FITT-Hot Hatch Tuning Challenge - Final Results are in!

Agreed with everyone above. A difference of 1 will (should?) have little impact on feel or laptime unless this is a super secret sweet spot on the car. If it is still bugging you give it a try yourself and make the determination then, but I don't see that we need to worry about it.
 
DigitalBaka
Agreed with everyone above. A difference of 1 will (should?) have little impact on feel or laptime unless this is a super secret sweet spot on the car. If it is still bugging you give it a try yourself and make the determination then, but I don't see that we need to worry about it.
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I find it real hard to believe 1 number will make a difference, just wanted a general consensus on the issue. I will either try it myself later if I have time or will just let it ride since we all missed it.
 
Depends on what number it is :P ARB, damper are now can make a difference on a car handling with just 1 value change. Spring rate change as little as 0.10kg/mm can also gives distinct change to handling balance on a well built/tuned car ( my Gallardo GT3-R for example ). For ride height, from my experience, I can feel a difference with just 2mm change on well tuned car.
 
Ridox2JZGTE
Depends on what number it is :P ARB, damper are now can make a difference on a car handling with just 1 value change. Spring rate change as little as 0.10kg/mm can also gives distinct change to handling balance on a well built/tuned car ( my Gallardo GT3-R for example ). For ride height, from my experience, I can feel a difference with just 2mm change on well tuned car.
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True but I think 1 lower, i.e. 115 instead of 116, would likely be the better setting for this car. I wanna try it myself and see.
 
Results for Hot Hatch Series.

All cars tested for 10 minutes (6 full laps) with a DS3 (pad, rather than stick). All aids off except driving line and ABS 1, with auto transmission.

A real mixed bag of cars in my hands. Some I thought would be quick, weren't, and some I expected to struggle with, I didn't. Well done to all tuners who entered this catagory. I think that this is a track where the tune has to match up with the driver, more than i've noticed on any other track.

@backnfourth - Golf V GTi '05
Time - 1:40:235
DC - 6
A fair bit of understeer for me here, and I struggled to get it into the corner when I wanted. Maybe didn't give myself enough time to adjust to track or tune.

@Bobby Steel - Golf IV GTi '01
Time - 1:42:915
DC - 4
Struggled to get the car through the corners, struggled on exit too.

@Bowtie-muscle - Scirocco R '10
Time - 1:39:510
DC - 7.5
Turn in bordering on oversteer here, but it does give you confidence to brake late and get on the power early, because you know it's going to get through the corner.

@brian wolf - Ibiza Cupra '04
Time - 1:39:972
DC - 7
Was quick enough but unstable under braking. Couldn't really predict what it would do on turn in. The slightest touch of the steering had the potential to send it into a 4 wheel drift.

@DigitalBaka - Scirocco R '10
Time - 1:39:747
DC - 7.5
Benefits from braking early and powering out of the turn. If you brake late or miss the apex you've lost the corner. Hit your lines though and it's quick enough.

@DolHaus - C30 R-Design '09
Time - 1:41:168
DC - 8
Predictable and good turn in. Good rotation and easy to get on the power through exit. Pretty much does exactly what you want it to.

@Motor City Hami - Scirocco R '10
Time - 1:39:168
DC - 8.5
Nice and tight this one. A little bit of understeer if you don't exit the corner correctly. Some wheelspin when the auto gearbox dropped too low (mainly through my mistakes). When you hit your lines drives like a dream.

@oppositelock - Clio R.S. '11
Time - 1:39:189
DC - 10
Great little car to drive. Good turn in and rotation. Can brake late with confidence. Gearing suited auto transmission. Good effort, bravo sir.

@Otaliema - Scirocco R '10
Time - 1:38:537
DC - 9
A little bit looser and more room for errors than the other Scirocco's on test. Seemed to suit my driving style well. Good under braking and easy to get through the corners. Well done.

@Ridox2JZGTE - Ibiza Cupra '04
Time - 1:40:351
DC - 7.5
Nice, easy car to drive. Nice and steady the order of the day. Doesn't like late braking but has good turn in and rotation at the right speed.

@shaunm80 - Mini Cooper S '11
Time - 1:41:171
DC - 7
Slow in, fast out the order of the day. No room for late braking, with a bit of understeer present. Lacked the pace of the other quicker entries.

@Woodski_427 - Ibiza Cupra '04
Time - 1:40:252
DC - 7
Nice tight tune although you'll have to watch your entry speed as it likes to push wide and you won't recover it. Was 0.4 up on the last lap but went too deep into the last corner and messed up, apologies.

