Debating about Camber

Lazy Liquid

Lazy Liquid

1,268
Brazil
Porto Alegre
LazyLiquid
Ok, guys. I don´t know about everyone here, but i do have some certain doubts about camber measures. All my life i tried to set the cambers based on the trial / error formula, but never being so sure of what i am doing. I noticed that mainly there are 2 things that can make your car drift slower if you setup wrong: Spring rates and camber elevation. Some users likes to looks diferent (or fancy, or even tacky) putting above 3.5 degrees on cambers, sometimes even 5 degrees. But is this the right decision?

Tecnicaly, when you decide to increase your camber, while you are going straight it will have fewer tire contact, but how is this same behavior on a corner, specialy while drifting?

More camber means more grip in a corner? Until witch degree of camber it stops to be proactive? Otherwise, what is the minimal to use it right?

About HP and weight, how and when it does change the right camber measure? For exemple, in a very low powered car with low weight (AE-86, for exemple), what is the best range of camber?

About rear / front... when put more camber on rear than in front?

Hehehehe, tons of questions, i know. But this veteran noob must know all about it. And maybe even more, depending how the discussion goes.
 
From GT5 racing experience, you can steal yourself an extra little bit of grip in corners by adding a small ammount of camber to the front and backs. The ammount however depends on your anti roll bars, weight of the car, tyre wear, and how you need the car to handle. (Just enough so that when the car rolls in turns the outside tyres become in full contact with the road) These numbers tend to only reach the 3.5 mark in extreme circumstances, myself usually running between 1 and 2.5 at most for my few FR racers.

Drifting on the other hand Doesn't really work the same, on comfort hards at the extreme outward forces we put on the tyres, there is not really any way to 'return' grip to those tyres without deflating them. :P

However (in my experience), camber acts as a direct control to reducing tyre grip, at differences most noticed in long continuous drifts, or when issues with over or under rotation occur on initiation or transitions.

I recently have switched from running [2.0-1.5] on all my drift cars to [1.0-1.5]. I found that running 2 on the front encouraged understeer (less grip on fronts) when trying to initiate or transition as smooth as possible (Slow rotational momentum to 'break' traction, required rear tyres to be trying to 'overtake' the fronts more, a quick tweak made a notable, preferred difference). This demonstrated how the camber can be used to balance the sliding of the car for whatever purpouse.

(Note I run my anti-roll bars at 6-6, personal preferance.)

Try to keep the rears below 2.0, as too high camber overall will reduce the 'feel' of the road (most notably on the wheel), will engourage the car to run wide off the track and will reduce the car's drifting speed. Set the rears to a set ammount, and vary the front camber in relation the backs. ([1.0-2.0]=encouraged oversteer, [3.0-2.0]=Encouraged understeer)

Aim to 'find' what could make your car more comfortable to drift, and tweak
Accordingly.
 
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For comp cars with stiff setups I run around 1.0 on front and 0.5 on rear because the car is leaning in the corner less but with cars like my 86 The camber on front is around 3.0 and 1.0 on rear. I use less camber on rear because some drifter a while back said you need less on rear to give the wheels more grip. Al I do is just go into the settings, tune it, take it on track and think "that'll do. Feels good." For me the LSD is more critical to a cars handling than the Camber. It is important to tune it a bit but it's not terribly important.

Also, I feel the max camber that should ever be set is around 2.5 or 4.0 because after that the wheels have too much angle and don't contact the rad well enough in corners
 
Good tips. Ill try reduce my standards (around 2.0 to 3.5) in some of my favorite cars to less (1.0 to 2.0 max) and see if ill gain some speed, specialy in the corner exits (my biggest weakness).

By the way, why some people put more camber on rear than in front? What kind of situation you could try this inversion?
 
Lazy Liquid
Good tips. Ill try reduce my standards (around 2.0 to 3.5) in some of my favorite cars to less (1.0 to 2.0 max) and see if ill gain some speed, specialy in the corner exits (my biggest weakness).

By the way, why some people put more camber on rear than in front? What kind of situation you could try this inversion?
Click to expand...

I only ever put more camber on rear with my troll drift cars which need the reduced tyre surface area to drift. However, it is a better idea to adjust the toe out if you want that effect so the tyres grip the corner while maintaining slide
 
More camber in the front: more steering response, encouraged oversteer, snappier transitions. GT5 isn't enough of a drifting sim to worry about camber too much (how it affects the inside tire vs the outside one).

3.5 on the front is a good max and 2.5 on the rear is a good max. There's an article by team orange that talks about it. i'll post it here later.
 
No Chris he is right ;)

I run all my cars with around 2.5-3.0 on the front and 0.5 on the back. You essentially want the back abit softer than the front with minimal camber , this allows the back to be controllable and have the grip you need . Adding lots of camber to the rear makes it wayward and have no control.
 
