Black List of drivers you must elude.

[TheDabbinDave]

NSA_USA needs to be at the top of the list.

The guy can drive, but most of the time he'd rather punt you off the track instead of racing you clean.

We were racing on the Daytona Inter-Continental Test event.


I know for a fact, some people race under a different PSN ID when they want to do dastardly things. You can tell the good drivers from the noobs by the way they drive when they are not crashing into you or someone else. The noobs don't seem to have any sort of control over their car.....ever.

Viper, it was cool to see you in the room at least once.

 

[Jay]

Viper, it was cool to see you in the room at least once.

Hehe same, first time I saw a name I recognised, and also a very rare time I started in first position, but I had a very angry Z06 on my heels (Daytona, I was in F430) so he kept me on my toes.

 

[yossigab]

I don't think it'll be too hard to administer, Stu.

Let's forget about the odd skirmish that can occur when we race on LAN or even online with Xlinx Kai for that matter, I'm sure they can be sorted out without black listing anyone. I'm talking about the repeat offenders, the obvious ones that don't even care about anything other than themselves, and the cheaters who are hell bent on doing anything to get that win or top place in time trial.

Allow me to show you an example:

I have no qualms about shaming this guy in public because he clearly deserves everything he gets. The decision to record this event was made after the two races prior to this one resulted in the same outcome.


PSN-ID:
KILLBILLS

Track:
Suzuka Circuit

Comments:
Yet another idiot that ruins this fine game.

Notice how he Deliberately brakes on the straight so that I hit him. @2.20

He then attempts to side-swipe me on the next turn @2.37, and hoping that I would fly off the track. I was ready for him (continued braking) @2.37

Shunted me on turn 2 / lap 2 @ 3.11

Another shunt @ 3.32

Another shunt @ 3.38

By this time I'm paying more attention to whats going on behind me instead of what's in front of me.

Another shunt @ 3.53

Again another shunt @ 4.15

Side swipe to put me on the grass and out of the race,. It didn't work @ 4.37

he tries to block my run down the straight but I surprise him by keeping the same line and getting through, but not before he manages to have another swipe at me as I go past. @5.02

@ 5.19 he successfully side swipes me to get past me but not before picking up yet another infringment for doing so.

But it seems crime does pay as he then weaves from left to right along the main straight to stop me from passing and winning the race.



Based on the evidence provided, would this example be worthy of a submission into the Hall of Shame, or does this sort of thing go unpunished and thus allowing others to follow his/her example?

There are also those guys who have made a mockery of Suzuka in the Online Time Trials. Do we allow them to gain the top spot without any come back? I think not.

(I don't own yet GT5P nor PS3, I do plan to buy it with the EU release...)
What pisses me off with this video is that this KILLBILLS driver do knows some good driving skills (or else he wouldn't stay at 1st/2nd places), but instead of using those skill in order to pass and play fair he is using it to kick some 'ssa'.
As other people say, there are noobs who don't drive well, but this guy doesn't look noob and still not playing fair. Also, there are others who don't drive at all and just playing "derby" style driving under the GT hood. I think that those type of drivers (if you can call them this way) are the worse, they don't drive and don't let you drive...

 

[RecklesAbandon2]

After watching the video, I can't honestly say that any of the contact before the sideswipe @4.37 was intentional. I can say that the 4.15 incident was actually Sphinx's fault, due to late braking, slowing down to much, and cutting to the inside of the turn where the proper line would've taken him outside. Meaning he actually cut down in front of the other driver.
That said, after that incident, clearly the other driver was trying to take him out, I'm just not positive it wasn't because of frustration.

Sphinx, before you take offense to that, let me say that all I'd like is to see it from his car's view, before I would blame him for all contact before 4.37

As for my opinion on this blacklist, there will be kids who WANT to get on it, because they'll find it funny.

