Better sound!

  • Thread starter Polo609GT
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Polo609GT

48
I tryed searching the topic but couldnt find anything. We'll for gt4 we were promised better sound. I beleive some sounds were improved but...not fully. I buy stay 4 turbo and I want to hear my turbo spool and i want to hear the blowoff valve...you barely hear it when your racing. Better exaust notes, more deep and more high pitch at full rpm and maybe more realistic skidding sounds. Would also be nice to see your engine during different tuning stages! 👍
marc
 
I too would love to hear the blowoff valve, you could hear it in GT2, why not now? New cars are silent? I would also love the hear the rumble of a big block V8. That would be nice.
 
hehe thank you for backing me up on this! Sound is one of the most important aspects of the game I find. Even if the graphics are amazing, the sound has to live up to what you see!
 
I hate to see this, but I like NFSU2's sound better. It may not be as realistic but it sounds more real. I like that clunking sound when you switch gears.
 
I think we may see... I'm sorry... HEAR different sounds. I don't know if the PS3 will offer far superior sound quality over the PS2 (not saying the PS2 is bad), but the reason why people don't like the sounds too much can be one of two things: (1) PD's sound recording technology, or (2) the limit of the hardware.

I think I'm about to do something I don't usually do all the time- agree with the majority on something. Some of the big American V6s and V8s don't really sound menacing as in a non-racing game, "Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas." Even the FCR-900 and Bandito (the buggy) both have sounds reminiscent of mean American muscle. Or as the GT4 Chat with Taku Imasaki went:

davethestalker: "With all of the technology at your disposal for sound quality, why did the V8s come across unatuthentic, especially if a 'racing muffler' is used. What will you do to prevent this in the future?"
Taku Imasaki: To davethestalker: "We've been working on sound improvement for such a long time now... our sound engineers have been challenged with getting that all-american throaty sound... it seems to have to do with how their programs works + hardware limitations. That's on of our top priority list."

I think PD is likely going to work on all of this for the next GT. Don't fall for the oldest trick in the book- think PD isn't going to modify anything for the better, or state that PD isn't going to listen to its fans for suggestions about the game. It's too early right now, but I am hopeful of such changes.
 
Hiya! :D :embarrassed: :lol: Meow! (='.'=)

Now that PD have competition from Forza, they are going to have to push themselves harder. I am not even sure if PD actually TRIED to get the sounds right. All those american V8 is the most dissapointing sound because they sound so plain and flat. NFSU2 did a good job on every car's sound believe it or not. Even Forza got some good sounds also. :embarrassed:

C'mon PD!!! :mad: DO SOMETHING!!! :embarrassed:
 
One of the few complaints I have about Gran Turismo would be the sound. It really sounds flat. I started to notice this in GT3, and GT4 sounds just as bad to me. In GT5, I want better sound with more bass. I'd like an DD/DTS 5.1 - 7.1 as well.
 
Now that the Spider Man/Vision Gran Turismo deal is posted in a recent thread, it makes me wonder about sound. I don't think getting the most accurate sound isn't an easy task. I think what we hear on television vs. what we hear in real life are two different things. I remember a Gran Turismo 4 thread which featured Hans Stuck(?) tackle the real Nurburgring Nordschleife (with the F1 Nurburgring course as part as the course). I remember the in-car audio of the BMW M3 GT-R he piloted. The sound is similar to touring cars I've raced in the game "Jarrett and Labonte Stock Car Racing." You talk about wanting PD to "stop whoring sounds from GT1," some of the cars from past Codemasters games kind of sound the same. Maybe sometimes, some game companies kind of have "signature" sounds. Some game companies have certain distinctive sounds for their cars. I think one problem to all of this is that there are so many cars, and to get the just right sound for each car is a challenge. I will say this, though. You don't have car sounds right if a rotary Mazda sounded more like an NASCAR s... race car.

