Forza 6 discussion

[Myles Prower]

Regarding the Formula Ford, I know a guy who races in Formula Ford with the EcoBoost 200 and he says it a pretty good example of the real car
http://www.forzamotorsport.net/en-us/news/hma_6_19_14

 

[Ialyrn]

Within days of Forza 5 been released, there where a lot of people saying the stock Ferrari F458 Italia was undriveable; so I had to take it out for a test.

This was the result of that test:


I was using a controller at the time (TX wheel wasnt released back then), without TCS/STM, no ABS, and manual with clutch. I drifted the third lap, just to prove I didnt have TCS/STM turned on. The car is also 100% stock, no upgrades and the default T10 tuning still in place (30/30 tire pressures and so on). As @HighSeasHoMastr said, you cant judge the physics from a video, because the user can make you see anything they want. Not only that, but the grip levels are highly dependant on the users ability to drive a car within a digital environment. EVERYBODY has differing skill levels within a video game, and everyone has different styles of play; no matter what the game or gametype is!

 

[VXR]

Do people think cars don't slide about if they're driven with little-to-no care for your own safety?! Try driving as you would in real life and you'll find it's much the same in Forza 5. Treat the cars like greased pigs and they'll react like it, digitally and in real life.

 

[20B_4ME]

Do people think cars don't slide about if they're driven with little-to-no care for your own safety?! Try driving as you would in real life and you'll find it's much the same in Forza 5. Treat the cars like greased pigs and they'll react like it, digitally and in real life.

Exactly, especially with assists turned off. There's a good reason why manufacturers put so much computer assisted functions on new cars. The majority of drivers cannot drive safe at all on extreme conditions.

 

[HAL20XX]

Within days of Forza 5 been released, there where a lot of people saying the stock Ferrari F458 Italia was undriveable; so I had to take it out for a test.

I'll admit I can't drive the 458 no matter what I seem to do. Stock, tuned, it doesn't matter. Short of slapping on massive amounts of downforce, I had to give up on this car. I think by default I'm just bad at mid-engine cars. They always want to swing around on me.

 

[Ialyrn]

I'll admit I can't drive the 458 no matter what I seem to do. Stock, tuned, it doesn't matter. Short of slapping on massive amounts of downforce, I had to give up on this car. I think by default I'm just bad at mid-engine cars. They always want to swing around on me.

Keeping some throttle on while braking helps with the mid engined cars, helps to keep their balance in check. What class would you like to use the F458 in? I am more than happy to make a tune for it, and to share it within forza.

 

[Imari]

I'll admit I can't drive the 458 no matter what I seem to do. Stock, tuned, it doesn't matter. Short of slapping on massive amounts of downforce, I had to give up on this car. I think by default I'm just bad at mid-engine cars. They always want to swing around on me.

You just have to remember that they're basically the opposite of front engined cars.

If I'm super oversimplifying, a FR will understeer off throttle and oversteer on throttle.
A MR or RR will oversteer off throttle and understeer on throttle.

Obviously you can make it oversteer with too much power as well, but if you want to kill that lift off oversteer (which is what catches most people), you need to make sure you're braking straight, get off the brakes well before you turn in, and get on the power very, very early in the corner. Even just the tiniest breath of throttle as you turn into the corner will settle the back and let you drive it through.

It's a fine art, and once you get it you'll see why so many serious sports and race cars are mid engined. Nailing a corner in an MR car is like a rocketship on rails compared to just about anything else. Most satisfying feeling in the world.

 

[HAL20XX]

Keeping some throttle on while braking helps with the mid engined cars, helps to keep their balance in check. What class would you like to use the F458 in? I am more than happy to make a tune for it, and to share it within forza.

I typically don't like to tune a car more than 1-level out of its base class. I believe the one I have was tuned to S-class, mostly because I put racing slicks on it to see if I could settle the car down.

To Imari's point, it's the throttle-off over-steer that gets me. I had started to adjust to braking earlier before a corner, but Drivatars are less than willing to accommodate me, haha!

 

[BoneSawTX]

I tried the Ecoboost Formula Ford last night bone stock, there's no traction in those slides. straight line braking and throttle along with 5 laps to get use to it help.

