Formula 1 Pirelli British Grand Prix 2021Formula 1

[TheCracker]

Since this forum is GTPlanet.
Pretty sure we've all played Gran Turismo in some form.

This means we should know that if you are going to be turning in to a corner from the inside, you will need to go slower over all to keep your line.
Hamilton was going same speed as Max, so Hamilton was going to understeer as a result.

Even on the first lap with full tanks and potentially not-quite-up-to-temperature tyres, Copse is flat out or maybe a slight lift or a touch of left foot braking to stabilise in an F1 car. How do you go in any slower when you are preparing not to be slowing down at all? Hamilton had already lifted when he realised Verstappen had no intension of conceding the corner, from that point, unbeknown to Max, the collision was Max's to avoid (by running a wider line, potentially onto the tarmac run off). They both had some options to avoid the collision, but neither wanted to concede. Max's race ended there and then, Lewis received a penalty. Racing incident that could have quite easily ended with both off or neither off.

 

[OJBrit]

'Red Bull have crash data that will allow them to blame Hamilton'

The crash involving Max Verstappen and Lewis Hamilton last weekend has, as expected, caused a lot of trouble. For example, the battle between Mercedes and Red Bull, which was already spicy off-track, has become a bit more extreme and Hamilton and Verstappen have also had some arguments amongst...

www.gpblog.com

In my humble opinion, if it can be scientifically and forensically proven that a driver entered the corner too fast to have possibly made the corner without contacting the other driver, then that changes everything, potentially. Again, IMHO, that could potentially constitute ramming. As a total irrelevance, in my amateur kart racing years, 1988-2015, the sanctioning body, the IKF, made it abundantly clear that ramming another karter off the course could constitute grounds for lifetime banishment. To be clear, I am not suggesting anything of the sort could or should occur under the present situation.

If Lewis was faster into Copse lap 1 than at any other point in the race then it is easily explainable.
1) Slipstream
2) Mashing of ERS to attack into Copse.
3) Lap 1 engine map.

No doubt Max had 2 of those available too but probably had used more ERS on the Wellington Straight to make up for his poor exit from the Loop.

Not sure I'm at all fond of the idea Red Bull can take legal action against Mercedes b/c of an accident that totalled one of their cars & therefore, Red Bull now has a budget issue.

Red Bull sues Merc due to budget reasons, they win.
Now Merc are over budget due to legal costs. Red Bull are the cause.
Merc sues Red Bull for them going over budget.
Rinse and repeat.

 

[SchnellShmel]

Since this forum is GTPlanet.
Pretty sure we've all played Gran Turismo in some form.

This means we should know that if you are going to be turning in to a corner from the inside, you will need to go slower over all to keep your line.
Hamilton was going same speed as Max, so Hamilton was going to understeer as a result.

Yes, this is my subjective point. Even with well skilled opponents in Assetto Corsa Competezione we crash sometimes in some places and it could be frustrating, but understandable (missed brake point, undervalued tyre wear, etc.). But if someone would dive in Copse that way, I would be really mad.

I understand that overtake in Copse is possible, but preparing the overtake is the key. When one car go in the perfect line, touching kerb on the entry and other car go in for overtake – it's OK. But when one car in the middle of the track and you still try to dive – it's not OK.

 

[Veinz]

incidents like this remind me why I stopped visiting the autosport forums.

 

[Saidur_Ali]

I feel like the FIA should apologise to Lewis for that decision.

 

[Grayfox]

Red Bull sues Merc due to budget reasons, they win.
Now Merc are over budget due to legal costs. Red Bull are the cause.
Merc sues Red Bull for them going over budget.
Rinse and repeat.

Well RBR would have a case since Lewis was blamed for the crash so the damage is Mercs burden to bare.
Merc has no real claim to recourse since they're deemed to be "At Fault".

But this would set a precedent that will allow teams to sue others for damages caused.
If Merc wanted to sue Williams over the Russell v Bottas issue.
That could really F up Williams.

 

[ScottPuss20]

But this would set a precedent that will allow teams to sue others for damages caused.

Oh no, that would completely screw things up. It would be the end of F1.

 

[kungtotte_]

Well RBR would have a case since Lewis was blamed for the crash so the damage is Mercs burden to bare.
Merc has no real claim to recourse since they're deemed to be "At Fault".