 

[ERacer]

I think the blacklist is an excellent idea. Especially when the offender's actions are backed up by proof such as submitted by Sphinx and reviewed or confirmed by other racers' experiences with the same offender.

I do not own a PS3 yet, so I have a question regarding lag time. (Clearly, the poor sportsmanship in the above video has nothing to do with lag time). I have been told that a wireless router may at times cause lag and that a direct cable link to the PS3 will eliminate such lag. Have you PS3'ers found this to be so.

Looking forward to racing with real drivers.

ERacer

 

[paulinho]

I have been playing GT5P for a few days now, and have played on the "Test" server listed in the game lobby a few times and in general most people are well behaved.
How ever I haven't seen any options to kick players or to set up a private race lobby or even a friends only lobby ? so how will the blacklist work ?

 

[JohnBM01]

See? This is one such subject matter I've been preaching ever since word of an online-enabled GT crossed news wires. The advantage would be about matching up against more human opponents than the AI racers. The negative is that you may be racing against some jackasses. Something I always say: "different doesn't always mean better." And when I saw the video from Post #26, it goes to show that some people can be just as bad as when the AI intentionally tries to end your race even if he/she sacrifices his/her own car to take yours out. I try not to belittle people, but I don't think most people (especially those who play rough) don't read or can't read when there are manners in regards to online racing. Some people think every racing game is or should be Burnout. You know, that racing game in which crashes are more important than racing? I don't have any online gaming experience, so I'm not aware of hotheads who have no respect for other gamers on the track. All I can say is that there has to be better management of people not willing to race clean. Maybe PD should allow for as many gamers as possible to race a track while some others can log on to be Administors and race directors. Take away the Tony Stewarts and Kurt Busches of Gran Turismo to make way for the respectful and good racers.

 

[spyrrari]

was thinking about somethink else too today...:what about the different views people use??...i always play onboard sinds gt5p but i know that there are several players who still use bumperview or even backcam.....now as i am next to a car in a corner,using onboard,does the other racer next to me see or "feel"me at all if he is using bumperview????......is this maybe a answer to some of the "cutting corners" questions we have???you know what i meen:you overtake somebody on the inside and while clearly being next to him and not running wide in the corner he turnes in so far that he will bumb in to you....most of the times this is not intentional so i think this "who uses what view" could make a difference....or not?

 

[Sphinx]

After watching the video, I can't honestly say that any of the contact before the sideswipe @4.37 was intentional. I can say that the 4.15 incident was actually Sphinx's fault, due to late braking, slowing down to much, and cutting to the inside of the turn where the proper line would've taken him outside. Meaning he actually cut down in front of the other driver.
That said, after that incident, clearly the other driver was trying to take him out, I'm just not positive it wasn't because of frustration.

Sphinx, before you take offense to that, let me say that all I'd like is to see it from his car's view, before I would blame him for all contact before 4.37

As for my opinion on this blacklist, there will be kids who WANT to get on it, because they'll find it funny.

No offence taken, but I will defend myself.

By this time I'm paying more attention to whats going on behind me instead of what's in front of me.

My error on that turn came about as a result of being continuously intimidated throughout the race. I was very aware that this turn was a prime location for him to take me out of the so-called race. He would’ve shunted me off I’m sure if it wasn’t down to me making the error that gave him a chance to get past. He therefore saw a gap and went for it regardless if he hit me or not. I would’ve eased off if I was the other driver, a trait that I clearly displayed throughout the race. He didn’t ease off around that turn because he knew full well that he would hit me to enable him to get past.

 

[zippyuk]

was thinking about somethink else too today...:what about the different views people use??...i always play onboard sinds gt5p but i know that there are several players who still use bumperview or even backcam.....now as i am next to a car in a corner,using onboard,does the other racer next to me see or "feel"me at all if he is using bumperview????......is this maybe a answer to some of the "cutting corners" questions we have???you know what i meen:you overtake somebody on the inside and while clearly being next to him and not running wide in the corner he turnes in so far that he will bumb in to you....most of the times this is not intentional so i think this "who uses what view" could make a difference....or not?