As for the 458, I've been redoing a lot of tunes and that was next on my list. I have the Risi 458 already done with 3 tunes.

 

[JTB10000]

The physics in Forza 5 seem very strange to me for some reason. Every car I've driven in that game either terribly understeers or terribly oversteers no matter how careful I am with the throttle and it is so easy to overshoot a turn. I guess that's realistic?

 

[VXR]

I'd say it's just a learning curve. My first few races I picked the S2000 thinking it'd be a similar experience to FM4 and then spent the next hour or so hating it and loving it in equal measure cause I had to step up and treat the car with more care than ever before.

The Xbox One's triggers aren't as well designed in my opinion, it seems they give too much response in the first few degrees of pressure, which makes it easy to over egg the pudding.

 

[RacerPaul]

The Xbox One's triggers aren't as well designed in my opinion, it seems they give too much response in the first few degrees of pressure, which makes it easy to over egg the pudding.

Have you tried a couple of degrees deadzone on the triggers to see if that helps?

And have the outside zone set to 100 too?

 

[SlyNine]

Look at the grip physics:

It starts at 2:00 The example of the Open Wheeled car here is Formula Ford.

You do realize tires have an angle of slip. Add to that, the camera doesn't follow the car 100% (which adds to the effect) and what you see is mostly just an illusion.

The guy definitely goes beyond peak but loses tons of speed when he does so. As far as getting a car to slide like that without loosing control, who knows what tune he's using. You could tune a real F1 car to drift, but no one in real life has ever tried to my knowledge

What I do not see here is 100% grip and high angles of slip.

 

[SlyNine]

Within days of Forza 5 been released, there where a lot of people saying the stock Ferrari F458 Italia was undriveable; so I had to take it out for a test.

This was the result of that test:


I was using a controller at the time (TX wheel wasnt released back then), without TCS/STM, no ABS, and manual with clutch. I drifted the third lap, just to prove I didnt have TCS/STM turned on. The car is also 100% stock, no upgrades and the default T10 tuning still in place (30/30 tire pressures and so on). As @HighSeasHoMastr said, you cant judge the physics from a video, because the user can make you see anything they want. Not only that, but the grip levels are highly dependant on the users ability to drive a car within a digital environment. EVERYBODY has differing skill levels within a video game, and everyone has different styles of play; no matter what the game or gametype is!

Nice driving. would you PM me your gamer tag for rivals?

 

[FordGTGuy]

Forza 5 is one of a few racing games that will quickly show you the limitations of driving a particular vehicle too hard. People seem so used to the hand holding in racing games that when they play Forza 5 they will become easily frustrated when trying to exceed these limits, only other PC Sims have shown this kind of car behavior.

Should also be noted that cars like the 458 come stock with tons of on board traction control and stability management systems, so driving the car without them is of course going to be tough.

The Ford GT is a good example of a supercar not built with TCS in mind and makes the car naturally easier to control without any.

 

[SimTourist]

Forza 5 is one of a few racing games that will quickly show you the limitations of driving a particular vehicle too hard. People seem so used to the hand holding in racing games that when they play Forza 5 they will become easily frustrated when trying to exceed these limits, only other PC Sims have shown this kind of car behavior.

Should also be noted that cars like the 458 come stock with tons of on board traction control and stability management systems, so driving the car without them is of course going to be tough.

The Ford GT is a good example of a supercar not built with TCS in mind and makes the car naturally easier to control without any.

Playing Forza 5 and GT6 back to back I find GT6 easier to drive in general, but funnily enough when I switch back to FM5 my racing lines and braking improve as well. I find the suspension work and body roll a bit exaggerated in GT6 on some cars, kinda reminds me of GTA 4

 

[ImaRobot]

I've never played GT6, but from videos and pictures I always thought the body roll looked a bit over the top.

 

[SlyNine]

The physics in Forza 5 seem very strange to me for some reason. Every car I've driven in that game either terribly understeers or terribly oversteers no matter how careful I am with the throttle and it is so easy to overshoot a turn. I guess that's realistic?

Id say when pushing a car to the edge, one or the other is highly likely. Give it more time and remember engine braking (dropping the throttle) can cause oversteer. Throttle on can cause both under and oversteer.

