Gran Turismo 7 Custom Race thread

[Nebuc72]

Sure, that's niche, I agree. But still someone had to make the decision for Sophy to use AT in a low powered car at a track with steep grades.
And how about the whole A110 one make @ Spa thing I wrote about earlier? The freight train in front of you, the non working difficulty settings, the insane pace of every single Sophy?

It's all very likely these are part of the reason why we never got Sophy in custom races to begin with. I don't know what influenced them otherwise, but they've done something that's given the player a bit of freedom to set things up to have some more fun with them.
It's not refined, but neither is Sophy, and quite frankly if it's all down to player discretion in the first place, I'd rather have the option to both make good and bad races, than to have no option at all.

 

[Sir Crashalot]

It's all very likely these are part of the reason why we never got Sophy in custom races to begin with. I don't know what influenced them otherwise, but they've done something that's given the player a bit of freedom to set things up to have some more fun with them.
It's not refined, but neither is Sophy, and quite frankly if it's all down to player discretion in the first place, I'd rather have the option to both make good and bad races, than to have no option at all.

Yeah, sorry, forgot once again that this a PD/Kaz fanboy forum. My bad!

 

[Nebuc72]

Yeah, sorry, forgot once again that this a PD/Kaz fanboy forum. My bad!

If agreeing that a feature is unrefined but liking the fact it gives the player more options, is being a fanboy - then the bar is below the floor with you mate.

 

[NekoPufferPPP]

Sir Crashalot's Alpine Challenge completed. Took 3 tries, it's hard, but fun.

Fastest lap was a 2:46.480

While Sophy doesn't seem to like racing against itself, it will race against you, defending corners and such.

 

[hawkeyez]

Imo it takes a little too much effort on the users behalf to get a good race going. Some people are really into it and that’s why they should allow users to share their custom races and have people rate it out of five stars. Untapped content right there. I personally don’t have the patience for it, I barely have the patience to copy tunes off of three settings page screenshots let alone repeatedly race a custom race and tweak cars and the tunes until I land on something fun. Rinse and repeat per track and per car class, not to mention tuning a group of cars equally or having to buy 20 Camaro’s and paint each one differently so you’re all not in the same damn car. lol

 

[UnkaD]

Tried a sophy race with my '08 Gr.2 1999 JGTC replicar collection and I've never felt so fulfilled to start 11th and finish 7th. So much fun! Noticing where specific AI will pull moves and adjusting the next lap. Seeing where they enter a bit deep and doing the cutback, and without crahing into a parked car on the apex no less. I can drive so naturally without worrying about crashing into the car ahead of me every corner. And the best thing is that the cars don't all look identical anymore.

Now if they can just fix the tire choice issue, because the next race I tried with all my tuned classic street cars was a real doozy.

 

[CodeRedR51]

Did a 30 minute race at Bathurst last night in Gr4 cars (RWD only, boost weak, BOP on) and it was amazing for me. It's nice to have AI run this track that aren't slow across the mountain. However there was one quirk: once I got past the 4th place car, the rest of the AI got bottled up behind that car and just wouldn't go around it. So it left me trying to chase down the two leaders that had pulled a big gap, and the rest of the field stuck behind 4th place. Managed to pass the leader going into the chase with just over 1 lap to go.

Also did an oopsie last night too. Saw that Maggiore had Sophy, so set up a race at East Reverse with FWD Gr4 cars. Race started and the AI were all running into each other and braking hard for no reason. And then it hit me that I wasn't racing with Sophy. I guess only the big track is available with Sophy right now. And unfortunately standing starts are not available with Sophy.

 

[tonidavid5]

@Sir Crashalot , for the MX-5 spec race you could try to set an event around different versions of the Roadster cars, TC, NA, ND and tune the lower powered ones to bring them up the Touring Car version performance. Not strictly one-make but I remember this as a special event from the Weekly Challenges and I had a blast.