For what it is worth, wether you use in car or bumper cam, you should always know what is around you and also the width of what you are driving, and that goes for racing aswell. Yes i have raced a car many years ago, and some very close racing was had, and yet we all had respect for each other.
I drive an artic for a living now and believe you me, you really do have to know what is around you at all times.
I have had some dam good races in the F430 at Suzuka, with peeps that know what they are doing, however it only takes 1 idiot to spoil it. BTW i use bumper cam and always have done with no probs.

 

[TheDabbinDave]

I have been playing GT5P for a few days now, and have played on the "Test" server listed in the game lobby a few times and in general most people are well behaved.

Try going in past 11 pm ET, once people get "lit".

 

[spyrrari]

For what it is worth, wether you use in car or bumper cam, you should always know what is around you and also the width of what you are driving, and that goes for racing aswell. Yes i have raced a car many years ago, and some very close racing was had, and yet we all had respect for each other.
I drive an artic for a living now and believe you me, you really do have to know what is around you at all times.
I have had some dam good races in the F430 at Suzuka, with peeps that know what they are doing, however it only takes 1 idiot to spoil it. BTW i use bumper cam and always have done with no probs.

well,as i have raced some cars as well(rally and formula ford)i know what your saying man....wrote this part cause of the somewhat inexperient players around....with some you can have a good race if you are behind them,but than when you place a totally propper overtaking the othr dude hits you slightly from far left or right side and amkes you spinn off...than he waits for you to appologise and we go on racing....thats what i ment.spyrrari.

Try going in past 11 pm ET, once people get "lit".

yep,its a total chaos out there....

 

[CMe]

For what it is worth, wether you use in car or bumper cam, you should always know what is around you and also the width of what you are driving, and that goes for racing aswell. Yes i have raced a car many years ago, and some very close racing was had, and yet we all had respect for each other.
I drive an artic for a living now and believe you me, you really do have to know what is around you at all times.
I have had some dam good races in the F430 at Suzuka, with peeps that know what they are doing, however it only takes 1 idiot to spoil it. BTW i use bumper cam and always have done with no probs.

Agreed.

I also drive using bumber cam, and look left or right when I suspect someone is next to me as the turn is approaching. Once in a blue-moon someone get's into my blind spot, but I still know they're near so I proceed with caution.

I too have had awsome races at Suzuka with lots of drivers who I know drive well (fast) and clean (not bumper cars). There are good drivers out there. Folks like ZippyUK, Pillat, blue_augen, S13-potato, I see often - and I know they're good, fast, and most importantly - they're respectable drivers.


IMHO The pro F430 Suzuka race is the best track online at the moment. I don't race dirty, and I wouldn't be happy winning - if I did. Sometimes I'm faster than the next car thru certain sections of the track. But if I can't make a clean pass, I don't. In which case I don't finish in 1st place, but that's ok when it's a clean race.

Granted somtimes collions can't be avoided, like when someone hits you from behind, and you hit the car in front, etc. But the foolish stunts demonstrated by KILLBILLS in the vid - shows very poor sportsmanship. People who race that way should be banned, penalized, and avoided. If I see any black-listed drivers on the track, I'm on guard.



__________________
HichCTech

 

[Touring Mars]

The video submitted by Sphinx is an excellent example of the level of proof required to call someone out on a charge of dirty racing. However, it is still just one race... plus, as yossigab most correctly points out, this KILLBILLS chap is clearly no novice, and despite his dirty tactics, must be a pretty good player to keep up with Sphinx!

There are many different categories of poor behaviour, and perhaps any 'lists' should also reflect the nature of the offense... e.g. players who deliberately disrupt races, players who bail out when they are losing, players who use dirty tactics like blocking, swerving, contact etc. (but are experienced players) and players who are simply driving badly (e.g. through inexperience).

