'Buttkicker' bass alternative - and 5.1 surround sound setup?

[trk29]

^Mr. Latte

Just curious where would you recommend someone putting their gamer2 (on their rig) and all other tactile,if they were going to do surround tactile?

 

[Mr Latte]

Probably on the "Center" channel and use it for your pedals.
It requires less strength or volume which would be ideal for a Gamer unit.

Mainly as our feet are very sensitive and you dont want it to be too distracting neither.


Im looking to group several tactile experienced cockpit owners, so if your into such please PM me guys.
The forum link in my sig will have a set of forums which is going to be quite dedicated to this sometimes confusing topic.

 

[Leemon]

It wouldnt be a problem if my country was in EU. The expenses regarding the delivery and customs are very big.

In specs of my AV it says: •preamp-level subwoofer output

That means that it doesnt have amplifier for that output?

And if I get it right you said that I can get LFE unit and it will work. And later to buy amplifier to power the LFE unit ( bass shaker) to get extra benefits from it?

 

[occasionalracer]

Thanks alot for you help man I think I still would have been stuck
So yeah now knowing that it WILL have different sounds from each speaker Im cool with that.

I've just seen these 'Logitech X-540'
and they seem the best speakers for me, even has a wired control for bass volume and 'matrix'

I totally would advise against opting for one of these cheap surround sound setups...

Either go for one those compact theaters that supports DD/DTS via optical.

OR opt for a used amplifier maybe 5 years old which supports 5.1., but you can start by using it as 2.1 system first, a nice little pair of stereo bookshelf speakers will blow that stale Logitech sound out the door. Trust me. There are tons of used receivers out there, then just find couple of small speakers used or new.. check these... and you're already getting decent sound, then just make a purchase for a cheap powered subwoofer or tacticle unit. You're set to rumble, and are free to add the other 3 speakers as time goes on.

I say this, because from personal/friends experience, seeing this supposed "matrix" technology as VERY improper. In movies this might still pass as being ok, but gaming.. there is no way a stupid amplifier can determine from which speaker the surround sound effect is meant to come from... so cars coming up behind/beside you is in no way as realistic as a true 5/7.1 separate channel decoding.

Trust me... there is no rush to by this imitation surround.. you'll waste your money on these fake ambient sounds coming from everywhere...you'll have better realistic stereo sound. Plus it looks waaay cooler to have a real amp sitting in your room.. never mind all the additional inputs for your PC, DVD, MP3 player! Don't rush it!

 

[Mr Latte]

It wouldnt be a problem if my country was in EU. The expenses regarding the delivery and customs are very big.

In specs of my AV it says: •preamp-level subwoofer output

That means that it doesnt have amplifier for that output?

And if I get it right you said that I can get LFE unit and it will work. And later to buy amplifier to power the LFE unit ( bass shaker) to get extra benefits from it?

I expect your sub out NOT TO BE AMPLIFIED/POWERED!
Therefore if you want a tactile unit to work with LFE you will need to connect an external amplifer.

Like the one linked friend.

I totally would advise against opting for one of these cheap surround sound setups...

We all have to start somewhere.
What you also have to realise is and Im sure their are people on these foums that have "Logitech" speaker setups and Im sure they will think they are pretty darn good.

The whole concept of the "all in one" is the simplicity.
Your now complicating the whole thing in yes recommending better but 2nd hand equipment that requires even more understanding to operate and configure.

As for "matrixed audio" on the contrary it can sound pretty damn good.
Additionally many high end amps take 5.1 and expand it to 7.1 or 9.1 with the same exact principle.
The only difference being they use a proper already multichannel source. Yet they add a simulated effect ontop.

Quite often I will play my games via "Matrixed Audio" soundfields like "Multichannel Stereo" so I certainly would not write off its uses or how it can sound. Personal taste like many DSP settings has a lot to do with it.

Sorry to disagree with you on this part.
I have recommended the Sony with Optical / HDMI digital input but it is beyond his very limited budget.

 

[occasionalracer]

As for "matrixed audio" on the contrary it can sound pretty damn good.
Additionally many high end amps take 5.1 and expand it to 7.1 or 9.1 with the same exact principle.

