GT Sport Driver Coaching

[Shottah072]

Cool! I updated my lap to a 2:01.668, with an optimal of a 2:01.301, so hopefully with your advice and replay I can break the :01 barrier!
The lobby is RM, BoP, and no tuning. It's a practice lobby specifically for this

Ah yes thats already quite some improvement. Looking good. Bathurst is a real fun track to drive once you get the hang of it and can get in the rythm.

 

[Alpha Cipher]

Ah yes thats already quite some improvement. Looking good. Bathurst is a real fun track to drive once you get the hang of it and can get in the rythm.

Yep! I started loving the track, but I realized I'm really slow in it, so I started to hate the track. Now that I'm getting better and better I'm starting to love it again

 

[Blacki2k2]

This is a great thread. Thanks to @RaceFace85 to make this possible. I have two laps, one on Dragon Trail and one on Alsace. I think i'm a good driver, not the fast, but good enough to race most time in a consistent way.

Booth laps are driven with Motul Autech GT-R in GR.2 Class. BoP is on, no tuning. Tires RH and no tire wear and no fuel consumption. My personal best lap time on Dragon trail is 1.28.070 (with tire wear and fuel consumption, tires were 10% worn and fuel was about 50%, no splistream), and i know, there must be a part, where i can improve my best time round about with -0.3 secs to land at 1.27.7. I didn't have that video, and it's hard to get this time again. Normally i have in races laptimes around 12.8.3 - 1.28.8. Maybe you can find some improvements here.



Then there is alsace, i didn't remember my fastest lap, but i think 1.40.x is possible, and maybe you have an advice for this track. I think it is not optimal what i have done here...



Thx!

 

[RaceFace85]

This is a great thread. Thanks to @RaceFace85 to make this possible. I have two laps, one on Dragon Trail and one on Alsace. I think i'm a good driver, not the fast, but good enough to race most time in a consistent way.

Booth laps are driven with Motul Autech GT-R in GR.2 Class. BoP is on, no tuning. Tires RH and no tire wear and no fuel consumption. My personal best lap time on Dragon trail is 1.28.070 (with tire wear and fuel consumption, tires were 10% worn and fuel was about 50%, no splistream), and i know, there must be a part, where i can improve my best time round about with -0.3 secs to land at 1.27.7. I didn't have that video, and it's hard to get this time again. Normally i have in races laptimes around 12.8.3 - 1.28.8. Maybe you can find some improvements here.



Then there is alsace, i didn't remember my fastest lap, but i think 1.40.x is possible, and maybe you have an advice for this track. I think it is not optimal what i have done here...



Thx!

I am not very fast at Alsace but for Dragon Trail I can help you.

You drive with the cones, but when you want to get much faster they will be a problem for you because you can cut the corners very extreme at dragon trail.

At the first sharp left corner after the long right corner you can make about a second when you cut the corner. It is enough to get no penalty when you slightly touch the curbs with the outside wheels. The curbs are round and higher at the middle and so you can get support and extra grip for your outside wheels from the curb.

You can do the cuts everywhere at Dragon Trail except at the long last right corner. You can do the curb support cutting technic also at the long S corner but here it is difficult to get the corner right without penalty and sometimes the car jumps over the curb.

You do a very good foot work and your line is good except that you don't cut the Apex.

The curbs are part of the track and so it is enough when you are with the two outside wheels on the inside part of the curb.

 

[Blacki2k2]

I am not very fast at Alsace but for Dragon Trail I can help you.

You drive with the cones, but when you want to get much faster they will be a problem for you because you can cut the corners very extreme at dragon trail.

At the first sharp left corner after the long right corner you can make about a second when you cut the corner. It is enough to get no penalty when you slightly touch the curbs with the outside wheels. The curbs are round and higher at the middle and so you can get support and extra grip for your outside wheels from the curb.

You can do the cuts everywhere at Dragon Trail except at the long last right corner. You can do the curb support cutting technic also at the long S corner but here it is difficult to get the corner right without penalty and sometimes the car jumps over the curb.

You do a very good foot work and your line is good except that you don't cut the Apex.

The curbs are part of the track and so it is enough when you are with the two outside wheels on the inside part of the curb.

Thx for your detailed feedback. I check the curbs out and leave a replay when im able to improve my times with it!

