Beater or Sleeper? COTW Forza 7 Week:END The Ultimate Sleeper, The Holden Sandman! Thanks Everyone!!

[Nacho Libre]

Mmm, a rather bland car in a rather bland track ribbon, I guess they are both beaters.

 

[Vic Reign93]

here’s your 24hr heads up for the end of this weeks time trial. 👍

 

[Drex124]

I knew I was forgetting something but I didn't know what.
Sooo.... add 2 seconds as a late fee?

Lovely car though, it's still one of my preferred cruisers in Horizon.

 

[Vic Reign93]

View attachment 755690

I knew I was forgetting something but I didn't know what.
Sooo.... add 2 seconds as a late fee?

Lovely car though, it's still one of my preferred cruisers in Horizon.

Only because of the low turnout that your time is being accepted, with those 2 seconds added.

Ok, here they are.

@Vic Reign93 1:18.846
@Drex124 1:21.804
@Nacho Libre 1:24.421

Upside, Nachos on podium.

For this week I decided on a well proven thoroughbred for this week, which’ll be taking place at the VIR Full layout, just not the thoroughbred you might be thinking of.

The car in question..

Is The 2016 Ford Shelby GT350R!!!

The classic Shelby GT350 name is brought back with a vengeance on arguably the best 21st century production Mustang model IMO.

Powered by a 5.2 Flat Plane crank V8 (codenamed Voodoo) built exclusively for the GT350 models, it’s chucking out 526hp and 429ft-lbs of torque.

With track focused suspension, extra aerodynamic tweaks and carbon fibre wheels (The first of its kind from a major manufacturer for a mass production car.), The GT350R has the bite to back up its very loud bark.

A pleasure to listen to, but will it be a pleasure to drive or will it be overcome by its nature to find a nearby crowd?

Best of luck people. 👍

 

[Thomas2012]

Handling wise you wouldn't think you were driving a mustang but nor a muscle car. With gears wider than VIR it feels somewhat sluggish compared to what you would expect from all that track work and tuning on a 'stang given the Shelby name. I myself was expecting a fire breathing straight line machine but got a tame horse which has a very high top speed but you'll probably never reach it. Due to it's great stability I'd vote it as a sleeper, but it's not so powerful straight line kick I'd vote it as a beater. Probably neutral for this one 👍

 

[MalibuClub]

I never though I'd like this car so much on this track. Those light chicanes, so much fun. I'd say it's sleeper.

 

[Nacho Libre]

Not a track demon, but it can go 155 mph all day with no problems. Very good stability, grip and brake power just good, no excessive understeer, I like it. SLEEPER.

 

[Vic Reign93]

Breaking the 2:00 minute barrier was my goal for this week.

The GT350R was everything I’d expected from it, agile, easy to drive and just plain fun.

Revving the V8 out to over 8000rpm never gets old and the fact it’s got a capable chassis and suspension setup is just the cherry on top.

Verdict: Sleeper 👍

 

[Vic Reign93]

Here’s your 24hr reminder to get your times posted for this week. 👍

 

[Vic Reign93]

Ok here’s the times for this week, apologies for the later than normal post.

@Vic Reign93 1:59.529
@Thomas2012 2:00.490
@Nacho Libre 2:04.998
@MalibuClub 2:06.449

Good times from all.👍

This weeks pick has an identical twin, only difference is the colour and the number.

It is..

The 2016 Subaru WRX STI VT15r Rally Car!!!

Both the blue #75 and the red #199 models are allowed for this event as they are identical from a mechanical standpoint.

Both weigh a class mandated 2,900lbs, both have 2.0 litre Flat 4 Turbo’s with class mandated restrictors pegging the power to 330hp and a rather mighty 480ft-lbs of torque.

With close ratio 6 speed gearbox’s and 4wd, acceleration is the order of the day with these machines, just note that the 480ft-lbs of torque does drop off rather quickly at higher Rpms so knowing when to shift will serve you well here.

The track for this week is the Alt Full Circuit layout at Lime Rock Park, a tight and technical track perfectly suited for a rally car.

Best of luck people. 👍

 

[Obelisk]

Hey, everyone! T10 is bringing back the old leaderboard system as "Time Attack".

Guess we all have an easier time now getting into the cars and running them.

 

[Nacho Libre]

Hmm, now I'm really confused how to do it... without homologation parts the Subaru goes from R820 to A668, which would place it into the A lobby, but it would not be competitive there... Or we still could race it in Free Play as usual I guess...