I remember once during the "Victory by Design" shows, that I heard a classic Jaguar at speed, and it sounded more like the sound of the Toyota GT-One from GT2 and the Jaguar XJ220. As much as one may think that sounds are being "whored" from GT1, let me tell you something. Sounds were much different from GT1 and GT2. GT2 and GT3 were slightly different. GT3 to GT4 were almost completely different. I think PD may need to study racing footage to know how certain cars sound at speed. I'm not a race car driver (much less a licensed driver), so how do I know how a car EXACTLY sounds? You can come close with all sorts of sound technology, but let's face it. Unless the game you're making is either centered around race cars or centered around a certain racing series, then I don't think you can take chances making cars sound EXACTLY the way it would in real life. How can sounds be perfect enough? How can we actually capture the sound the best way possible from every perspective? I'm not down to keep bullying Polyphony Digital for not getting sounds perfect, I think you do the best you can. Then with muffler modifications and maybe some bigtime HP upgrades, it changes sounds very much. How can you be absolutely sure? I don't know how the next GT will pull off sounds, but I'm not buying that PD is going to screw things up again with sound. You freaking dig?
 
JohnBM01
How can we actually capture the sound the best way possible from every perspective? I'm not down to keep bullying Polyphony Digital for not getting sounds perfect, I think you do the best you can. Then with muffler modifications and maybe some bigtime HP upgrades, it changes sounds very much.
Click to expand...

it does seem like a daunting task. but there are definetly way, and they have plenty of time to work on it. not to mention they have made more money on these games then almost anyother series released..ever.

you take every car you are going to put in the game, you bring it to a acoustically chamber with a dyno in it. you position reference-spec microphones in the car, on top of the car, behind the car, al over the room. you run the car at various speeds, (i.e. idle, slow, fast, pinned) then you get the same car with a turbo or SC or race exhaust or whatever. then its only a matter of resampling the sound with high end audio-fragmentors (they have the cash for these sort of things) and sync them in with the acceleration forumulas/code whathaveyou. repeat 1200 times. yes it is probably very long tedious work, but cmon PD, if your gunna make us wait for 5 years for a game, do it right. please dont try to convince me that a formula 1 car sounds like a moped engine.

in closing, i think the ps3 will be able to handle alot more of everything. sound environments, polygon rendering, scenery, AI, etc. lets hope this game will be worth the wait and without a bunch of siezure jitters when you have a rolling start.
 
Well, I'm hoping this will fall into the "new game engine" thing, that PD will be forced to re-create GT from scratch because of the multi-threaded architecture, rather than simply porting and tweaking the same old game engine like they've been doing since GT1.

We know PS3 will be able to do better sound. Ungodly numbers of audio channels, as well as full-bore Dolby Digital/DTS 5.1 surround, which is a damn sight better than the Pro Logic II that PS2 is limited to (PLII ain't bad, but it's no match for discrete audio).

I was thinking about this the other day, and I think I have a theory that may explain some of it. I think a lot of it may boil down to storage space. Remember, they actually have to store sound samples, in addition to programming that tells the system how those samples work together. Uncompressed audio is big.. The sound samples for one car could easily take over 1MB, per car. That's over 700MB in storage on the disc, just for the engine sounds. That's probably unacceptable.. not just for real estate on the disc, but also load times and system memory. So, they have to compress it. Which means limiting the bitrate. And then a bit more, and then a bit more... until you have a sound that, while "taken from the original recordings of the real cars", is now just a synthetic-sounding shadow of what it used to be. And that's what we ended up with. This would explain why the demos had better sound than the final version of the game.. because the demos only had audio for a half a dozen different cars, rather than seven hundred of them.

Now, however, we have Blu-Ray. Need 1GB for audio? Have at it, there's 49GB more we can use for everything else. Of all the games out there, I think GT is one of the more likely to be using Blu-Ray out of the gate (remember that GT4 is one of just a few games that uses a double-layer DVD).

Combine the freedom of storage space, memory, power, a brand-spanking-new game engine, all-new audio tools and full Dolby 5.1? Oh, yeah... the audio will be a LOT better.

And if it's not, then KY is going to have some explaining to do. You know people will ask that if the worst happens... "Why does GT5, the greatest racing game on the planet, have the absolute worst sound effects?" And he'll be stumped for an answer, I'm sure.

For those of you who think the sound in GT4 isn't that bad, go watch a video of the McLaren-Mercedes SLR in real-life, then go play it in the game. That car actually pisses me off... it's one of the coolest cars in the game, but it sounds like absolute crap. I can't even stand to drive it. And that's what pisses me off, because I WANT to drive it.
 