 

[inri]

Necro
Can anyone help me with Bathurst Gr. 3 (RS 01)? It's on RM tires but I can only manage a 2:02

I'll try again, this time with CSA off, but anything else anyone might add?

i'm OK at bathurst (low 2:02 or high 2:01 i forget which and the stats site is down, with rh and BoP). you can go on the power earlier for turn 1. seems like a lot of people in the daily races lose a tenth or two a lap there, maybe they aren't paying attention since it's not a complex corner but there's a straight afterwards

at 45 seconds, a nice way to take that corner is to ride the brakes at like half throttle through the apex, depending on the car and brake balance you can get this nice on rails feeling. i think the rs01 and other MR cars like to take fast corners like that

the uphill section is nice

You don't need to lift that much for the last corner before the downhill sector begins, in fact you dont necessarily need to lift at all but a safety lift during racing and timed qualifying is a good idea cos the flat out line is hard and probably can't be done on worn tyres. but you only need to go to maybe 80% throttle for a fraction of a second right as the car goes light. easy 2 tenths there i think

you're probably losing time on the downhill bit, it seems kinda tentative to me. my tip again is to ride the brakes but not too heavily, at least from the bridge until the first slow corner. the reason is that since its downhill you get a lot of lift off oversteer and stuff like that, i think thats what its called, like when the car slides during turning. anyway if you keep some throttle and brake on for most of it cars seem to feel more stable there, which means you can go faster. i think keeping the car steady is the basic principle of going fast down there

the rest looks fine

 

[mirial]

I’m not the fastest all around, but I can usually get into the leaderboards when is Gr.1. I may be able to help with that, specially at Nurb GP, Kyoto and Suzuka.

I really like this type of thread. I had one like this before, but was called something like “What is wrong with me”, so it was the other way around. I was looking for help, and soon other people joined me in the search for mentors.

I think all the groups other than Gr.1, particularly because of the dreaded default ABS is more a reflection of sim racer quackery exploitation than anything special with those laps that so called aliens do. You just have to look, and there is nothing Hamilton-esque going on, so the fact you are better in group one than the others is a more positive sign in my opinion. Notice how the so called star drivers seldom do group 1.

 

[xxxman1]

While I am happy to break my PB by 1s on a Veryon. Still looking for wise word to improve the lap time. Thanks.

Just can’t break the 56 barrier.

 

[Nando deBem]

I have a Monza question too.
I did a good lap in that RedBull Standard event. Got 4th in the Americas, but I was still almost one second off the pace of the 1st place. So, if someone could watch and try to figure it out where I lost 1 second, it would be awesome. Thanks!

 

[Nando deBem]

While I am happy to break my PB by 1s on a Veryon. Still looking for wise word to improve the lap time. Thanks.

Just can’t break the 56 barrier.

I’ve never driven the Veyron, so it’s a genuine question. Are those early shifts on porpose?

Sorry, I double posted! I didn’t even notice!

 

[xxxman1]

I’ve never driven the Veyron, so it’s a genuine question. Are those early shifts on porpose?

Sorry, I double posted! I didn’t even notice!

I watched at least 3 top stars on Veryon. They all did the same. I found that the acceleration is a bit faster for early shifts especially at 5/6 gears.

 

[mthomas_95]

I think all the groups other than Gr.1, particularly because of the dreaded default ABS is more a reflection of sim racer quackery exploitation than anything special with those laps that so called aliens do. You just have to look, and there is nothing Hamilton-esque going on, so the fact you are better in group one than the others is a more positive sign in my opinion. Notice how the so called star drivers seldom do group 1.

Weird, those "so called" aliens are still right at the front in the Gr1 cars in my experience. If it's so easy to drive with default ABS why am I not seeing your name at the top of all the leaderboards and FIA standings

 

[Alpha Cipher]

Weird, those "so called" aliens are still right at the front in the Gr1 cars in my experience. If it's so easy to drive with default ABS why am I not seeing your name at the top of all the leaderboards and FIA standings

#burn

 

[mirial]

Weird, those "so called" aliens are still right at the front in the Gr1 cars in my experience. If it's so easy to drive with default ABS why am I not seeing your name at the top of all the leaderboards and FIA standings

That's the point. You simply cannot rotate the car, and any attempt to get the car on the limit or slightly over it is immediately thwarted. With previous GTs, this was rewarded and reflected by the lap time and immediate feedback, but Default ABS, and to a lesser degree weak ABS are skill levellers in GTS, as they do away with the cruscendo of the corner, which is setting up the rotation - a vital skill that has to be mastered in karting before you can competently drive anything else. Yes, we have a system that prevents us from overstepping the mark, which is not what driving on the limit is about, and.......this is why we have this horrid penalty system ATM, because those who advocate assists, are victims of their own driving philosophy because any assist doesn't encourage patience or discipline (I've checked the dashes of guys who have wiped me out in the past and they always at least had CSA or TCS or both).

