Do you believe in God?

[CodeName]

Those are not just questions asked by atheists. However, they probably come to different answers than those from theists. Answers like "don't know", "can't know" and "don't care" are among those.

Don't know? You know what it means? It means you don't know, but we know every questions of life.

By "man in the sky" I was referring to God.

That is pretty much what Christianity and many other religions are based upon.

God has created 7 sky. We are only in the first and we will never go to the second. GOD is in the 7'th sky and he will never show himself because he is too glorious, this is why he send messages with prophets and sometimes, he sent angels.

By "man in the sky" I was referring to God.

That is pretty much what Christianity and many other religions are based upon.

Yes because bible and torah also were GOD's message, but the only one today is the quran.

 

[Famine]

Be secure enough in your beliefs to believe in them without seeking proof. Don't try to prove them because that denies your beliefs.

...

So most people want to search and know which religion is the real.

No, they don't.

Most people think their religion is the real one or that no religions are the real one. Those who want to know which is real are in the minority.

The big bang theory is described

The Islamic creation myth is barely any different from the Christian and Jewish ones.

the sirius star ( his movement and calculations )

Wow. Imagine if that hadn't been spotted, logged and chronicled 3,000 years earlier. That'd be something.

Incidentally, I never said anything about life after death or the purpose of life.

 

[Carbonox]

Multi quote button combined with edit, please.

 

[CodeName]

...No, they don't.

Most people think their religion is the real one or that no religions are the real one. Those who want to know which is real are in the minority.The Islamic creation myth is barely any different from the Christian and Jewish ones.Wow. .

Yes because the bible and the torah also was the words of GOD. But now, these religion are corrupted, knowing that they are described, why don't you agree with reality?
http://www.alislam.org/library/books/revelation/part_4_section_5.html
This website described the Quran and the cosmology, if you are looking for prooves, then go there.

 

[Famine]

Yes because the bible and the torah also was the words of GOD. But now, these religion are corrupted, knowing that they are described, why don't you agree with reality?

I do - all three are a rehashing of much older Mesopotamian myths. I agree with the reality of this because I have nothing invested in believing any one of them is a special one.

This website described the Quran and the cosmology, if you are looking for prooves, then go there.

Be secure enough in your beliefs to believe in them without seeking proof. Don't try to prove them because that denies your beliefs.

That aside, there's not a single shred of proof that any form of modern cosmology was known about and written about in the Qu'ran on that page. There's a lot of conjecture and interpretation (as is common when religions try to prove themselves) about what was written and how it relates to modern cosmology, but there's no way to read the Qu'ran with no knowledge of astrophysics and learn about stellar evolution, neutrinos, inflation, relativity or any other aspect of cosmology from the Qu'ran alone.

It's a traditional practice seen with such mundanities as Nostradamus. You can't tell the future from the quatrains, but people insist on interpreting them to their own ends and applying them to past events and pretending he knew about them in advance.

 

[CodeName]

I do - all three are a rehashing of much older Mesopotamian myths. I agree with the reality of this because I have nothing invested in believing any one of them is a special one.That aside, there's not a single shred of proof that any form of modern cosmology was known about and written about in the Qu'ran on that page. There's a lot of conjecture and interpretation (as is common when religions try to prove themselves) about what was written and how it relates to modern cosmology, but there's no way to read the Qu'ran with no knowledge of astrophysics and learn about stellar evolution, neutrinos, inflation, relativity or any other aspect of cosmology from the Qu'ran alone.

It's a traditional practice seen with such mundanities as Nostradamus. You can't tell the future from the quatrains, but people insist on interpreting them to their own ends and applying them to past events and pretending he knew about them in advance.

What is fabulous is that, every signs, prooves, and evidences i post or I will post, you wouldn't agree with this reality, you are not open to change your way of life, you like as it is, you don't like changes. Try to open your mind to something different then the conversation's gonna start.

 

[Famine]

What is fabulous is that, every signs, prooves, and evidences i post or I will post, you wouldn't agree with this reality, you are not open to change your way of life, you like as it is, you don't like changes.

I keep telling you, the advantage of being an atheist is that we approach all religions with equal merit. However those who've chosen a religion have a great deal invested in having their choice as the right one. We like not knowing things, because it means we get to try to find out, while those who've set their stall out on a religion don't like the questions it raises.

You cannot prove belief. You cannot give evidence of belief. You cannot believe in something that has been proven through evidence - you can accept it or disbelieve it. You can only believe in something that has neither proof nor evidence.