Same thing with a Honda Civic EK spec event, there are the EK Touring Car, the EK 98 and the EK 95 versions you could mix up giving Sophie more variation (assuming Sophie can run all 3 types)

 

[05XR8]

Obviously not as simple as adjusting a difficulty toggle, but I’m curious if you can just power-up your own vehicle in the pre-race screen to create favorable difficulty conditions? I’d think Boost Weak with a little more oomph in your own car could work…it’d be a little more like racing the old AI, wherein the player has a horsepower advantage.

Now, we’ve seen how Sophy can cheat to keep up with faster driving, so maybe it won’t have an effect, but I’d think that could be a better experience than Boost Off.

This pre-race adjustment concept also has a hand in maximizing your payouts - if you create a ‘sandbag’/lowest-PP tune sheet and launch your Custom Race while it is active, you’ll set the payout even higher due to the apparent relative disadvantage. Before you jump into the actual race, while on the pre-race screen, adjust your tune (change to your ‘good’ tune sheet) at no impact to the AI or payout.

Should let you get the best experience, I’d suspect!

That’s what I did last night. Just tried my RS 500 at ATCC specs with 540BHP/1185kg at Spa. All other RS 500s were at 390BHP/1035kg. Usual start from 20th. Of course I blew by SOPHY on the straights. I’m using SOPHY driving lines and not over driving to defend. I’m jjust being smooth and making sure I don’t leave the door open. Not blocking aggressively, but my trajectory corner to corner keeps SOPHY honest while behind.

The furthest I’ve gapped SOPHY in the 10 lap race was 1.1 seconds. Had a train of three M3 EVOs and the pole position RS 500 battling me for first the whole race. Finished the race 0.3 seconds ahead of a SOPHY M3 that divebomed the P2 RS 500 at the final corner. The Boost weak was definitely keeping SOPHY on my tail.

Next race, I jumped in an M3 EVO 320BHP/983kg. Set one M3 EVO to ATCC specs 340BHP/983kg(all other M3s are same spec and my car). While having a SOPHY in the 540BHP/1185kg RS 500. The M3 is so good, I was able to battle for 17th(yay) with no problem. Making up for the RS 500 straight line speed advantage. Both SOPHY is the ATCC spec cars had checked out.
Meanwhile, there was plenty of overtaking for positions just like at Spa.

As pointed out a few pages ago, if taking yourself out of the race, as I’ve done many times to spectate, the AI will gradually make moves. With SOPHY, they’ll say in the procession and hold station for the race.

 

[Sir Crashalot]

Put the boost on it's default setting of off. That puts boost on and you'll find that at the halfway point in the race Sophy will slow down to let you catch her.

So I just tested this, again at Spa and again one make with the A110.
Good news, the difficulty setting actually works here!
I started with intermediate and shot from last place to 12th before Les Combes. Nah, too quick, exit.
Next try on Professional. Much better but still not extremely hard. Took P1 on lap 4 but Sophy kept the pressure. Driving error by me on the last lap and I finished P3.

So, for one makes, boost off and professional difficulty seems to be the way to go when you use Sophy. In terms of pace it's about the same as regular AI on Professional with boost weak. Maybe a bit slower but therefore you get the benefit of a more predictable and fairer driving style by AI.
Still, there seems to be no setting that allows for a real competitive and realistic type of race, at least not for one makes.

 

[BadBoomerang]

Anyone else noticing Sophy cannot figure out fuel/pit stops?

Set up a race where everyone needs to pit around lap 6/7 of 9. Whole field pits together which is annoying but not as much as the back 6-10 cars deciding they didn't take enough fuel during the pit stop (they only need a half tank to finish at most), and so decide to pit again just before the final lap... Even though they've got the exact same amount of fuel (or more) that the rest of the cars.

The entire pack is split by about 8-10 seconds going into the last lap, but the last group putting puts them 30 seconds behind for absolutely no reason.

Tried adding laps, changing the multiplier,changing the refuel rate, and none of it changes that behaviour.

So guessing put stops are still pretty much pointless.


Its crazy how much difference "boost weak" makes to the Sophy races too.
With it on I'm lucky if I can go from the back to the top 8 in 9 laps.

With it off I can be at the front in 2-3, gain a 5 second lead without any sweat.