 

[Obelisk]

Hmm, now I'm really confused how to do it... without homologation parts the Subaru goes from R820 to A668, which would place it into the A lobby, but it would not be competitive there... Or we still could race it in Free Play as usual I guess...

During the FH3 days, we had people inexplicably place in the top 50 if not higher in full stock cars.

Right, @Vic Reign93?

 

[Vic Reign93]

During the FH3 days, we had people inexplicably place in the top 50 if not higher in full stock cars.

Right, @Vic Reign93?

I think it was the case with the F40 IIRC, might be one or two other examples as well.

 

[Obelisk]

I think it was the case with the F40 IIRC, might be one or two other examples as well.

Didn't Populuxe get top 50 with the Infiniti coupe we looked at?

 

[Vic Reign93]

There’s a trick to this car, don’t rev it all the way out to redline, instead shift up between 5–6k rpm to make use of the low down torque.

Given it’s a rally car with what I assume not a proper tarmac setup, it’s handles ok, but a small amount of handbrake can help get the nose turned in.

A fully derestricted version makes 600hp and a mind blowing 873ft-lbs of torque, which is 44ft-lbs more than the total torque output of a Porsche 918 Spyder at 829ft-lbs.

As a stock machine, it and it’s twin are more suited to the world of Horizon, but aren’t exactly terrible here either.

Verdict: Neutral

 

[Nacho Libre]

Was this in a free play race or in time attack mode? Asking for a friend

 

[Vic Reign93]

Was this in a free play race or in time attack mode? Asking for a friend

That run was in free play race, But as long as the cars stock and you’re on the right track, I don’t see any issues running in time attack either. 👍

 

[Vic Reign93]

Here’s your 24hr reminder folks, get those times up, don’t leave me up on that podium all alone now.

 

[Nacho Libre]

It's a neutral for me. Understeer is a challenge in the chicanes of Lime Green, but grip and torque are huge. I have to try it in Laguna Seca!
BTW, free race and Rivals are separate leaderboards.

 

[Obelisk]

I was going to run a time but I'm so rusty that I locked the tires on the very first turn and gave up.

Next car, I'll make an honest effort to get on track and set a time.

 

[Vic Reign93]

Only two times this week, at least it ain’t one time.

@Vic Reign93 1:03.150
@Nacho Libre 1:05.026

2 High performance machines this week and we’ll start with an often forgotten American supercar.

Introducing...

The 2004 Saleen S7!!!

Built by a company that tuned (Still in the tuning business?) Ford Mustangs among other Fords, Saleen decided to build a supercar to represent America at the time.

Powered by a 7 litre Ford Windsor V8, It’s chucking out 575hp and 570ft-lbs of Torque which is sent to the rear via a 6 speed manual gearbox.

Thanks to its aerodynamic designs,(I’m assuming with the optional Competition package.) it supposedly could create its own weight in downforce at 160mph.(Around 1,300kgs worth.)

If 575hp and an estimated top speed of 220mph wasn’t enough, you could get a twin turbo version starting on the ‘05 models with 750hp and a quoted top speed of 248mph.

Still not enough? the ‘06 Twin turbo models could be had with the Competion package which cranked it to near as makes no difference 1000hp with optional front splitter and rear wing package.

While searching for info on the S7, I chanced upon an article which talks about the origins of the S7 and while the story itself is disputed from all the parties involved, it did allegedly involve the other car in this weeks line up.

Speaking of which...

It’s The 1989 Aston Martin #18 Aston Martin AMR1!!!

Here’s the article in question, but just note that the dispute between the involved parties means you should take it all with a pinch of salt, but I was surprised that of all the vehicles I picked, these two would end up in the same story. https://jalopnik.com/the-mysterious-disputed-birth-of-americas-greatest-sup-1675129620
(Worth a good read at the very least.)

The AMR1 didn’t have the greatest race record with a best ever finish of 4th place in the 7 races it entered, including the 24hrs of LeMans where one car dropped out and the other finished 11th overall.

Powered by a Callaway built 6.3 litre V8, it chucked out 720+hp (740 in game) in its version II form and weighed just under 2000lbs overall.

With a 5 speed manual gearbox handling the power, The AMR1 awaits for its chance at redemption in the virtual world.

I was originally gonna have both cars run at tracks in their respective countries, But then decided to have them invade each other’s country instead.

So the Saleen S7 will be driven at the Grand Prix layout of Silverstone in the dry and the Aston Martin AMR1 will be at the Grand Prix layout at the Circuit Of The Americas.

