GT7 Expectations - Same Old or New breath of life?

[jblackrevo9]

I love GT! But the fact remains that with increased competition and lack of execution from PD over the years(GT5P, postponing GT5 sixteen times, and the obvious cash-grab that GT6 was), the new game really needs to be another GT3:A-Spec in almost all aspects to give this ol' dog a breath of new life.

I don't have all the time-line facts down but here are some alarming sales stats from your beloved franchise.

GT: 10.95 Million copies sold worldwide
GT2: 9.49 Million copies sold worldwide
GT3: 14.98 million copies sold worldwide
GT4: 11.66 million copies sold worldwide
GT5 first 10 weeks = 5.9 million, next 47 weeks 1.4 million, 7.33 million sold over the first 5 quarters and totaling 10.52 million copies sold worldwide.
GT6 first 10 weeks = 2.2 million copies sold & just under 800k for the year 2014. 2.98 total for the first 5 quarters on the shelves.

GT5P: had about the same number sold as GT6 through the first 5 quarters.

GT6 hasn't even sold as many copies as GTPSP yet. This is very disturbing as a GT fan. If PD can't get the market to buy-in for GT7 the future of the franchise may be a lot more bleak than I once thought.

I own everyone of these games except PSP. I had the highest expectations for GT5, the delays, the prologue, everything made me believe this game was going to be the Greatest of all time. Sadly it did not meet my expectations but still a fine game that I enjoyed thoroughly. I lowered my expectations of GT6 drastically. Sadly it has been far less than satisfactory for me. I like the tracks, that's about it. So for GT7 I don't even know what to think. Can it get worse? Ugh, I hope not.

GT3: A-Spec was a ground-breaking industry-revolutionizing game that is hard to match. It single-handedly sold millions of PS2 consoles and sold more copies than any other non-nintendo video game that preceded it! It did so well for many reasons, of which marketing how revolutionary it was and combining it with the console did help. However, the biggest thing that made it such a huge success was because it was a fantastic and completed game out of the box. Everything was finished, clean, and better than anything we had ever seen.

Are those days gone or can PD regain that magic with GT7?

Ok, ok, so of course they can, but do you think they will? What also disturbs me is that the GT7 thread is open and people are champing at the bit for it already. The kaz Q&A is shut down, we all know what we want to see, what we would like to stay the same, and what needs a whole rework. And finally, where do your expectations lie for whats to come? HINT: I expect a PS4/GT7 Console package in 4th Quarter 2016.

Polyphony needs to take a look back at granturismo 3 as a reference for gran turismo 7.


Be professional and fun!!!!

Not boring and professional

 

[HarVee]

I think one of the major reasons why GT6 has sold poorly is because of poor marketing and/or marketing targeted at the wrong audiences. With GT5 we had over 4 years of trailers and hype that was targeted towards everyone. Gamers and car enthusiasts alike. GT6 was the opposite. Only 8 months of marketing targeted towards fans of the series and automotive enthusiasts. Not gamers.

 

[Jump_Ace]

Where's the poll?

Same Old. #bankonit


Jerome

 

[Tenacious D]

I think one of the major reasons why GT6 has sold poorly is because of poor marketing and/or marketing targeted at the wrong audiences.

To add to this, it's strange that even with Gran Turismo being SONY's marquee racing franchise, it was still abandoned with the rest of the PS3 universe as they threw their emphasis completely behind PS4 and its game library. And the gamers didn't need much urging to follow along.

I have to admit that I can understand why gamers turned their noses up at a last gen Gran Turismo, when I see the glorious visuals in DriveClub and P CARS, and the better physics in PC - with as many as 50 cars on track! It makes GT6 seem downright rusty. I'm with the millions of fans who want to see GT7 as soon as... well, when it's well endowed with goodies and ready to sell.

 

[gtracedriver1]

As per sales number posted. We do not know how many copies they have sold for sure. According to vgchartz estimate it is 3.17million physical copies. It was top 10 games on PSN for PS3. These are not bad number for GT. But the days of 10million mark is out of question.

