Boston Bombing, Boston Marathon April 15th

[Wardez]

Your insistence on calling them "Muslim terrorists" without a shred of evidence that they carried out the attacks in the name of their faith is a distasteful generalisation.

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/201...-no-indication-of-accomplice-source-says?lite

Dzhokhar Tsarnaev has told investigators he and his brother acted alone, learned to build the pressure-cooker bombs over the Internet and were motivated by a desire to defend Islam because of "the U.S. wars in Iraq and Afghanistan," said the source, who has received multiple briefings on the probe.

No one's jumping the gun and making any of us Muslims mad by calling them Muslim terrorists too soon, it's ok.

Once we knew they were Chechens I knew they were extremist idiots.

 

[Caz]

Glad this thread gotntotally derailed. Thanks.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Your respect for due process is admirable, but the suspect has already made statements to the effect that their extremist take on Islam was a central factor in their actions, and has made no attempt to deny involvement or to shirk responsibility. The suspect remains innocent in a technical sense only - the evidence is already stacked in favour of a guilty verdict... the suspect has rights and will be afforded the privilege of due process - but that doesn't mean that the murdering scumbag deserves any respect at all - nor does he deserve apologists trying to treat him with kid gloves.

I haven't seen any of that. It's received no coverage in the media here. I can only go by the sources I have at the time.

Wow, just wow...incredible actually...

Without any evidence to the contrary, it's a plausible scenario.

Once we knew they were Chechens I knew they were extremist idiots.

So, all Chechens are extremists, and all Chechens are idiots, then?

What were we just saying about generalising people?

 

[Wardez]

Come on, I don't have to spell it out do I?

Once we knew it was Chechens that bombed the Boston marathon. 'cause honestly, what other type of Chechen would have an inclination towards this sort of thing?

We know they did it, we have the younger brother confessing, why they did it, we don't have to be overly PC now, good sir.

I haven't seen any of that. It's received no coverage in the media here. I can only go by the sources I have at the time.

Totally fair, I've heard it all over the news. First heard it on the radio, but of course in the U.S. it's going to be different since everyone wants to highlight the creed, religion, faction, asap and start up the rallying.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Once we knew it was Chechens that bombed the Boston marathon. 'cause honestly, what other type of Chechen would have an inclination towards this sort of thing?

"Chechen extremists" tend to be separatists fighting for an independent Chechnya, which has since evolved into a Caucasus Emirate encompassing Chechnya, Ingushetia, Ossetia and Dagestan (and a few smaller areas on an on-again, off-again basis). These extremists have generally only attacked Russian targets - the Kizlyar-Pervomayskoye hostage taking, 1999 apartment bombings, Moscow theatre siege, Znamenskoye suicide bombing, 2004 aircraft bombings and the Beslan hostage crisis are all examples of their preferred targets: Russian intersts on Russian soil. As far as I am aware, the Boston marathon bombing is the first incident of Chechen extremists or Chechen-trained extremists carrying out an attack on a target outside Russia against a target that was not Russian.

 

[Touring Mars]

Without any evidence to the contrary, it's a plausible scenario.

It was a possible scenario, but in the light of emerging evidence, it is increasingly implausible - The FBI have uncovered text messages from the elder brother from 2011 which state that he vowed to die for Islam. As for the younger brother, he confirmed his participation in the attacks before he was read his rights... he has since been read his rights and surprise, surprise, he's gone all quiet.

 

[Johnnypenso]

I haven't seen any of that. It's received no coverage in the media here. I can only go by the sources I have at the time.

Without any evidence to the contrary, it's a plausible scenario.

You can't get news from the internet?

 

[Caz]

http://m.nypost.com/p/news/national/hero_victim_is_gift_himself_Mu183hTCLPvNY9HYQQW3DP#

 

[prisonermonkeys]

You can't get news from the internet?

I can, but the news I get tends to come from local sites rather than international, because that way I can get local and international news that is most relevant to me. It's odd that these sites would neglect to report Tsarnaev talking with police, though.