They would if this was two road cars on a public road, and not two purpose built racing cars on a closed racing circuit during a FIA racing event. They wave all sorts of claims and liabilities as part of the race entry registration just so that the organizers and other contestants can't be held liable for damages, so I don't think Red Bull would get far with any lawsuit even if they tried.

 

[Jimlaad43]

I wouldn't go down that rabbit hole Christian. If teams start claiming money from teams for incidents they erroneously blame solely on other drivers, I'm sure there's a big invoice from Ferrari heading his way for Singapore 2017

 

[Grayfox]

They would if this was two road cars on a public road, and not two purpose built racing cars on a closed racing circuit during a FIA racing event. They wave all sorts of claims and liabilities as part of the race entry registration just so that the organizers and other contestants can't be held liable for damages, so I don't think Red Bull would get far with any lawsuit even if they tried.

Is their any factual evidence that they're thinking of a lawsuit or is it just the Rumor Windmill spinning?
Red bull would have good lawyers and they would go, no.

 

[OJBrit]

Well RBR would have a case since Lewis was blamed for the crash so the damage is Mercs burden to bare.
Merc has no real claim to recourse since they're deemed to be "At Fault".

But this would set a precedent that will allow teams to sue others for damages caused.
If Merc wanted to sue Williams over the Russell v Bottas issue.
That could really F up Williams.

It was just a tongue in cheek reply to a previous comment. I would not expect anybody to sue anyone else over this crash.

 

[kungtotte_]

Is their any factual evidence that they're thinking of a lawsuit or is it just the Rumor Windmill spinning?
Red bull would have good lawyers and they would go, no.

Helmut Marko Is Not OK

The Red Bull advisor claims the team has hired a lawyer in the wake of the British GP crash.

jalopnik.com

This could just be Helmut being a bag of wind like usual, but according to him they've put lawyers on the case. I doubt they'll get anywhere with it though, and like you say they have good lawyers which will likely inform Dr. Marko that: they have no legal grounds for a lawsuit and that even if they did it opens up a can of worms if teams sue and counter-sue each other back and forth.

 

[Grayfox]

Helmut Marko Is Not OK

The Red Bull advisor claims the team has hired a lawyer in the wake of the British GP crash.

jalopnik.com

This could just be Helmut being a bag of wind like usual, but according to him they've put lawyers on the case. I doubt they'll get anywhere with it though, and like you say they have good lawyers which will likely inform Dr. Marko that: they have no legal grounds for a lawsuit and that even if they did it opens up a can of worms if teams sue and counter-sue each other back and forth.

He is just riding on emotion.
Ones that wears off, things will be back to normal.

 

[GingerBredMan]

"Mercedes has explained it only went ahead with its British Grand Prix victory celebrations because it had been told by Red Bull and the FIA that Max Verstappen was uninjured."
Source: https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/...clear-before-british-gp-celebrations/6635189/

So Max and Jos' tweets were clearly intended to stir up drama. I didn't really care for Max before this weekend, but my respect for him as a driver plummeted. Kind of a bad look for Red Bull as a team to be allowing behavior like this.

 

[StPeterMartyr]

deleted. wrong thread

 

[Samus]

Masi has warned no more uninvited Karen's at the stewards door in future.

British Grand Prix: F1 teams could face penalties if they visit race stewards without an invitation

Formula 1 teams are warned they could face penalties if they visit race stewards without an invitation.

www.bbc.co.uk

Also of note

Mercedes had Verstappen all-clear before British GP celebrations

www.motorsport.com

Mercedes has explained it only went ahead with its British Grand Prix victory celebrations because it had been told by Red Bull and the FIA that Max Verstappen was uninjured.​

"We had the feedback from senior management of Red Bull that Max was fine. Christian [Horner] mentioned it to [F1 race director] Michael Masi on the intercom that he's unharmed and fine, and the FIA gave us similar feedback.

"So at no point would we have celebrated if Max would have been injured. And I think that's very important to understand."

Makes that response from VER rather inflammatory and manufactured.

 

[-Fred-]

Kind of a bad look for Red Bull as a team to be allowing behavior like this.

That's just typical Horner and Marko behavior of desperately trying to attract attention to an issue that does not benefit them.

 

[Mr Grumpy]

Racing incident in my eyes, I've seen a lot worse over the years.
Also.....

There's probably a similar video of Lewis (or a few drivers for that matter) doing exactly the same.

