Comparison Project cars vs Forza 6.

[PzR Slim]

I'm not saying one is better than the other, but I can pretty much guarantee I'll be playing one more often than the other.

Yet you were posting it in the Forza v PCars comparison thread. I thought you were suggesting the controller bug you had experienced in PCars was game breaking. I was asking whether the controller bug I'd experienced in Forza meant it was broken as well.

Lets not kid ourselves eh

 

[PzR Slim]

Sure PCARS has its strengths, but it was a mess at launch. Despite having gotten many of the issues fixed, it just doesn't excite the soul and relay the sheer thrill of racing like Forza does. My honest 2.

Forza Motorsport and the people who make it fundamentally misunderstand racing. That can be easily seen in many of the design decisions that have been made. PCars at it's very core is a racing game. It does every aspect of racing better than Forza. So how you can come up with the above statement boggles the mind.

 

[UKMikey]

Yet you were posting it in the Forza v PCars comparison thread. I thought you were suggesting the controller bug you had experienced in PCars was game breaking. I was asking whether the controller bug I'd experienced in Forza meant it was broken as well.

Lets not kid ourselves eh

I'm comparing my user experience with both games. Quit trying to put words in my mouth. You're the one talking about broken games, not me.

 

[PzR Slim]

I'm comparing my user experience with both games. Quit trying to put words in my mouth. You're the one talking about broken games, not me.

I'm sorry what?!

Whatever Forza is guilty of it hasn't exhibited any bugs as game breaking as that during play.

Honestly, you guys need to come up with some sort of coherent reasoning for your opinions because at the moment it just looks like you're blinded.

 

[Speedster911]

Forza Motorsport and the people who make it fundamentally misunderstand racing. That can be easily seen in many of the design decisions that have been made. PCars at it's very core is a racing game. It does every aspect of racing better than Forza. So how you can come up with the above statement boggles the mind.

Forza isn't a proper racing or even motorsport game to begin with - I don't know when they have that word in the title.

It is essentially a car game... or a car collector's game.. I remember reading somewhere a few years back where Dan was saying he got inspired to do Forza through a PC driving game called Midtown Madness. Crazy fun that game was.

Now when I say the "sheer thrill of racing", I certainly do not mean professional motorsport kind of racing.. but simply the on-track experience. It's that experience, which makes you want to play over and over again.

 

[UKMikey]

I'm sorry what?!



Honestly, you guys need to come up with some sort of coherent reasoning for your opinions because at the moment it just looks like you're blinded.

I'm supposed to come up with some sort of coherent reasoning for why you think I said Project Cars is broken?! The only thing blinding me is my experience actually playing both games, it looks like, so I'd respectfully ask you to please wind your neck in and leave people to play the game they prefer instead of jumping down their throats at every opportunity.

 

[PzR Slim]

I'm supposed to come up with some sort of coherent reasoning for why you think I said Project Cars is broken?! The only thing blinding me is my experience actually playing both games, it looks like, so I'd respectfully ask you to please wind your neck in and leave people to play the game they prefer instead of jumping down their throats at every opportunity.

Wind my neck in? Maybe you are Ronnie Pickering, lolz.

And I'm more than happy for you to play the game you prefer, how am I stopping you from doing that? But what I'm not about to do is sit here and let you talk a whole load of shoot. I'm going to call you out on it because if we have people talking a whole load of shoot we don't have an informed debate

 

[PzR Slim]

Forza isn't a proper racing or even motorsport game to begin with - I don't know when they have that word in the title.

It is essentially a car game... or a car collector's game.. I remember reading somewhere a few years back where Dan was saying he got inspired to do Forza through a PC driving game called Midtown Madness. Crazy fun that game was.

Now when I say the "sheer thrill of racing", I certainly do not mean professional motorsport kind of racing.. but simply the on-track experience. It's that experience, which makes you want to play over and over again.

Which is why I keep posting the below when this debate comes up.

I think it's pretty straightforward, if you want a car game, Forza 6 it is, if you want a racing game, it's PCars. Forza does cars better than Pcars and PCars does racing better than Forza.

Which is very funny when you think about it, PCars has cars in the title and Forza has motorsport in the title. More apt titles would be Forza Cars and Project Motorsport.

I would disagree with you about the thrill of racing though. Being able to run through a full race weekend with dynamic ToD and weather as well as a better handling and physics model means I enjoy the racing much more in PCars. That's my preference though, yours is different.

 

[HBR-Roadhog]

It's the same controller I use for Forza and it's never disconnected from my Xbox. If it's a driver issue then it's never exhibited it on any other PC game I play (Dirt Rally ot Grid AutoSport). As soon as I quit the race the controller magically came back to life in the menu but by that time I'd lost interest in my PCars session. If it was a physical connection break, then I'm not sure why Windows didn't make a USB disconnection or reconnection sound.

There were some issues using the XB1 controller with the PC in PCars. Mostly FFB related.
I used to have issues in FM3 and 4 with my wheel disconnecting from time to time as did my friends but we kept playing anyway. Never had a problem like that with any game other than Forza though.