 

[Wardez]

Yeah, I'm reading now from a bunch of different stories that Dzhokhar was first only communicating by written word, as he had been shot in the damn neck.

This is how he initially let investigators know how they did this as payback for invading and hurting Islam.

Anyway, he healed up enough after treatment that he started talking regularly, then the official came in to read him his Miranda rights and he supposedly shut up after that.

In other news, there seems to be a growing movement supporting this kid as an innocent, and that he should be freed. It seems to be mostly being pushed by young girls on Twitter that are most probably out of touch with things (don't wanna generalize , but wow, that's putting things lightly for most teenage girls)

http://theweek.com/article/index/243230/free-jahar-the-online-push-to-exonerate-dzhokhar-tsarnaev

 

[Johnnypenso]

Yeah, I'm reading now from a bunch of different stories that Dzhokhar was first only communicating by written word, as he had been shot in the damn neck.

This is how he initially let investigators know how they did this as payback for invading and hurting Islam.

Anyway, he healed up enough after treatment that he started talking regularly, then the official came in to read him his Miranda rights and he supposedly shut up after that.

In other news, there seems to be a growing movement supporting this kid as an innocent, and that he should be freed. It seems to be mostly being pushed by young girls on Twitter that are most probably out of touch with things (don't wanna generalize , but wow, that's putting things lightly for most teenage girls)

http://theweek.com/article/index/243230/free-jahar-the-online-push-to-exonerate-dzhokhar-tsarnaev

I wish they had used the "enemy combatant" designation for this Muslim extremist terrorist. As it was, the "public safety exemption" to reading him his Miranda rights ran out, which is why they had to be read.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

I wish they had used the "enemy combatant" designation for this Muslim extremist terrorist. As it was, the "public safety exemption" to reading him his Miranda rights ran out, which is why they had to be read.

What gives you the right to demand that one person be denied his rights in one thread, but in another, you demand that another person have his rights respected.

Also, why do you insist on referring to Tsarnaev as "this Muslim extremist terrorist" instead of by name? He's not Lord Voldemort.

 

[arora]

Wish =/= demand.

 

[GTsail]

Late last night, Tsarnaev was moved from the Beth Israel Deaconess Medical Center to a prison facility at Fort Devens (a military base in Massachusetts).

The base at Fort Devens has a federal prison for male inmates requiring specialized medical care.

IMO, a smart move.👍 The Beth Israel Hospital was receiving quite a few complaints from family members who were visiting the injured patients at the Hospital who are still recovering from their injuries caused by Tsarnaev's bombs. Some family members did not like the fact that Tsarnaev was receiving care at the same hospital. I would also guess that the additional security measures necessitated by the prescence of Tsarnaev would not be entirely condusive to patient recovery.

GTsail

 

[Dotini]

deleted post

 

[playnthru]

Um that kid went missing a month before the bombings?? Not sure how your timeline works. ESP??

 

[Johnnypenso]

What gives you the right to demand that one person be denied his rights in one thread, but in another, you demand that another person have his rights respected.

Also, why do you insist on referring to Tsarnaev as "this Muslim extremist terrorist" instead of by name? He's not Lord Voldemort.

A demand is not a wish, and he is a Muslim extremist terrorist.

 

[dylansan]

A demand is not a wish, and he is a Muslim extremist terrorist.

Again with this.

No matter what he is, it's very unconventional to use the same string of words to refer to a person every single time. You could refer to him by name or as "the bomber", use a pronoun once in a while or anything else you see fit.

If for no other reason, I'd suggest you use other words just as a matter of writing style.

And actually, if you claim you're aiming for specificity, use his name then. It's far more specific than Muslim extremist terrorist, of which he is certainly not the only one.

 

[NissanSkylineN1]

Its simple. He likes being racist towards Muslims. Usually something very hard to change. Best if we just ignore it. Shall we?

 

[Johnnypenso]

Its simple. He likes being racist towards Muslims. Usually something very hard to change. Best if we just ignore it. Shall we?

