Heel and Toe Shifting

[ultrataco]

I use heel-toe in gt5p for fun and realism, but I think it's easier in real life because you can feel the car and it's much more evident if you did it properly or not.
<rant>Reality is also easier because gt5 has that stupid ridiculous unrealistic neutral penalty which is always messing up my shifting. I think it's supposed to keep people from flat shifting, but it's incredibly annoying imo. In a real car, I can feel when the clutch engages, and even if I do mis-shift, the car doesn't just go to neutral.
</rant>

(sorry, just had a bad drive and needed an excuse to rant.)

 

[vr6wantsr20det]

I use heel-toe in gt5p for fun and realism, but I think it's easier in real life because you can feel the car and it's much more evident if you did it properly or not.
<rant>Reality is also easier because gt5 has that stupid ridiculous unrealistic neutral penalty which is always messing up my shifting. I think it's supposed to keep people from flat shifting, but it's incredibly annoying imo. In a real car, I can feel when the clutch engages, and even if I do mis-shift, the car doesn't just go to neutral.
</rant>

(sorry, just had a bad drive and needed an excuse to rant.)

you are not alone. I HATE that you can't be on the throttle at ALL or even have a lot of wheel spin when shifting. It's just retarded they would take that out. Especially for drifting which is what i love to do most. I can't up-shift a gear mid-drift. For instance certain turns start off sharp, and widen as you reach the exit, this is a PERFECT example in drifting when you would want to go from 2nd to 3rd gear to have more rpm/power-band to swing the car to the outside of the turn and pick up speed at the same time to clear the whole turn. The only time i NEVER have a problem with it going to Neutral is down-shifting, rev-matching and heel-toeing. . If they don't fix it with the full GT5, i will boycott PD! I know they took it away because people were power-shifting in races giving them an advantage over Pad/DS3 users. But i dont think it's fare to hamper the experience and performance of someone who spent all that money for a wheel to get the most out of the game, only to be restricted

 

[foxmulder9]

What? no rev matching needed? then what's the fun with a clutch?

 

[Jay]

I am with you guys, but I am happy to be penalised with gearbox damage if I abuse flat/power shifting, I just want it back.

Fact is you don't have to off the throttle completely when upshifting, if you do quick shifts take note in relpay of the throttle meter you will notice even though you 'lift' you never remove the throttle completely, GT5P has some limits but it's not zero throttle.

My biggest gripe is the wheelspin problem, bad, bad for drifitng, I don't want to have to kill much of my wheelspin in drifting to select the next gear, that is awful.

and the biggest problem I find now with heel toeing is my pedals are not gripping the carpet so well anymore (carpet is worn a bit) and as I rotate my foot to blip the throttle the pedal unit sometimes rotates too which causes some brake pressure loss, only started recently, I will have to mount the pedals better.

 

[EERS4YEARS]

i hold the throttle down with clutch pedal down and car still goes with my G25, very realistic. real race cars dont use clutch pedals, nor do the best street cars.

 

[wrcsti]

Maybe you didn't turn the clutch on?

 

[Ghost_drift]

i hold the throttle down with clutch pedal down and car still goes with my G25, very realistic. real race cars dont use clutch pedals, nor do the best street cars.

Depends what sort of race car it is. 80% still have clutch pedals. And most drivers will tell you that they would rather have a clutch and H shifter rather than the stupid Padel shift gearboxes.

And in GT5 you cant hold your foot on the clutch and the throttle at the same time or it wont shift. So make sure you press triangle befor the race starts.

 

[ultrataco]

...So make sure you press triangle befor the race starts.

...but after the ding noise. In other words, when you get control of the car, then hit the triangle.

 

[seizure_]

whenever possible I like to perform heel & toe just to get a more realistic feel

 

[Oberst Struppi]

Look at my Youtube Channel, and go into my Multiview Playlist.

www.youtube.com/user/OberstStruppi

There are 3 Videos. Look the newest one -> Z06 Multiview .

i always perfom heel and toe technique, even in my hotlaps.

rainer

 

[vr6wantsr20det]

I am with you guys, but I am happy to be penalised with gearbox damage if I abuse flat/power shifting, I just want it back.

Fact is you don't have to off the throttle completely when upshifting, if you do quick shifts take note in relpay of the throttle meter you will notice even though you 'lift' you never remove the throttle completely, GT5P has some limits but it's not zero throttle.

My biggest gripe is the wheelspin problem, bad, bad for drifitng, I don't want to have to kill much of my wheelspin in drifting to select the next gear, that is awful.

and the biggest problem I find now with heel toeing is my pedals are not gripping the carpet so well anymore (carpet is worn a bit) and as I rotate my foot to blip the throttle the pedal unit sometimes rotates too which causes some brake pressure loss, only started recently, I will have to mount the pedals better.

I agree for damage/penalties for power-shifting constantly as it does and would put strain on the drive-train. I find you have to be very careful and precise when shifting, and to not be on the throttle to be safe when up-shifting. When down-shifting or heel-toeing it's not problem as they let you rev-match and still go into gear.

I also notice more stable braking and turn-in when using the heel-toe. Just for drifting i want to be able to select gears with wheel spin, taking that out is just Blasphemy!

