FITT Tunes The GT6 Seasonals - Concept 1 Series @ Madrid - Results pending!

Bowtie-muscle
Motor City Garage....check out his tuning guide, it's a great help if you haven't.
Click to expand...

I don't need a tuning guide, but thanks.

My question is on the set ups here. What's with the FD tuning process used here.

There are only a couple that are riding low on soft springs maxing compression before the weight sets onto the springs. I'm not even sure if the tuner realizes it's going on. I ask in case there is a reason it's done and not just a mistake.
 
ShamrockGT
I don't need a tuning guide, but thanks.

My question is on the set ups here. What's with the FD tuning process used here.

There are only a couple that are riding low on soft springs maxing compression before the weight sets onto the springs. I'm not even sure if the tuner realizes it's going on. I ask in case there is a reason it's done and not just a mistake.
Click to expand...
I want to start off, if I say anything incorrect, please correct me, I don't know a lot about transmissions.

I believe the graph represents the top speed and adds a visual representation for each gear related to the top speed of each gear. If you watch the graph, you can see all the gears change accordingly.

I know that the smaller the ratio of the gear takes longer to make one revolution and for a complete revolution, it also travels farther.

I will try to give an example of the reasoning for the two final gears, also known as axle ratios. If you build a transmission for your car with axle ratio X to be able to go 100 mph in the top gear at Y rpm, and then you change the gears in the axle to ones that are smaller, you will be travelling faster at the same rpm.

Does this make sense?
 
@DaBomm4 your spot on for real life, and that may be the case in GT6 i'm not sure tbh, @ShamrockGT the reason we set the FG at max value the TS at min value is better acceleration through the gears all the way upto and including top end off the car. The longer (smaller number) FG you use to start the transmission set up the shorter each gear is giving you greater acceleration but this set up lacks pulling power near the top end of the car. The shorter the FG is to start the transmission set up the longer each gear is giving you less acceleration but much better pulling power at top end. I tend to use a high mid set up to get the pulling power at the top end and some of the acceleration of the sprint type transmission. If the track is short enough I will use a low mid starting point.
 
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ShamrockGT
I don't need a tuning guide, but thanks.

My question is on the set ups here. What's with the FD tuning process used here.

There are only a couple that are riding low on soft springs maxing compression before the weight sets onto the springs. I'm not even sure if the tuner realizes it's going on. I ask in case there is a reason it's done and not just a mistake.
Click to expand...
Sorry, the tuning guide is what many follow for setting trans...I should have been clearer.
 
The graph shows the rpm the gear starts at when redline shifting up to red line along with the speed at entry and exit. But the graph is hard to read. Not clear data.

I built the same thing on my lap top but it gives more details and shows all the gears when stretched out including specific speed at entry and exit and specific rpm at entry.

I can make pretty much the same gearing with any FD. For example I took MotorCities gears and remade them using a 2.000 FD, and with a smaller the FD the car will pull rpm faster. Same gearing to a T, but with a smaller FD it's faster.

Hit the test track in automatic, run a full lap, then use the same gearing with a smaller FD run again and watch as you pull gears faster than the ghost.

In GT the smaller the FD the faster the car pulls RPM, since at least GT4 it's been like this.
 
Actually to make a small correction, the ratios at the lowest TS setting are not faster than any other. For equal gearing it's always the smallest FD used that gives best pull through the rpms. With equal gearing everything is the same, gears grab at the same rpm, same speed etc, It only goes faster through the rpm with a smaller FD.
 
DaBomm4
I will try to give an example of the reasoning for the two final gears, also known as axle ratios. If you build a transmission for your car with axle ratio X to be able to go 100 mph in the top gear at Y rpm, and then you change the gears in the axle to ones that are smaller, you will be travelling faster at the same rpm.
Click to expand...
I will add to this statement I made. Once you have built your transmission for the best acceleration (and lowest top speed) all you have to do is change the gear to fit the longest straight instead of rebuilding your transmission for a shorter track.

I guess the same could be done in reverse where you build the car with the smallest FD and fastest top speed, then you use a bigger gear for shorter tracks.
 
Thats been a debate for a while. I can tell you that a transmission built with a short FG and low TS gives better top end pull, and a transmission built with a longer FG and mid set ts give much better acceleration but lacks pull at top end.
Now that we have a data logger i suppose we can actually test the transmissions for acceleration factor. just have to tune the car than build the transmissions you want to test and take them to SSRX and test the 0-1000km acceleration see which one gets to what faster.