My name doesn't appear in any of the standings because I've been busy, I don't agree with the cars/track choices that PD/popularity choose, and added to that, I'm mediocre in mediocre cars which is about 90% of what is FIA, and because of the rotation problem I mentioned above.

 

[CaptainAlan8]

That's the point. You simply cannot rotate the car, and any attempt to get the car on the limit or slightly over it is immediately thwarted. With previous GTs, this was rewarded and reflected by the lap time and immediate feedback, but Default ABS, and to a lesser degree weak ABS are skill levellers in GTS, as they do away with the cruscendo of the corner, which is setting up the rotation - a vital skill that has to be mastered in karting before you can competently drive anything else. Yes, we have a system that prevents us from overstepping the mark, which is not what driving on the limit is about, and.......this is why we have this horrid penalty system ATM, because those who advocate assists, are victims of their own driving philosophy because any assist doesn't encourage patience or discipline (I've checked the dashes of guys who have wiped me out in the past and they always at least had CSA or TCS or both).

My name doesn't appear in any of the standings because I've been busy, I don't agree with the cars/track choices that PD/popularity choose, and added to that, I'm mediocre in mediocre cars which is about 90% of what is FIA, and because of the rotation problem I mentioned above.

I agree that ABS is a bit of a skill leveler. But GTS as a whole is quite a skill leveler (simcade). It has a relatively low skill cap and once you get there it’s just a case of practice and repetition.

But I think that’s half of the appeal of GTS. It makes for some great close racing online and that’s the main reason I keep coming back!

 

[Vegard]

Still looking for wise word to improve the lap time. Thanks.

I do feel uncomfortable giving advice to fast drivers but I notice you have a tendency to turn in a little bit early on some corners (Lesmo 2 and the first part of Ascari). Your line into Parabolica also leaves some room for improvement.

Note that I haven't driven the Veyron at Monza but rather I am making these comments on a general basis.

 

[Stotty]

That's the point. You simply cannot rotate the car, and any attempt to get the car on the limit or slightly over it is immediately thwarted. With previous GTs, this was rewarded and reflected by the lap time and immediate feedback, but Default ABS, and to a lesser degree weak ABS are skill levellers in GTS, as they do away with the cruscendo of the corner, which is setting up the rotation - a vital skill that has to be mastered in karting before you can competently drive anything else. Yes, we have a system that prevents us from overstepping the mark, which is not what driving on the limit is about, and.......this is why we have this horrid penalty system ATM, because those who advocate assists, are victims of their own driving philosophy because any assist doesn't encourage patience or discipline (I've checked the dashes of guys who have wiped me out in the past and they always at least had CSA or TCS or both).

I don't think there's any difference in how ABS works in GTS compared to the other recent versions of GT.

What is different in GTS is the lack of oversteer if you release the brakes sharply whilst trailing braking - which was the 'trick' to make cars rotate in to the corner in GT6 (for example). Personally, I have no issue with this as it was a completely unrealistic behavior... watching some of the super fast drivers drift the rear of F1 cars, or LMPs, in to corners on slick tyres in GT6 was always hilarious.

I'll qualify this by saying there no (or significantly less) 'brake release oversteer' on stock settings (I've not spent much time driving tuned cars)... so might still be there, but hidden by the massive amounts of positive rear toe and high LSD decel cars have stock.

 

[Alpha Cipher]

While I am happy to break my PB by 1s on a Veryon. Still looking for wise word to improve the lap time. Thanks.

Just can’t break the 56 barrier.

At T1, you can tuck the car further into that first chicane. You can cut it as much as you did at the second chicane.

Speaking of the second chicane, you were able to cut the corner nicely, but lacked commitment on the throttle. When you stop braking you go flat out there though you might need a slight amount if throttle modulation/countersteer on the second part of the chicane because the kerbs can unsettle the car to the point of spinning out if you carry that much speed.

