Good job its now the overriding theme of the thread then.
Someone needs to keep this thread in the right perspective. GT may need saving to some, but it is key to understand that as a whole, the franchise is alive and well and continues to maintain it's place in the spotlight with brilliant marketing devices such as GT Academy.
Plus, if I didn't bring up sales, you might be bored.
I've never claimed them to be 100% accurate, they were posted as indicative figures, used to illustrate that the claim made by Saidur_Ali that PD could continue for decades without releasing a title was nonsense.
Now while I believe that PDI's ventures with Nissan and General Motors (for example) benefit them as a company, PDI needs to make GT games in order to survive.
I didn't miss the point you were making at all, what you did is take an example of an apparently (more on that in a minute) profitable title and state that as it made money then GT must have done, which is rather poor reasoning.
What I did was come to the conclusion that GT5 was a profitable title based on it's budget vs income from sales and since there are no articles (that I am aware of) that show PDI's profit/loss margins, I provided an example from another Sony owned studio to show why I think the way I do.
Nor has anyone claimed to, so what we do is take what we know and apply figures from the industry to see how the figures roughly look (which is exactly what i transparently did). I never once claimed them to be 100% accurate or perfect, but they are a damn site better than simply assuming PD made a mint and claiming they can last for decades.
Of course PDI can't last for decades sitting still and no, your figures aren't any better then someone assuming PDI's financial status when what you posted was more of the same.
Quality of DLC affects sales and has an impact on future sales (GT6 the topic of this conversation remember), however if you believe that the small amount of DLC that accompanied GT5 is directly comparable to the quantity that Forza managed across three full releases then feel free.
No, the topic of this conversation and thread is wondering if GT6 is the savior of the franchise. It is spoken as if Gran Turismo is dying.. My sales reference did nothing but show that even this economic downturn, GT has managed to maintain its market lead.
DLC was a source of income for GT5...
Indeed.
None of which changes the fact that if your revenue doesn't exceed you development costs then your not making a profit
Which if one were to compare the budget of GT5 to the revenue resulting from the sales, PDI did quite well in regards to profit even if we use your numbers.
I'm sure you know full well that I was referring to the Shift series, the first of which sold 5 million, the second of which sold 0.6 million, the third of which will not exist. A rather good example.
Actually, no I didn't. Here is what you said.
Oh and once NfS was king of the racing titles and the best known kid on the block, same with PES and football/soccer titles. Todays fame is no assurance of always having it.
I stand by my original statement in regards that NFS is still producing yearly million plus sellers, so while Shift is an excellent example (of what not to do), NFS (as you posted) is not.
GT, GT3, GT4 all sold more than GT5 has, and with increasing rumours of a GT6 on the PS3 its unlikely to better any of those bar maybe the original. Which would continue to show a decline in sales since GT3.
I have never disputed that fact, and again, please show me how GT5 compared to those titles at the two year mark.
However please keep in mind that simply because you don't accept my figures doesn't mean that PD are making a profit, if you wish to make that claim then apply the same standard to yourself and ensure you are able to back it up.
If you remember, I won't post numbers on what PDI has done with GT5 because well, I can't. So with that said, I am holding myself to the same standard... in case you missed that part.
Which was the point this thread was about until an insistence to discuss sales dominated.
I guessed I could have let this thread go with my original post, but I was under the impression that GTPlanet encouraged discussions. You don't agree with me... never said you had to.
Actually if you look back I've not compared the two directly, I've used one as an example to explain a concept (DLC) and other titles (Shift) to explain how loss of sales can kill a series.
Scaff, look at what happened to Shift 1 vs Shift 2. It was a total collapse in numbers and while GT is losing numbers (never disputed that) over the years, the franchise is still holding the market lead.
In fact, My guess is that GT5 could compare to two games combined of certain other games and could quite possibly still be the number one selling simulator game two plus years after release. Plus, please consider that GT as a series has been on top for 15 years.
I have no problem with people disagreeing with my opinion, but when data is ignored in favour of personal preference, with no attempt to counter it with alternate sources then I'm not going to let the loudest voice win the day, particularly when a few of those involved in the conservation have a track record of 'creating facts'
It's somewhat difficult to understand whom you are speaking about since you did this in a "beat around the bush" manner. I would have assumed that you would have just stated the party(s) involved for clarity. Yes?
rologue or GT