 

[UKMikey]

Wind my neck in? Maybe you are Ronnie Pickering, lolz.

And I'm more than happy for you to play the game you prefer, how am I stopping you from doing that? But what I'm not about to do is sit here and let you talk a whole load of shoot. I'm going to call you out on it because if we have people talking a whole load of shoot we don't have an informed debate

The only load of shoot is you saying I'm calling the game broken and that no-one should play it. All I posted is that the controller cut out on me. The post was informed by my experience and any conclusions you've drawn are entirely your own.

I can now understand what @Mr Latte is talking about upthread regarding aggressive responses intimidating people out of posting their opinions and experiences.

 

[PzR Slim]

The only load of shoot is you saying I'm calling the game broken and that no-one should play it. All I posted is that the controller cut out on me. The post was informed by my experience and any conclusions you've drawn are entirely your own.

I can now understand what @Mr Latte is talking about upthread regarding aggressive responses intimidating people out of posting their opinions and experiences.

Honestly do you guys even think before you post? You claimed I was putting words in your mouth by saying you claimed PCars was broken. To refute that I posted a quote where you said exactly that. You then say this;

you saying I'm calling the game broken and that no-one should play it

Never once said that, so who is it that is putting words in peoples mouths?

As for the aggressive response card you are trying to play, what is 'wind your neck in' if it's not aggressive, poor little you

 

[UKMikey]

Honestly do you guys even think before you post? You claimed I was putting words in your mouth by saying you claimed PCars was broken. To refute that I posted a quote where you said exactly that. You then say this;



Never once said that, so who is it that is putting words in peoples mouths?

As for the aggressive response card you are trying to play, what is 'wind your neck in' if it's not aggressive, poor little you

It's a polite request to calm down. Police officers even use it so I don't think it counts as aggressive. All I'm saying is that I had a bad experience with the game. Once again, anything you want to read into it beyond that is not in my post. I'm not trying to wind people up with condescending language. If you don't want to respond respectfully to other user's post that's up to you but I think I'll leave you to it. I'm not playing any cards as I think the tone of your posts speaks for itself.

 

[PzR Slim]

It's a polite request to calm down. Police officers even use it so I don't think it counts as aggressive. All I'm saying is that I had a bad experience with the game. Once again, anything you want to read into it beyond that is not in my post. I'm not trying to wind people up with condescending language. If you don't want to respond respectfully to other user's post that's up to you but I think I'll leave you to it. I'm not playing any cards as I think the tone of your posts speaks for itself.

If it was a polite request you would have said, 'Would you please calm down.' A copper would never use that as it would potentially inflame a situation

And I think the back tracking and lack of response to the obvious things you have been called out on speaks volumes about yours. Now I'm off to do some hotlapping in Rivals before the rugby. Enjoy your evening.

 

[ImaRobot]

PCars was a mess. Horribly optimized controls and horribly fluctuating FPS is my biggest gripe with the game. I can't even enjoy it's advertised features because as soon as you approach the first turn with dynamic TOD and weather enabled it just becomes a crap shoot with its slow motion effects as well as fluctuating frames. You can't even gauge the turns because it will slow down the whole game wen you press the brakes and then when you let off the game goes back to normal throwing you off completely.

I'll gladly stick to the "inferior" tech because atleast I can use all of it's advertised features without problem.

@Speedster911 yes I still get the glitch with steering, I've had it for years now and I doubt it's going anywhere. I'm beginning to think it just might be a faulty controller because I'm noticing odd delays on other games too.

 

[killerjimbag]

PCars was a mess. Horribly optimized controls and horribly fluctuating FPS is my biggest gripe with the game. I can't even enjoy it's advertised features because as soon as you approach the first turn with dynamic TOD and weather enabled it just becomes a crap shoot with its slow motion effects as well as fluctuating frames. You can't even gauge the turns because it will slow down the whole game wen you press the brakes and then when you let off the game goes back to normal throwing you off completely.

I'll gladly stick to the "inferior" tech because atleast I can use all of it's advertised features without problem.

@Speedster911 yes I still get the glitch with steering, I've had it for years now and I doubt it's going anywhere. I'm beginning to think it just might be a faulty controller because I'm noticing odd delays on other games too.

Your kidding? What a load of BS. I play the game daily with my T300 and have not experienced anything close to what your posting. OK I get it,reading your posts, there us no sense even responding.

 

[TrevorPhilips]

Damn, man, it seems like you haven't even played Forza. The track lighting is already completely pre-baked, has been for 10 years, it doesn't cost any performance which is exactly why Forza is the only 1080p/60 racing game of this generation. And in fact during night racing track side lights cast dynamic shadows of the passing cars, and your car's headlights cast dynamic shadows of the opponents occluding them.

You can't pre-bake headlights no matter how hard you try. In regards to your car casting shadows, that is the only one. The one I was referring to in all my posts containing the pro's and con's. I have no idea how you got the impression I have never played a Forza, let alone didn't know it's lighting methods. I have worked with more game engines than I care to remember over the last 15 years. I kinda know a thing or two when it comes to this kind of stuff, what works best for certain situations and what does not.