For GT7 first game on a new console and more detail, definitely improved sounds and no memory limitation like PS3 they should be able to make a great game. I think the processor is not much of a improvement but PS4 games are easier to make. GT5 had leveling system and more of a grind. GT6 career is shorter. It needs to be something in middle. Economy, leveling system is fine for me. They should be keep either of them or both. Career and special events needs to be bigger. Take off coffee break. License mode is also fine. I thought GT6 difficult was just great not too difficult. Have some old stuff and bring something new is the best thing to do

 

[Lord Protector]

There will be some new features for sure, but nothing that elaborate...

 

[Eks]

I really, really want to "expect" something new and fun such as a custom event creator (PCars almost nails it, just wish we could choose our opponents), but I just feel like no matter how popular and widely-suggested the idea is/gets to be, it simply isn't going to happen.

Enhanced graphics, potentially increased grid size, improved AI, and massive car list will be advertised to oblivion, but other than that, same old.

 

[Wools]

This thread is named Gran Turismo 7 expectations and if i'm honest I'm concerned. Knowing Polyphony, I seriously think Gran Turismo 7 will be Gran Turismo 6 but given a lick of paint and polish.

However, my one hope that won't be the case is that I also though GT7 was going to be shown off at E3 this year and it wasn't. That suggests they are still deep in development of the game which could mean GT7 is a brand new game running on a brand new, or modified engine for PS4.

If that's the case then I would suggest they start with a blank sheet of paper. Gran Turismo is many things to many people but there's no question, GT5 and GT6 were eccentric titles that pushed the host system beyond its means.

If I were in charge, I would aim for GT7 to be a distillation and refinement of GT with a laser focus. I would focus the car collection and with the insane times it takes to model objects nowadays, I would aim for 150 - 300 cars. If that means brining outside help (Forza had some fantastic car modelling that was achieved outside of the developers studio) then do it. No PS2 era models, no ridiculous trucks or SUV's that no one gives a **** about, just cool road cars, great GT models, hypercars and one off's like F1. With that, open up the game to everyone and give a refresh of career. Keep the racing for cars framework that feels satisfying but don't force grinding on anyone. If that means the game can be completed in 30 hours then so be it.

It's an exciting time for GT and I hope Polyphony get it right. I don't care if fans moan that there's only a few hundred cars or why isn't my beloved car not in the game, wahaa! The GT series is beautiful but antiquated, it needs the cobwebs blown out and a clean slate to move on. Fingers crossed we see it next year at E3 2016!

 

[paulpg87]

Same old.
I also expect GT7 to be the last in the series from PD. Than the series will be rebooted under a new developer.
Considering developing time, budget and competitors i see no future for the series.

I'm not even sure i will buy it after having all of them.. i mean there are better games now. Back then there was nothing else.

 

[oli440]

Same old.
I also expect GT7 to be the last in the series from PD. Than the series will be rebooted under a new developer.
Considering developing time, budget and competitors i see no future for the series.

I'm not even sure i will buy it after having all of them.. i mean there are better games now. Back then there was nothing else.

It would be terribly unfortunate to see PD move out, but if it means bringing in a new team that are faster and more efficient developers, Sony would see sense in that. To be honest, I'm baffled that Sony hasn't been stricter with PD from day one. Ever since GT2, they could have focused on hiring far more people, creating separate divisions and generally making Gran Turismo a more consistent all round franchise.

Problems such as standard cars and sound would be non-existent with a larger group of developers earlier on. Better still, utilizing resources wherever possible, much like Turn 10 with Forza.

PD are extremely talented, but because they seek perfection outright, they fail to hold onto the necessities of game development, i.e sticking to deadlines, expanding on crew (even though they're doing that now) and... you know, keeping the fans as happy as possible?

The days of traditional development strategies just so Kaz can feel nostalgia are long gone. What Gran Turismo needs is an industrial revolution, as it were. If that involves overthrowing the leader then so be it.

Unless PD can prove me wrong with Gran Turismo 7, I too see a dark future for the franchise.

 

[oli440]

As for Gran Turismo 7 itself, I anticipate that the PS4's power will be well utilized and there will most certainly be refinements in visuals, gameplay and overall content.

