DTM is in race room racing experience ( cars and tracks ). You can buy them...
How The FIA Helped Develop Gran Turismo Sport
- Thread starter GTPNewsWire
- 87 comments
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DTM is in race room racing experience ( cars and tracks ). You can buy them...
- 27,387
- Toronto
- NewAesthetic
- SlipZtrEm
It's important to make the distinction between a selection process and a training process.
GT Academy was brilliant marketing, and it helped whittle down thousands of people to a more manageable number, but GT (or any other commercially-available sim racer, really) is not single-handedly turning gamers into racers.
Also, @Sergio18 - don't double-post, that's what the +Quote and Edit buttons are for. 👍
A possible solution would be to expand the awards to the division winners as well. Maybe not the big FIA dinner/trophy, but something.
Seems an appropriate time to look over at GTPlanet's own Weekly Race Series, then...
- 1,875
- United States
Comparing apples to oranges here I see.
My exact statement was concerning that real world and virtual world have totally different elements involved.
As someone with quite a few of real world laps on road course circuits in the real world over a period of about 17 years (on two wheels) I am fully aware of the differences in real world and virtual world racing.
Your original comment was:
"the goal has always been (for the aliens) to win in GT, PC , Asseto etc and be able to compete in reality"
My response was that virtual world only experience does not prepare a person to be an accomplished racer in the real world based on that experience alone. Then you want to talk about the success of racers that ALREADY HAD real world experience. Not the same conversation as someone who has never raced on a real track or real vehicle just raced in the virtual world.
- 1,654
- UK
- JacksHereR
If the races were broadcasted and commentated on, with post race penalties etc
Taking part at the back of the grid or anywhere in between would be something I would be interested in.
Currently there are too many anonymous racers who don't care how they block swerve dive etc.
People getting points on their race license and getting disqualified or grid/weight/performance penalties etc.
The game needs consequences to insure people try their hardest to be clean and fair.
Taking part at the back of the grid or anywhere in between would be something I would be interested in.
Currently there are too many anonymous racers who don't care how they block swerve dive etc.
People getting points on their race license and getting disqualified or grid/weight/performance penalties etc.
The game needs consequences to insure people try their hardest to be clean and fair.
100%
On average 50% of my FIA races are destroyed by someone else. I've just had a 1,000 point+ result on Bathurst reduced to a discard value by someone who blatantly rammed me off into the wall at the final tight corner before the main straight. Classic using the car in front as a brake. As if the punt wasn't enough, the game saw fit to inflict damage on every part of my car so I couldn't even minimise the loss. Podium position becomes back of the field. The person who rammed me off drove off and finished 4th. {Edit: This is a grid full of DR A SR S drivers, so should be a good standard}
This behaviour absolutely changes the shape of the race, the results, points awarded and therefore championship.
There is no steward, there is no retrospective action, there is no penalty system, sanction or warning applied to the cheats and it's somewhere in virtually every race. {Edit: I actually think it's possible to do a couple of blatant dirty moves in a 10 lap race and still get a blue SR at the end}
How can this be FIA approved? The people who've created this ****show certainly aren't playing it.
- 539
- USA
- TheLadiesMan
Eagerly awaiting this well produced Power Point presentation on your solution.
..So while we all wait for that, I think the only thing they can really do is add a couple different divisions. Probably Pro (S and A), Intermediate (B and C), Amateur (D and E). Now, since this has already been discussed to death, issues have already been raised:
* Are there even enough players to fill out these grids? I've just moved into S/S but the vast majority of races I do include people from S to B. There just aren't enough people to fill out the grids. You could end up picking time slot #2 for Intermediate and only have ten people in the race. This is one of the reasons why the Strength of Field system exists and works well.
* You also have to factor in that it's dividing people up by Safety Rating, which further whittles down the various player pools. Frankly, I don't want to race with anyone less than an SR S, because anything lower than that and you must be pretty sloppy. I make plenty of mistakes and I've still never dropped out of SR S. If it were up to me, an SR S should be mandatory for FIA race participation.
* Then you've got the issue of Driver and Safety ratings actually fluctuate. People have already discussed sandbagging (someone deliberately lowering their DR so they can race and beat easier opponents) or say you have a bad race and your DR gets knocked down from A to B in the middle of a season. Potential solution for this is locking your DR at the season start.