As long as british tea isn’t dropped into Boston harbour by the Americans(again) and the Brits don’t try and burn down the White House(again), this crossover event will be smooth sailings.

Best of luck people.

 

[Nacho Libre]

COTA? Argh! Oh, well, an excuse to test the new track limits there, which at this point I'm finding to be great!

 

[Drex124]

^wot he said.

I will forever be disappointed that we don't have any of the twin turbo versions of that Saleen. And no, whacking the twin turbo upgrades on it doesn't even get it to the 750 mark. 👎

 

[Obelisk]

Still in the tuning business?

Still around, I believe.

 

[Thomas2012]

Sadly haven't had much time to participate lately. Found some for the Saleen at least. Last time I was able to get my hands on one of these was back in Gran Turismo 4! so it was in ways almost a reunion of sorts. The car felt pretty solid lapping around Silverstone, the powerful V8 pushes through it's wide gear ratios with ease albeit not able to top out I'm sure it could (somewhere), handling wise was good to alright with a bit of under steer but very manageable with plenty of mechanical grip from it's huge tires. Overall I wouldn't have any comparisons as I surprisingly haven't really driven many S class cars but I could expect surprises from what it's capable of. With slight tuning it'd be a real monster for sure so I reckon I'd put it as a sleeper just leaving the neutral stage. Oh and what a body it has!

 

[ClydeYellow]

Ah, I knew that story was going to come up eventually... I may take the Saleen for a spin later, but for now I decided to focus on the shiny, new toy.



The Group C era has, perhaps more than any other era of motorsport, given us some sad stories of heartbreak, wasted potential and "what could have beens". The poster-child for this is probably the Lancia LC2: developed and raced "on the cheap", the Martini-liveried prototypes were often faster in qualifying than the much more pedestrian-looking Porsches, but their poor reliability constantly forced them on the sidelines. But even more soul-crushing is the fate of Aston Martin's ambitious foray in the prototype racing scene, in the late 80s. After providing engines for the the Nimrod and EMKA cars earlier in the decade, the company, which back then was a small outfit very much stuck in its old ways, decided to take up the ambitious challenge of developing an all-new car to compete against the Porsches, Jaguars and Sauber-Mercedeses of the time. In reality, however, the prototype would be an Aston Martin in name only: the cutting-edge carbon-kevlar monocoque and the skin draped around it would be designed by the joint team of Ray Mallock and Max Boxstrom, of Ecurie Ecosse fame, and built by composite specialist Courtaulds. The engine, which was to be shared with the brand-new Virage road-going GT car, was originally intended to be developed by Cosworth, but the high demands of the British firm led Aston Martin to look elsewhere, and namely, on the other side of the Atlantic: Callaway Cars was choosen to develop the 5.3 litre Tickford V8 of the aging Vantage. While the firm is nowadays mostly remembered for its twin-turbo Corvettes, it had some credentials as a racing engine developer, having built an Indy-spec eight-cylinder engine almost from scratch in just 11 months; and they diligently set to work on new 32-valve, DOHC cylinder heads. In the bulky Virage, the seemingly endless amounts of torque available produced supercar levels of acceleration; and in racing trim, stroked to 6 and later 6.3 litres, the RDP87 produced up to 720 hp - a figure that was, and still is, quite respectable.

The canted - and, as we will soon find out, quite cantankerous - V8.

The car was christened AMR1, and signed up for the 1989 World Sportscar Championship with very high hopes of bringing the Aston Martin name back to the top echelons of motorsports. During its maiden season, however, the car would show all sorts of teething problems. It didn't even take part to the first race of the season, in Suzuka: the only chassis built at that point, AMR1/01, was crashed during tests at Donington, and could not be repaired in time. In its first outing, at Dijon-Prenois, the car finished in a disappointing 17th position, eight laps down the winning Porsche, and two behind the Chamberlain-Spice that won in the C2 class. At 600 horsepower, the car was significantly underpowered against its turbocharged competition; the aerodynamic package, on the other hand, was a bit too good at generating downforce, giving the car an alarming tendency to porpoise. At Le Mans Ecurie Ecosse would enter two cars, with one retiring with electrical problems, and the other finishing the grueling race in 11th, more than 20 places up from its starting position. Afterwards, the adoption of a larger and more powerful engine and some adjustments to the suspension and aerodynamics setup allowed the AMR1 to improve on its competitiveness: at Brands Hatch, in front of a British crowd, the only car entered would be "best of the rest", arriving in 4th behind the dominating Saubers, and at the end of the WSC season Aston Martin would manage to finish 6th in the Teams standings, leaving behind the more established Toyota team. Had things gone to plan, 1990 would have seen the cars converted to the improved AMR2 spec, featuring some much-needed aerodynamic improvements and an even more capable version of the Callaway powerplant, rumored to produce something north of 740 hp; eventually, this too would have been replaced by a far more advanced AMR3, which the Mallock-Boxstrom team had already begun to engineer.


