GT5.....Last in the series?

[FlyingFox]

Having played on Gran Turismo 5 for a few months now one thing has become clear, not everyone is entirely happy with it. It seems to be missing a bit of something for everyone be it cars, tracks, online racing options or graphics. I agree that after of 5 years of development between GT4 and GT5 that they would have done a better job with the game, but it seems that the development team at Polyphony Digital (PD) seem to have got stuck in a rut. But fear not. The PS3 has become more like a PC than a gaming’s console, able to accept updates both for itself and the games that it runs.

So let’s have a look at it.

I play IL2 Sturmovik 1946, which is currently in its 9th evolutionary update and as you know GT5 has had two updates 1.06 and 1.07 which has fixed some problems but not really tackled any big issues that people are bitching about. Why? Should this community start banging on PD’s door asking for what we want or do we just trust them to come up with the goods in their own time? I personally don’t think that people will wait for this so as a community we have to approach P.D. and ask them for updated to rectify some problems.

Cars:
It’s a shame that there are so many cars of the same type and PD has not taken the 5 years to get some new cars on the scene. For instance there are no Australian dealers (Holden/Ford). Talking of Ford, where is the Focus RS? Also there needs to be more RM cars. There are a hell of a lot of racing disciplines around the world and most manufactured cars race in one form or another. All you have to do it turn on Motors TV and you could probably find that most cars that are in GT5 are out there racing in one form or another.

Tracks:
Because of licensing laws PD cannot use certain tracks that some of us would like to see. I personally wanted Spa Francorchamps and Mt. Panorama in Australia (where they hold the Bathurst 1000 for the V8 Supercar series). But what about the tracks that no longer exist? What about the old Hockenheimring where they used to blast into the forest. Surely that can be added along with others that do exist that PD can get the development license for. And what about reinstating some tracks that are not there? The Test Track, Midfield Raceway (always liked that one) and Red Rock Valley (GT2).

Online Racing:
Can’t comment much about this as I’ve not done very much online with GT5, except I think you should be able to choose individual cars or drive trains to use other than just power settings.

Graphics:
GT5 seems to be no better than GT4 and in some cases even worse. Shadow blockiness seems to be an issue whether its car shading and shadows of interior or exterior, for a high definition game are quite frankly poor and this issue really needs addressing if GT5 is to look visually great.

If PD wants to make a midi ocher game to be great, even outstanding then the development team at PD need to listen to what the GT5 community is saying to them and bloody well act upon it. SOON! PD Needn’t fork out millions developing GT6 all they have to do is make GT5 a standalone racing sim. By developing and adding to what they already have.

These are my personnal opinions and as such do not reflect the GT5 community as a whole.

If I’ve left anything out then I apologies and I’m certain you’ll put me right about it!

 

[WuMing77]

*sigh*

I think everyone is pretty sick of this kind of thread now.

There's tons wrong in your statement, the only one I can be bothered to point out for now is check the carlist. The Focus RS is in it.

 

[Stephen220378]

I agree with most of what you're saying but PD will never try to develop GT5 too much and more importantly, Sony won't let them. You say that they don't have to spend millions developing GT6, well put it this way, the GT series makes a lot more money for Sony than they spend making it, why would a company that's out to make as much money as possible continue firing out free updates for a game when the time and resources can by put into developing their next big money spinner? In an ideal world, what you're proposing would be the best solution for us, the consumers, but this isn't an ideal world.

 

[amar212]

I still fight my brain very hard to understand how does your personal rant and subjective claims about GT5 and it's content fits with the title of this thread.

 

[FlyingFox]

I agree with most of what you're saying but PD will never try to develop GT5 too much and more importantly, Sony won't let them. You say that they don't have to spend millions developing GT6, well put it this way, the GT series makes a lot more money for Sony than they spend making it, why would a company that's out to make as much money as possible continue firing out free updates for a game when the time and resources can by put into developing their next big money spinner? In an ideal world, what you're proposing would be the best solution for us, the consumers, but this isn't an ideal world.