Same cars both races, and my car is by no means faster than any of them.


Love the Sophy option generally but feels like it needs some bug fixing/polish.

 

[Tired Tyres]

I did a 300KM race at Dragon Tail for gr3 cars. The GT3 cars pitted after I did at around an hour, but the faster cars, McLaren F1, Viper and Mazda VGT all pitted before me.

That was will fuel and tyres at 1x.

These faster cars pitted again towards the end of the race. They clearly didn't put enough fuel in as they had either 0 or 5 litres left when they pitted. This lead to me winning by 16 seconds. The fact that the other GT3 cars including a Ferrari 458 GT3 just like the one I was driving all pitted after me indicates that Sophy was fuel saving when I was struggling to keep up at full fuel.

This means endurance races against Sophy will be harder....

Or not.I did the 300KM again and was in a battle with two Audi R8's (who knew the '15 was faster than the Evo?) They both pitted one lap after me and then I blew it big time with 2 laps to go. I was just driving around in 3rd after that but got a big shock. Both Audi's pitted again. They showed 2 litres left. Behind us the two M6's did the same thing. This handed me a race, which if I'm being honest, I was only going to finish 2nd at best due to the superior straight line pace of a car that in the real world had a reputation for being slow in a straight line because of all the downforce they had....

This has got to be a bug. Hopefully PD will fix.

 

[Aphelion]

I did a 300KM race at Dragon Tail for gr3 cars. The GT3 cars pitted after I did at around an hour, but the faster cars, McLaren F1, Viper and Mazda VGT all pitted before me.

That was will fuel and tyres at 1x.

These faster cars pitted again towards the end of the race. They clearly didn't put enough fuel in as they had either 0 or 5 litres left when they pitted. This lead to me winning by 16 seconds. The fact that the other GT3 cars including a Ferrari 458 GT3 just like the one I was driving all pitted after me indicates that Sophy was fuel saving when I was struggling to keep up at full fuel.

This means endurance races against Sophy will be harder....

Or not.I did the 300KM again and was in a battle with two Audi R8's (who knew the '15 was faster than the Evo?) They both pitted one lap after me and then I blew it big time with 2 laps to go. I was just driving around in 3rd after that but got a big shock. Both Audi's pitted again. They showed 2 litres left. Behind us the two M6's did the same thing. This handed me a race, which if I'm being honest, I was only going to finish 2nd at best due to the superior straight line pace of a car that in the real world had a reputation for being slow in a straight line because of all the downforce they had....

This has got to be a bug. Hopefully PD will fix.

I have definitely noticed this kind of thing with the regular AI as well, it's very common for the AI to pit on the very last lap because the fuel light comes on and they just panic, even if they totally have just enough fuel to make it.

 

[MroczMR]

Still, there seems to be no setting that allows for a real competitive and realistic type of race, at least not for one makes.

There is. It is boost set to weak instead of off. It turns off rubberbanding completly. The settings are mixed. Boost off should be boost weak etc.

 

[Aphelion]

There is. It is boost set to weak instead of off. It turns off rubberbanding completly. The settings are mixed. Boost off should be boost weak etc.

One-make races still dont work very well with "boost weak" because all of the cars on the track drive identically and therefore never overtake each other, driving like a train. Definitely one of the most glaring problems with Sophy at the moment.

 

[KAlex122]

There is. It is boost set to weak instead of off. It turns off rubberbanding completly. The settings are mixed. Boost off should be boost weak etc.

I don't think it's just mixed. Boost weak has a boost. If i drive the same car as my opponent behind me and get a better exit out of a corner i gain time at the corner exit but on the long straight after it i keep loosing again. If the cars where completely the same, i should gain and gain. Here we see that there is in fact a boost on.

It's just Polyphony-weirdness as they just can't provide the tools for perfect races. We are forced to work around that as good as we can. (Which is a shame because the 99 % of players not on this forum will have no clue.)