It is a truthful statement, he is a Muslim extremist terrorist. And I've made no generalizations about any Muslims, nor referred to any other Muslims in any of my statements. Please research the meaning of "racist" before you refer to someone as racist.

 

[GTsail]

Has everyone seen the articles/interviews with Matt Patterson?

Link: Off-duty firefighter helps save Jane Richards, who was critically injured

Matt Patterson, helped by a second guy (Michael Chase), carried Jane Richards from the middle of the street down to the medical personel and then went back to her brother. The guy in blue is holding a tourniquet around Jane's leg. Matt was in the restaurant when the two bombs went off.

Much respect and deserves our thanks:tup:
GTsail

 

[dylansan]

It is a truthful statement, he is a Muslim extremist terrorist. And I've made no generalizations about any Muslims, nor referred to any other Muslims in any of my statements. Please research the meaning of "racist" before you refer to someone as racist.

It is a truthful statement, but not a necessary one. I do not think you are a racist, however if you are not, I don't know why you are so opposed to using language that will make it much clearer that you aren't one.

Clearly your choice of words so far has made many people suspicious of your intentions. You've been shown several alternatives which would serve the purpose equally well and would probably stop people pestering you, but you adamantly refuse, because the words you chose are "technically accurate."

Guess what, all the other options are accurate too, so why must you stick to the one that is unnecessarily incitatory?

 

[Johnnypenso]

Has everyone seen the articles/interviews with Matt Patterson?

Link: Off-duty firefighter helps save Jane Richards, who was critically injured

Matt Patterson, helped by a second guy (Michael Chase), carried Jane Richards from the middle of the street down to the medical personel and then went back to her brother. The guy in blue is holding a tourniquet around Jane's leg. Matt was in the restaurant when the two bombs went off.

Much respect and deserves our thanks:tup:
GTsail

The tragedy this family in particular had to face and will face in the future is simply impossible for me to imagine. Godspeed to that little girl, her mother and the rest of her family that will have to pick up the pieces and somehow move on from this. The courage displayed by this firefighter and the many many countless others who ran towards the trouble, not knowing or even caring whether another explosive device may have been waiting for them, is just magnificent. Truly inspiring.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

he is a Muslim extremist terrorist.

Repeatedly referring to him like this makes you out to be a bigot.

 

[Dotini]

Repeatedly referring to him like this makes you out to be a bigot.

It might be slightly more tactful to refer to him as the "accused Muslim extremist terrorist", or the "reported Muslim extremist terrorist".

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Or by his name.

 

[Caz]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eYhqABFjwLs&feature=youtube_gdata_player


This was a good read. Not really informational but a good read actually on the subject.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/mobileweb/gavin-shulman/are-the-boston-bombers-ju_b_3156038.html

 

[Hun200kmh]

Ok, let's settle this then. Johnnypenso defines these terrorists as muslims because that's part of the how they saw themselves and how they justified their actions.

So, if it's what the Tsarnaevs think and the way they see things that counts, I suppose we must conclude, referring to what happened, that ...

... two Muslim extremist terrorists attacked the United Christian States of America.

 

[Slash]

Anyone else hear that their next intended target was Times Square? I guess the FBI found plans

 

[Dotini]

Ok, let's settle this then. Johnnypenso defines these terrorists as muslims because that's part of the how they saw themselves and how they justified their actions.

So, if it's what the Tsarnaevs think and the way they see things that counts, I suppose we must conclude, referring to what happened, that ...

... two Muslim extremist terrorists attacked the United Christian States of America.

One stands accused, but not yet tried or convicted.

And it is incorrect to say "United Christian States of America", because the USA is a secular nation with freedom of religion for all.

Personally, I would say a misguided and disgruntled Chechen refugee with legal US status came under the influence of Muslim extremism, and convinced his misguided and disgruntled brother, a US citizen, to join him in doing something very terrible. Let's not get too carried away by extreme rhetoric of our own.