Attack in London.

[suv139]

http://www.cnn.com/2015/12/05/europe/london-tube-stabbings/index.html

Terror attacks seem to be happening a lot more often now, it sadly isn't even shocking anymore at this point in time.

 

[W3H5]

http://www.cnn.com/2015/12/05/europe/london-tube-stabbings/index.html

Terror attacks seem to be happening a lot more often now, it sadly isn't even shocking anymore at this point in time.

While it is being treated as a terror attack and probably rightly so, it seems more like one angry person pissed off about the Middle East situation than it does an organised militant attack.

Knife crime is incredibly high around London and while this kind of thing certainly seems to be politically motivated it pales in comparison to knife crime that is drug or gang related.

Still, I wonder how long it takes before more people become inclined to use acts of violence both for and against the citizens of London as a result of the Middle East crisis and rising tensions among cultures, ethnicities and religions.

 

[ECGadget]

Shoot. That was my local tube station at one point. Really hope the three (?) stabbed are okay.

That being said though, is it being classed as terrorism because the man shouted 'this is for Syria'? Or because of something else. Reason I say this is because over the years there have been crimes in East London far worse than that, and the stories my father has told me about some of the incidents he responded to were a lot worse than three people being stabbed, but they were classed as GBH and the like.

From the Britain thread.
On another note, #YouAintNoMuslimBruv is trending around social networks. As much as I am a more 'correctly spoken' Londoner, that phrase which was yelled out whilst the male was arrested was brilliant and its use has done three things in my opinion:

1) Undermined the whole idea of terrorism from 'Muslims' in the UK because we ain't falling for that BS from the Daesh.
2) Showed that the UK communities are far closer to each other and can stay that way despite some differences which are to be correctly respected by all.
3) Comined with "Calm the **** down", shows we're jammy little sods, aren't we.

Personally though, as @W3HS said, taking away the motivation, this is nothing compared to what happens in some of the London boroughs. East London has some pretty rough areas around Leytonstone, such as Wanstead Flats and even Holloway a couple of miles down the road where this thing happens a lot. I know from experience. Wrong place at the wrong time and may not come back. Some people I knew didn't, all in one back street attack.
We need to take a hardline approach to knife crime, and whilst I know that the Met have these days where of you surrender your knives you won't be charged with possesion of a lethal weapon, incidents like these which are far more common and widespread than the news leads you to believe need to stop.

On a final note: politically motivated attack = terrorism now? How our definition has been skewed. Also, I think we may be able to merge this with the Britain thread, I don't think it needs, nor warrants, a seperate thread.

 

[W3H5]

Just as a bit of something to thing about I have a scenario.

Let's say I get back to London next month and I'm so disgraced with the way things are going in my home city I decide to borrow my brother's car, drive it into a crowd of Muslims outside the East London Mosque, just up the road from me, and then jump out with some kind of weapon and lay siege to the street. Would I be considered a terrorist as a white British male, born and raised in London?

 

[ECGadget]

Just as a bit of something to thing about I have a scenario.

Let's say I get back to London next month and I'm so disgraced with the way things are going in my home city I decide to borrow my brother's car, drive it into a crowd of Muslims outside the East London Mosque, just up the road from me, and then jump out with some kind of weapon and lay siege to the street. Would I be considered a terrorist as a white British male, born and raised in London?

I hope so? Hypothetically speaking anyway. If you do that I shall find you and beat you with a phone book.

But seriously, under the definitions you should be classed as one, right? I would say it wouldn't matter if you did that in Whitechapel or Trafalgar Square, it would still be terrorism?

 

[W3H5]

I have no intentions of violence, for the record.

I just wonder what kind of spin would be put on it by the media. The guy in London just seemed like a pissed of guy, I wouldn't personally have labelled it a a terror incident without knowing more about it. An attack certainly but terrorism, I don't know. Perhaps I'm unaware of what constitutes a terrorist.

 

[ECGadget]

I have no intentions of violence, for the record.

I just wonder what kind of spin would be put on it by the media. The guy in London just seemed like a pissed of guy, I wouldn't personally have labelled it a a terror incident without knowing more about it. An attack certainly but terrorism, I don't know. Perhaps I'm unaware of what constitutes a terrorist.

I was joking about the phone book xD
That's the confusing part, I wouldn't have classed it as terrorism and I still wouldn't. I would have him charged for GBH, possession of an offensive weapon, attempted murder. Maybe it is being treated as such as a way to get harsher sentences on the fellow (which he deserves. I think the justice system here is too weak now).
On another note, interesting to see that the arresting officer was not SO19, but a Leytonstone constable, who happened to be Muslim. I do wonder if the officers gave him that arrest to make a point.