 

[EERS4YEARS]

i need a stand for my shifter, so i dont use clutch yet. and in motoGP and F1 clutches are used on starts only. i laugh when i see all of you argue with technology, you all should be engineers... lol By the way big rigs dont use their clutch either hahaha

 

[Ghost_drift]

i need a stand for my shifter, so i dont use clutch yet. and in motoGP and F1 clutches are used on starts only. i laugh when i see all of you argue with technology, you all should be engineers... lol By the way big rigs dont use their clutch either hahaha

That is hardly all racing cars is it. And why bring up MotoGP thats motorbikes not even cars.

 

[mu22stang]

i need a stand for my shifter, so i dont use clutch yet. and in motoGP and F1 clutches are used on starts only. i laugh when i see all of you argue with technology, you all should be engineers... lol By the way big rigs dont use their clutch either hahaha

I am an engineer, and I agree with most of these comments. And the two gearboxes you used as examples are racing application sequential gearboxes, which inherently only use the clutch from a stop. This discussion concerns manual gearboxes only.

 

[Jay]

I also notice more stable braking and turn-in when using the heel-toe. Just for drifting i want to be able to select gears with wheel spin, taking that out is just Blasphemy!

Yep I notice the same and yep I agree, Blasphemy!

 

[bobzed]

i always perfom heel and toe technique, even in my hotlaps.

rainer

same here. I heel-toe even in time trials (if allowed) hotlapping and racing online. I've been using heel-toe technique since day 1 with GT5P and G25.


PS. and I wear Subelt gloves and Pumas in my black Evo too 👍

 

[Asylum]

i will add my 2 cents. i FULLY agree on the nutural penalty deal with the clutch. The lucky few ( including my self ) that forked out the cash for the g25 or equal wheel with a clutch should NOT be penalized when trying to quick shift with a RETARDED neutral penalty. I have NEVER seen anything SO RETARDED to this in ANY real car EVER....


I have drove MANY beat up trannys with no syncros anymore and was still able to " flat " shift or power shift it with hardly any troubles at all..

so untill this penalty system is removed I REFUSE to use the clutch at all it has no use to me what so ever but just to slow my shifts down and piss me off while in a heated battle.

ON a side note what is the deal with the FAKE CLUTCH PHYSICS anyhow? What i mean is try to go out and give her a clutch kick. tell me what u notice. No wheelspin you cant even break the tires loose with it.... HOW STUPID CAN PD BE TO MAKE THERE CLUTCH ACT LIKE THIS.... THE answer is simple its because the DFGT is the gt5 wheel so why would they make a clutch feature when that CHEAP wheel does not have one HAHAHAHA


SHAME ON YOU PD EPIC FAIL

 

[Oberst Struppi]

same here. I heel-toe even in time trials (if allowed) hotlapping and racing online. I've been using heel-toe technique since day 1 with GT5P and G25.


PS. and I wear Subelt gloves and Pumas in my black Evo too 👍

What do u mean with that?!

 

[Ghost_drift]

What do u mean with that?!

I think he means that he wears them for realism reasons.

 

[vr6wantsr20det]

ON a side note what is the deal with the FAKE CLUTCH PHYSICS anyhow? What i mean is try to go out and give her a clutch kick. tell me what u notice. No wheelspin you cant even break the tires loose with it.... HOW STUPID CAN PD BE TO MAKE THERE CLUTCH ACT LIKE THIS.... THE answer is simple its because the DFGT is the gt5 wheel so why would they make a clutch feature when that CHEAP wheel does not have one HAHAHAHA


SHAME ON YOU PD EPIC FAIL[/QUOTE]

I thought the same but the clutch physics as far as function (besides fast *****) does provide a function for shift-lock and clutch kick. In drifting the Blitz R34, or decently powered cars with N3 tires, the clutch kick does seem to work. I've used it quite a bit. Also i did a test and there is a little bit of modulation with the clutch, you have to be precise and very carefull, but you can ride/slip the clutch. It's hard to notice like in a real car but it does work.

I took the integra type-R on the Suzuka Straight (somewhat level ground) and pinned the RPM at redline. I then SLOOOOWLY released the clutch and it started to partially engage as if riding/slipping the clutch. The rpm dropped slowly and the car started rolling. If you just drop the clutch, the rpm drops quick and you can't notice the little bit of modulation you get. Now in racing there's really no need for this, but the feature/realism is there, although they can definately improve a lot on it. This is why for a more Simulation drive, i play/drift in LFS. With the tweak (power-mod) and Steering lock mod drifting realism is better than GT5p. Don't get me wrong they did a lot of good things in gt5p, and hopefully the full game will improve on all these issues. 👍

 

[bobzed]

What do u mean with that?!

I meant that I'm in the same boat with you.
I watched your vid and noticed you wearing gloves and pumas in a black evo.
Same here. I use gloves and pumas, and have Evo too. That's it.

I think he means that he wears them for realism reasons.

It's real pain to heel-toe bare footed

 

[Ghost_drift]

It's real pain too heel-toe bare footed

It is actualy easyer. but it hurts the tootsy's.