If you post a video with where you're struggling I'm sure people would be glad to give you tips or thoughts on what went wrong.

 

[VXR]

Have you tried a couple of degrees deadzone on the triggers to see if that helps?

And have the outside zone set to 100 too?

I do keep meaning to try, but I always think "hmm, I've kinda got used to it as-is".

 

[ImaRobot]

I do keep meaning to try, but I always think "hmm, I've kinda got used to it as-is".

Default is way harder to adjust to. I recommend switching all deadzones immediately. I've never done so on past Forzas, but now that I have I realized I should have been doing it long ago.

 

[VXR]

Will give it a try next time. I just managed a clean lap of the Nord using the EcoBoost FF and feel a sense of satisfaction. Until I looked at my time, which was a full minute slower than the real world, even ignoring the couple of mini spins I had.

 

[Saidur_Ali]

So I played FM5 a couple days back and got me thinking another area they need to improve is AI. I was surprised that AI is a bit like rolling roadblocks even on unbeatable AI on a number of situations especially at start of race and especially tracks with high speed corners. I was expecting a bit more real life like driving but I think this is problem using drivatars as way AI drive as people can drive a bit crazy and quite slow.

I am interested also what they can do to improve graphics for Forza 6 and I wonder if they will stick at 1080p. Also I hope they improve the sound for tyres, I find it quite annoying when cornering.

 

[CAMAROBOY69]

Where is the "All of the above" option in the poll?

 

[Gerarghini]

I want to make a suggestion regarding affinity. I feel as though certain brands should be combined for a sort of "umbrella" affinity.

For instance, combine Acura with Honda for a general Honda affinity that covers both brands. I find it kind of odd, in my opinion, that they'd be different like that. Same for brands like Nissan + Infiniti, Toyota + Scion, Ford + Mercury, etc. For me I feel it makes it a chore to go to an Acura Integra but find you don't get quite the same payout even though it's basically a rebadged Honda, so you have to increase affinity for the Acura brand itself. Just my $0.02

Off topic but why is it that some cars I drive in Forza 5 have their headlights on? I find it a bit strange. Also the 2014 Civic Si isn't a hatchback but is in the Modern Hot Hatch series.

 

[mrPetros]

For next forza I'd like some further refinements in various fields:

1) multiplayer
bring back ability to create open lobbies.
bring back various snippets of info when racing, like distances to car back/front, delta, etc. make this user customizable in display/positioning.
throw a bone to the people that want more options, and offer for those who want practice laps for positioning and pitstop strategy (I dont care for this personally, but I respect the wishes of other players I know indeed play and enjoy)

2) replays
I feel like replays just dont do justice to the game. I'd like a small team inside t10 that their single specialty are ..replays.
from placement and camera movements up to good cinematography. special attention as to how the replay engine takes the data points from the race and draws the cars. I know its only at half the framerate of the game itself, but what choppiness I see I do not account it on framerate but rather on the way the replay engine plots. turn 10 has still much to cover in this field, should they want to.

3) precision
I think t10 switching to laser scanned tracks was the best news for me on f5. I want this trend to continue and be turned to eleven.
Also physics side (which I find real good, a step up from 4 and very enjoyable (sim steering with tx is a handfull)) and even tuning side, these aspects which are great right now can became even greater.

edit:
leaderboards!!
I want elaborate leaderboards, am not happy as they are now.
-Career races should have their own leaderboards. ok, you got the best lap (even if with a car not allowed in the career race), but lets see who got the fastest accumulated laps time -and clean too- in that race.
-Per Car per Class leaderboards. who's got the fastest tuned mk2 gti around nurburgring? and in which class too. (this is a great omission for me)
Older forzas did have separate career races leaderboards, and while they didnt have the per class per car leaderboards, at least they kept locally the best laptimes of your five fastest cars per class around each track.

night/weather: I really dont care for those. even if we had consoles that could push these effects on top without having to restructure to find the juice, I would still complain for the valuable (for other stuff) time missed on those.
and hopefully those that think that its alpha and omega of racing will find their happiness in horizon2 and driveclub and stop bugging me with that stuff. what they did in previous games offering the same track in different conditions to choose from was good enough for me.
personally I think that there is still a lot of road that we have to cover on dry tarmac on sunlight, before we set our goal to replicate wet conditions at night. or even worse, dynamic transitions of sunlight to moonlight seems too superficial for my tastes

now, dont take my words wrong, forza is my favorite franchise and I really love forza 5
but enemy of good has always been better

cheers

 