However, the success of the game depends ultimately on how well it is executed. Standard cars will be a major turn off for many people. The proposed sound overhaul will be met with extremely high expectation. The overall level of realism will be pitched against the latest racing simulators. Will the game manage 1080p and 60fps?

Above all else, what traditional fans of the series will want is soul, character; the sense that the game really is an automotive heaven. If the game is met with a truck load of problems like GT5 and 6, this 'soul' will be non-existent.

I really do hope that PD can take full advantage of the PS4's power, Sony's budget and the increase in staff, to provide what might turn out to be the best GT game yet. It might seem a long shot, but for the little faith I have left, I am still nonetheless optimistic about GT7.

 

[super_gt]

It would be terribly unfortunate to see PD move out, but if it means bringing in a new team that are faster and more efficient developers, Sony would see sense in that. To be honest, I'm baffled that Sony hasn't been stricter with PD from day one.

I don"t expect nothing better from SONY,what they bring first on PS4 a super shiny arcade driving game with 30
frames per second,no thanks!
SONY do not want to make a full simulation,only simcades for the masses with gamepads.They kill Gran Turismo faster than PD.

 

[Sick Cylinder]

Same old.
I also expect GT7 to be the last in the series from PD. Than the series will be rebooted under a new developer.
Considering developing time, budget and competitors i see no future for the series.

I'm not even sure i will buy it after having all of them.. i mean there are better games now. Back then there was nothing else.

I agree with this post. I'm a big fan having bought a wheel to enjoy GT5 more and hosting online championships. But regularly on this site I read the reports about updates or new game releases from other developers who seem able to do a quicker job.

The new Forza has a great car list and will enable Hosts to hold Group 7 / Can Am championships or race Historic F1. I spend a lot of time searching through the GT6 car list trying to create interesting race series, but frankly it needs a complete overhaul - I don't enjoy wading through endless repeats of cars such as Mazda MX5's trying to find the premium versions - obviously as a Host I want to pick the ones which can have race numbers if possible.

The current car list has been thrown together, seemingly without any thought or consideration as to how it will be used by Hosts. If they get it right (which isn't difficult in my view) you can then add a meaningful event creator.

I suspect GT7 will be slightly better than GT6 - more premium cars, slightly better sounds, some modern cars including hyper cars. But it will be much poorer than it could be, which as a fan I find very frustrating. I have the impression that PD don't know how to select cars and group them in order to create race series and when they do select a good car they either fail to put natural competitors into the game or miss out a feature to make it difficult for Hosts to get full use from it. Example we get a Ferrari 250 GTO, but not it's competitors (Cobra 289 and Factory Lightweight E Type) and you can't change the race number.

As an actual video game to play on your own GT5 was poor, but was saved by the ability to play online either informally via Shuffle racing or in organised championships. GT6 was more of the same except it was probably a worse game to play on your own. PD abolish shuffle racing and give us the dreadful quick match option

GT7 won't be out for a long time - FM 6 is looking great and I fully expect FM7 to be out by then together with improved and updated offerings from Project Cars, Assetto Corsa etc. The focus that PD has on the minutiae seems to have let the bigger picture slip from under their eyes - subcontracting GT8 to outside developers may be a good move and perhaps could bring the series back to life for Sony. I will probably buy a PS4 and GT7, but I fully expect the game not to live up to what I know is possible and be littered with poor decisions and illogical car choices.

 

[oli440]

I don"t expect nothing better from SONY,what they bring first on PS4 a super shiny arcade driving game with 30
frames per second,no thanks!
SONY do not want to make a full simulation,only simcades for the masses with gamepads.They kill Gran Turismo faster than PD.

I'm fairly certain that Gran Turismo's simulation appeal is still a main priority for Sony, since one of the most talked about features of GT6 was the improved physics (which stand as the best in the series as far as I can tell). No doubt that a large chunk of the games budget was put into improving the simulation factor. For me, It's one of the main reasons I still play GT6 these days.

Surely then, the power of the PS4 will be ideal platform for improved physics. Why would Sony want to discard the feature of Gran Turismo that made it revolutionary in the first place? Of course, they might not compare to PC sims, but they're as close as they will get on consoles.