Thinking about it you're correct @ShamrockGT the transmission will always grab at the same rpm. But it there is effect on time in each gear and how fast it gets through them based on where the FG and TS sliders start. the reason is due to length of each gear. Short FG and low TS means shorter actual gear length but longer gearing it's self allowing for tighter grouping of the gears and better use of the power band of the car. Longer FG's and mid set TS means longer actual gear length but still mainstaing the tighter grouping allowing for maximum use of the power band with fewer shifts, but the longer gears means less power to the ground at high speed resulting longer acceleration times past about 500 m or 3/4 the top speed of the car for it's power.
 
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ShamrockGT
I've got a few questions.

Most tunes I have to adjust the FD to 5 then lower the top speed tuner adjust gears then readjust the FD.

Why is that done?
Click to expand...
For actually trying to answer the question, for me at least, I build the transmission with max FD and min TS, tune the forward gears, and then adjust the FD again for the longest straight to have a transmission that is good for most tracks with only one minor adjustment or two. Does this help answer the question?
 
DFGT All assist off ABS-0 each car was given 5laps at Silverstone to get a feel of the set up and then 10laps at Madrid. Car wash after each session.

All cars with Racing Brakes I used standard instead as none we're drive able like that without ABS

MrGrado DC 7.5
Fastest Lap 1:34.567
Lap Average 1:37.290
Lap Average and Fastest lap Gap
2.723

Otaliema DC 7.5
FL 1:34.750
LA 1:36.900
Gap 2.150

Bowtie-muscle DC 7
FL 1:35.090
LA 1:38.771
Gap 3.681

Backnfourth DC 8
FL 1:35.120
LA 1:37.027
Gap 1.907

Dolhaus DC 5
FL 1:35.284
LA 1:39.909
Gap 4.625

JujiroMatsudo DC 7.5
FL 1:35.367
LA 1:38.137
Gap 2.769

Dabomm4 DC 7
FL 1:35.408
LA 1:37.904
Gap 2.546

Xande1959 DC 6.5
FL 1:35.808
LA 1:38.899
Gap 3.091

Ridox2JZGTE DC 7.5
FL 1:36.229
LA 1:37.583
Gap 1.354

Bonus Testing

Motor-City DC 8.5
FL 1:34.434
LA 1:36.620
Gap 2.186

This car would of been serious competition here

Ridox1959 DC 8
retuned power and weight to 480pp

FL 1:34.518
LA 1:36.926
Gap 2.408

This is a shame the car wasn't at spec for the event. I dropped weight and reduced power limiting a bit and the car is right next to Motor-City, probably could of took home the win if dialled in by the tuner for the even instead of my in-tuned adjustments to meet event spec.
 
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@ShamrockGT

A shortest answer to your question is it's the only way to get all the gears bunch up as close as possible. I like to set my gear up like a motorbike, I want a long 2nd gear and short 6th gear. To get gears closest, you set TS to minimum. I then set my 2nd gear to its longest possible value, 6th gear to its shortest, spread in-between gears evenly, then bring gears up higher by changing FG ratio longer. I set my 6th gear always shortest, use FG to adjust to its optimal top speed.

Then sometimes, I might run out of FG values when doing it; I may set my FG to already its longest (lowest value) yet the 2nd gear is still too short and 6th not long enough to reach its top speed. So I'd end up with gears where 2nd is too short, 6th having had to lengthened, gears aren't bunched up as close as I like.

To overcome this, I set my FG slide bar all the way to its right, hence the maximum FG value, the shortest FG gear ratio. Then set TS to minimum. Now I have lot more reserve on FG value to play with. If 2nd gear gets too long I can always make that individual gear shorter, but 6th gear at its shortest the shift indicator blinks just before the end of the straight. I'm a happy gearbox mechanic now:)

Well it's not shortest answer now is it?:crazy:
 
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Gear tuning to use the FD to adjust to track all you have to do is find the FD range you want to work with and make sure the FD at the slowest speed has enough room to lower to your fastest speed.

On sloooow tracks we don't need all 6gears. Using the top of 5th instead gives better use of the power band, and we spend less time shifting, and less shifting mid corner.

From testing though in GT4 each game to GT6 the smallest FD will pull rpm faster from 0 to Redline.

I'll take any gear set and make them faster readjusting it to a smaller FD & equal gearing. I don't like using this "trick" as it's hard to do and so I feel it's a bit of an unfair advantage.
 
ShamrockGT
DFGT All assist off ABS-0 each car was given 5laps at Silverstone to get a feel of the set up and then 10laps at Madrid. Car wash after each session.