STiGoFLyBy
I hate to see this, but I like NFSU2's sound better. It may not be as realistic but it sounds more real. I like that clunking sound when you switch gears.
Click to expand...


I hate to say it, but I agree. Changing gears in NFSU2 is far more realistic than in GT4.
 
I been hearing people say that the reason y the gt series could not carry the recorded sounds were that most of the tv's couldnt handle it and the PS2..... which i soo wrong cuz i think that if our tvs couldnt handle it, then we wouldnt be able to here the racing sounds when u watch racing on speed channel, or formula d on g4tv. Also there are other games on the ps2 that has more realistic sounds, for example, NFSU2, that game clearly shows that the ps2 can carry better more realistic sounds.



FUTURE DRIFTER
 
Jedi2016
Now, however, we have Blu-Ray. Need 1GB for audio? Have at it, there's 49GB more we can use for everything else. Of all the games out there, I think GT is one of the more likely to be using Blu-Ray out of the gate (remember that GT4 is one of just a few games that uses a double-layer DVD).

Combine the freedom of storage space, memory, power, a brand-spanking-new game engine, all-new audio tools and full Dolby 5.1? Oh, yeah... the audio will be a LOT better.
Click to expand...

Hiya! :D :embarrassed: :lol: Meow! (='.'=)

I am not really a computer type of person, but I have some stuff messing with my mind when it comes to capacity. :odd:

If the graphics are going to be better, wouldn't it also take up more space? Just watching all those tech demos and pictures of the PS3's power makes me think that all those fancy graphics got to take up a lot of space right? :odd: I need help! :embarrassed: 👍
 
I watched the Le Mans 24 Hours this year, and saw the corvettes and the audi cars...TO ME, they dont sound pretty much the same. They sound different. Wasnt PD the one's they said that they recorded the sounds of all the cars for each car it's for??? The Audi R8 in GT4 sounds a bit like the Toyota GTONe, again this is just my opinion. Someone out there must have some clips of sounds from GT1,GT2,GT3,GT4....too much to ask but im looking to see if i or we, can compare the sounds that are in the game, to the sounds that are actually SOUNDs of racing cars. ...u get me?? anywho. so those are my 2 cents.
 
McLaren'sAngel
Hiya! :D :embarrassed: :lol: Meow! (='.'=)

I am not really a computer type of person, but I have some stuff messing with my mind when it comes to capacity. :odd:

If the graphics are going to be better, wouldn't it also take up more space? Just watching all those tech demos and pictures of the PS3's power makes me think that all those fancy grpahics got to take up a lot of space right? :odd: I need help! :embarrassed: 👍
Click to expand...

Yes, you are correct. :)

Normally, graphics are created by the game engine.. but what you're seeing is originally made up of models and textures that are being loaded from the disc. And a 20,000-polygon car takes up a bit more room than a 5,000-poly car. And a 2400x2400 texture takes up a lot more room than a 480x480 texture. And, since images are compressed, a photographic texture will be larger than a hand-painted texture, even if they're the same resolution (because of the extra detail and fidelity). In fact, if you simply double the resolution of an image.. say, from 640x480 to 1280x960, that new image is actually four times larger than the original. It's twice as wide AND twice as tall.

So yes, next-gen games will take up quite a bit more space than current-gen games do.

To be honest, this is where Microsoft screwed up. I believe (and it's my opinion) that Microsoft underestimated how much larger next-gen games are going to get. Even a game the same "size" as a current-gen game could easily take five or ten times as much storage space, just because of how high-resolution everything is. Consider that we already have PS2 games that are easily five or six times larger than PS1 games... dual-layer DVDs being used where one CD was good enough before. The same will happen next-gen... a game five or six times larger than the average PS2 game will be around 20GB or so. Sure ain't gonna fit that on a DVD, are ya? By the time next-gen is over, you'll be hard-pressed to find a PS3 game on DVD, nearly all of them will be Blu-Ray. Just like it's pretty difficult to find new PS2 games on CD these days. People may say that "50GB is too big", but it's not about 50GB, is it? It's about 9.1GB. Even if a game is just one measly megabyte over the limit for a DVD, you're screwed without blue-laser technology. And that one megabyte will have to be removed. It won't make much of a difference at launch, but give it a couple years.
 