The first two categories are easy to spot - the latter two are more difficult and potentially far more contentious (i.e. how many 'chances' do you give a driver? Should a good but dirty driver be blacklisted on the strength of one poor race?)... and should you blacklist new drivers who make more mistakes? If anything, these people should be 'greylisted' as opposed to 'blacklisted'.

Perhaps a fairer and more workable alternative to blacklisting is whitelisting... stick to the players you know who drive fairly, but give new people a chance to prove themselves as fair drivers too. Perhaps a list of people who you've had a good race with might be helpful? That way we could start to build up an index of 'verified' drivers that you could add to your PSN contact list? A similar GTP list could also be made...

 

[TheCracker]

The first two categories are easy to spot - the latter two are more difficult and potentially far more contentious (i.e. how many 'chances' do you give a driver? Should a good but dirty driver be blacklisted on the strength of one poor race?)... and should you blacklist new drivers who make more mistakes? If anything, these people should be 'greylisted' as opposed to 'blacklisted'.

It's also quite possible that a usually very clean driver has other people, like younger brothers, using the same PSN account and user tag to occasionally play the game when they fancy a change from their normal Burnout Paradise smash-fest. The respectable user shouldn't be blacklisted for someone elses mistakes.

 

[yossigab]

The video submitted by Sphinx is an excellent example of the level of proof required to call someone out on a charge of dirty racing. However, it is still just one race... plus, as yossigab most correctly points out, this KILLBILLS chap is clearly no novice, and despite his dirty tactics, must be a pretty good player to keep up with Sphinx!

There are many different categories of poor behaviour, and perhaps any 'lists' should also reflect the nature of the offense... e.g. players who deliberately disrupt races, players who bail out when they are losing, players who use dirty tactics like blocking, swerving, contact etc. (but are experienced players) and players who are simply driving badly (e.g. through inexperience).

The first two categories are easy to spot - the latter two are more difficult and potentially far more contentious (i.e. how many 'chances' do you give a driver? Should a good but dirty driver be blacklisted on the strength of one poor race?)... and should you blacklist new drivers who make more mistakes? If anything, these people should be 'greylisted' as opposed to 'blacklisted'.

Perhaps a fairer and more workable alternative to blacklisting is whitelisting... stick to the players you know who drive fairly, but give new people a chance to prove themselves as fair drivers too. Perhaps a list of people who you've had a good race with might be helpful? That way we could start to build up an index of 'verified' drivers that you could add to your PSN contact list? A similar GTP list could also be made...

I agree with you that whitelisting will be easier to maintain and track, and this is a good idea to start with.
Still, by reading all the posts in here I understand (as I said, I don't own GT5P yet) that there are some drivers who go into GT5P online just to play "derby" style and not even tried to race in any certain way (not even as beginners), just waiting in some turn to pull off others from the track. If those people names are keep doing it over & over (need a proof of course) with more than one GTP member then this could be blacklisted guy...

 

[MTC]

It's also quite possible that a usually very clean driver has other people, like younger brothers, using the same PSN account and user tag to occasionally play the game when they fancy a change from their normal Burnout Paradise smash-fest. The respectable user shouldn't be blacklisted for someone elses mistakes.

They shouldn't be letting someone else use their PSN account, they should make separate (sub-)accounts for other people, especially if they're bad drivers.

 

[RecklesAbandon2]

My error on that turn came about as a result of being continuously intimidated throughout the race. I was very aware that this turn was a prime location for him to take me out of the so-called race. He would’ve shunted me off I’m sure if it wasn’t down to me making the error that gave him a chance to get past. He therefore saw a gap and went for it regardless if he hit me or not. I would’ve eased off if I was the other driver, a trait that I clearly displayed throughout the race. He didn’t ease off around that turn because he knew full well that he would hit me to enable him to get past.