All cars with Racing Brakes I used standard instead as none we're drive able like that without ABS

MrGrado DC 7.5
Fastest Lap 1:34.567
Lap Average 1:37.290
Lap Average and Fastest lap Gap
2.723

Otaliema DC 7.5
FL 1:34.750
LA 1:36.900
Gap 2.150

Bowtie-muscle DC 7
FL 1:35.090
LA 1:38.771
Gap 3.681

Backnfourth DC 8
FL 1:35.120
LA 1:37.027
Gap 1.907

Dolhaus DC 5
FL 1:35.284
LA 1:39.909
Gap 4.625

JujiroMatsudo DC 7.5
FL 1:35.367
LA 1:38.137
Gap 2.769

Dabomm4 DC 7
FL 1:35.408
LA 1:37.904
Gap 2.546

Xande1959 DC 6.5
FL 1:35.808
LA 1:38.899
Gap 3.091

Ridox2JZGTE DC 7.5
FL 1:36.229
LA 1:37.583
Gap 1.354

Bonus Testing

Motor-City DC 8.5
FL 1:34.434
LA 1:36.620
Gap 2.186

This car would of been serious competition here

Ridox1959 DC 8
retuned power and weight to 480pp

FL 1:34.518
LA 1:36.926
Gap 2.408

This is a shame the car wasn't at spec for the event. I dropped weight and reduced power limiting a bit and the car is right next to Motor-City, probably could of took home the win if dialled in by the tuner for the even instead of my in-tuned adjustments to meet event spec.
Click to expand...

Ridox1959 DC 8
retuned power and weight to 480pp

FL 1:34.518
LA 1:36.926
Gap 2.408
Click to expand...

Is it me there ? :P Could you please elaborate more on the power and weight figure ? Any other changes ? That is a very good no ABS time :D 👍
 
Thanks BTW

Stage 3 weight reduction and light windows plus I adjusted to 69kg ballast at the same place and power limiter to 89.7%

I dropped weight to get closer to the crowd and used the power limiter to hit spec.

I think it could be better with removing the performance parts to use less power limiting and moving the ballast around to get a better pivot point.

With my testing done Ive gone and installed the update 1.06

I'm so glad to see the data logger but not liking the map where I should see a replay to actually see the car as data is tracked, but testing hot lap vs hot lap it's got nice stuff.

I'll be doing some analyzing test runs for the next few hours.
 
ShamrockGT
Thanks BTW

Stage 3 weight reduction and light windows plus I adjusted to 69kg ballast at the same place and power limiter to 89.7%

I dropped weight to get closer to the crowd and used the power limiter to hit spec.

I think it could be better with removing the performance parts to use less power limiting and moving the ballast around to get a better pivot point.

With my testing done Ive gone and installed the update 1.06

I'm so glad to see the data logger but not liking the map where I should see a replay to actually see the car as data is tracked, but testing hot lap vs hot lap it's got nice stuff.

I'll be doing some analyzing test runs for the next few hours.
Click to expand...

:D Nice tuning, I entered the replica as I wanted to know how it drives in the hands of variety of drivers :) Good to know with simple weight reduction and power adjustment, the car can be competitive 👍 1M coupe must be a nice car in real life too.
 
@ShamrockGT Thanks for the review, interesting technique you have there, if it works for you great:tup:, now I would like to see you tune. Sounds like you have a pretty good idea how to attack a setup and could make for good competition. Most of us are just in it for the fun, but some can be alittle competitive :)....and some of us just get lucky:lol:
 
a good test driver would be a good thing as well. get a fresh look at the tune, prefuerbly someone a tad faster and differant style than your self that way you correct the tune to work more than just your self
 
@ShamrockGT thanks for testing. It's interesting see the average lap in there too. That's some solid driving you did.
And I don't think it comes as a surprise that Motor City Hami's tune would have right up there at the top. I'm going to give his tune some laps and will see if I can beat out my best time thus far.
Great job everyone and thanks @DigitalBaka for facilitating
 
**hand goes up** not much me and my bro can't turn into a competition.

Thanks
I often find the fastest laps are done with unstable set ups that have difficulty with consistency. The average lap and gap tell a deeper story than just a hot lap time. The more consistent cars do better when racing.

I will publish some set ups and hope there is a new shoot out for tuners soon. I got to earn newbies stripes so I did test driving first, but no surprise I build set ups too.


I thought I would post this up as an example of what I was explaining earlier. I put it together quickly.