Driveclub was only an arcade game because that's what Evolution Studios have prided themselves with since Motorstorm and possibly the WRC games back on PS2. Just because Driveclub was an arcade game with real cars doesn't mean that Gran Turismo will be the same.

 

[Johnnypenso]

Surely then, the power of the PS4 will be ideal platform for improved physics. Why would Sony want to discard the feature of Gran Turismo that made it revolutionary in the first place? Of course, they might not compare to PC sims, but they're as close as they will get on consoles.

Project Cars has already far surpassed GT in terms of physics on consoles.

 

[oli440]

Project Cars has already far surpassed GT in terms of physics on consoles.

Agreed. Nonetheless, I'd like to see what GT7 can bring in terms of physics. Next gen hardware and all.

 

[JKgo]

Project Cars has already far surpassed GT in terms of physics on consoles.

...Shhh, careful now - you're going to set off those 'last-gen vs current gen' arguements...

 

[Johnnypenso]

...Shhh, careful now - you're going to set off those 'last-gen vs current gen' arguements...

The comment was in the context of physics of next gen consoles but I know what you mean

 

[gtracedriver1]

Same old.
I also expect GT7 to be the last in the series from PD. Than the series will be rebooted under a new developer.
Considering developing time, budget and competitors i see no future for the series.

I'm not even sure i will buy it after having all of them.. i mean there are better games now. Back then there was nothing else.

Wow from where are you getting this info

You are right about choices. Assetto corsa will release next year. Then Pcars2 and GT7 will release. F1 games, rally including dirt rally should be coming etc

I have not played GT6 for a month may be but I would think many are still there. During then GTA competition there were more than 100K people better than me I expect GT7 to be better or at worst upto the current and upcoming games for sure. I am little worried about the decision they take but nobody knows what is going on with GT7. So we have to wait for them to release info

 

[RacerPaul]

The improved course creator (which we should see in GT6 at some point too) could be revolutionary, and with the PS4's powerful processor and 8gb of RAM to play with, the courses could potentially be quite huge

You're still hanging on to that?

 

[JoaoSilva]

You're still hanging on to that?

It's something that was promised to him and that he paid for so what's the problem with hanging on to it? He has his own opinion on it , it doesn't have to be the same as yours.

 

[RacerPaul]

It's something that was promised to him and that he paid for so what's the problem with hanging on to it? He has his own opinion on it , it doesn't have to be the same as yours

I didn't say he shouldn't hang on to it, merely expressing my surprise that he was

My comment wasn't directed at you and I'm sure he can speak for himself

 

[JoaoSilva]

I didn't say he shouldn't hang on to it, merely expressing my surprise that he was

My comment wasn't directed at you and I'm sure he can speak for himself

But i can talk on it if i want to , that's why we are all here.

Moving on ...

 

[RacerPaul]

But i can talk on it if i want to , that's why we are all here

Very true

 

[sems4arsenal]

Heart says new
Brain says same old

 

[chzsln485]

In desperation to find any sign that PDI are working out how to make GT7 a good game, I did some digging around on their recruitment page. Now, we know already that they're hiring for sound engineers, race rule designers, and AI programmers, when I read something intriguing. The phrases "deep learning" and "machine learning" popped up in the AI programmer job description, and again in a sort of employee testimonial page for each of the positions they are hiring in.

Now, I'm not a mathsy, sciencey, programmery type in the slightest, but I do wonder if anyone more knowledgeable than myself would be able to explain what this may potentially mean for the AI of GT7.

It's quite difficult to discern the meaning of it from the context it's written in (due to the incredibly mangled nature of Japanese -> English translation via Google), and I got about four lines into the Wikipedia articles on them before deciding I literally have no clue. I know @Griffith500 is an extremely knowledgeable person who is very good at explaining things clearly, especially when it comes to sound. I don't know if his/her knowledge extends to AI programming though.

As I understand it, deep learning, however it actually works, seems to be new and exciting and revolutionary compared to machine learning. I mean, it sounds fairly complex and important, so it must be a good thing.