I agree totally but who would by GT6 whan GT5 has been a bit of a damp squib? Surley they'd want to say "hey look at this fantastic game we've developed buy GT6 its great".....Not sure I would.

 

[brainfade]

Oh GT is definately getting the chop when Sony process their financial report for the year, £60million for lacklustre effort is not cost effective at all and GT does unfortunately look vulnerable at the end of this fiscal year according to what I'm hearing from within Sony itself.

They're not happy with the level of negative reviews and flaws that are apparent in the game and alot of senior heads are asking just what the hell were PD doing the 5 or 6 years?

Yes, GT did get some good reviews and yes, GT did sell very well, but Sony are not stupid, they know that if there are bad reviews and flaws then it will have a detrimental effect on interest in the sequel and the actual sales of that sequel unless something drastic or innovative is done to improve the game for the sequel.

PD are running on very thin ice at this moment.

 

[amar212]

Oh GT is definately getting the chop when Sony process their financial report for the year, £60million for lacklustre effort is not cost effective at all and GT does unfortunately look vulnerable at the end of this fiscal year according to what I'm hearing from within Sony itself.

They're not happy with the level of negative reviews and flaws that are apparent in the game and alot of senior heads are asking just what the hell were PD doing the 5 or 6 years?

Yes, GT did get some good reviews and yes, GT did sell very well, but Sony are not stupid, they know that if there are bad reviews and flaws then it will have a detrimental effect on interest in the sequel and the actual sales of that sequel unless something drastic or innovative is done to improve the game for the sequel.

PD are running on very thin ice at this moment.

Can you please share us with some evidence of the claims you've presented above?

I find this whole "within Sony itself" very intriguing. Thanx in advance 👍

 

[Gamerwillz]

I have to say that I disagree with you about the graphics. How can you say that GT4 had better graphics?

My disappointments with the game are listed below.

- Lack of events so A-Spec is small and boring.
- Standard cars. Some good cars is ruined by low quality detail.
- There is no way for me to afford a Cr.20,000,000 car with rubbish A-Spec like that.

GT6 development have already started. So GT5 is not the last one.

 

[Bigbazz]

Considering the massive ammount of money this game has already made, i very very much doubt that Sony is considering scrapping their biggest money making, flagship title.

Could you actually be anymore ridiculous?


You know GT5 has already been heralded, is up for the GAME Bafta award? Kaz has been declared a modern influencial icon?


I very much doubt that sony are thinking "oooh this is badd, we will have to scrap the series", regardless of how much you may not like it.

 

[charliec]

Oh GT is definately getting the chop when Sony process their financial report for the year, £60million for lacklustre effort is not cost effective at all and GT does unfortunately look vulnerable at the end of this fiscal year according to what I'm hearing from within Sony itself.

Multiply sales number by retail price. They're probably not that unhappy. http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-...analyst-estimates-sales-forecast-lowered.html

They're not happy with the level of negative reviews and flaws that are apparent in the game and alot of senior heads are asking just what the hell were PD doing the 5 or 6 years?

Other than writing the game from scratch, part of that time was spent developing the 3D implementation for Sony to use to show off the Bravia 3D TV line.

 

[DrTrouserPlank]

Multiply sales by about 2/3rds of the retail price if you want a better estimate. Sony obviously don't get paid the retail price per game sold as there is retail mark-up to account for.

 

[the Interceptor]

I'm absolutely sure there will be a GT6. The much more interesting question is: what will GT6 be, and on which platform?

If GT6 will be released on the PS3, how much further will they patch GT5 and add content to it? Point being: what could GT6 offer that a fully "repaired" GT5 doesn't? A couple of new tracks and more premium cars? And would that really be enough to sell as many units of #6 as #5 did? So the more they polish GT5, the less attractive GT6 might be to potential buyers. On the other hand, leaving GT5 as it is might scare away those exact people, so they never even consider buying GT6. Weird, isn't it?

