I have no idea if this is against the rules, but I feel that this is an important statement made by Rory Alexander (Eerieissss Youtube) to Kaz. It is open and honest about the state pf play, and I personally agree. I do not bash this game, I have played it since GT1, and will continue to do so. I do not hate post anywhere, but this is a statement which should not be ignored, and perhaps this community can get behind it.
An open letter to Kaz and Polyphony
- Thread starter adrianh33
- 171 comments
- 16,041 views
Silver Arrows
(Banned)
- 4,715
- Brandon, MB
- Silver-Arrows21
I wonder how this is going to play with the people who try to Baghdad Bob things and say that everything is alright, that the game is selling well and that many of the problems are being blown out of proportion by supposed bad faith actors and fly by nighters.
- 1
- United Kingdom
Couldn't agree more with you and Rory on this Adrian. While there are indeed a lot of issues with the game, I feel things have gotten especially bad since the change was made to the penalty system. I am still encountering appalling levels of racecraft and behaviour that is being allowed to continue through lack of penalisation for contact - it is quickly becoming unplayable.
I sincerely hope, if PD will not take Rory up on his offer, that they take heed of his words. There needs to be an open and constructive dialogue about the issues GT7 is experiencing at present and PD need to show us that they are listening and commit to communicating with us. Otherwise, this game will soon die.
I sincerely hope, if PD will not take Rory up on his offer, that they take heed of his words. There needs to be an open and constructive dialogue about the issues GT7 is experiencing at present and PD need to show us that they are listening and commit to communicating with us. Otherwise, this game will soon die.
- 115
- United States
Near everyone agrees that there are some problems that PD have been slow to fix. This video highlights them, stop trying to bring the same discussion with you in every thread.
Silver Arrows
(Banned)
- 4,715
- Brandon, MB
- Silver-Arrows21
The issue is that you can apply this to more or less the vast majority of problems the game has. This video talks about the Sport Mode side of things, but you can easily apply the crux of the video to the lack of significant single player content, or especially to how Polyphony straight up do not have a plan in place in order to outline what type of content is coming to the game other then vague promises, even vaguer patch notes, and the occasional car silhouette posted by Kaz.
And there is a very vocal group of people on this forum who seem to believe that pointing out this fact is tantamount to somehow bullying Polyphony - forgetting that their lack of desire to broadcast what needs to be fixed with the game has been the case since GT5, really, and is by this point incredibly deliberate, and in a world where people are very much expecting clear and honest answers in how a game is going to be fixed in the short and long term, this sort of silence and staying the course with dripfed content is actively pushing away people from playing the game, on both the high and low end. Nor does it really eliminate the elephant in the room that many of the legacy problems with the franchise have not even been attempted in being fixed, and even if the problems with GT7 in the current time frame are fixed, it's just going to expose those legacy problems and invite further scrutiny.
- 1,777
- Florida, USA
I think with PD unfortunately this will be taken as a low humming noise in the background, a few months ago we had the luxury of so many new players because of the game release with YouTube channels to beat the drum loud enough that PD listened, but most of those players weren't diehard players have likely moved on. Don't think will ever get that communication with PD that people want that other developers give.
Jewel Runner
(Banned)
- 141
- United States
Like they are going to listen to a low grade YouTuber like him. They'll never know he even exists. They hardly even listen to Super GT or any of their own floating heads.
- 3,768
- London, Ontario
- voodoovaj
I agree with him. Also, it goes beyond that, regardless of the apologists will say. The reality is, this product SHOULD be better. It could be better with ease. Literally a few clicks of a mouse. Something as simple as allowing custom races to have chili pepper difficulty...that has to be no more than a day of work. They aren't actually making any new features, so, I will say it again, WHAT have they been doing?
If what we have is the total output of that team, the team count has to be miniscule. It's a thinly veiled reskin of a game that was, by their own account, lacking the features to be a full numbered title.
Good luck to him. I don't think that he will get an honest response, or any real action. I've tried to get somewhere (in the past) through connections and it has been fruitless.