Ya but taking a 5.1 to 7/9.1 is a lot more accurate deal than taking stereo and separating it. Anyway I didn't think my advice was confusing at all, all receivers are practically the same so hooking a pair of speakers into the back of it is stupid simple.

Quite often I will play my games via "Matrxed Audio" soundfields like "Multichannel Stereo" so I certainly would not write off its uses or how it can sound. Personal taste like many DSP settings has a lot to do with it.

I never do.. whether I'm playing SNES or Richard Burns Rally, or even movies and music, none of these "technology's" have ever resulted in anything pleasing to me... personal preference indeed!


Also, I didn't think my advise was that complicated, all receivers are practically the same and speaker hookup is stupid simple.

 

[trk29]

Probably on the "Center" channel and use it for your pedals.
It requires less strength or volume which would be ideal for a Gamer unit.

Mainly as our feet are very sensitive and you dont want it to be too distracting neither.


Im looking to group several tactile experienced cockpit owners, so if your into such please PM me guys.
The forum link in my sig will have a set of forums which is going to be quite dedicated to this sometimes confusing topic.

Thanks for your advice. Couldn't I keep it on my same receiver since it is hooked up to the sub out and use my other receiver just for the surround tactile. Because if I hook it to my center channel I will have to have another amp correct?

 

[Mr Latte]

I never do.. whether I'm playing SNES or Richard Burns Rally, or even movies and music, none of these "technology's" have ever resulted in anything pleasing to me... personal preference indeed!


Also, I didn't think my advise was that complicated, all receivers are practically the same and speaker hookup is stupid simple.

While I agree some DSP and often is the case quite a lot of "soundfields" can ruin the actual source or enjoyment. I would say that their are good examples also which can create a more intense or enveloping soundstage particulary for games.

Yamaha for me always had the best "DSP" (on their high end models) but advances from both Dolby and DTS over the years have been impressive. The beauty is if you dont like it you can indeed just run standard stereo. Some however I believe and really thats a majority won't fuss so much over the original intended audio is being altered but how it may sound better coming from multiple speakers and using a sub via LFE from multichannel processing compared to just standard stereo. Particulary on cheap solutions which wont have that good of a stereo quality anyways.

Like how many people buy surround headphones and end up just using them in stereo only mode for gamming?

Also think your overlooking that for beginners it can indeed be quite daunting and a lot to take in regards setting up AV. The connections alone can baffle folk, the differences in various sound formats (as seen) the multiple speaker setup options. Multiple surround modes, adding or removing delay, setting independent volume levels for each channel. Configuring a sub crossover, gees their is quite a lot to pick up and learn for a first timer including probably a remote for them which at the start looks rather complicated.

Beginners have to start somewhere and really for this particular persons approx £100 budget their is little chance you could get a decent seperates solution including speakers, a sub and speaker cables even 2nd hand all in good condition and delivered for so little money.

Thanks for your advice. Couldn't I keep it on my same receiver since it is hooked up to the sub out and use my other receiver just for the surround tactile. Because if I hook it to my center channel I will have to have another amp correct?

You could keep the LFE tactile on the primary audio amplifer.
I would say though to try the Aura Pro unit using the BK amplifer, do compare them.
For quite the serious setup you are building I would recommend the BK4 or the "Mini Buttkicker" for the LFE role. Then use the "Gamer Tactile" on the center channel at your pedals from the secondary amp/reciever. You can tweak at volume output levels to help get the desired strength and/or match the others.

Stereo Mode Limitation
In keeping the LFE on the audio amp you could have a benefit of running just the audio amp for a single tactile experience when it is enough or you do not want the full experience. Yet you could however then use the secondary unit and run it only in stereo for music or some games. With the benefit that you still get the LFE tactile from the primary audio amplifer. Using stereo on most amplifers will cut off the LFE you see so you wouldnt get the LFE working at all if the tactile amp was in stereo. This way you would get 2.1 tactile and if you buy enough tactile units have upto 5.1 tactile at your control.