Another possibility: GT6 will be launched on the PS4. The PS3 is already deep in its lifecycle and might see a successor before GT6 is ready. That would give PD the opportunity to overcome the hardware limitations they were facing with GT5. Nonetheless, it would probably be a lot of work, because they might need to build the game again from the ground up, which will consume loads of time.

So whichever way you turn it, reading the first solid informations about GT6 will be interesting.

 

[charliec]

Multiply sales by about 2/3rds of the retail price if you want a better estimate. Sony obviously don't get paid the retail price per game sold as there is retail mark-up to account for.

Yea that definitely wasn't exact, but you have to remember that GT5P pretty much covered the development cost of GT5 (5+ mil copies at around $30 USD each, much distributed directly via the PS Store), plus with the exchange price differences throughout the world (I think retail price in the UK is about $80 USD for example) they have made out pretty well from GT5. I have a feeling they had minimal expenses on book still from GT5 development so much of what they get back is pure profit.

 

[Gamerwillz]

I'm absolutely sure there will be a GT6. The much more interesting question is: what will GT6 be, and on which platform?

If GT6 will be released on the PS3, how much further will they patch GT5 and add content to it? Point being: what could GT6 offer that a fully "repaired" GT5 doesn't? A couple of new tracks and more premium cars? And would that really be enough to sell as many units of #6 as #5 did? So the more they polish GT5, the less attractive GT6 might be to potential buyers. On the other hand, leaving GT5 as it is might scare away those exact people, so they never even consider buying GT6. Weird, isn't it?

Another possibility: GT6 will be launched on the PS4. The PS3 is already deep in its lifecycle and might see a successor before GT6 is ready. That would give PD the opportunity to overcome the hardware limitations they were facing with GT5. Nonetheless, it would probably be a lot of work, because they might need to build the game again from the ground up, which will consume loads of time.

So whichever way you turn it, reading the first solid informations about GT6 will be interesting.

GT6 already exist. Kaz said that they're working on it. I've read it in a PlayStation magazine.

GT6 will be on PS3. Definitely because Sony wanted PS3 to be around for 10 years. And if you look at the pattern here, you'll see that GT6 will be on PS3:

GT1 and GT2 were on PS1. GT3 and GT4 were on PS2. GT5 and GT6 will be on PS3. So there are two GT games on each consoles.

 

[thesuperfunk]

I agree totally but who would by GT6 whan GT5 has been a bit of a damp squib? Surley they'd want to say "hey look at this fantastic game we've developed buy GT6 its great".....Not sure I would.

It's the same scenario they had with the releases of GT3 & GT4 ... eleven million still stumped up their hard earned cash for the latter.

 

[G.T.Ace]

GT6 already exist. Kaz said that they're working on it. I've read it in a PlayStation magazine.

GT6 will be on PS3. Definitely because Sony wanted PS3 to be around for 10 years. And if you look at the pattern here, you'll see that GT6 will be on PS3:

GT1 and GT2 were on PS1. GT3 and GT4 were on PS2. GT5 and GT6 will be on PS3. So there are two GT games on each consoles.

But GT1 was a "second gen" (yes, games inside of a console generation also have generations) PS1 game, GT3 was a "first gen" PS2 game and GT5 is a "third gen" PS3 game. The PS3 is now already 4 years old, a new system will most likely be revealed next year, so it is possible that we won't get GT6 on the PS3.

 

[FlyingFox]

I'm absolutely sure there will be a GT6. The much more interesting question is: what will GT6 be, and on which platform?

If GT6 will be released on the PS3, how much further will they patch GT5 and add content to it? Point being: what could GT6 offer that a fully "repaired" GT5 doesn't? A couple of new tracks and more premium cars? And would that really be enough to sell as many units of #6 as #5 did? So the more they polish GT5, the less attractive GT6 might be to potential buyers. On the other hand, leaving GT5 as it is might scare away those exact people, so they never even consider buying GT6. Weird, isn't it?