I get how ROI works. Money in versus return on investment, but what is lacking from this game could be rectified with a handful of people. It smells of low manpower everywhere. It smells of accounting efficiencies. It smells of an absentee game director (if they actually have one) and of "design" by committee.
Again...I hope someone listens.
If what we have is the total output of that team, the team count has to be miniscule. It's a thinly veiled reskin of a game that was, by their own account, lacking the features to be a full numbered title.
Good luck to him. I don't think that he will get an honest response, or any real action. I've tried to get somewhere (in the past) through connections and it has been fruitless.
I get how ROI works. Money in versus return on investment, but what is lacking from this game could be rectified with a handful of people. It smells of low manpower everywhere. It smells of accounting efficiencies. It smells of an absentee game director (if they actually have one) and of "design" by committee.
Again...I hope someone listens.
- 1,743
- Aussie
- Tassie_tiger
I remember when one of the PD team began posting on the official SONY forums quite a few years ago. It seemed like a positive step forward. It lasted for a very short period of time.
It's how PD operate, love it or hate it.
I doubt it will ever change, or if it does, it will happen very slowly.
Most of us who have been around long enough know this to be the case.
Expecting change, knowing it will probably never happen, at least not in sudden huge leaps and bounds, is a fools game.
Just telling it like it is.
It's how PD operate, love it or hate it.
I doubt it will ever change, or if it does, it will happen very slowly.
Most of us who have been around long enough know this to be the case.
Expecting change, knowing it will probably never happen, at least not in sudden huge leaps and bounds, is a fools game.
Just telling it like it is.
That's the thing, some people sarcastically reply to criticism with "I'd like to see you do better" but I really don't think I'm tooting my own trumpet when I say yes, I could. So could you. So could countless people on this forum. Not on our own of course, but if I/we were in charge of the 300 staff members of PD I genuinely believe I/we could have formulated a better GT7, in the same timeframe, with the same budget, working from the same base of GT6 and GTS.
Why? Because a lot of the issues the game has is down to choice, and a lot of the features missing ALREADY EXISTED. They've just taken them away and/or regressed. It's not down to lack of money, manpower or skills. I'm confident PD do have a lot of very talented programmers. The problem is what they've been asked to do. Program garbage like the roulette, program the numerous FOMO systems, a billion scapes, and so on.
Would my version of GT7 make as much $ for Sony as Kaz's? Probably not, because it'd have no MTs at all for one thing, of course, but it'd be a damn better game for the playing public, I'm pretty sure, and it'd sell like hot cakes.
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- 3,768
- London, Ontario
- voodoovaj
This is true.
I am going to say it again, because the evidence points to it. They did not have 300 people on this game. NO WAY.
The pandemic force many industrial shut downs. Large companies had cost overruns in places, and lost profits. I am sure Sony is not different. GT7 provided a golden opportunity to make a minimal investment, knowing that the game will sell regardless.
The cars were outsourced to India, so that's not a dev team task. Remove the cars, and what did they add that could have required 300 people?
Widebodies didn't require 300 people. 2 people tops
The economy is 1 person
Physics - a small team. Maybe 10-15 people
Menu art - 5 people max
There no new game play aside from the missions (maybe). So 1 game play programmer and some implementers (maybe).
And then, there are the removed features like ghost cars.
I'm not confident of this. What they likely have is ACCESS to programmers that are a part of SIE, and maybe tasked with many other game features.
Ubisoft and EA work like that. People get shuffled from project to project as the needs increase and decrease.
Ya, it depends on how you measure it. Gran Turismo's consistent quality carries it for 1-2 titles later, if not more. But, it doesn't take much to poison the well that they keep going back to.
Hopefully, there's some high level meetings happening about getting the game back on track. I suspect that they'll have a Spec 2.0 or something just in time for the release of FM.
