GTP Cool Wall: 2015-2017 McLaren 675LT Coupé

[Sage Ages]

If people think it is cool (and I mean enough people to be culturally significant), then it is.

No, coolness is a subjective opinion. Not a fact.

 

[Danoff]

Yeah, if people think it's cool, than to them it's cool. But why doesn't that work for me? If I don't think it's cool, than it's not cool to me. More people thinking its cool doesn't automatically make it cool to me. So you yourself are saying it, so again, I'm at a loss of your misunderstanding. You're trying really hard to contort my words, and for someone that says that the emotion that I thought was there, isn't, it's really odd thing to do.

It's not something that an individual can bestow on anything (unless that individual is super cool by themselves, like... a celebrity signing a football or something, I dunno). It would even be possible to identify someone as a coolness barometer, such as "if Kristen Scott Thomas is impressed, it's cool". But "Cool" is not really personal. I have my answer, and I pretty much knew it when I first posted in this thread. A criterion other than "cool" is being used. A criterion such as "I like it".

No, coolness is a subjective opinion. Not a fact.

It is a collective subjective opinion.

 

[ImaRobot]

At this point, you're unwilling to open your eyes a little, just a tiny little bit, to anyone else's opinion and now you're just continuing to shout out without really even making much sense. Unfortunately, at this point, time is wasted on you as you seem to have some sort of comprehension issue, or something else is the matter. Whatever the case, have fun with your issues. It's almost as if you've understood literally nothing at all, but keep on pushing forward for whatever reason.

Car's still not cool.

 

[Danoff]

At this point, you're unwilling to open your eyes a little, just a tiny little bit, to anyone else's opinion and now you're just continuing to shout out without really even making much sense. Unfortunately, at this point, time is wasted on you as you seem to have some sort of comprehension issue, or something else is the matter. Whatever the case, have fun with your issues. It's almost as if you've understood literally nothing at all, but keep on pushing forward for whatever reason.

I understand you, I just don't agree with you.

---------------------------------------------------
At anyone who bothers reading:

So why the misunderstanding about the word "cool"? It's because it gets thrown around a lot in common language. Someone says "hey, do you want to go watch a movie?" perhaps you say "that's cool". Of course, you do not mean that it's cool at all. What you mean is "that sounds like a great idea chum". It gets used as an expression of agreeableness. Why would people use the word "cool" in this way? Well, the short answer is narcissism. To go from an expression of "that is generally liked" when you say "that's cool" to the more personal "I like that" when you say "that's cool" is an apparent form of a cognitive bias called the false consensus effect - the assumption that more people agree with you than actually do.

It's more than that though. It moves your own opinion from something personal and subjective, to something that is more demonstrably true. Instead of making a statement like "I like that", which is a subjective opinion, a statement like "that is cool" is more factual. It's a cognitive sleight of hand to bolster your own opinion.

It's still more than that though. There's just the assumption that if you like it, everyone should like it, which is where narcissism comes in to play.

Nobody thinks about any of this of course. People use the word incorrectly because they've heard it used that way and they liked the outcome. Someone was successfully able to project their opinion about something onto society at large to you, and so it's appealing to you to do the same. The result is using the word "cool" in place of the more personal "like". We all do it, myself very much included. The problem comes in when people do not recognize that that's what they are doing. It makes very little sense to do that in the context of evaluating a car, especially for the purposes of the original Top Gear show which was precisely to determine the effect the car had on the general public and whether it would impress the layperson or even people who are difficult to impress and worthy of impressing (I'm casting a wide net here because I don't know who Kristen Scott Thomas is).

"Cool" is a great language intensifier. But it does have its own meaning, apart from being used in exaggeration. Forgetting that can result in... at a minimum... confusion.

 

[TexRex]

It is a collective subjective opinion.

So...the point of this series of threads is for us to vote in accordance to what we perceive the collective opinion to be? Then what's the point, really?

 

[Danoff]

So...the point of this series of threads is for us to vote in accordance to what we perceive the collective opinion to be? Then what's the point, really?

To figure out which car would impress Kristen Scott Thomas... or, in broader terms, to try to tease out which cars have general appeal outside of car-person circles. It was a tongue in cheek bit about car guys trying to figure out whether they look like a tool in some of the cars they like, while looking like a tool trying to figure it out.

 

[Dennisch]

To figure out which car would impress Kristen Scott Thomas...

.....

 

[Danoff]

.....

She looks hard to impress.