Lesmos 1 you can trail brake for the whole corner, instead of dabbing the brakes fully and then coasting throughout. This way you can tuck the corner further up inside the corner and apply the throttle earlier, as well as making use of all the exit. Lesmos 2 is good.

Through the Ascari your line is perfect, you just need more commitment to the throttle again on the first corner.

Parabolica you braked too late and missed the apex. The cones there are decently placed, so you can rely on them

 

[xxxman1]

At T1, you can tuck the car further into that first chicane. You can cut it as much as you did at the second chicane.

Speaking of the second chicane, you were able to cut the corner nicely, but lacked commitment on the throttle. When you stop braking you go flat out there though you might need a slight amount if throttle modulation/countersteer on the second part of the chicane because the kerbs can unsettle the car to the point of spinning out if you carry that much speed.

Lesmos 1 you can trail brake for the whole corner, instead of dabbing the brakes fully and then coasting throughout. This way you can tuck the corner further up inside the corner and apply the throttle earlier, as well as making use of all the exit. Lesmos 2 is good.

Through the Ascari your line is perfect, you just need more commitment to the throttle again on the first corner.

Parabolica you braked too late and missed the apex. The cones there are decently placed, so you can rely on them

Thanks @Alpha Cipher for such a detailed comment. Appreciating your turn by turn corner by corner advise. I need more courage to the throttle. Easy to get your point. Hard to execute behind the wheel. Thanks again.

 

[Alpha Cipher]

Thanks @Alpha Cipher for such a detailed comment. Appreciating your turn by turn corner by corner advise. I need more courage to the throttle. Easy to get your point. Hard to execute behind the wheel. Thanks again.

Welcome
These 4WD cars really need to be worked on with the throttle because they're so stable, but too much and it's understeer heaven
With your lines though you can do it

 

[xxxman1]

I do feel uncomfortable giving advice to fast drivers but I notice you have a tendency to turn in a little bit early on some corners (Lesmo 2 and the first part of Ascari). Your line into Parabolica also leaves some room for improvement.

Note that I haven't driven the Veyron at Monza but rather I am making these comments on a general basis.

Thanks @Vegard I treasure every advices from gtp. We all need improvements. Turn in early may be my driving style. Just can’t attack corners as quick as faster guy so I tend to brake a bit early hence turn in a bit early. Thanks again

 

[RaceFace85]

I am very happy that this thread is used how it was intended!

 

[adstomko]

I have noticed two racing teams which need some advice. The teams, Oscaro and TX3, seem to be having trouble with the application of the brake pedal.
Could one of you kindly help them out where they are going wrong?

 

[Alpha Cipher]

I have noticed two racing teams which need some advice. The teams, Oscaro and TX3, seem to be having trouble with the application of the brake pedal.
Could one of you kindly help them out where they are going wrong?

If you can point out that something's wrong with their brake pedal application, I think you can answer your own questions yourself
They won't really learn either since they don't know this thread

 

[steviea712]

I have noticed two racing teams which need some advice. The teams, Oscaro and TX3, seem to be having trouble with the application of the brake pedal.
Could one of you kindly help them out where they are going wrong?

First 2 are disgraceful

Third one is more a case of 2 wide into / through that particular corner just doesn’t work, doesn’t seem as malicious as the other 2 incidents to me

 

[adstomko]

First 2 are disgraceful

Third one is more a case of 2 wide into / through that particular corner just doesn’t work, doesn’t seem as malicious as the other 2 incidents to me

Nowhere near as malicious, just dumb. He brakes too late, wobbles, then doesn't leave any space on outside. There was enough space for two cars, but he was selfish with the space available.

 

[steviea712]

Nowhere near as malicious, just dumb. He brakes too late, wobbles, then doesn't leave any space on outside. There was enough space for two cars, but he was selfish with the space available.

Definitely wouldn’t disagree, it is clumsy but it’s more of a racing incident rather than a deliberate take out, the other 2 were simply acts of petulance, pretty pathetic for drivers of their calibre

 

[mirial]

I don't think there's any difference in how ABS works in GTS compared to the other recent versions of GT.

What is different in GTS is the lack of oversteer if you release the brakes sharply whilst trailing braking - which was the 'trick' to make cars rotate in to the corner in GT6 (for example). Personally, I have no issue with this as it was a completely unrealistic behavior... watching some of the super fast drivers drift the rear of F1 cars, or LMPs, in to corners on slick tyres in GT6 was always hilarious.