I agree, I've been there racing AI in other GT games. The bumper cam comment made by spyrarri pretty much sums up what I was getting at. While your video was pretty definitive, and regardless of what happened where, he clearly started driving like an immature, well... brat. But without seeing the race from a broader view, I cannot say that he didn't feel like he was faster than you, and simply being blocked. I also wanted to point out that just because somebody is in the lead, does not mean that contact is not their fault.
As for your race, I highly doubt that any camera angle could have saved my respect for his driving charactor, but it does show that you maintained a respectful, dignified manner in the face of evil, So I'll give you kudos for that, because I can't say if somebody pulled that sideswipe crap on me, that I would'nt put them into a wall or field myself. (which you easily could've in the last corners)

Edit: even if he did feel you were blocking, that is part of racing, last I checked, so people like him will need to deal with this

 

[GEORGE_GR33]

First of all i want to say hi to all.
About this matter,i believe there has to be categories of drivers,as in real world
(amateur,pro,expert,master...).These categories will be related to the time trials
and the gap from the first for every category to the last has to be no more than 1-1,5 sec.I believe only then we all participate at an incredible beauty's and suspense races.

 

[zippyuk]

Daytona infield is a great circuit, however there is always one who has to spoil it : PILLATS or something like that, 3 races i was in with him and everytime he had to take me and others out, roll on private lobbies.

 

[CMe]

Daytona infield is a great circuit, however there is always one who has to spoil it : PILLATS or something like that, 3 races i was in with him and everytime he had to take me and others out, roll on private lobbies.

Sorry to hear that ZippyUK, I had some good races with PILLAT where the passes were clean.

I agree with you. We need private lobbies with chat or voice support in the lobby.

 

[Suzuki]

We could use voice chat in the game, but seeing as its japanese release only, most would be japanese unless we go to US or Euro server to play.

 

[fahrer]

i agree with CMe PILLAT being a clean and fair racer

 

[Turbo91GT]

I think I figured it out, some people received GT5 with a different case.

 

[Jay]

I just had the worst experience ever on that Suzuka 16 car race...... I don't want to go into it, I just feel like throttling everyone that was in it.

 

[kingcars]

I'm not sure why everyone takes shots at people who play games like Burnout...I love the Burnout series (and just got Paradise when it came out), but in GT5P, you can ask Sphinx, Turbo91, DaveTheStalker, etc, and they'll tell ya I'm no rough driver.

Anyways, yeah, it's really hard to officially blacklist drivers because you never know if its the actual account owner who is playing or not. Never hurts to warn people about certain players so they can proceed with caution, though.

 

[unimental]

I just had the worst experience ever on that Suzuka 16 car race...... I don't want to go into it, I just feel like throttling everyone that was in it.

And I as well. Two in a row, actually.

The current Suzuka online race is an embarrassment to GT and sim racing in general. The first turn is all ghosts and fender-banging... and so on from there. It doesn't help that the amateur physics setting allows for a much more aggressive driving style.

Horrendous.

EDIT

I've added a video example for those who haven't yet experienced the joy of arcade/amateur physics @ Suzuka.

 

[Turbo91GT]

I actually enjoy the Suzuka race, even though I get hit off the track, and get penalized for stupid reasons. I still usually end up winning, or at least in the top 3. It's fun working your way through traffic and making good passes. I had one of my best online experiences there today, against a racer named RUDDY_LILA. We were both in '02 GT-Rs and got ahead of everyone by about 20 seconds. We were perfectly matched, staying nose to tail. I was ahead for most of the time, until towards the end of lap 3. I made a slight mistake and lost some momentum, which allowed me to be passed. Even though I came in second, it was an awesome race. I race to have fun, not to win.

 

[Nitrof1]

PSN: AZKUMA
@daytone roadcourse race
this guy is really beginner and doesnt know how to brake or he hit me 3 times on his purpose :@

 

[Diego440]

sorry for the off-topic: what/why are ghosts? And why are the cars jumpy?