@xande1959 - Clio R.S. '11
Time - 1:38:637
DC - 9.5
No idea where this lap came from!! Good turn in, good rotation, good speed through the corner. A little bit of understeer on corner exit, but easy to counter. Hit a 1:39:100 on the 1st lap, so was easy to adjust to. Good effort, well done.
 
Glad my Cupra was easy and steady to drive :P I am happy with the results for my entries, with equal ride height is not so bad :lol: just another experiment.
 
@biffa3 thanks for testing and the feedback. I think I've learned a whole lot from testing for this shootout that I definitely feel I can get rid of more of that dreadful FF understeer:D.

And @Bowtie-muscle I tested xande's MiTo as it was posted as well. I don't think the extra difference in ride height would change much of anything given the power of the cars and tires they were riding on. I'm fine with letting it slide since we all missed it and I really doubt it was intentional. We know @xande1959 is an honest and good competitor.:cheers:
 
@biffa3 thank you for the feedback on both my cars. Glade you found my street version a bit easier to drive :) impressive time with it as well. Better than anything I pulled in it.
 
Testing for the Spec MiTo Class.

Tested on DS3 with all aids off except ABS = 1.
General note, it seems that higher front brake balance was a main issue in my results. Over all, these cars were definitely interesting to drive. :)

@brian wolf
Best Time: 1:35.604
DC: 6
Comments: The car is too loose for my liking, it throws itself across the track a lot. It is very fast if you can keep it tamed through the corners though.

@DaBomm4
Best Time: 1:35.160
DC: 8
Comments: I think if the brake balance were better, you could go faster.

@donpost
Best Time: 1:34.785
DC: 8
Comments: The car feels good and listens well also. The brakes seem a little too strong on the front though.

@jules283
Best Time: 1:35.524
DC: 7.5
Comments: There is a little more understeer but it is still very fast and consistent.

@krenkme
Best Time: 1:34.817
DC: 9
Comments: This car handles very well. Are you sure this is a FF car?

@Ridox2JZGTE
Best Time: 1:36.248
DC: 7
Comments: I could feel that the car has a heavy and slow front, this made most corner entries slower which is where I feel made this car so slow. It was very accurate once I got the hang of the front end.

@shaunm80
Best Time: 1:35.154
DC: 8
Comments: The front brakes seem to be too strong but otherwise the car felt good.

@xande1959
Best Time: 1:35.155
DC: 8
Comments: The front brakes seem to be too strong also. The car felt fast though.

@787bcgr
Best Time: 1:36.465
DC: 7
Comments: The front has a little too much understeer still. It has good acceleration and handles well once I understood the understeer.
 
biffa3
Results for Hot Hatch Series.

All cars tested for 10 minutes (6 full laps) with a DS3 (pad, rather than stick). All aids off except driving line and ABS 1, with auto transmission.

A real mixed bag of cars in my hands. Some I thought would be quick, weren't, and some I expected to struggle with, I didn't. Well done to all tuners who entered this catagory. I think that this is a track where the tune has to match up with the driver, more than i've noticed on any other track.

@backnfourth - Golf V GTi '05
Time - 1:40:235
DC - 6
A fair bit of understeer for me here, and I struggled to get it into the corner when I wanted. Maybe didn't give myself enough time to adjust to track or tune.

@Bobby Steel - Golf IV GTi '01
Time - 1:42:915
DC - 4
Struggled to get the car through the corners, struggled on exit too.

@Bowtie-muscle - Scirocco R '10
Time - 1:39:510
DC - 7.5
Turn in bordering on oversteer here, but it does give you confidence to brake late and get on the power early, because you know it's going to get through the corner.

@brian wolf - Ibiza Cupra '04
Time - 1:39:972
DC - 7
Was quick enough but unstable under braking. Couldn't really predict what it would do on turn in. The slightest touch of the steering had the potential to send it into a 4 wheel drift.

@DigitalBaka - Scirocco R '10
Time - 1:39:747
DC - 7.5
Benefits from braking early and powering out of the turn. If you brake late or miss the apex you've lost the corner. Hit your lines though and it's quick enough.

@DolHaus - C30 R-Design '09
Time - 1:41:168
DC - 8
Predictable and good turn in. Good rotation and easy to get on the power through exit. Pretty much does exactly what you want it to.

@Motor City Hami - Scirocco R '10
Time - 1:39:168
DC - 8.5
Nice and tight this one. A little bit of understeer if you don't exit the corner correctly. Some wheelspin when the auto gearbox dropped too low (mainly through my mistakes). When you hit your lines drives like a dream.

