Europe - The Official Thread

[Keef]

Nope, they were just smoking subprime joints. FAN-TAS-TIC interest rates, dude ...

(not that the german bankers say "dude", they're a lot closer to the "other" Jeff Lebowski).

I understand that Germany houses most of the problem but given modern Keynsian economics it's plenty likely that they'll stupidly attempt to bolster their bottom line by invading debtors and claiming their resources. The logic is that if they're going to get their money back they have to do it with force before they actually go broke.

 

[Encyclopedia]

I find it funny that Germany, once the über powerhouse on the fields of battle, is going to pretty much dominate Europe via economic means.

Those crafty Germans up to no good again.

 

[Sphinx]

If you were Greek, where would your hard earned savings be right now?

Still sitting in the bank?
Under the mattress?
Silver & Gold etc?
Overseas account?
A hole in the garden Roman style?
Elsewhere?

 

[Dotini]

If you were Greek, where would your hard earned savings be right now?

Still sitting in the bank?
Under the mattress?
Silver & Gold etc?
Overseas account?
A hole in the garden Roman style?
Elsewhere?

The conventional wisdom on CNBC says that Greeks will have a run on their banks, withdrawing Euros before they become drachma.

Respectfully,
Steve

 

[Touring Mars]

The conventional wisdom on CNBC says that Greeks will have a run on their banks, withdrawing Euros before they become drachma.

Respectfully,
Steve

Typical CNBC... always making a drachma out of a crisis.

 

[Hun200kmh]

Everyone compares Portugal to Greece so, being portuguese and trying to be careful with my own savings I'll tell you what I did:

- I converted cash into farmland (prices have come down lately). With bank support, they do need to lend money and they will do it if you also have some of your own to invest.
- I converted cash into a country house (same thing about prices coming down, same thing about this being done partly with my money, partly with bank money)
- I made two investments. One is of moderate risk and pays close to 9% (portuguese sovereign debt but short term, well within the "troika" deal and we - Portugal - have not derailed so far). The other is a deposit (5% per year, not bad) in an investment bank that is owned by portuguese but "works" and invests mainly abroad. Oh, and is not involved (directly at least) with the Greek sovereign debt.

I think I am as covered as I can be. The other option would be to put all my savings in good foreign banks. But partly by national pride and national solidarity, partly because I don't think having all your savings in cash is advisable, I didn't go that way.

PS - Anyway, I live with what I earn by working. And that's still my main concern. That I will be able to work, and that the people I work for are still able to pay me. Because if that fails (and it might) in a couple of years I will posting in gtplanet from Brasil, Angola, Moçambique or Macau. I like places where I can speak portuguese and be understood

 

[Sphinx]

The conventional wisdom on CNBC says that Greeks will have a run on their banks, withdrawing Euros before they become drachma.

Respectfully,
Steve

A tad risky:

Check the serial numbers on your euro notes or you could be left with "funny money", a leading British travel company warned yesterday in response to the deepening crisis involving the single currency.

DialAFlight told customers: "Although nobody is quite sure what will happen if Greece is ejected from the euro, we think it is possible that Greek euro notes would have to be used as a temporary currency."

The company urged people to check their euro currency to look for the country of origin: Greek notes begin with the letter "Y" and Spanish notes with the letter "V".

http://www.independent.co.uk/travel/simon-calder/beware-greek-euros-travel-company-warns-7746780.html

 

[Hun200kmh]

Sphinx, it would never work like that, the notes are scattered all over Europe, so are the coins (I just checked, in my pocket I have coins from portugal, spain, germany, france and ireland).

I think the transitional period would be run under some kind of "overprinted" notes and, about the coins, probably they would recover the drachmas (I think they have been collected but not melt. Can be wrong though).

 

[Dotini]

When fear permeates markets, hard assets are advisable, no?

Respectfully,
Steve

 

[Sphinx]

Sphinx, it would never work like that, the notes are scattered all over Europe, so are the coins (I just checked, in my pocket I have coins from portugal, spain, germany, france and ireland).

I think the transitional period would be run under some kind of "overprinted" notes and, about the coins, probably they would recover the drachmas (I think they have been collected but not melt. Can be wrong though).

I wouldn't know to be honest. The only time I buy Euro's is when I go on holiday. Currently looking at Greece if the Euro continues to devalue, I've heard it's quite nice this time of year.

 

[Keef]

hard earned savings

Hard earned savings made especially difficult by prolonged bouts of Mediterranean-style relaxation.

My Big Fat Greek Naptime.

 

[Touring Mars]

Hard earned savings made especially difficult by prolonged bouts of Mediterranean-style relaxation.

That's a very unfair generalisation. (OK, it was also a joke, but still...)

 

[Sphinx]

Hard earned savings made especially difficult by prolonged bouts of Mediterranean-style relaxation.

My Big Fat Greek Naptime.

Hook line and sinker.

You're becoming too predictable, Keef.

 

[Keef]

Hook line and sinker.

My weakness. You have found it.

 

[Dennisch]

New elections in Greece. 17th of June.