- 183
- Vietnam
Even though what he says is true, I find this video ridiculous honestly. First of all, quoting Winston Churchill to start a statement about issues in a video game, dramatic much? Secondly, everything he says has been said a million times over since release. Im listening and he doesnt say anything new nor does he come up with any new suggestion, everything has been chewed up before. Lastly, "we tweeted, texted,bla bla......now its time to send a letter"....Polyphony get 100s of emails a day probably, he is making it so dramatic as if he is putting his foot down, he is going to show them.
Then he mentions his size on Youtube how its bigger than most so he hopes he will be heard because others have a smaller voice. I glance over to his sub numbers...47K subscribers lol. I can name you 5+ other YTers that have a way, way, WAY more bigger presence and voice for GT than this guy. He just sounds too dramatic and talks as if without him writing a letter on behalf of the community, nothing will change because for sure Polyphony will notice him.
Then he mentions his size on Youtube how its bigger than most so he hopes he will be heard because others have a smaller voice. I glance over to his sub numbers...47K subscribers lol. I can name you 5+ other YTers that have a way, way, WAY more bigger presence and voice for GT than this guy. He just sounds too dramatic and talks as if without him writing a letter on behalf of the community, nothing will change because for sure Polyphony will notice him.
- 2,099
- Zimbabwe
Scapes.
Yet not one of the bigger GTubers have leveraged their platform to do anything. Publicly at least. What a ridiculous take.
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- 175
- United States
Completely agree. Makes the GT community look a bit cringe. May want to stick with single player.
- 1,743
- Aussie
- Tassie_tiger
This particular YouTuber recently quit their job in favour of full time content creation on the back of the Gran Turismo series.
Does he have you and me as players in mind, or perhaps his wallet also?
I'm not detracting from any reasonable points he may have made, but every time I've recently watched his streams, within 5 minutes he mentions the amount of likes, the amount of viewers, the the amount of subscribers, or all 3.
And that's not an exaggeration, so I don't bother watching anymore.
Each to their own, but not for me.
Needless to say, I stop watching that video rather quickly.
As I mentioned, PD, who is almost inseparable from SONY, couldn't keep up appearances in an official SONY forum.
A 50k YouTuber pretending to flex his muscles means next to nothing.
- 2,404
- The failed experiment entitled “California”.
Idk...
I find it heartfelt, and somwhat spot on... but I also find it 50% self serving as well. As a regular watcher of Rory's stream (same for Kie and Tidge), the only one who even gives single player content the slightest nod, is Tidgney. The rest of the lot, all they talk about is the online stuff because surprise, surprise... that's how they make their living. For the most part, they are fairly passive with he other problems that effect the MAJORITY of the player base; because it really doesn't affect how they play the game. This stance the youtuber's have, also somewhat proves my other estimation that the VAST MAJORITY of the GT7 playerbase, is unaware or unphased by the issues in Single Player Mode. The only people who care, are the very small minority of posters on the Twitter's, and the other various forums. This also further tells me that the lion's share of tweaks to GT7, will have to do with Sport Mode, because youtube and Twitch is where this game gets the most post-launch exposure. No one streams single player content anymore.
Then why do I find it a tad self-serving?
Because OF COURSE he wants to be THE GUY that gets to talk with Kaz and "offer" his services. Rory could only dream of that kind of exposure. The fact of the matter is, like many other GT7 streamers, their views are starting to slide because GT7 kind of sucks sllab at the moment. He has a direct vested interest in this, because is livelyhood depends on it. If he would have mentioned the Single Player Content problems in this view; which does get talked about in the chat from time to time.... then I would be inclined to take this video and his letter more seriously. But as is, and under the current GT7 climate, I feel like at least 1/2 of this is under the guise of him portraying to be some sort of GT7 savior.
I find it heartfelt, and somwhat spot on... but I also find it 50% self serving as well. As a regular watcher of Rory's stream (same for Kie and Tidge), the only one who even gives single player content the slightest nod, is Tidgney. The rest of the lot, all they talk about is the online stuff because surprise, surprise... that's how they make their living. For the most part, they are fairly passive with he other problems that effect the MAJORITY of the player base; because it really doesn't affect how they play the game. This stance the youtuber's have, also somewhat proves my other estimation that the VAST MAJORITY of the GT7 playerbase, is unaware or unphased by the issues in Single Player Mode. The only people who care, are the very small minority of posters on the Twitter's, and the other various forums. This also further tells me that the lion's share of tweaks to GT7, will have to do with Sport Mode, because youtube and Twitch is where this game gets the most post-launch exposure. No one streams single player content anymore.