I always hit between 1 and 2 on front and 4 and 7 on the rear , but that's me.

(I only used 7 rear camber on the 1.5k RAM to look like a RWD . Crazy rear style :crazy:)
 
ps3dan101
No Chris he is right ;)

I run all my cars with around 2.5-3.0 on the front and 0.5 on the back. You essentially want the back abit softer than the front with minimal camber , this allows the back to be controllable and have the grip you need . Adding lots of camber to the rear makes it wayward and have no control.
Click to expand...
Yeh Drifting is about grip, you want more on the back...
 
4.0 to 6.0 camber is what I use at the front. Never go above 1.3 at the rear.
 
ProtegeDrifter
More camber in the front: more steering response, encouraged oversteer, snappier transitions. GT5 isn't enough of a drifting sim to worry about camber too much (how it affects the inside tire vs the outside one).

3.5 on the front is a good max and 2.5 on the rear is a good max. There's an article by team orange that talks about it. i'll post it here later.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the feedback. These valors was exactly what i used before start this thread and notice that i was doing something wrong about cambers. After 1 year and a half drifting in this game on CH and always getting used to drift easily, but slower than some top drifters in our community, i noticed that this "standard recipe based in real life" of camber measures was not working optimaly.

So yeah, what you had said is not all wrong, but doesn´t brings the drift settings using CH into a next level. And looking for that "next level" is what made me start this thread.

After read the first answers in this thread, i started to change in some of my favorite drift cars the 3.5 pattern to 1.8 max, and i already found some significant improvement.
 
Between 1 - 2,5 in the front, and 0.3 - 0.8 in rear. (Wheel settings)
Controller: 0 - 0.5 in front, 0 in rear.
 
i usually run more front camber than rear. My reason being - more front grip means it's easier to ge the car sliding.

My preference however is between 2.0 - 3.5 in front and between 0.9 - 2.0 in the rear
 
Again, the main point here to be discussed is - in CH situations - untill what camber degrees it stops to increase grip and start to be messy.

Some people defends the same standards than real life (around 3.0 on front) and somebody else (including myself now) are using fewer camber on front.

Considering weight, HP and the CH tires... the realistic x optimal is the point where should be spotted this discussion.
 
Lazy Liquid
Again, the main point here to be discussed is - in CH situations - untill what camber degrees it stops to increase grip and start to be messy.

Some people defends the same standards than real life (around 3.0 on front) and somebody else (including myself now) are using fewer camber on front.

Considering weight, HP and the CH tires... the realistic x optimal is the point where should be spotted this discussion.
Click to expand...

5F 3R... That is where I find it to become stupid... Hope that helps
 
ProtegeDrifter
Fine want something more specific? Go figure it out than asking others and replying in a sarcastic manner.
Click to expand...

Not sarcasm from my side, im saying it seriously. Its bloody obvious that "Back To the Future Hoover Delorian" cambers are ridiculous by itself and i wouldn´t use them even if they was the optimal for drifting, never.

But people are losing the focous on the main question. I´ts not "what", because actualy its "why" you use these range or camber degree. You said already that you try to replicate what people use in real life - witch is legit, and was the same range that i used before start the thread - but im starting to realise that CH + GT5 physics demands fewer camber for drifting.

We have 2 points here about CH. Who defends the CH, its because the grip breaking and grip recover is more realistic for drifting than any other. Who is against, complains that is so much hard to stay on the track after the car lose grip because is splashes away too much (at least much more than what they consider realistic). Also, CH is noticiable harder to domain in the corner exits and banked situations, comparing to another tires.

What im trying to find is how to still use CH with his sweet traction transition, but not splashing away so much, having a more efficient corner exit and a bit easier domain in elevations. And thats where the debate should keeps: What camber range it starts to be not that beneficial for the CH. Again, i drifted for a long time using around 2.6~3.2 on front and 2.0~2.5 on rears, but im starting to accept that this is beyond the necessary.

No harsh, no hard feelings. Im just want to be sure that this dead horse will not raise from the graves after several hits. And im still not that sure yet.
 
I apologize liquid. Thanks for clearing that up 👍. Back to the thread:

In my opinion, I feel like real life camber stilll makes the car handle the best due to the amount of control you have over the car. You don't ever have to force anything and the car slides effortlessly. However, this is based off of my G27 experience so it may very from view-to-view and DS3-to-DFGT-to-etc.
 
Lazy Liquid
Good tips. Ill try reduce my standards (around 2.0 to 3.5) in some of my favorite cars to less (1.0 to 2.0 max) and see if ill gain some speed, specialy in the corner exits (my biggest weakness).

By the way, why some people put more camber on rear than in front? What kind of situation you could try this inversion?
Click to expand...

I run my z33 with 2.5f 3.5 rear and it feels great but it's the only car I use witch has more rear camber than front usually I use between 0.0 and 1.0 on rear and between 1.0 and 3.0 on front
 

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