And the Greek people are taking up their savings, coming close to a billion Euro now. So, my Drachma's will be worth something soon!

 

[Dotini]

Typical CNBC... always making a drachma out of a crisis.

The much despised CNBC reports a run on Greek banks, with the withdrawal of 700,000,000 Euros.
http://www.cnbc.com/id/47428134

Contagion is the next ugly thing to be feared. This means that depositors in other banks around Europe may be inclined to make withdrawals, either before the banks chain their doors, or the Euro declines precipitously in value. Those holding Euros and fearing the worst may decide to convert them into dollars or into hard assets.

Cautiously submitted,
Steve

 

[Keef]

The much despised CNBC reports a run on Greek banks, with the withdrawal of 700,000,000 Euros.
http://www.cnbc.com/id/47428134

Contagion is the next ugly thing to be feared. This means that depositors in other banks around Europe may be inclined to make withdrawals, either before the banks chain their doors, or the Euro declines precipitously in value. Those holding Euros and fearing the worst may decide to convert them into dollars or into hard assets.

Cautiously submitted,
Steve

Hmm, where have I heard this before...

Oh yeah, that's where. Luckily all we need is another world war to pull ourselves out of it.

 

[Carbonox]

Even though I oppose all those Greek rioters who opposed Finland because we didn't just blindly give them money, I'd happily take them here to work and to replace all the bad immigrants that we currently have (rapists and beggars).

 

[Dotini]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/...-euro-exit-looms-closer-as-banks-crumble.html
This makes it sound like the end is near.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-18098505
Cameron says austerity will save the world.



"When in danger or in doubt, run in circles, scream and shout!"

 

[Touring Mars]

To be fair, The Telegraph has been saying that Greece is "on the brink" for atleast two years, if not longer... that said, everything that has been done so far to avert collapse has either not worked or never stood a chance of working in the first place.

 

[Vince_Fiero]

To be fair, The Telegraph has been saying that Greece is "on the brink" for atleast two years, if not longer... that said, everything that has been done so far to avert collapse has either not worked or never stood a chance of working in the first place.

California? 2012 is not as bad as 2009, why is California not leaving the dollar zone?

The Budget is not like household money.

It seems that if Europe wants (like the US has done since 173 years), they can live with not having a balanced budget and just print money, allow some devaluation of the Euro. If the Germans do not want to live with the rest of Europe, should they not leave?

IMHO the Greeks deserve a lesson, giving false statements, not wanting to bend to the common rules, .... but the Germans are not the only ones to decide and there are multiple ways possible. Clearly if the Greeks want the money from Europe, they need to fulfill the conditions. If Europe does not lend the money, they will have to handle the effect on the Euro.

Germany too has been in violation of European Union budget rules in recent years, posting a deficit of 4.3 percent of gross domestic product (GDP) in 2010.

 

[Keef]

California? 2012 is not as bad as 2009, why is California not leaving the dollar zone?

Theoretically they are able to secede from the union but practically the Feds will have none of that - they don't seem to understand the idea of State sovereignty and have worked diligently for many decades to erase it so they can control the entire country. This trend started with Abraham Lincoln, a man usually thought of as one of our greatest Presidents, but who actually was one of our strongest pro-foreign intervention warmongers.

 

[Dennisch]

Citigroup expects that Greece will leave the Eurozone on 1-1-2013. Grexit.

The new currency will be expected to fall 60% immediately. This all will happen when the elections next month will not bring anything new.

 

[axletramp]

I bet all those people who threw away those 'useless' Drachmas they'd accumulated on holiday are feeling gutted now...

 

[Dennisch]

I bet all those people who threw away those 'useless' Drachmas they'd accumulated on holiday are feeling gutted now...

I still have an old bill lying around, so I'm covered.

 

[Liquid]

I've got 100 Ostmarken, which is like a zillion pounds. Maybe East Germany will come back one day and I can live like a Kaiser.

 

[Dotini]

No one really wants Greece to leave the Eurozone, but no one really wants austerity. It's a classic case of denial, wanting it both ways, or cognitive dissonance.

The new Drachmas will be printed up, and all the EU countries now have fresh orders to prepare contingency plans for Greece to leave. A moment of Truth will arrive when all stare together into the abyss, and then following the drumroll, the great leap will occur.

melodramatically,
Steve

 

[Dennisch]

Dutch financial big shots are looking into the plan for quitting altogether with the Euro. They want to get together with the Germans and French, and see how much it will cost everyone (rich guys) to quit the coin and get back to pre-Euro state. If it turns out that the losses are good enough to go for, (equal to the money now being poured into the PIIGS, and the reserves for any other emergency cases) they will make it happen.

I'll predict it now : within 5 years it will be either chaos through war, or we'll all be happy with our old currencies.

Screw the south of Europe.

 

[Keef]

The Eurozone is a good example of why I hate working in groups for class projects.

 

[Dennisch]

The Eurozone is a good example of why I hate working in groups for class projects.

Indeed. So did I.

If it has to be done right, you'll have to do it yourself.