should be done, not because it will sell more copies of GT5 because the chances are that it won't, but because it shows that they are catering for the gamers more.

It depends. Like eMke3 says, people do hard to comprehend things. We are an odd race. One area where it might make an impact is the review reaction, either from a reviewer or a friend. Suppose a reviewer at a fairly respected source like IGN is amazed at how the driver view suddenly made the game come alive. Like, being able to situate the cam behind the wheel so that the view of the road isn't like something from the back seat, but panoramic and immediate, so that he could tell where his wheels were landing. The same with a friend gushing to another, inviting them over to check it out. Maybe like me, they find another view that makes them go, "Wow... this is what it's all about."

That was my reaction to GT4. Now, every game has to compare to it. Ferrari Challenge is a marvelous game, but the driver views just kill me. I can't take curves comfortably, and that's the biggest obstacle of racing to me. All the wonderful physics in the world is worthless if I feel like I'm driving with one eye closed or looking through a fogged windshield. And I found the same thing in Prologue when I took a car around Suzuka from chase view, it was a struggle.

So it depends. It might influence 500 people, or it might influence 500,000 or more, we just never know.

 

[Fredzy]

I think the in-car view they have in GT5P is pretty good, but machscnel has a good point about seeing two wheels at once - it can throw me off a little. There should be a view with and without. Maybe for the no-wheel in car view, allow an optional wheel icon like the one in GT4 that tells you where the wheel is. That's more of a reference that never interferes with my judgement.

The in-car FOV can feel awkward but I'm used to it and can't see it getting too much better. Only other thing bothering me with in-car view is that there seems to be a tint to the windows. I like things bright as can be.

 

[Patrik]

With all the talk lately about what will/won't be added to GT5, I thought I'd put my ideas out there and see if they were held by others and if so, Polyphony might take notice.

My only real "problem" with GT5 Prologue is the lack of a realistic view. I still love playing the game, don't get me wrong, but a feel a simple addition is needed - a new view. In my opinion, this new view would be similar to those seen in Toca Race Driver 3 and more recently Supercar Challenge.
Basically, when the view is selected you see the top of the dash (you do not see the steering wheel), the front window and then the bonnet. I feel this view would be the most realistic, or atleast more realistic than the following _

In-car view - Wierd seeing the steering wheel in my lap, and then again on my screen
- Seems like your sitting too far back

Bumper view - Seems much too low

Roof view - Too high

3rd person - Do I need to explain?

So how to you guys/girls feel?

!?!?!?!?

The in-car view is very good, except you can't remove the driver and the steering wheel.

I have no idea what you're talking about concerning the roof view.

I have even less understanding in what you're saying about the 3rd person view.

However, the only view to use when playing a racing sim is the in-car view, so I dont even get why you mention the others. Sounds on you like there is a law or something about how views in racing games have to be made???

Only other thing bothering me with in-car view is that there seems to be a tint to the windows. I like things bright as can be.

I also thought about this, but I think it's pretty realistic with the tint. One thing I would like PD to add though, is reflections in the windshield. Look at iRacing for example, looks too damn hot when you can see the dash and stuff reflected in the windshield.

(screenshot by Gabkicks in this thread)

 

[Raitziger]

in happy with in-car-view but in-game wheel rotation does not match to what you are turning with 900 degree wheel.

 

[GT]

I´m fine with the in/car view, best there is as far as i am concerend.

Yet some things are missing such as 900 degree rotation in/game with matching hand movements!

Please make the driver shift manually with his fingers if he´s in a car with paddle shifters! I mean come on, you gotta do this seeing as the F1 car already has that feature!

less robotic arms, make them more human like

When shifting in a manual car make the arm go down and instead of a simple tug at the gear lever, make the drivers arm actually move the gear stick coresponding to the pattern of the vehicle!

that´s about it I guess

 

[ajprice]

I'm going to do something now that doesn't happen often, refer to something in a NFS game as a good idea. Here goes!

NFS Shift - http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=209088

But by far the most definitive feature of Shift is found during its in-car view. Unlike the comparatively sterile cockpit of Forza, Shift attempts to emulate the effects of g-force and vision blur.

As your motor accelerates the game recreates the feel of g-force by subtly tilting the camera backwards. Slam on the anchors and your camera 'head' will jolt forward. It's a simple but effective way to further immerse you in the experience. At speed the interior starts to blur out, as your focus sharpens on the road ahead.

I think thats a good idea, the in car camera is your head, with the view affected by jolts and g forces.

 

[Fredzy]

I'm going to do something now that doesn't happen often, refer to something in a NFS game as a good idea. Here goes!

NFS Shift - http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=209088

I think thats a good idea, the in car camera is your head, with the view affected by jolts and g forces.

A neat idea, but I think my head bobbles around enough as I sit playing in my den haha. Maybe a tiny bit would be OK but I'd hate for it to get annoying.