The AMR1 didn't bring home gobsmacking results, but 1989 was still a promising rookie season for the Aston Martin-Ecurie Ecosse team-up.

But in 1990, Ford - which up until then had been a minority shareholder of the British carmaker - acquired Victor Gauntlett's share of the company. Meanwhile, a rule change was announced for the 1991 season, which would limited Category 1 Sportscars to the use of 3.5 litre, naturally-aspirated engines. Ford, which also owned Jaguar, had no use for two teams racing in the WSC, and a limited supply of Cosworth F1 engines to go around. Coventry's program was much more established, having dominated the previous two seasons with a car, the XJR-8/9, that wasn't too different from the AMR1, but had a much longer gestation. And so, the daring and ambitious Aston Martin racing program was unceremoniously terminated before the AMR1 could mature into a title contender. Fortunately, Aston Martin would return to Le Mans, both in the GT classes, where it would become of the dominant forces of the past decade, and in the top-billed LMP1 category, following up on a mildly successful Lola-designed, V12 car with the AMR-One, one of the worst flops in the history of the division.

Underwhelming as it may have been, the AMR1 wasn't sold as spare parts to other teams.

In its Forza Motorsport incarnation, the AMR1 features the ultimate, Version III evolution of the RDP87, displacing 6.3 litres and pushing 740 hp and a gargantuan 841 Nm of torque to the crank: that gives the Aston an advantage of over 20 Nm over the Sauber C9 and Jaguar XJR-9 of the same era. And contrarely to the Merc, which is turbocharged, and the Jag, which has an engine that is more fractioned, over 80% of that torque is available from the word "go": this makes for a sometimes frightening experience, with the ultra-wide rear tires struggling to cope with the stress induced by the mighty Callaway powerplant in 1st and 2nd gear. But taming the boisterous V8 only requires some exercise; and after getting the hang of its throttle response, the car really came alive in the fast sweepers of the Circuit of the Americas, thanks to its precise steering, seemingly infinite amounts of lateral grip, and powerful brakes. It's such a shame, then, that a 1990-spec AMR2 never became a thing: it's easy to imagine that with some work by its two highly competent chief engineers, and perhaps with some injection of cash from Ford, it would have been a sweeter thing still.

All that is left now is a Lancia LC2, and then we can really have a Group C1 party!

Pros: it looks cutting-edge even today, imagine in 1989!
Cons: yes, Callaway, there is a thing such as "too much torque"...

Laptime (COTA GP Layout): 01:56.379

 

[Vic Reign93]

Really had to throw the boat out to get that lap time.

The S7 was easy to drive up to its limits, but at times it had too much rear grip and was pushing wide on corner exits.

Once you account for the rear grip, you can really push it to the limit with braking and handling at Silverstone.

It might’ve shown up out of nowhere, sold for a few years and then disappeared and yes there’s the previously mentioned and disputed/rumoured connection to the Group C AMR1 Aston, But while it was around, it left its mark in gaming.

Mostly forgotten by reality, never forgotten in the virtual world.

Verdict: Sleeper 👍

Speaking of something that could’ve easily been relegated to the archives of “Cars that’ll never be in a video game.”, The Aston Martin AMR1 Group C.

Unlike the AMR1 of 2011, this one actually managed to finish the 24hr of Le Mans in 11th place and the one that failed lasted a hell of a lot longer than the 6 laps total that BOTH 2011 AMR1’s had done before they gave up the ghost.

Mind you, one of those AMR1 chassis did end up forming the base for the Deltawing project so it kinda sorta redeemed itself?

Anyways, the old AMR1, tricky at low speeds due to the power available, but is somewhat easy to drive once up to speed.

Once tamed, it can reward you greatly, as greatly as the dominant Sauber C9? likely not IMO.

That’s not to say it’s terrible, it’s pretty decent, especially since it’s a freebie, but it’ll need a good tune and driver to take the fight to the C9.

Verdict: Neutral

 

[Vic Reign93]

24hrs to go until the next event is live, Get your times in folks.

 

[Nacho Libre]

Well, I had a good time with both cars and I probably could be a bit faster. Both sleepers.