If you believe in your religion, believe in it. Don't seek to prove it - because doing so denies your own belief.

Try to open your mind to something different then the conversation's gonna start.

The problem is that having a mind that is too open causes your brain to fall out.

You're convinced Islam is right. I'm sure many Christians and Jews are convinced Christianity and Judaism are right. You're convinced that the message of your book is that their books are corruptions, while they're convinced that the message of their books (being older) are the original and yours came about from more corrupt people.

Given that I approach all three positions as being questionable, the notion of being told to have an open mind by someone closed off to any concept other than "my book is right" and seeking to prove that which cannot be proven and should not be attempted to be proven is laughable.

Your position is immutable - Islam is right and there is no argument. Mine is changeable - whatever can be proven to likely be right (by way of proving it isn't wrong) through independent and repeatable experiment is probably right. Which of us is closed-minded?

 

[Denur]

Don't know? You know what it means? It means you don't know, but we know every questions of life.

No, you claim to know every answer to all questions of life.

 

[CodeName]

I keep telling you, the advantage of being an atheist is that we approach all religions with equal merit. However those who've chosen a religion have a great deal invested in having their choice as the right one. We like not knowing things, because it means we get to try to find out, while those who've set their stall out on a religion don't like the questions it raises.

You cannot prove belief. You cannot give evidence of belief. You cannot believe in something that has been proven through evidence - you can accept it or disbelieve it. You can only believe in something that has neither proof nor evidence.

If you believe in your religion, believe in it. Don't seek to prove it - because doing so denies your own belief.The problem is that having a mind that is too open causes your brain to fall out.

You're convinced Islam is right. I'm sure many Christians and Jews are convinced Christianity and Judaism are right. You're convinced that the message of your book is that their books are corruptions, while they're convinced that the message of their books (being older) are the original and yours came about from more corrupt people.

Given that I approach all three positions as being questionable, the notion of being told to have an open mind by someone closed off to any concept other than "my book is right" and seeking to prove that which cannot be proven and should not be attempted to be proven is laughable.

Your position is immutable - Islam is right and there is no argument. Mine is changeable - whatever can be proven to likely be right (by way of proving it isn't wrong) through independent and repeatable experiment is probably right. Which of us is closed-minded?

Yes but things are, there are no doubt in islam and many doubt in other religion.
Surah I like ( arabic to english):

Say, "He is Allah , [who is] One,
Allah , the Eternal Refuge.
He neither begets nor is born,
Nor is there to Him any equivalent."

 

[Famine]

Yes but things are, there are no doubt in islam and many doubt in other religion.

While the other religions say the exact same thing about their religions compared to yours. You believe what you believe because you believe it - not because it's more factual (which would immediately destroy the point of it), but because you believe it to be so.

It's trite, but when you see why you question all the religions apart from your own, you'll see why yours can be questioned too.

 

[CodeName]

While the other religions say the exact same thing about their religions compared to yours. You believe what you believe because you believe it - not because it's more factual (which would immediately destroy the point of it), but because you believe it to be so.

It's trite, but when you see why you question all the religions apart from your own, you'll see why yours can be questioned too.

Proof that christianity is false:
ALLAH has sent jesus to correct the older religion ( jews ) .
He also sent the book to jesus but many have changed it because there were things they didn't like. You can see major changes from an old bible and a recent one.
The quran came and ALLAH has promised us that he will take car of this book and will not let anyone change it ( things he didn't say with the bible). I you find the older quran, you won't see any changes.

 

[BobK]

That's not proof, that's unsubstantiated claims.

 

[niky]

The good is subjective, and I guess the real issue is not how to show what is right or wrong, but how to reconcile the differences between beliefs. I think that in the end, that is something we will never truly know, but must be dealt with.

drunk driving is not wrong until you violate someone, just saying.

Penalties are almost as stiff where there is no victim as they are when the victim dies(where I live).

Answering both in detail in the Human Rights thread... here:

https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showthread.php?p=8077651#post8077651

 

[Famine]

Proof that christianity is false:
ALLAH has sent jesus to correct the older religion ( jews ) .
He also sent the book to jesus but many have changed it because there were things they didn't like. You can see major changes from an old bible and a recent one.
The quran came and ALLAH has promised us that he will take car of this book and will not let anyone change it ( things he didn't say with the bible). I you find the older quran, you won't see any changes.

That's not proof, that's unsubstantiated claims.

Quite so - and still trying to prove belief...