 

[TexRex]

To figure out which car would impress Kristen Scott Thomas... or, in broader terms, to try to tease out which cars have general appeal outside of car-person circles. It was a tongue in cheek bit about car guys trying to figure out whether they look like a tool in some of the cars they like, while looking like a tool trying to figure it out.

Yes, I believe it was you who elaborated to that effect when another indicated it was inspired by Top Gear. Not being particularly interested in Top Gear, I've conformed to what's stated in governing posts. If you can indicate where your remarks are the intended purpose, I'll bend.

Edit: Added an "ly" to a word it was left out of.

 

[Danoff]

Yes, I believe it was you who elaborated to that effect when another indicated it was inspired by Top Gear. Not being particular interested in Top Gear, I've conformed to what's stated in governing posts. If you can indicate where your remarks are the intended purpose, I'll bend.

Mine was speculation about why it might be interesting to vote on such a thing, which was the question you appeared to be asking.

 

[TexRex]

Mine was speculation about why it might be interesting to vote on such a thing, which was the question you appeared to be asking.

No, and if I'm honest, it seems to fly in the face of comments you've made questioning the way others vote. Since polling for electoral candidates sees that individuals vote for who they think should be elected into office rather than who they think some obscure individual would want to be elected into office...well, I don't think it's necessary to finish that thought.

 

[Murcie_LP640]

Top Gear's Cool Wall inspired this one? You mean the one where, with a couple of notable exceptions such as the Koenigsegg CCX, all supercars were catastrophically Uncool?

 

[Danoff]

Top Gear's Cool Wall inspired this one? You mean the one where, with a couple of notable exceptions such as the Koenigsegg CCX, all supercars were catastrophically Uncool?

Do you agree with that assessment?

 

[Murcie_LP640]

Do you agree with that assessment?

Welllll, y'know. Sometimes I do, sometimes I don't.

I'm just saying, you think it's objectively Sub-Zero for the exact same reasons that they thought these types of cars were Seriously Uncool.

So who's got the "correct" definition of Cool? Is there a "correct" definition of Cool?

 

[Danoff]

I'm just saying, you think it's objectively Sub-Zero for the exact same reasons that they thought these types of cars were Seriously Uncool.

Not the same reasons surely.

So who's got the "correct" definition of Cool? Is there a "correct" definition of Cool?

If not, why are we using the word?

 

[Murcie_LP640]

Not the same reasons surely.

Far too flashy (ie. Draws a crowd) and there are very few cool people who can actually afford them or own them (relating somewhat to rarity).

The CCX was the main exception because of its inherent scariness, and there was also the M-B SLR McLaren and Bugatti Veyron that were deemed "Cool."

If not, why are we using the word?

Because then we wouldn't have anywhere near as many fascinating arguments over someone's subjective opinion on a subjective subject.

A definition implies objectivity. Now if you'll excuse me I'm off to reminisce about the hilarity that was the McLaren F1 thread.

 

[Turbo]

Why are we still discussing what is cool and what isn't? I thought this poll closed eleven days ago.

Coolness has no clear definition and it is nothing more than one's opinion. Anything can be cool.

 

[Tornado]

If this is truly the end of the GTP Cool Wall (something adapted from an entertainment program where a middle aged man once ate a photograph to win an argument), I can think of no more a perfect encapsulation of its legacy over the years than someone arguing for multiple pages over two weeks in the final poll that his opinion is the only objective one being expressed.


Truly the end of an era.

 

[TexRex]

If this is truly the end of the GTP Cool Wall (something adapted from an entertainment program where a middle aged man once ate a photograph to win an argument), I can think of no more a perfect encapsulation of its legacy over the years than someone arguing for multiple pages over two weeks in the final poll that his opinion is the only objective one being expressed.


Truly the end of an era.

 

[Danoff]

I can think of no more a perfect encapsulation of its legacy over the years than someone arguing for multiple pages over two weeks in the final poll that his opinion is the only objective one being expressed.

It's still more than that though. There's just the assumption that if you like it, everyone should like it, which is where narcissism comes in to play.

A definition implies objectivity.

Subjective terms don't have definitions... nice try.

 

[TheCracker]

Why are we still discussing what is cool and what isn't? I thought this poll closed eleven days ago.

Coolness has no clear definition and it is nothing more than one's opinion. Anything can be cool.

Given that this is the very last Cool Wall poll (unless someone at some point resurrects it) i think everyone involved has knowingly had a last hurrah at arguing over the definition of something that can't be defined.

Cool Wall. It's been a blast. 👍