 

[Zathra5_]

I don't find the in car view realistic at all. It restricts your field of vision way too much. Pay attention when you are driving one day. What can you clearly see when you are driving? You can't clearly see the ceiling of the car. You can't even clearly see the speedometer unless you actually move your eyes down. In GT5P in car view, you barely have to move your eyes at all to focus on the either the ceiling or the speedometer. Until we get VR goggles or huge rap around monitors, any point of view will be a compromise. Different people will think that different compromises are better than others. I personally like the bumper cam since it gives me a much better field of view than in car. The new dash view in SCC may work well for me as well.

 

[machscnel]

I don't find the in car view realistic at all. It restricts your field of vision way too much. Pay attention when you are driving one day. What can you clearly see when you are driving? You can't clearly see the ceiling of the car. You can't even clearly see the speedometer unless you actually move your eyes down. In GT5P in car view, you barely have to move your eyes at all to focus on the either the ceiling or the speedometer. Until we get VR goggles or huge rap around monitors, any point of view will be a compromise. Different people will think that different compromises are better than others. I personally like the bumper cam since it gives me a much better field of view than in car. The new dash view in SCC may work well for me as well.

I'd have to agree with you mate. There's not alot Polyphony (or any console developer) can do to make the views that much better. I, like you use the bumper cam view simply because it's the closest to what I actually see when driving. As you say, I dont see the roof, steering wheel, tacho(don't see why you have to see this in game anyway) etc.

And yes, the new SCC view does look very good, it seems like your head is positioned exactly where it should be, and the whole screen is nearly clear of any interior features, all you see is the very top of the steering wheel.


http://forums.eutechnyx.com/index.php/topic,449.0.html

 

[Patrik]

I'm going to do something now that doesn't happen often, refer to something in a NFS game as a good idea. Here goes!

NFS Shift - http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=209088

I think thats a good idea, the in car camera is your head, with the view affected by jolts and g forces.

The head is already moving a little backward and forward in GT5P, it's more than enough. As for blur effetcs? C'mon they're arcadish as hell...

 

[JDMKING13]

Blur effects 👎 I have no problem with GT5P Interior view, however it would be cool if they let you adjust your view in the interior view so everyone could be happy

 

[homeforsummer]

I wouldn't have a problem with PD implementing the view being discussed, but I disagree that it's the more realistic view than the current first-person view.

When you're driving you do see the steering wheel, your dashboard etc, albeit in your peripheral vision. PD's current driver-view is simply replicating the peripheral vision as well as the "tunnel vision" view, your main focus watching only out of the windscreen.

I think that where you currently sit in the car is quite realistic. It does vary from car to car too, for example, in the tiny Cappuccino you sit quite close to the wheel and the cockpit feels more cramped, as you'd feel in the real car.

 

[Zathra5_]

I wouldn't have a problem with PD implementing the view being discussed, but I disagree that it's the more realistic view than the current first-person view.

When you're driving you do see the steering wheel, your dashboard etc, albeit in your peripheral vision. PD's current driver-view is simply replicating the peripheral vision as well as the "tunnel vision" view, your main focus watching only out of the windscreen.

I think that where you currently sit in the car is quite realistic. It does vary from car to car too, for example, in the tiny Cappuccino you sit quite close to the wheel and the cockpit feels more cramped, as you'd feel in the real car.

Yes they are in your peripheral vision and on your TV they are not (or much less so). Thus it is unrealistic. The byproduct of this is that unimportant stuff like your ceiling is taking up space that could be used for more important things like the track.

 

[Squasher]

Yes they are in your peripheral vision and on your TV they are not (or much less so). Thus it is unrealistic. The byproduct of this is that unimportant stuff like your ceiling is taking up space that could be used for more important things like the track.

If you sit really close to your TV you'll find that the current cockpit view is perfect. The track is your focus with everything else in the car in your periphery as IRL.

People complaining about seeing two wheels and incorrect hand movements would find it far better aswell as when I drive I dont notice my wheel and actually have to move my eyes (like in real life) to see my mirrors and tacho.

The only problem I can see with this method is if you have a SD TV it will probably look ugly the closer you sit and you won't be able to see details in the distance

 

[MGR]

There is no "bumper cam" point-of-view in GT5P.

 

[homeforsummer]

Yes they are in your peripheral vision and on your TV they are not (or much less so). Thus it is unrealistic. The byproduct of this is that unimportant stuff like your ceiling is taking up space that could be used for more important things like the track.

Not really. Because the POV is further back, you get a wider field of view of the circuit, so really you see more.

I do okay and I still use a 14" CRT TV, so people claiming they can't see enough doesn't really cut it.

 

[Zathra5_]

The simple fact is that you have a bunch of unnecessary stuff blocking the view, therefore you are seeing less. I don't care that you do ok with a 14 inch screen, that isn't what this is about. We are talking about having a more realistic view. All views are a compromise including (especially in car). I don't care if you like in car better or not. The fact is that it is a compromise and not realistic.

 

[JDMKING13]

Just bought the tuned viper, and while i was driving i notice my vision more focused on the road. I think it was because of the front windsheild sticker. I really enjoyed the tuned viper interior view while driving 👍