jpmontoya
Danoff and Duke, well, I'm sorry to learn that I'm a desperate case who really doesn't want to learn what reason is.
I didn't classify you as a "desperate case". I doubt
danoff does either, since he invited you to take your time, think about
Farenheit 911 as long as necessary, and come back with the specific parts you found credible, so those points could be discussed rationally and in detail.
I thought the opinions forums was a place to voice and discuss opinions. But it's more a place where you teach others what is right and what is wrong, and if they don't get it, well subtle (or not so subtle) insultfest takes over.
Indeed, this is a place for
opinions. As I've stated several times now, I would not object to Michael Moore's films if they were offered as fiction, satire, or editorial works. These are all genres that are based completely upon
opinion. However, Moore insists on categorizing his films as
documentaries, which is defined (
www.dictionary.com) as:
2. Presenting facts objectively without editorializing or inserting fictional matter, as in a book or film.
Moore's work clearly does not adhere to this in any way, as I'm sure even the biggest fan will admit. Yet he is quick to sell it, and the public is quick to buy it, as "documentary" - lending his work a validity it does not posess at all.
I often feel the the same exasperation that you have when I hear thoughts that are the opposite of my beliefs, but I've never seen you as desperate cases who needs to be enlightened. I understand your beliefs and your arguments, there are just some fundamental differences in our ways of seeing things, and yes, I could be mistaken. If I didn't have any doubts over my beliefs I wouldn't be discussing it here.
I am always interested in finding holes in my own logic. It's a full-time pursuit for me, and it is one of the main reasons I participate in this forum. I've been shown some errors in my logic that have helped me consolidate my thoughts.
If people show that they are capable of logic, then they are not "desperate cases in need of enlightenment". I often disagree with you, but you're definitely capable of logic, and therefore I respect you. The same goes with
Gil and
Pako, with whom I've had logical debates. We can acknowledge that each other have a thought process, without agreeing to the outcome.
But I get tired of wasting coherent thought and the time to express it on people who are not interested in coherent thought. That's what prompted my post to
danoff.
I think I'll steer clear of the opinions forum for a while. Now I understand the rule of the Etiquette that says political discussions should be avoided at the table.
That's up to you, of course. But please don't think I'm trying to run you off, and please don't assume that anything I say on this board is based on my position as a staff member, because it isn't.
And if you're frustrated over 12 years old teenagers opinion, don't worry, it's likely time will make it change. At that age, I was watching Desert storm news reports on CNN, and God I was excited about seeing Tomahawk missiles hitting targets live, that was waaay too cool.
I'm happy to try to demonstrate logical thought to people of any age. And yes, I would hope that a person's thought processes mature as they do. People may well start out in one place and end up in another, and as long as that is based on a logical thought process, I support the method regardless of the conclusion.
But blindly swallowing anything that is against the
status quo is just as idiotic as blindly swallowing anything that is for it. Many -
most - of the users I've come in disagreement with here have fallen into this category. What frustrates me is their complete unwillingness to acknowledge that. They frequently state things like:
I don't care if the 9/11 attacks were really terrorist or not, I just blame the government either way. America is the one who started the attacks either way, by supporting the Jews and opposing the Taliban, I say America should stop trying to police the planet and get back to our own problems.
It is difficult for a person of conscience, regardless of which side they support, to let such a screamingly irrational and inane statement go unchallenged. And the more hysterically such things are broadcast, the more strongly they must be countered.
Only because they have our oil j/k
). Alot of what people say about the movie points out very minor details about the film (the bit about the vacation was like 3 minutes long, not the theme of the movie [obviously]) and try to use it to discredit it entirely. Honestly, there is some spin in the film, but it isnt in the footage, the footage speaks for itself. 