Another possibility: GT6 will be launched on the PS4. The PS3 is already deep in its lifecycle and might see a successor before GT6 is ready. That would give PD the opportunity to overcome the hardware limitations they were facing with GT5. Nonetheless, it would probably be a lot of work, because they might need to build the game again from the ground up, which will consume loads of time.

So whichever way you turn it, reading the first solid informations about GT6 will be interesting.

Weird it certainly is but look at it this way.

I mentioned I played IL2 on the PC. Now IC who wrote IL2 and is licensed under Ubisoft have made 9 significant upgrades to IL2 and have only ever asked for £10 for one of its upgrades and they are a far smaller company that PD or Sony so surely if PD want to redeem themselves then they would tackle these issues rather than getting bad press.

I guess only time will tell.

 

[G.T.Ace]

You cannot really compare a PC game made by such a small company with a multimillion dollar project like GT5 for a console. Just look at the train simulator community, where even mods are sold for a lot of money (30 bucks for a steam train for example). Or PC race sims, which only really work with modifications, because the games themself lack content or aren't polished at all. It's not that easy.

EDIT: By the way, the first version from IL-2 Sturmovik was released 2001, ten years ago. Everything after that, even 1946, were more or less just add-ons until they released Birds of Prey (and it's PC counterpart, forgot the tagline).

 

[Fkyx]

I agree totally but who would by GT6 whan GT5 has been a bit of a damp squib?

I would, and so would millions of others.

 

[maxpontiac]

I still fight my brain very hard to understand how does your personal rant and subjective claims about GT5 and it's content fits with the title of this thread.

Well, the topic of this thread is nothing more then an attempt to draw people in. Excuse me, I have to pull the fish hook out of my bottom lip.

 

[f00g001]

I have tried to stay out of these type of posts but I may as well put my 10 cents in.

Gran turismo has always been about car collecting, tuning and hot lapping for me. I have been playing from the beginning and I think that Kaz makes the game he wants to play and its up to you if you want to throw down for it.

The reviews were most likely out when you bought the game, and sure promises were broken, so if you are a producer and payed to make it then you might have a case. The way people go on about the standards and delays, its like everyone believes that they have been paying their wages for the last five years. If they want to take 10 years to bring out the next game then good for them, you didn't sign a contract after gt4 that gt5 will have 1000 premium cars and be out in 2 years. All the original games had problems, for some fans that's what was so great about it.

For example I believe no other first person shooter has even come close to topping half life 2 but I still enjoyed call of duty, there isn't any sign of half life 3 yet but when it arrive it has my money, if its **** I will live and I wont feel the need to tell everyone on the valve forum over and over again that I hate it

I will gladly fork out $100 for the next GT. I thought forza and shift were both good games but neither held my attention for any length of time.

I drive and have owned several V8 holdens and fords, I want to drive the the cars i could never afford like zondas, ford gt's and ferrari f40's, bathurst would be a bonus but i am at home driving on trial mountain and deep forrest anyway.

 

[kdryan]

I'm still trying to quit laughing at 'Midi Ocher.' I'll try to finish later...

 

[the Interceptor]

GT6 already exist. Kaz said that they're working on it. I've read it in a PlayStation magazine.

GT6 will be on PS3. Definitely because Sony wanted PS3 to be around for 10 years. And if you look at the pattern here, you'll see that GT6 will be on PS3:

GT1 and GT2 were on PS1. GT3 and GT4 were on PS2. GT5 and GT6 will be on PS3. So there are two GT games on each consoles.

I know, but like I said, GT5 came very late when you measure it by how long the PS3 has been around:

There is no solid information on a possible Playstation 4. There are rumors that it will be released 2012, but there is no proof of that. Also, I didn't find any info on how long the PS3 will be around. If Sony handles it like it has with the previous two models however, the PS3 will still be produced and sold when the PS4 is already on the market. So a 10 year life cycle may be possible, but we might still see a PS4 soon.