At the end of the day Skazz asked a question, I gave the answer, a better answer than what is available now, something you are defending right now but don't like yourself.... I think you'll find your exact words were "But as far as actual rendering tech goes it's about 10 years behind competition, dynamic shadows should be standard by now" But for some reason when I give the obvious solution to the problem, you don't like it. If you take an interest in these things like I do, done as many tests as I have in various different engines and have been following the trends, you'd know this is the only feasible way forward, it simply is.

You may be just defensive because you think I am taking a pop at Turn 10 or the game. I know @ImaRobot did. I assure you that is not the case. I think the game is a great effort. For what it sets out for it achieves easily, both technically and practically. Flawless 1080p @ 60fps, 450+ of a nice broad selection of motors and enough tracks to keep anyone entertained enough to feel they got the moneys worth, easily. On top of that a good physics model and enough tools to keep you occupied for a long time off the track.

There is not much to complain about and I don't. If I were to give it a score from what I have played and seen it would be the highest Forza yet and I loved FM4, the most balanced and fun car game of the last generation of what I sunk a lot of hours in to. But forward+ is the elephant in the room, for me it's the standard cars debate all over again. Some people hate it, some people don't mind. If I feel they are bringing the game down I'm not going to let it slide over there without saying something so I'm not going to let it slide by over here either. Whether any one agrees or not.

This is a problem with straight up Forward rendering, but with Horizon 2 they've introduced Clustered Forward rendering which allows them to have any number of dynamic light sources. A good example is all the opponent AIs cast dynamic light that are identical to the one player's car uses and the draw distance for them is actually quite impressive compared to the majority of games in which they fade out a few meters from the camera or like GT6 that has player's car casting a light, one opponent car casting simplified light and the rest of the field not casting any light at all. This shot from me showcases this tech in action.

You have a knack of confusing yourself, you really do! Anyway I explained that above but one last thing I would add is that the clustered method was first used in FM5. I read a case study on the method and execution and what works and what did not a while back. The amount of times it mentioned or leaned towards ease of use and re-usable content confirmed it was a time choice. I don't blame them for it, but they will have to change it, I guarantee that.

 

[HBR-Roadhog]

PCars was a mess. Horribly optimized controls and horribly fluctuating FPS is my biggest gripe with the game. I can't even enjoy it's advertised features because as soon as you approach the first turn with dynamic TOD and weather enabled it just becomes a crap shoot with its slow motion effects as well as fluctuating frames. You can't even gauge the turns because it will slow down the whole game wen you press the brakes and then when you let off the game goes back to normal throwing you off completely.

I'll gladly stick to the "inferior" tech because atleast I can use all of it's advertised features without problem.

@Speedster911 yes I still get the glitch with steering, I've had it for years now and I doubt it's going anywhere. I'm beginning to think it just might be a faulty controller because I'm noticing odd delays on other games too.

Even on the PC version people were having slow down issues like you mention if they used an Xbox controller to try to drive. Something to do with the FFB in the controller triggers apparently caused the problem when using that controller.

Some Overclocked PCs were having some issues as well but most were fine. I know when I played it I was getting steady 60 FPS even with 56 cars on the track and I am using a mid level GPU.

 

[ImaRobot]

Your kidding? What a load of BS. I play the game daily with my T300 and have not experienced anything close to what your posting. OK I get it,reading your posts, there us no sense even responding.

Its a wide known issue. Whether you believe me or not doesn't matter, as there are even plenty of people vocal about it.

 

[killerjimbag]

Its a wide known issue. Whether you believe me or not doesn't matter, as there are even plenty of people vocal about it.

Please, really,I have 230 hours of game time on PCars. Using a controller to play a racing sim is akin to using a spoon to row a boat! I have never used a controller since 2003.I'm not a fanboy of any franchise,other people I wonder?

 

[ImaRobot]

Please, really,I have 230 hours of game time on PCars. Using a controller to play a racing sim is akin to using a spoon to row a boat! I have never used a controller since 2003.I'm not a fanboy of any franchise,other people I wonder?

Good for you. Although I'm not sure what this has to do with the subject, but ok.

 

[killerjimbag]

Good for you. Although I'm not sure what this has to do with the subject, but ok.

Look at your posts, I'm not doing it for you.

 

[ImaRobot]

Look at your posts, I'm not doing it for you.

So in other words, nothing. Whatever you seem to be going for, it means nothing as the issues you seem to be dismissive of are already acknowledged. Your stance on peripherals added nothing and had nothing to do with what is being said.

 

[killerjimbag]

So in other words, nothing. Whatever you seem to be going for, it means nothing as the issues you seem to be dismissive of are already acknowledged. Your stance on peripherals added nothing and had nothing to do with what is being said.

So your problems with your controller,playing PCars doesn't affect your game play? Now read your posts again. All people are not experiencing the same problems. Xbone users are having way more problems than PS4,PC users. Blame XBox not the game.