Then why do I find it a tad self-serving?
Because OF COURSE he wants to be THE GUY that gets to talk with Kaz and "offer" his services. Rory could only dream of that kind of exposure. The fact of the matter is, like many other GT7 streamers, their views are starting to slide because GT7 kind of sucks sllab at the moment. He has a direct vested interest in this, because is livelyhood depends on it. If he would have mentioned the Single Player Content problems in this view; which does get talked about in the chat from time to time.... then I would be inclined to take this video and his letter more seriously. But as is, and under the current GT7 climate, I feel like at least 1/2 of this is under the guise of him portraying to be some sort of GT7 savior.
- 261
- Kratos_Q8
not if we vote with our money .. im 100% sure atleast 50% of player base now wont buy gt8 on release if we keep paying them blindly nothing will change for sure
- 1,743
- Aussie
- Tassie_tiger
- 1,372
- Serbia
- Warlock__SRB
...now that you menion GT5, man, it was awesome game compared to what we have now., and compared to what it was promised by Kazunori-san and PD...
Cheers...
- 2
- United States
Made an account so I could bump this thread. A few of you should learn what "ad hominem" means.
I don't know all the GT content creators out there. There's Super GT, Jimmy Broadbent, and then after them, I have no idea who's next. Rory could very well be the 3rd biggest, but I'll say this - Rory's a really genuine guy. I think he really loves Gran Turismo, much like a lot of us who grew up on it, and he wants better for the game. So do I - he just happens to actually have a voice big enough to where it might be heard. It's not all about the exposure. You can want better for something and also could not care less about what you stand to gain or lose from it, but even if PD ignores him (and by extension, us), it doesn't hurt to try. Plenty of folks quit before they even walked through the proverbial door of something because they didn't even try. You can't bash someone for trying.
The fact of the matter is, GT7 could be so much better than it is, and it wouldn't take a rocket scientist to make that happen.
I don't know all the GT content creators out there. There's Super GT, Jimmy Broadbent, and then after them, I have no idea who's next. Rory could very well be the 3rd biggest, but I'll say this - Rory's a really genuine guy. I think he really loves Gran Turismo, much like a lot of us who grew up on it, and he wants better for the game. So do I - he just happens to actually have a voice big enough to where it might be heard. It's not all about the exposure. You can want better for something and also could not care less about what you stand to gain or lose from it, but even if PD ignores him (and by extension, us), it doesn't hurt to try. Plenty of folks quit before they even walked through the proverbial door of something because they didn't even try. You can't bash someone for trying.
The fact of the matter is, GT7 could be so much better than it is, and it wouldn't take a rocket scientist to make that happen.
- 3,768
- London, Ontario
- voodoovaj
Scapes are photos. Sending people around the world to take photos does not require a dev team.
It's the same feature as GTS, and the titles before it. The photos themselves could have been bought from Getty Images and it would not have been much different.
It might require like 1 person to actually make sure the feature works and that person is probably the same person who does the rest of the menus.
- 1,743
- Aussie
- Tassie_tiger
This may or may not surprise you, but here in Australia, it cost me basically the same price to purchase the PS1 on release as it did the PS5, and it also cost basically the same price to buy GT1 in 1998 as it did to buy GT7 in 2022.
Communication hasn't changed ... couldn't care less.
Forced to buy micro transactions ... says who??
Half finished game ... Sure, maybe. Depends on your point of view. But GT7 has a lot more to give in it's life time, than what it has in it's current state 3 months after release.
Will GT7 on PS5 be a better game than GT1 on the PS1? Yes, unless you have some obscure point of view.
Sorry, but from my stand point, I struggle to see the issue.