 

[zjn]

2 comments:
the first on the ability to save gasoline. i don't think the AI can/is capable of adjusting the engine mapping. I think the only thing they possibly can do (but I'm not convinced they are capable) is adjust the lap pace to save fuel. With these assumptions, if the gas runs out, it runs out. So either they do the math wrong and when they go to the pits they don't put in the right amount, or, for some race configuration, it may happen that they have to go back to the pits on the last lap because they couldn't make saving.

The second on the boost. I think it is unrealistic. Yes, certainly boost week makes sure that it doesn't create too big gaps, but it does it in an unrealistic way. Sometimes the car behind on the straight becomes a missile and makes up a second. On the same straight where maybe on the lap before you came out of the corner in the slipstream and overtook them on the straight yourself. This is even more noticeable in races where the opponents' cars are randomly chosen. The behaviors of the same car inside the race vary hysterically from lap to lap. This is why I prefer boost off. It makes the difference between the cars seem more real, net of AI and human driving ability.

 

[Alfa Romeo GT]

The second on the boost. I think it is unrealistic. Yes, certainly boost week makes sure that it doesn't create too big gaps, but it does it in an unrealistic way.

Yes, you only need to do two races to verify this...

One race with two identical vehicles between us and sophy.

And a race where the player uses a vehicle much more powerful than sophy.
You'll see in the replay of the second race that sophy had an unrealistically high top speed to catch us.

She was driving a Megane Trophy 11 and her top speed was over 250 km/h, which is impossible.

 

[05XR8]

Ran a couple Kangoo test races. Regular(Reggie™️) AI was competitive at this circuit, as per usual.

Seemed okay at Miyabi, but too easy compared to ther races I’ve done.

Even tough Reggie™️ kept pace, still track dependent with certain set ups.

 

[wowbaggerBR]

this is my Interlagos 100KM race one make event using the Porsche 911 CS from 1995. As you can see, if you have the patience lol, the Sophy field splits strategies and the cars are not all bunched up at the end.

managed to make things interesting by combining ballast and performance limits randomly (made a python script for this):

#03 R. Gomes - Ballast: 6 - Performance: 100
#04 P. Marques - Ballast: 6 - Performance: 95
#05 L. Giacomelli - Ballast: 7 - Performance: 98
#06 F. Reynaud - Ballast: 5 - Performance: 99
#07 R. Capello - Ballast: 10 - Performance: 99
#08 R. Goodwin - Ballast: 6 - Performance: 96
#21 J. Raulet - Ballast: 6 - Performance: 97
#22 M. Gottlieb - Ballast: 10 - Performance: 96
#27 F. Garrett - Ballast: 8 - Performance: 100
#28 A. Garrett - Ballast: 9 - Performance: 98
#29 J. Watson - Ballast: 6 - Performance: 96
#30 L. Rowland - Ballast: 9 - Performance: 97
#35 D. Eberhardt - Ballast: 9 - Performance: 100
#36 A. Turner - Ballast: 5 - Performance: 95
#55 A. Dumas - Ballast: 8 - Performance: 96
#56 L. Astrada - Ballast: 10 - Performance: 98
#87 F. Mayer - Ballast: 8 - Performance: 100
#88 O. Poutanen - Ballast: 10 - Performance: 98
#91 L. White - Ballast: 6 - Performance: 97
#92 A. Carboni - Ballast: 8 - Performance: 97

the script won't ever generate a grid with more than 4 cars at 100% performance level. Performance ranges from 94 to 100% and ballast from 5 to 10kg, and no two cars will be ever the same. I am refining it with some more features to make things more unpredictable and races feel more realistic.

2 comments:
the first on the ability to save gasoline. i don't think the AI can/is capable of adjusting the engine mapping. I think the only thing they possibly can do (but I'm not convinced they are capable) is adjust the lap pace to save fuel. With these assumptions, if the gas runs out, it runs out. So either they do the math wrong and when they go to the pits they don't put in the right amount, or, for some race configuration, it may happen that they have to go back to the pits on the last lap because they couldn't make saving.