 

[TenEightyOne]

I was joking about the phone book xD
That's the confusing part, I wouldn't have classed it as terrorism and I still wouldn't. I would have him charged for GBH, possession of an offensive weapon, attempted murder. Maybe it is being treated as such as a way to get harsher sentences on the fellow (which he deserves. I think the justice system here is too weak now).
On another note, interesting to see that the arresting officer was not SO19, but a Leytonstone constable, who happened to be Muslim. I do wonder if the officers gave him that arrest to make a point.

It could be coincidence if he was first-responder.

 

[ECGadget]

It could be coincidence if he was first-responder.

Asked my dad how it works, whether it is the armed officers who arrest or the first responder. My dad (who would have been most likely assigned to this call had he still been an officer) said in a situation like that it goes to the officer who either wants the arrest or is told to make the arrest. I was under the assumption that it may have been a first-responder, like you said, but that's not the case apparently. 👍

 

[TenEightyOne]

Asked my dad how it works, whether it is the armed officers who arrest or the first responder. My dad (who would have been most likely assigned to this call had he still been an officer) said in a situation like that it goes to the officer who either wants the arrest or is told to make the arrest. I was under the assumption that it may have been a first-responder, like you said, but that's not the case apparently. 👍

Looking at the video it's two plods who arrived first, I think the counter-terrorism involvement was after that fact. BBC. There certainly isn't the armed cohort around the suspect that I'd expect in a full-on CT arrest.

 

[ECGadget]

Looking at the video it's two plods who arrived first, I think the counter-terrorism involvement was after that fact. BBC. There certainly isn't the armed cohort around the suspect that I'd expect in a full-on CT arrest.

Either way though, good on the Met here for a clean arrest! And unintentionally, the arresting officer has put out a message I believe.
Also, haven't heard the word plod for yonks. They don't use it up in the Midlands!

 

[W3H5]

It was also quite interesting to hear somebody in the region of whoever was filming it, or perhaps the man who was filming it, shout "You ain't no Muslim, bruv!" showing that are people who understand what is what according many of the points you've made in the Islam thread, @ECGadget.

It was interesting to note that the same video show how ineffective the police Tasers are, seeming to malfunction or misfire somehow. Lucky them officers in the Met do wear stab vests.

 

[ECGadget]

It was also quite interesting to hear somebody in the region of whoever was filming it, or perhaps the man who was filming it, shout "You ain't no Muslim, bruv!" showing that are people who understand what is what according many of the points you've made in the Islam thread, @ECGadget.

It was interesting to note that the same video show how ineffective the police Tasers are, seeming to malfunction or misfire somehow. Lucky them officers in the Met do wear stab vests.

Yes, I am really glad that people are able to differentiate between what is what. But it was concerning that the tasers did not deploy properly but it could have been to do with the fact the man was moving around in an erratic fashion and they couldn't get a clear shot. But like you said it is good that officers wear stabproof vests. Also a good thing that uniforms have drastically decreased in weight over the years to allow better movement too.

 

[TenEightyOne]

It was also quite interesting to hear somebody in the region of whoever was filming it, or perhaps the man who was filming it, shout "You ain't no Muslim, bruv!"...

...which has become a top-trendy-internet-type hashtag, #youaintnomuslimbruv. BBC.

 

[ECGadget]

...which has become a top-trendy-internet-type hashtag, #youaintnomuslimbruv. BBC.

lol, mentioned that in my post this morning. Strange to see that trending all day. But also somewhat funny to see that the NY Times had to explain what 'bruv' meant

 

[Com Fox]

I wouldn't call this a terrorist attack and more of a temper tantrum gone overboard.

Though this has become so routinic (is that even a word) it is hard for me to feel anything other than a shrug. It is definitely sad that people are getting hurt though.

Very proud of those "You ain't Muslim" chants, makes me restore faith in humanity as they aren't pointing fingers at Muslims.

 

[TenEightyOne]

Muhiddin Mire has been found guilty of attempted murder. BBC.

 

[ECGadget]

Good. We do not need people like that on our streets. I see he denies attempted murder, I'm not sure what he thought attacking someone with a knife in that fashion would do...

 

[prisonermonkeys]

I'm not sure what he thought attacking someone with a knife in that fashion would do...

"Honest, y'honner, it wasn' attempted moidah. I was jus' wavin' me knife about, practicin' me fencin' for the Rio errlympicks when the silly bugger walked straight into the path o' me epée sixteen times. And then 'e turned around and walked backwards into it anovver nine."

 

[TenEightyOne]

"Honest, y'honner, it wasn' attempted moidah. I was jus' wavin' me knife about, practicin' me fencin' for the Rio errlympicks when the silly bugger walked straight into the path o' me epée sixteen times. And then 'e turned around and walked backwards into it anovver nine."

Eeh, where is Dick van Dyke nowadays?