@oppositelock - Clio R.S. '11
Time - 1:39:189
DC - 10
Great little car to drive. Good turn in and rotation. Can brake late with confidence. Gearing suited auto transmission. Good effort, bravo sir.

@Otaliema - Scirocco R '10
Time - 1:38:537
DC - 9
A little bit looser and more room for errors than the other Scirocco's on test. Seemed to suit my driving style well. Good under braking and easy to get through the corners. Well done.

@Ridox2JZGTE - Ibiza Cupra '04
Time - 1:40:351
DC - 7.5
Nice, easy car to drive. Nice and steady the order of the day. Doesn't like late braking but has good turn in and rotation at the right speed.

@shaunm80 - Mini Cooper S '11
Time - 1:41:171
DC - 7
Slow in, fast out the order of the day. No room for late braking, with a bit of understeer present. Lacked the pace of the other quicker entries.

@Woodski_427 - Ibiza Cupra '04
Time - 1:40:252
DC - 7
Nice tight tune although you'll have to watch your entry speed as it likes to push wide and you won't recover it. Was 0.4 up on the last lap but went too deep into the last corner and messed up, apologies.

@xande1959 - Clio R.S. '11
Time - 1:38:637
DC - 9.5
No idea where this lap came from!! Good turn in, good rotation, good speed through the corner. A little bit of understeer on corner exit, but easy to counter. Hit a 1:39:100 on the 1st lap, so was easy to adjust to. Good effort, well done.
Click to expand...
- Thanks biffa3 :bowdown::cheers::gtpflag:
 
DaBomm4
Testing for the Spec MiTo Class.

Tested on DS3 with all aids off except ABS = 1.
General note, it seems that higher front brake balance was a main issue in my results. Over all, these cars were definitely interesting to drive. :)

@brian wolf
Best Time: 1:35.604
DC: 6
Comments: The car is too loose for my liking, it throws itself across the track a lot. It is very fast if you can keep it tamed through the corners though.

@DaBomm4
Best Time: 1:35.160
DC: 8
Comments: I think if the brake balance were better, you could go faster.

@donpost
Best Time: 1:34.785
DC: 8
Comments: The car feels good and listens well also. The brakes seem a little too strong on the front though.

@jules283
Best Time: 1:35.524
DC: 7.5
Comments: There is a little more understeer but it is still very fast and consistent.

@krenkme
Best Time: 1:34.817
DC: 9
Comments: This car handles very well. Are you sure this is a FF car?

@Ridox2JZGTE
Best Time: 1:36.248
DC: 7
Comments: I could feel that the car has a heavy and slow front, this made most corner entries slower which is where I feel made this car so slow. It was very accurate once I got the hang of the front end.

@shaunm80
Best Time: 1:35.154
DC: 8
Comments: The front brakes seem to be too strong but otherwise the car felt good.

@xande1959
Best Time: 1:35.155
DC: 8
Comments: The front brakes seem to be too strong also. The car felt fast though.

@787bcgr
Best Time: 1:36.465
DC: 7
Comments: The front has a little too much understeer still. It has good acceleration and handles well once I understood the understeer.
Click to expand...
- Thanks DaBomm4 :bowdown::cheers::gtpflag:
 
For the record, and just because, I have built and tested @xande1959 MiTo with ride height at 116 (1:35.298) and 115 (1:35.198). Car did not seem to have any notable difference and was glued to the ghost, managed to take a late corner different to gain the tenth. @DaBomm4 was the tester who brought this to my attention earlier today, he also tested both ways and found the same result. All other testers don't seem to think it would make a difference and 2 of them were competitors in the Spec Class. No complaints have been received from other competitors and therefore I am going to allow the testing to ride as is. Since I did look at every tune, some only briefly, I will assume partial responsibility for not catching it sooner and will accept it as a typo when it was submitted. If there are any comments or concerns, please let me know. Thank you all.

Edit: 4 laps with each height, have not driven this car or track combo in weeks so that explains slow lap times.
 
Last edited:
shaunm80
Do we have a bit of break before the next competition or are you planning to do something in the next few weeks?
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This is up to a few people who may be working on hosting another event, or if @DigitalBaka was thinking about doing another seasonal related challenge. To keep track, I'd follow the main FITT thread.
 
DaBomm4
This is up to a few people who may be working on hosting another event, or if @DigitalBaka was thinking about doing another seasonal related challenge. To keep track, I'd follow the main FITT thread.
Click to expand...
Thanks. Will keep an eye out. Be nice to have a weeks break personally as I have an exam next wednesday so head to the books time :)
 

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