I'll qualify this by saying there no (or significantly less) 'brake release oversteer' on stock settings (I've not spent much time driving tuned cars)... so might still be there, but hidden by the massive amounts of positive rear toe and high LSD decel cars have stock.

Interesting you think there is no difference between the ABS in GTS and previous versions. I've had a good go at trying to get the Gr.2s to rotate and point into the corners on entry with little success (lap times are much of a muchness default settings or not). But I've noticed the ride height is limited to 70 at the front on the NSX and GTR whilst the rear is 75 and 70 respectively; these were the same limits in GT5 and GT6, and I always remember that the Lexus could be raised to 105 on some tracks with mostly low and medium speed corners which would then operate at a much lower slip angle, resulting in the car being on the limit or close to it in most corners which was easy to rotate when carefully coming off the brakes.

I've also played around with 919 which possibly comes closest to the Lexus in the above scenario and which if you're not careful, will break into oversteer when coming off the brakes at Monza at least. Other tracks would have to tried with more moderate braking. It's possible that once you set the car up to work at lower slip angles and therefore closer to limit, that the ABS just becomes less effective because the car just isn't sliding as much and there is virtually no transition between having loads of grip and none at all.

 

[Stotty]

Interesting you think there is no difference between the ABS in GTS and previous versions. I've had a good go at trying to get the Gr.2s to rotate and point into the corners on entry with little success (lap times are much of a muchness default settings or not). But I've noticed the ride height is limited to 70 at the front on the NSX and GTR whilst the rear is 75 and 70 respectively; these were the same limits in GT5 and GT6, and I always remember that the Lexus could be raised to 105 on some tracks with mostly low and medium speed corners which would then operate at a much lower slip angle, resulting in the car being on the limit or close to it in most corners which was easy to rotate when carefully coming off the brakes.

I've also played around with 919 which possibly comes closest to the Lexus in the above scenario and which if you're not careful, will break into oversteer when coming off the brakes at Monza at least. Other tracks would have to tried with more moderate braking. It's possible that once you set the car up to work at lower slip angles and therefore closer to limit, that the ABS just becomes less effective because the car just isn't sliding as much and there is virtually no transition between having loads of grip and none at all.

Ride height has been a bit of an oddity since GT5… for a long period it worked counter to real life (in so far as you got more rotation with a high front/low rear… and also a higher top speed ).

Even when they said it was ‘fixed’, it never seemed to work as it did in GT1-5P (where low front vs rear = more rotation). I haven’t tested it extensively in GTS, but from what I have tested, I don’t find a positive rake (low front) has much of an effect on rotation.

Personally, I think the lack of rotation in GTS is down to 2 of the stock settings - rear toe and LSD decl.

Stock rear toe is +0.60 on most race cars, and you’ll struggle to get anything to rotate with that much toe. And LSD settings have always had the most influence over handling in previous version of GT… so when you see any LSD decel setting above 10, the car is never going to rotate when decelerating (either braking, or lifting the throttle).

I’m pretty sure I know why the cars are like this – because it makes them easy to drive for casuals/DS users… you never have to worry about the losing the rear because of momentum/weight transfers, all you really have to worry about is oversteer caused by too much throttle. People will have therefore have less serious crashes as understeer is much easier to control than the rear swinging round as you turn in!

LSD decel has always been set quite high stock in previous version of the game… but rear toe used to be +0.20 for almost all cars.

When I do tune something for fun (just hotlapping the ‘Ring, for example), the 1st thing I do on any car is set rear toe to zero and LSD decel to minimum (5)… this creates the maximum amount of rotation on entry. If the car is too unstable to drive like this, I’ll add a bit back in, but in very small increments due to the powerful nature of the effects – so toe in increments of 0.05, LSD decel in increments of 1. However, it's rare I would have either a anything other than minimum.

As it stands, stock, almost every car in GTS is simply front grip limited… there’s very little feeling of the lateral grip being balanced front to rear.

 

[Sean Renon]

Nowhere near as malicious, just dumb. He brakes too late, wobbles, then doesn't leave any space on outside. There was enough space for two cars, but he was selfish with the space available.

FYI, I think you were as much to blame for the 3rd incident as the he was.
Notice how much space he gave you around the first part of the chicane?
You really squeezed him on the second part, leaving no room for error - so when he was struggling to get the car under control you had given him no margin for error and unfortunately when on the outside you got burned.