So let's say GT6 will be on the PS3, and they are already working on it. They have GT5 as a basis, so it shouldn't be too long of a wait from now. But what will the game be? They are already working on the technical limit of the PS3 with GT5, so one can assume that the graphics will be on a GT5 level of quality minor the current problems (shadows, etc.). They might also scrap the standards and add more premiums. And they might fix and improve a lot of other things. But the question remains: will that be enough for people to buy it?

When GT6 will "only" be what GT5 should have been from the beginning - something which is well possible - there might be a lot of people who will not pay another $60 just for that. That said, this also means that they would want to stop fixing GT5 at some point, because everything that improves GT5 would decrease the advantage of GT6.

 

[Stephen220378]

I agree totally but who would by GT6 whan GT5 has been a bit of a damp squib? Surley they'd want to say "hey look at this fantastic game we've developed buy GT6 its great".....Not sure I would.

In all honesty I think most people would and most people will, I know will, despite all the critisism I've handed out to PD and GT5. Why? Simply because as far as racing games go, the GT series doesn't have and since GT1 hasn't had a serious competitor on any Playstation console. Sony and PD unfortunately seem to know this only too well, Forza supposedly (I haven't played it so I'm going by what others say) is the closest you can get to GT but Forza is exclusive to Xbox and many like myself wouldn't switch to Xbox for the sake of a driving game. Until the GT series has some decent competition, Sony will sit back knowing that their flagship racing series will sell millions despite the complaints.

 

[Ritterkreuz]

I play IL2 Sturmovik 1946, which is currently in its 9th evolutionary update and as you know GT5 has had two updates 1.06 and 1.07 which has fixed some problems but not really tackled any big issues that people are bitching about. Why? Should this community start banging on PD’s door asking for what we want or do we just trust them to come up with the goods in their own time? I personally don’t think that people will wait for this so as a community we have to approach P.D. and ask them for updated to rectify some problems.

One big difference is that Oleg Maddox would routinely update us, heck, the guy had a whole forum just for that sole purpose. He also dealt with a lot of B.S. too.

I agree with a lot of what you said, frankly I feel as though I only got half a game, but then again I don't race online.

 

[brainfade]

Can you please share us with some evidence of the claims you've presented above?

I find this whole "within Sony itself" very intriguing. Thanx in advance 👍

If it was legally possible without anyone having to lose their job then I would provide the evidence, but the general consensus is that if they set their crosshairs on GT then one of two things will happen:

- External management sent to PD to run the project.

OR, and I sincerely hope Sony don't do this

- Sacking Kaz

He was heavily ridiculed within Sony and his talk on 'mimesis' didn't sit well with Sony at all.

 

[defaultoasis]

They're working on GT6 doesn't necessarily mean there will be a GT6 though, mind you. There might be one eventually, it's just a matter of if we can live longer than Kaz, haha. Never high hopes on these guys. Makes you feel better

 

[brambos]

I will buy GT6. Simply because I'm a racing-game-whore. I will -however- have a lot lower expectations than for GT5 and will not believe all the hypemaking Sony/PD will be doing prior to its launch.

Who knows... maybe underestimation will lead to more enjoyment and less disappointment next time around?

 

[G.T.Ace]

If it was legally possible without anyone having to lose their job then I would provide the evidence...

Come on man, seriously.

 

[Ben78]

I think that PD was too confident and since Asians are proud, they probably sat on their you know what while making GT5, thinking it would be all that since there is so many fanboys who never complain. I seriously think (and hope) that Shift 2 and Forza 4 will decide which direction GT5 (and PD) will be going.

I seriously hope that Shift 2 will be awesome and as for Forza 4, I know it will be great. A double b**** slap would be good for Kaz and company.