What goes around comes around eventually.

Lando, George, Danny, Kimi & Sebastian fan by the way, before anyone accuses me of being biased because I'm English.

Also I don't want any team running away with the championship, not Mercedes, Redbull or anyone, I'd much prefer a different winner every race.

 

[GingerBredMan]

Racing incident in my eyes, I've seen a lot worse over the years.
Also.....

The radio from Singapore will never not be funny.
"Got damage, GOT DAMAAAGE....Urgugh"

But yeah pretty bad. Also surprising how many run ins he's had with teammates. That clip didn't even include this gem:

 

[ScottPuss20]

Makes that response from VER rather inflammatory and manufactured.

Well of course, anything to cause controversy and whip the "fans" into a racist frenzy.

 

[ROAD_DOGG33J]

The big news that came out is that Max unfollowed Lewis on Instagram.

 

[SchnellShmel]

Makes that response from VER rather inflammatory and manufactured.

How it's called nowadays, victim-blaming, right?

The big news that came out is that Max unfollowed Lewis on Instagram.

Good idea. Glad I'm banned in Ham's Instagram for about 5 years (rooted for Vettel in their Silverstone battle, haha) and I'm safe from his zero-pound-spending world saving manifests.

 

[Dotini]

What the sport has needed and hasn't had for many years is a good, hard, sustained rivalry at the very top. Hopefully, Max is healthy and Lewis still hungry for fame and money, and their rivalry can persist for a few more years. My fondest F1 memories are from the kit car era and the subsequent rivalries among Prost , Piquet, Senna, Mansell and the wily Lauda.

 

[StPeterMartyr]

Well of course, anything to cause controversy and whip the "fans" into a racist frenzy.

If anything not being Lord Hammie friendly is racists friendly, we must shut the whatever up... No two ways about it: you win.

 

[GingerBredMan]

Good idea. Glad I'm banned in Ham's Instagram for about 5 years (rooted for Vettel in their Silverstone battle, haha) and I'm safe from his zero-pound-spending world saving manifests.

If you're getting banned from instagram accounts, it might be a good time to take a step back and think about why. Also these things are pretty easy to avoid of you don't follow him? Also I highly doubt that's all you did to get banned.

I don't like Max, but I'm not spending any amount of time commenting on his posts in hopes that he sees it. It's always bizarre to see how people who don't like Lewis spend so much time on him.

 

[SchnellShmel]

If you're getting banned from instagram accounts, it might be a good time to take a step back and think about why. Also these things are pretty easy to avoid of you don't follow him? Also I highly doubt that's all you did to get banned.

I don't like Max, but I'm not spending any amount of time commenting on his posts in hopes that he sees it. It's always bizarre to see how people who don't like Lewis spend so much time on him.

Oh, thank you, anonymous guy from Internet with unasked advices. Much appreciated.

 

[MaxAttack]

Oh, thank you, anonymous guy from Internet with unasked advices. Much appreciated.

• post opinion in a public forum
• expect opinions on your opinion.

That it's 2021 and people are still not getting their head around this is a good argument for reintroducing the ever present threat of nuclear mutually assured destruction.

 

[SchnellShmel]

• post opinion in a public forum
• expect opinions on your opinion.

That it's 2021 and people are still not getting their head around this is a good argument for reintroducing the ever present threat of nuclear mutually assured destruction.

Right, it's my opinion on his opinion. What's wrong?

 

[McLaren]

Makes that response from VER rather inflammatory and manufactured.

Yeah, I still think that was Horner in his ear.

The big news that came out is that Max unfollowed Lewis on Instagram.

I don't buy much into these reports, personally. I've seen it a lot in the NBA and it never amounts to anything. I think it's still just emotions.

How it's called nowadays, victim-blaming, right?


Good idea. Glad I'm banned in Ham's Instagram for about 5 years (rooted for Vettel in their Silverstone battle, haha) and I'm safe from his zero-pound-spending world saving manifests.

Imagine bragging about how you're banned from a celebrity's social media page, and not somehow realizing that reflects more on you than them.


This isn't the member who got banned for his strange arguments supporting Mazepin earlier in the year, is it?

 

[Samus]

This isn't the member who got banned for his strange arguments supporting Mazepin earlier in the year, is it?

It had crossed my mind. Curious they've posted solely in this topic since joining GTP, seems unusual.