Headphones & Tactile:
If you plug in headphones but want tactile take note that plugging in headphones will cancel all speaker outputs including your LFE. So in this case you would need the LFE swapped over to the secondary tactile amplifer to still get all the tactile but using headphones on the primary amplifer. You could have it that you swap over your sub out if this would be a factor for you. Just remember to power them down before disconnecting and reconnecting.

 

[Leemon]

I am little boring, but i have another question.

When i connect active sub to AV reciever, can I connect aura pro bass shakers to active sub? As i can see some active subs have output for extra speakers. Are those outputs cut from high frequencies?

 

[Mr Latte]

I am little boring, but i have another question.

When i connect active sub to AV reciever, can I connect aura pro bass shakers to active sub? As i can see some active subs have output for extra speakers. Are those outputs cut from high frequencies?

It is likely a bypass to loop additional subs later.
The filters will typically only effect the internal amplifer for the sub.

Maybe read the manual however.
It will likely not power another external sub or in this case a tactile unit.

 

[trk29]

You could keep the LFE tactile on the primary audio amplifer.
I would say though to try the Aura Pro unit using the BK amplifer, do compare them.
For quite the serious setup you are building I would recommend the BK4 or the "Mini Buttkicker" for the LFE role. Then use the "Gamer Tactile" on the center channel at your pedals from the secondary amp/reciever. You can tweak at volume output levels to help get the desired strength and/or match the others.

Stereo Mode Limitation
In keeping the LFE on the audio amp you could have a benefit of running just the audio amp for a single tactile experience when it is enough or you do not want the full experience. Yet you could however then use the secondary unit and run it only in stereo for music or some games. With the benefit that you still get the LFE tactile from the primary audio amplifer. Using stereo on most amplifers will cut off the LFE you see so you wouldnt get the LFE working at all if the tactile amp was in stereo. This way you would get 2.1 tactile and if you buy enough tactile units have upto 5.1 tactile at your control.

Headphones & Tactile:
If you plug in headphones but want tactile take note that plugging in headphones will cancel all speaker outputs including your LFE. So in this case you would need the LFE swapped over to the secondary tactile amplifer to still get all the tactile but using headphones on the primary amplifer. You could have it that you swap over your sub out if this would be a factor for you. Just remember to power them down before disconnecting and reconnecting.

Thanks that is what I was thinking of doing, use it when I want it or just use some of the tactile. Regarding the headphone comment, with what I have now (gamer 2) I have the PS3 setup with multi out so when I use my wired headphones I can still use my gamer for the vibration. What's weird is butt kicker still gets signal even with the headphones plugged in. Of course I lose this with my new Sony branded wireless headphones. Yes I understand that if I was using tactile surround with a second receiver then I would lose it, thanks for saying that because I'm sure some didn't know. I wish I had the funds for the bigger buttkicker or I would do what you said oh maybe later I actually thought of getting one of those to use for my theater under my couch leg.

I may have to try the aurora thanks.

 

[VINCE__]

Here are some shots of my dual Gamer2 set up.

 

[VINCE__]

Whoops, sorry. My iPhone said it never loaded.

 

[trk29]

^Tell everyone how you have two Buttkicker's setup.

 

[the_greeze]

Are they positioned like that for some sort of stereo separation? If they are, surely they're too close together to notice which one is 'active'? Or are they set for one big kick up the a$$?! lol

 

[Mr Latte]

Are they positioned like that for some sort of stereo separation? If they are, surely they're too close together to notice which one is 'active'? Or are they set for one big kick up the a$$?! lol

He uses a Gamepod with the Buttkicker Plate and "Dual Mounting" option that they have. The metal plate that they attach to connects directly to the seat so the tactile flows throw the whole metal plate and into the seat mounts.

How have you found the "Gamer Tactile" compares to the Aura Pro, your one of very few I know has both?

 

[VINCE__]

Are they positioned like that for some sort of stereo separation? If they are, surely they're too close together to notice which one is 'active'? Or are they set for one big kick up the a$$?! lol

Yes stereo. You can tell a difference between LR. I had a mount break on me last week and I could feel it immediately.