They absolutely do save fuel. I did some runs with my spec series setup where the fuel would be marginal to finish the race. I went with 1 mapping with no saving and I had to do a splash and go at the end while Sophy managed to finish the race without it. I don't think it saves fuel by changing engine mapping, but you can clearly spot it doing corners with higher gears than necessary, for instance.

In my video, there is one Sophy car that gets the math wrong and stops at the last lap for fuel.

 

[Bojador]

I got to try the update yesterday. I'll start by saying I haven't been playing much so I'm definitely not up to speed.

I agree with most things you're reporting, but one thing I haven't seen mention is how aggressive, in a bad way, Sophy is. They push to pass, they go for moves and outbreak themselves, they don't leave space when going side by side on a corner...

They are fast, but very one dimensional for now. They drive every lap the same. They loose time in the same corners, have 2 or 3 variations of lines they take. When battling other AI cars you do see some variation, but not much.

I'd say is much better and it's fun to battle for the last places on the grid and follow an AI car, but when you're being chased you just know they will see openings when there's aren't any. Road Atlanta seems to be the worst offender in this case.

Best race for me was a one make Lambo Huracan Gr4 at Monza. The AI is slow in the second chicane and the S's but it was a very fun race.

They still struggle with some corners like Eau Rouge where they take the wrong line and often touch the curb on the right and start to loose the car in front of you. It happened way too many times with Gr3 cars. And they lift in the left corner before the bus stop.

They also lift at 130R in Suzuka and are too slow in the inner part of Interlagos.

I had fun, and I hope they can iterate on this.

 

[suomi1]

The positive side of all this is that the more players use Custom Race mode, the more people will notice that it has many problems. In the long run, it might help to make things happen. I say "might" because I read (I can't remember when) that PD had made these choices on purpose.

By the way, I found that quite ironic to see people realizing Custom Race is bugged after 3 years spent to say "You want a career mode and endurance races? Stop whining and create yours yourself!". See? Now let's complain together so things may change..

 

[pritchyTim]

this is my Interlagos 100KM race one make event using the Porsche 911 CS from 1995. As you can see, if you have the patience lol, the Sophy field splits strategies and the cars are not all bunched up at the end.



They absolutely do save fuel. I did some runs with my spec series setup where the fuel would be marginal to finish the race. I went with 1 mapping with no saving and I had to do a splash and go at the end while Sophy managed to finish the race without it. I don't think it saves fuel by changing engine mapping, but you can clearly spot it doing corners with higher gears than necessary, for instance.

In my video, there is one Sophy car that gets the math wrong and stops at the last lap for fuel.

mind sharing your tune for that 911? Sophy’s been all over the track for me with a couple of mine…



namely that 911 and the aero-lacking lambos!

 

[wowbaggerBR]

mind sharing your tune for that 911? Sophy’s been all over the track for me with a couple of mine…



namely that 911 and the aero-lacking lambos!

they are all running the default tune. The only changes I made were adding the wide body mod, front and side aero bits, a diffuser, and a rear wing. I also had to buy the ballast and performance limiter for each car, but other than that, no modifications were made, even to the one I drive.

 

[appu]

I always have been returning to Gran Turismo whenever there was something exciting in Sport. I never thought I would return to Gran Turismo to play custom races. But Sophy 2.1 got me curious. I spent the weekend playing against it. Some observations:
1. Multiclass racing works as intended. Can't believe we have a functional multiclass racing now!
2. Yes, boost weak makes Sophy more competitive but having boost weak is bad for strategy. For example, if I go for an overcut, the boost system makes all the other drivers much faster than is realistic, and my overcut strategy goes to waste.
3. I finally settled for boost off. Yes, Sophy is tamer but it remains a competitive threat nonetheless (I am a DR low-A driver). It also makes the race feel more realistic by having drivers spread out unevenly instead of being in a tight train. That uneven-ness is still pretty tight, mind you. Way tighter than in Sport.
4. My favorite custom race so far was the simplest one- 50 min endurance at the Green Hell in GT3 with BOP and with a complete day-night cycle (30x time speed). 3x tire and 3x fuel, meaning one tire change and some splash of fuel was required (I changed into another set of hards, to be fair to Sophy). It was fun for me to cut off fueling quickly like I do in Sport so that I don't lose out on precious sub-second gaps.