 

[AXEofGOD]

I leave a link to a recent article i read about this:
http://www.teamvvv.com/en/news/comments/GT7-Prolonged-where-was-Gran-Turismo-7-at-E3-2015

I like how the article says we(the customer) will expect 1000 premium cars. I seem to remember with all the delays of gt5, especially after prologue, we expected it then. 10 years later and nothing has changed. We expect the world, I hope we aren't handed a rock and pd says "here it is."

 

[RedlinerAU]

I bought my PS4 for Gran Turismo 7 in November last year and I regret doing so.
I don't think Kaz understands that the competition these days is very real, he really needs to pick up the pace and take being a developer more seriously.

With Forza releasing annually and having more features than Gran Turismo, PD has a lot of catching up to do if they ever want to keep their place in the competitive industry that Video Games are these days.
Its not 2002, its time to move on with cryptic information and actually make your product known.

Im giving PD till Feb, if GT7 doesnt make an appearance or even appears to come close to Forza, I'll be trading in my PS4 for an Xbox One and making the switch to Forza. The delays, the lack of the franchise evolving, the silence... Its all getting a bit old.

 

[AXEofGOD]

I bought my PS4 for Gran Turismo 7 in November last year and I regret doing so.
I don't think Kaz understands that the competition these days is very real, he really needs to pick up the pace and take being a developer more seriously.

I agree with you somewhat. I've waited to buy a ps4 or xbone. It comes down to which is better gt7 or whatever forza is out at gt's release. I will bet that kaz doesn't see himself as a developer.

With Forza releasing annually and having more features than Gran Turismo, PD has a lot of catching up to do if they ever want to keep their place in the competitive industry that Video Games are these days.

PD and GT are far ahead of their competitors in so many ways. For good or bad GTTV(it was ok), the Academy, and Vision concepts are leaps and bounds ahead of anyone else. The academy and the relationships created by PD are groundbreaking and can only further prove that this franchise is not going anywhere. It also proves for good or bad that PD will never truly care what we their main consumer base really want. We can have any features we want, as long as they are the features kaz wants.

It's hard to be a beggar with PD because they just do not care about us at all. Either we play THEIR game or, which this is weird, we go somewhere else(which they again do not care if we do). If they did care we would be able to see it. I remember the questions for PD thread. They didn't acknowledge any of our concerns.

My suggestion to the community is to not be proactive with PD. Do not care about what isn't in the game. And do not under any circumstances listen to what they say about what is in the pipeline! This is key. When gt7 comes out, either pay for what you get on release date, and if it's not finished to your liking do NOT buy it.

Same old.
I also expect GT7 to be the last in the series from PD. Than the series will be rebooted under a new developer.
Considering developing time, budget and competitors i see no future for the series.

Maybe in a different corporate culture, but not in Japan, and not with this current team of PD and sony.


I love GT. I hate that I am so loyal to it. I will never understand their way of business but as long the DLC is free and they continue to add to their track library I will continue to buy GT and no other racer.

 

[jblackrevo9]

I bought my PS4 for Gran Turismo 7 in November last year and I regret doing so.
I don't think Kaz understands that the competition these days is very real, he really needs to pick up the pace and take being a developer more seriously.

With Forza releasing annually and having more features than Gran Turismo, PD has a lot of catching up to do if they ever want to keep their place in the competitive industry that Video Games are these days.
Its not 2002, its time to move on with cryptic information and actually make your product known.

Im giving PD till Feb, if GT7 doesnt make an appearance or even appears to come close to Forza, I'll be trading in my PS4 for an Xbox One and making the switch to Forza. The delays, the lack of the franchise evolving, the silence... Its all getting a bit old.

I understand your frustration but hold on. Kaz is taking this very serious as he has went into a hiring spree for more staffing. He now probably realizes that his current staff is not enough to take Gran turismo 7 into a new direction. You seen what happen with GT6. Gran turismo 6 outsourced the team which in return became a very bad installment. He is aware of competition (Sony probably weren't happy with Gt6 either) which is why they are more involved this time. Gran-turismo 7 will be what we should have had back in Gran turismo 5. To add to it, Playstation VR will be in GT7. Hold on, "6" was a bad number for any installment.