Even then, only the very best S drivers (the aliens) are going to potentially get any tangible rewards. If you finish first in the Amateur division, that's all well and good and you should be happy about it, that doesn't mean you're a world class driver. I'm sure there are other issues I'm forgetting. As I said, many people have already discussed this.
I'm very curious to see how this Top 24 race works, because the explanation is too vague. I would also assume they'd like to broadcast this race eventually. Something I think they could do, and would be very fun, is maybe having a special annual event where the finalists in the Pro division have a race with some real drivers that maybe PD could drag in like Lewis Hamilton or Lucas or whoever else. Makes for a fun event for the players and a nice marketing move that various news outlets can pick up on.
Another note: I doubt this "digital license" will hold any weight in the real world. You'll probably be the butt of jokes among real world race drivers, which is both old fashioned but also not entirely wrong. I don't think you're going to show up to any organization and say okay put me in that GT3 car, here is my FIA digital license. Point is, don't be too jealous. The real reward is going to be potentially moving into some sort of international GT Academy event out of the best players in the world for a chance to audition to move into real racing.
- 2,006
- Austria
"
In advance of Mardenborough’s victory, the FIA,
realising that a digital rubicon was being crossed, entered
into a multi-year partnership with Polyphony Digital, the
Japanese company behind the wildly successful Gran
Turismo racing game.
The partnership has a two-fold
aim, firstly to promote
motor sport safety to competitors, even in the virtual world,
and secondly to encourage young people to get involved in
motor sport"
https://www.fia.com/sites/default/files/auto8.pdf
- 87,511
- Rule 12
- GTP_Famine
You can't turn up and say "okay put me in that GT3 car" with a National B licence either.
That's what the FIA Digital License is equivalent to - or rather it may be equivalent to the theory part of a National B licence qualification. It's a start, not an advanced international licence.
- 539
- USA
- TheLadiesMan
Yea, I gotcha. And if that image of the license is anything to go on, it says right on it that it's down to the individual organization to evaluate it.
I'm curious, is there an FIA guideline we can see on what the real world license tiers are and what they enable you to do? What sort of experience and credentials you need to get each?
I'm just saying, if I showed up to a local SCCA club-level race or even 24 hours of Lemons race, I certainly would not expect them to let me on track. Even with some pre-race observation, I can imagine they'd be very nervous. And I can't blame them. If some person walked up to me and showed me this license they earned from playing a game online, I'd probably think they were kidding. A handful of HPDE events is far more significant than any amount of virtual racing.
That's looking at it from the cynical outsider though. Plenty of people I've run with in DR S or A have a good attitude (i.e. sportsmanship) and seem to have a fairly good understanding of driving that I'd be perfectly comfortable on a real track with them.
GT Sport definitely needs more legit flagging rules before I'd consider this a true mental training in race theory or race craft as it says.
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- 1,605
- Greece
- Giorgos_Ferrari
Ok Great Then why didn't gave the the license of every track/race cars ever??
- 17,307
- United Kingdom
Neither the FIA, nor licensing agreements are what you think they are.
- 1,605
- Greece
- Giorgos_Ferrari
True i don't know anything about them but if anyone could give license's easy is the FIA if they can't for (Thair official game) who can?
user3392345
(Banned)
- 702
- Antarctica
This must be a joke or just marketing? this game is so far behind reality... it only looks good, everything else is poor.
- 862
- Northamptonshire
- Ryanswannell
I would have thought these licences were up to the brand/ organisation owners, for example liberty media allowing a full F1 grid in a game etc.
- 1,605
- Greece
- Giorgos_Ferrari
Of course but with the Power FIA have it would be a lot more easy than normal
- 17,307
- United Kingdom
The people who own the thing that somebody wants a license agreement for.
Why??? How hard do you think it is normally?
- 1,875
- United States
What is meaningless is anyone with no real world track experience thinking that the top lap time they turned on a virtual rendition of a real world circuit would result in the same results in a real world race car on the real world track with them being the driver.
Not sure you would find many race teams willing to risk a race car worth multiple hundreds of thousands dollars to see if such virtual driver attempt such feat either.