[imported_skidmark]

For next forza I'd like some further refinements in various fields:

1) multiplayer
bring back ability to create open lobbies.
bring back various snippets of info when racing, like distances to car back/front, delta, etc. make this user customizable in display/positioning.
throw a bone to the people that want more options, and offer for those who want practice laps for positioning and pitstop strategy (I dont care for this personally, but I respect the wishes of other players I know indeed play and enjoy)

2) replays
I feel like replays just dont do justice to the game. I'd like a small team inside t10 that their single specialty are ..replays.
from placement and camera movements up to good cinematography. special attention as to how the replay engine takes the data points from the race and draws the cars. I know its only at half the framerate of the game itself, but what choppiness I see I do not account it on framerate but rather on the way the replay engine plots. turn 10 has still much to cover in this field, should they want to.

3) precision
I think t10 switching to laser scanned tracks was the best news for me on f5. I want this trend to continue and be turned to eleven.
Also physics side (which I find real good, a step up from 4 and very enjoyable (sim steering with tx is a handfull)) and even tuning side, these aspects which are great right now can became even greater.

edit:
leaderboards!!
I want elaborate leaderboards, am not happy as they are now.
-Career races should have their own leaderboards. ok, you got the best lap (even if with a car not allowed in the career race), but lets see who got the fastest accumulated laps time -and clean too- in that race.
-Per Car per Class leaderboards. who's got the fastest tuned mk2 gti around nurburgring? and in which class too. (this is a great omission for me)
Older forzas did have separate career races leaderboards, and while they didnt have the per class per car leaderboards, at least they kept locally the best laptimes of your five fastest cars per class around each track.

night/weather: I really dont care for those. even if we had consoles that could push these effects on top without having to restructure to find the juice, I would still complain for the valuable (for other stuff) time missed on those.
and hopefully those that think that its alpha and omega of racing will find their happiness in horizon2 and driveclub and stop bugging me with that stuff. what they did in previous games offering the same track in different conditions to choose from was good enough for me.
personally I think that there is still a lot of road that we have to cover on dry tarmac on sunlight, before we set our goal to replicate wet conditions at night. or even worse, dynamic transitions of sunlight to moonlight seems too superficial for my tastes

now, dont take my words wrong, forza is my favorite franchise and I really love forza 5
but enemy of good has always been better

cheers

I agree with almost everything you propose for forza 6. The ai is fine for me though,I made it up to expert so two more Drivatar lvls to conquer!

Also I'm with you on the weather and dynamic lighting not being a major issue, all they could do is have different times of day for track layouts this would mean not skimping out on other juicy goodness!

All and all I don't think turn 10 have there work cut out to much with forza 6 I really don't.f5 IS a QUALITY product it was just a little thin!

 

[FordGTGuy]

I know everyone is worried about every other system in the game but game upgrading cars needs a major overhaul and needs to become relevant again.

 

[SimTourist]

There's a rumor that T10 is going on a 3 year dev cycle with FM6, part of me wants it as it will allow them to put more content into the game and polish it better and maybe figure out how to include night/weather and not compromise 1080p/60fps, but on the other hand I don't want to wait another 2 years for FM6, that's just too much waiting for me these days, I'd rather have them continue on with FM5 model of releasing a base game and then adding content throughout the following year. It'll be interesting to see if this rumor is true.

 

[VXR]

If they continued to flesh out 5 in conjunction with Horizon for the next two years I'd be more than happy.

 

[Chippy569]

There's a rumor that T10 is going on a 3 year dev cycle with FM6, part of me wants it as it will allow them to put more content into the game and polish it better and maybe figure out how to include night/weather and not compromise 1080p/60fps, but on the other hand I don't want to wait another 2 years for FM6, that's just too much waiting for me these days, I'd rather have them continue on with FM5 model of releasing a base game and then adding content throughout the following year. It'll be interesting to see if this rumor is true.

where did that rumor come from?