Motor City Tune Gear Set Retuned with a 2.000 FD

Adjust FD to 2.500, then move the Top Speed Slider to 124

Adjust the gears to

5.550
4.025
3.100
2.525
2.150
1.905

Readjust the FD to 2.000

The car bounces on the limiter but It will pull around 1 car length ahead by the time gearing runs out with the 2.000 set up vs the 4.000
 
ShamrockGT
**hand goes up** not much me and my bro can't turn into a competition.

Thanks
I often find the fastest laps are done with unstable set ups that have difficulty with consistency. The average lap and gap tell a deeper story than just a hot lap time. The more consistent cars do better when racing.

I will publish some set ups and hope there is a new shoot out for tuners soon. I got to earn newbies stripes so I did test driving first, but no surprise I build set ups too.


I thought I would post this up as an example of what I was explaining earlier. I put it together quickly.

Motor City Tune Gear Set Retuned with a 2.000 FD

Adjust FD to 2.500, then move the Top Speed Slider to 124

Adjust the gears to

5.550
4.025
3.100
2.525
2.150
1.905

Readjust the FD to 2.000

The car bounces on the limiter but It will pull around 1 car length ahead by the time gearing runs out with the 2.000 set up vs the 4.000
Click to expand...
Am I correct by your post count that you're new around here? If so, let me say "Welcome to the Planet":gtpflag:
 
Alright So i built 3 transmissions using my BMW engine build from this challenge.
Initial FG
FG 5.000 speed at 400m 185 km/h 5th gear speed at breaking point 195 km/h
FG 3.500 speed at 400m 186 km/h 5th gear speed at breaking point 196 km/h
FG 2.500 speed at 400m 187 km/h 6th gear speed at breaking point 196 km/h time difference FG 5.000 -0.017 FG 3.500 -0.016 this may be due to starting pointbeing a tad behind the line when the theres where right on*
at 100m the time difference was FG 5.000 -0.082 FG 3.500 -0.082
some of difference is due to me not getting the actually run FG set right but over all the actual speed differences are minimal. the time difference is noticeable though as you see in 300m the longer FG set up made up 0.065 seconds on strait line speed and acceleration.
 
@ otaliema
If you post up the gear sets I can calculate variations. They may account for what you see. The sets I calculate are quite precise, little to no variation at all.

If you run the Motor-City car at the test track in automatic and use the calculated retuned set for 2.000 vs the 4.000 original set you can see what Im talking about. The data logger even confirms the higher speed earlier on the track.
 
I sadly didn't think about saving the gears like I should have. I think the better part off the problem is the starting point is not exactly the same. So I'm getting more run up with the two of the cars. The rest of the track the average speed is higher with the low fd car but my line skwed the time
 
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@ShamrockGT yup, you got my vote. I can confirm that I can creep up on my own ghost about a bumper length ahead, not quite half a car length or more but at no point was I ever behind my own ghost.

My previous best was 1:31.903 with my revised version with better suspension and LSD. I reconfigured my gear ratio with following values:

FG 2.015
1 5.041
2 3.930
3 3.140
4 2.565
5 2.170
6 1.875

The starting FG value as I now call it, instead of wind it back FG to 5.000 previously, I start it at 2.500, set TS to minimum, then lower the FG value (hence making it longer) to near its minimum value, this case 2.015.

The gear ratio and its pattern is virtually identical to my old version except this time its obvious much lower FG value. I tested on free run mode so I won't have other people's blue lines to distract me. I loaded my best ghost and I raced against it. Took me 7 laps just to match my then best form, then on lap 12 I did improve: 1:31.743. Now I wish I had done that on online TT that would've jump me 100 places up:(

The main reason I improved was that my previous best lap I did a really poor last sector, I lifted off on that long right hander before that big round about hairpin, and I skidded really wide on it too. I'd say with my new gears I'd shave uff 0.050 with exactly the same driving.

The most surprising finding of all this, is that the gear whines are a lot more quieter! Obviously, the tranny is spinning at much lower speed and that annoying high pitch gearbox whine is minimised, making driving experience a lot more enjoyable. I can hear the engine sound a lot more clearer! This is by far the biggest benefit for me:tup:

I had noticed this deliberate lower FG when I was doing Toyota 86 TT where @eclipsee's gear ratio setup where instead of setting starting FG to usual max value, for that case it was 5.500 I believe, his instruction was that you set it to start at 4.300 or something like that. Then wind down to near minimal FG value. The theoretical top speed would be the same with any given method as long as you get all the gears identical but I knew there was more to it than that something those aliens aren't telling.lol
 
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