For my sake, I'll at least give PD the benefit of the doubt. I've heard all sorts of cars on TV and such. My real issue is, how can we really be sure? Hell, I've even recorded a sound sample of the Audi R8 during last year's 12 Hours of Sebring. To hear the car at speed in GT4, it sounded completely unlike. But don't go being like "all this technology and all this money PD makes, and they can't afford better sound technology?"

I give things the benefit of the doubt so it doesn't seem like I'm ass-kissing all the time. With sound, I speak from passion. How can we really be sure what a car really sounds like compared to how a game puts it? Have you raced an Audi R8? Have you driven a Dodge Viper to its limit? Have you rally raced a Subaru Impreza WRC? How can you be completely sure that sounds are completely perfect? I've played Codemasters games in which the cars almost seem to similar in sound. That is why I am not making too much of a deal out of this. If a PC game can get sounds down perfect while a console game sounds like crap or sounds completely different from one another, then that's just the PC's gain and the console's loss. I don't own a rigged-out PC. I own a crappy 32 MBRAM, crash-happy eMachines. This is not to mention you have production cars in addition to race cars. One thing I was kind of annoyed with in GT3 was when I put a Racing Muffler on a car, there seems to be this "universal" sound. For example, if I hook up an S2000 or a Civic with a Racing Muffler, it will seem to sound like the JGTC/Super GT NSXes.

All I'm getting at is that I think things will get better in terms of sound. I'm not going to make the distinction between what exactly sounds like the car in question, and what doesn't. If a Daihatsu Move sounds like a Dodge Viper GTS-R, oh well. I'll reserve my judgments when the next GT is finally released. Then we'll be the judge.
 
Hiya! :D :embarrassed: :lol: Meow! (='.'=)

Good stuff Jedi! :embarrassed: 👍

I think PD must be feeling some pressure now since the team from PGR3 have given a demo of how a Ferrari F355 and a Nissan Skyline GT-R R34 will sound like in the game. To me, it sounds AMAZING!!! PD better do something about this since their competition have revealed what they can do. :embarrassed:
 
I've been fiddling around with sound effects on my computer, and I think I know what the problem is with GT:

Most of the cars use only a single sound as the basis for the entire RPM range.

I have a sound here, some unidentified car running at mid-RPM, nice and steady. Sounds real because it is real. But, when I pitch up the sound (i.e. revving up), guess what it sounds like? Yep. Fake-ass GT engine sound.

What I need is a better sound to fiddle with.. something grumbly like a Viper. Any clue where to find a sound bit of a Viper running steady at mid-RPMs?
 
Jedi2016
What I need is a better sound to fiddle with.. something grumbly like a Viper. Any clue where to find a sound bit of a Viper running steady at mid-RPMs?
Click to expand...

Hiya! :D :embarrassed: :lol: Meow! (='.'=)

You could try to find a good Viper forum, see if their is a sound section.

If not, I suggest this site:

http://www.ls1sounds.com/

Although the cars in here are not vipers, there are numerous soundclips of aftermarket exhuast sounds. Some are revving and some are steady. :embarrassed: 👍 It's all about the SLP LOUDMOUTH! :sly: :embarrassed:
 
actually im pretty sure you can hear the Bov in gt4 and gt3 but only in the cockpit view..but yea they should make the cars sound more realistic...like why do these american cars sound like they got a jdm motor in 'em...xD lol
 
"American cars with JDM motors?" American car afficionados, you be the judge to this statement! Considering all the cars in Gran Turismo games, what's the key to the best-possible sounds? I don't mean the best guess, but more of believable sounds of licensed automobiles.

I have a feeling that disc space is quite a factor, even for every car in a game. That may all change with the next installment as there may be a proper amount of data to use in making the next game. I think Famine or somebody was talking about GT4 used up about 1/2 of the DVD-ROM, so imagine if PD went all-out with disc space and high-quality automobile sounds.
 
It also has to do with memory. If the system is shy on memory (which is PS2 most definitely is), then they have to keep the sound samples very short, and will be limited to only a few. Hopefully the PS2's 256MB of system memory and all that extra sound-processing power (which is done by Cell) will mean they'll finally do it justice.
 

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