 

[Liquid]

Proof that christianity is false:
ALLAH has sent jesus to correct the older religion ( jews ) .
He also sent the book to jesus but many have changed it because there were things they didn't like. You can see major changes from an old bible and a recent one.
The quran came and ALLAH has promised us that he will take car of this book and will not let anyone change it ( things he didn't say with the bible). I you find the older quran, you won't see any changes.

You saying it, doesn't make it true.

That is not 'proof'.

 

[Kingland093]

Proof that christianity is false:
ALLAH has sent jesus to correct the older religion ( jews ) .
He also sent the book to jesus but many have changed it because there were things they didn't like. You can see major changes from an old bible and a recent one.
The quran came and ALLAH has promised us that he will take car of this book and will not let anyone change it ( things he didn't say with the bible). I you find the older quran, you won't see any changes.

The changes are probably due to different translations throughout the years
Plus, some denominations omit some Old Testament books (don't understand why)

 

[Azuremen]

The quran came and ALLAH has promised us that he will take car of this book and will not let anyone change it ( things he didn't say with the bible). I you find the older quran, you won't see any changes.

Minus the addition of diacritical marks, you mean?

 

[CodeName]

Minus the addition of diacritical marks, you mean?

Why does it need changes like this? If the bible didn't say to people things wrong like jesus ( peace be upon him ) is God or his son, the quran wouldn't even came. If people didn't change the bible for the first time, the bible would say jesus ( peace be upon him ) is a prophet and sent by GOD.

You saying it, doesn't make it true.

That is not 'proof'.

Why don't you see or accept with reality?
The only book that came to jesus wa the bible and no other book. Do you think that if you change the words of GOD, it steel words of GOD? No. The Quran came and isn't chaned since 1400 years. There are NON ERRORS in the Quran in Arabic because it came in Arabic to the prophet ( peace be upon him ) . Some errors that you find in it, you don't find them in arabic because arabic is a verry different from english or other languages.
Many people say that changes from bible are only translations changes. No. Jesus has never celebrated christmas or the born of Moses ( peace be upon them ) . People have created many things, and they still blind and trying to say this is the book.

 

[orimarc]

So the Qu'ran hasn't changed during the years like the Bible has. That doesn't make it "true", and it definitely doesn't make it "right", specially if it still includes things like stoning women to death.

 

[Famine]

Why don't you see or accept with reality?

The reality is that, like most theists, you have a great deal invested in your chosen religion being the right one and will refuse to consider any possibility that it isn't as a result.

But as I've said many times now, you cannot prove belief. You shouldn't try to either. You should just believe - or don't.

 

[CodeName]

So the Qu'ran hasn't changed during the years like the Bible has. That doesn't make it "true", and it definitely doesn't make it "right", specially if it still includes things like stoning women to death.

It never says that, TV always give a bad view of Islam for some reason.
In the surah of women in the quran, it says :

Men are in charge of women by [right of] what Allah has given one over the other and what they spend [for maintenance] from their wealth. So righteous women are devoutly obedient, guarding in [the husband's] absence what Allah would have them guard. But those [wives] from whom you fear arrogance - [first] advise them; [then if they persist], forsake them in bed; and [finally], strike them. But if they obey you [once more], seek no means against them. Indeed, Allah is ever Exalted and Grand.

Already, the first thing that I want to emphasize is that the Book of Allah said, any believers to leave the marital bed when they want, or beat their wives when they want . Say otherwise is a slur on the book of Allah. The Qur'an clearly tells us about the attitude to have towards wife:

"And you behave appropriately towards them. If you have dislike them during cohabitation,
it may be that you have the dislike something in which Allah has deposited a great thing. "
[Surah 4 - Verse 19]

The Prophet Muhammad said for his part:

"That belief has no aversion to a believer, if she hates behavior,
Then he has to approved of her other behavior. "

The Koran, referring to the intimate relationship between husband and wife, said:

"They are your garments and you are their garments."
(Sura 2 / Verse 187)

The Prophet had also confirmed about Salman al Farissi companion who said to Abu Darda-Ed:

"Know that Allah has rights over you, that your" nafs "(your person) has rights over you and your wife has rights over you, then give each his right" (He told that, when pretext to get closer to his Lord, Abu Darda-Ed 'was abandoned by his wife, to the point where it had complained saying he had no desire for good this life. (Hadith narrated by Al Bukhari and others.))