- 1,605
- Greece
- Giorgos_Ferrari
Quite Hard considering we had only 4 GT3 Cars until now.
I've lost count of the number of times I've been overtaken under yellows.
- 25
- New Zealand
From the article: "By playing Gran Turismo, the player fulfils the two requirements necessary to gain a real-life racing license: knowledge of basic racecraft, and race theory such as flag rules.
"Naturally for safety reasons, some of the national motorsport organizations may still require a practical demonstration, but the FIA Digital License will still count towards a real driving qualification."
Naturally for safety reasons basic racecraft requires a heightened level of situational awareness.
Part of this situational awareness is knowing what's in your rear-vision mirror. I cannot take apparent FIA endorsement or Kazunori Yamauchi seriously when a rear-vision mirror is prohibited in bonnet camera. Bonnet cam is better than bumper cam for judging turning points. It's a faster mode to drive in and I really enjoy seeing the front of my car. But I cannot use it because I care about the situation of other cars on the track.
Situational awareness is penalised in Gran Turismo Sport and Kazunori Yamauchi is OK with this as otherwise everyone might start using bonnet cam. Yet learning to use a rear-vision mirror is a real-life safety skill that should be promoted, not prohibited.
The FIA in partnership with Polyphony Digital are in a position to rectify this and overcome any ego-blocking impediments. Polyphony Digital has taken on the responsibility for handing out real-life racing licenses. Prohibiting situational awareness for spurious reasons just makes the franchise look bad.
"Naturally for safety reasons, some of the national motorsport organizations may still require a practical demonstration, but the FIA Digital License will still count towards a real driving qualification."
Naturally for safety reasons basic racecraft requires a heightened level of situational awareness.
Part of this situational awareness is knowing what's in your rear-vision mirror. I cannot take apparent FIA endorsement or Kazunori Yamauchi seriously when a rear-vision mirror is prohibited in bonnet camera. Bonnet cam is better than bumper cam for judging turning points. It's a faster mode to drive in and I really enjoy seeing the front of my car. But I cannot use it because I care about the situation of other cars on the track.
Situational awareness is penalised in Gran Turismo Sport and Kazunori Yamauchi is OK with this as otherwise everyone might start using bonnet cam. Yet learning to use a rear-vision mirror is a real-life safety skill that should be promoted, not prohibited.
The FIA in partnership with Polyphony Digital are in a position to rectify this and overcome any ego-blocking impediments. Polyphony Digital has taken on the responsibility for handing out real-life racing licenses. Prohibiting situational awareness for spurious reasons just makes the franchise look bad.
- 4,550
- Australia
The first priority has to be having a solid game with a decent number of categories and tracks. The delighters like the FIA affiliation have to come after that, and I don't believe that's being done.
- 1,343
- Brazil
- 87,511
- Rule 12
- GTP_Famine
You'd need to pay your entry fee (or pay your team's entry fee) before you showed up, attend the driver briefing and scrutineering, and have a novice sticker on your car (black cross on a yellow background on the rear of the car), but there's absolutely no reason you can't show up to a track with an entry level licence and no experience, to drive in a race that your licence qualifies you for.
In fact I got mine to do exactly that in 2015. Sadly, other things came up.
This is not part of a basic national B licence test. In fact the only driving requirement for a basic national B licence is to drive three laps of a racing circuit at around 50mph with an instructor, with no other cars on the track, as an assessment of whether you can follow a racing line.
There's also a theory test in a classroom, that consists of watching a 15 minute video and answering multiple choice questions on it.
That's all you need to do to get a national B licence.
- 24,636
- Anoka, MN
The FIA usually has no control over marketing/commercial rights, which is what you need for a series to be featured in a video game. DTM for instance is ran by DMSB and ITR, Blancpain is SRO and WEC is ACO, F1 is Liberty Media. Those are the bodies that control licensing, not the FIA.
- 1,875
- United States
To get a novice license for the SCCA in the United States requires a completed doctors physical and completion of an approved racing school. You will then be eligible for a provisional race license and upon successful safe participation in up to 3 racing events (number can be dependent on which school you completed) then would be eligible for a full regular competition license, this is pretty close to the same requirements for a motorcycle road race license here in the states as well.
Sounds as if the FIA license has fewer requirements to obtain, not sure if that is a good thing or not.
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