Edit: And oh, I forgot to add one last point: I loved it!! Can't wait for support for the rain!

 

[miata_rf]

I found this update to be very humbling.

(Boost off, professional difficulty) Starting from 20th in Suzuka, with NSX 00', I found myself fighting with the top 3 after 5 laps. The top 2 drivers offered a very fun fight and I finished 2nd, but all the others were a bit slow. FL started at around 2:05, dropped to 2:03 later in the race.

(Boost weak, beginner) I'm fighting to keep up with the pack ahead in 18th. FL was around 2:00 right from the start.

Love the ability to finally customize the length of the races, even if I can't make much sense of the settings.

 

[zjn]

I always have been returning to Gran Turismo whenever there was something exciting in Sport. I never thought I would return to Gran Turismo to play custom races. But Sophy 2.1 got me curious. I spent the weekend playing against it. Some observations:
1. Multiclass racing works as intended. Can't believe we have a functional multiclass racing now!
2. Yes, boost weak makes Sophy more competitive but having boost weak is bad for strategy. For example, if I go for an overcut, the boost system makes all the other drivers much faster than is realistic, and my overcut strategy goes to waste.
3. I finally settled for boost off. Yes, Sophy is tamer but it remains a competitive threat nonetheless (I am a DR low-A driver). It also makes the race feel more realistic by having drivers spread out unevenly instead of being in a tight train. That uneven-ness is still pretty tight, mind you. Way tighter than in Sport.
4. My favorite custom race so far was the simplest one- 50 min endurance at the Green Hell in GT3 with BOP and with a complete day-night cycle (30x time speed). 3x tire and 3x fuel, meaning one tire change and some splash of fuel was required (I changed into another set of hards, to be fair to Sophy). It was fun for me to cut off fueling quickly like I do in Sport so that I don't lose out on precious sub-second gaps.

Edit: And oh, I forgot to add one last point: I loved it!! Can't wait for support for the rain!

Your 1) is very intriguing
Does it really mean that a mixed field of gr3 and gr4 behave properly, no matter if the human driver is on the gr3 or gr4?

 

[Nebuc72]

Your 1) is very intriguing
Does it really mean that a mixed field of gr3 and gr4 behave properly, no matter if the human driver is on the gr3 or gr4?

I have only tried in the slower class but it was flawless for me. The slower class has no slowdown, and Sophy is fantastic at managing traffic. Can't recommend giving it a go enough.

 

[05XR8]

Going to have to rebuild my '09 Rolex Sports Car series now that I don't have to worry about slowdown.

 

[Galvston]

Ready to post my Sophy findings.

Boost Weak is the fastest apart from Strong but strong has considerable rubberbanding.

Weak will have rubberbanding ONLY if the car that is behind is way behind. I couldn't specify how many seconds (anyone have an Idea?). For this I was using a Gallardo vs Civic SiR (sophy car), both stock.

At tokyo, the Civic will reach the tunnel at 200km if driven by me, at the end of the straight, 218 km/h. With Sophy, after she is way behind, it can reach around 228 km/h at the end of the straight. So in boost weak it gets a 10 kilometer boost, ONLY if way behind.

When its in racing situations, i.e., has cars around it, even on boost weak It will be stock and have stock speed, doesn't matter if there's like 2 or 3 cars way ahead, If one is close to It, it will have regular speed. This means either my car or another sophy car.

So I tried the other way around, SOPHY with the Gallardo and me on the Civic with boost weak to see if anyone of us is affected: nope.

Sophy will Max out at 311km/h, like me when I tried the Gallardo. My Civic, even if way behind SOPHY, will not gain 10 kilometers per hour like she does, was maxing out at the same 218km/h as before.

So, If SOPHY on boost weak rubberbands ONLY if the next car is waaaay ahead, its a great compromise to have boost weak turned on. When in racing situations its running on regular speed. It does not rubberband.

If anyone can disagree and show I am wrong I am waiting to discuss this. So Far, boost weak sophy is great.