 

[Liquid]

Why don't you see or accept with reality?
The only book that came to jesus wa the bible and no other book. Do you think that if you change the words of GOD, it steel words of GOD? No. The Quran came and isn't chaned since 1400 years. There are NON ERRORS in the Quran in Arabic because it came in Arabic to the prophet ( peace be upon him ) . Some errors that you find in it, you don't find them in arabic because arabic is a verry different from english or other languages.
Many people say that changes from bible are only translations changes. No. Jesus has never celebrated christmas or the born of Moses ( peace be upon them ) . People have created many things, and they still blind and trying to say this is the book.

Bolded section - Oh. The irony. The literal, Goddamned irony.

As for the rest of your post;

[Citation needed]

You are free to believe it if you want to, but just because it is in a book, does not make it fact. Not without evidence and falsifiability.

Your premise is that because it is in a book and very old it is therefore infallible. I once read in a book that a decorated WW2 veteran called Sir Hugo Drax tried to launch a nuclear strike over the south coast of England. I'm pretty sure that never happened either.

Mohammed himself even said "Seek knowledge, even if it is in China". At the time, China was the centre of cultural and technological innovation. What Mohammed was saying, is that it is entirely possible that one can seek knowledge and truth outside of Islam, and that it is wrong to blindly accept things. And they did seek knowledge. Between the 4th century and the 12th century, while Europe was in the dark ages and spreading the good word of Christianity by slaughtering natives, the Middle East was the centre of almost absolutely everything that mattered. Science and academia thrived in the Middle East in this period. Right up until the 12th century, when Islam, much like the Chinese and Japanese, put up the shutters and cut themselves off from the rest of the world. Europe took over the torch of knowledge, and haven't really looked back.

You say that Islam is more correct than Christianity because it is older. The Greeks, Romans, Egyptians, Babylonians and countless other civilizations were older than Islam or the Koran. Tell me, what makes them wrong and you right?

 

[CodeName]

Bolded section - Oh. The irony. The literal, Goddamned irony.

As for the rest of your post;

[Citation needed]

You are free to believe it if you want to, but just because it is in a book, does not make it fact. Not without evidence and falsifiability.

Your premise is that because it is in a book and very old it is therefore infallible. I once read in a book that a decorated WW2 veteran called Sir Hugo Drax tried to launch a nuclear strike over the south coast of England. I'm pretty sure that never happened either.

Mohammed himself even said "Seek knowledge, even if it is in China". At the time, China was the centre of cultural and technological innovation. What Mohammed was saying, is that it is entirely possible that one can seek knowledge and truth outside of Islam, and that it is wrong to blindly accept things. And they did seek knowledge. Between the 4th century and the 12th century, while Europe was in the dark ages and spreading the good word of Christianity by slaughtering natives, the Middle East was the centre of almost absolutely everything that mattered. Science and academia thrived in the Middle East in this period. Right up until the 12th century, when Islam, much like the Chinese and Japanese, put up the shutters and cut themselves off from the rest of the world. Europe took over the torch of knowledge, and haven't really looked back.

In the Quran ( book of GOD ) , it clearly says don't believe something other than the words of GOD. Muhammad was the pessenger of GOD, he never missed his mission there to warn people. He says to look at knowledge every where. He meant to look after science, history... Because as i said earlier, GOD say that the one who is more intelligent, he is more near with me. After that, the muslim empire used every old science methods of many country like the compass and many other things.

 

[Liquid]

You are either deliberately not understanding what we are saying, or are so blind you cannot. And I don't know which is worse.

I won't respond to your drivel anymore.

 

[Dennisch]

In the Quran ( book of GOD ) ,

The bible seems to be the book of god too. And the torah. So, either, you guys (religious) are all right, or as normal people tend to think, you guys are all wrong.

Your book, the quran, is just another fancy old fairy tale book like all the others.
But you already, like many others before you, are so blinded by your faith that you won't or can't accept you could be wrong.

 

[Liquid]

I won't respond to your drivel anymore.

Except for this post script. I just realised that when you quoted my post, CodeName, you conveniently didn't quote this section;

You say that Islam is more correct than Christianity because it is older. The Greeks, Romans, Egyptians, Babylonians and countless other civilizations were older than Islam or the Koran. Tell me, what makes them wrong and you right?

Oh.

 

[Zenith]

"My book is the word of god!"

"How do you know?"

"God said so!"

"Where?"

"Here in this book!"

Circular reasoning works because circular reasoning works because...

 

[Kingland093]

The bible seems to be the book of god too. And the torah. So, either, you guys (religious) are all right, or as normal people tend to think, you guys are all wrong.

well the Torah is actually the first few books of the Old Testament

 

[Dennisch]

well the Torah is actually the first few books of the Old Testament

I know. I was pointing out an obvious silly.

 

[arora]

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