Is anybody thinking about making the switch

[Zoom!Zoom!]

If you say the cars sound better in GT than in Forza you seriously have never ever driven a real car before, excuse me.

Have you actually read the tech thread about GT5? How much the frame rate slows down? FM3 stays on 60 pretty much ALL the time, tested by the same Eurogamer. Your facts are totally wrong and colored.

I believe the average framerate difference between the two was 3 fps. a cost of 3 fps and still average above 50 fps for 1080p is a good deal.I lose 10 fps running F1 2010 in DX11. (most of Gt5 frame rate drops was due to the cars butch together in view especially bumper view which has a rear view mirror)
Gt5 is a lot sharper image running 1080p than Forza 3 which really brings out those sharp jagged shadow edges.

p.s As far as sounds I can feel my engine through my Buttkicker in GT5 more than any racing game I've played. I really like feeling the car engine. I doubt PD did this just for us Buttkicker owners though.

 

[Lain]

I bought a 360 and Forza to kill time during the wait for GT5, and it's a good game.

I prefer the feel of GT's physics however, and also track selection. Also I prefer GT's slow burn as opposed to Forza 3 where you earn credits, level up and win prize cars much faster.

 

[Vicious3745]

Ima be as straight forward as i can about my expierience

I purchased Forza 2 waiting for the next GT5.

I was suddenly very spoiled by the damage and the livery editor.

Suddenly Forza 3 came out, and thanks to all the fun times with 2, i said "Why not" and spent just as much time in it. I found myself stressed just a bit by the wonky menus and it's fetish with saving between every screen, but the community was fun, the AI was a decent challenge, and i spent way too much time in the livery editor. xD Not to mention, it was my first chance to really get a feel for my Fanatec PWTS, and i thought the driving was perfection at times with that wheel.

GT5 was delayed a year, i was hoping it was to take all the great ideas being tossed out in racing genre and reconsider some options.

Dirt 2 Came out, it was my first time really getting a handle of some amazing Direct X 11 capable racing, i was officially spoiled by the interiors, the damage, and the wonderful windshield effects with wipers, water and dirt. Not to mention, i was amazed with how well the game handled the Fanatec, even on PC. It was about the time i learned the hard way not to strap that wheel to unstable surfaces, much less foldable tv trays, it nearly threw it aside. xD

Finally GT5 came out, of course i picked it up asap. The list of things i was put off about was staggering, things such as loading screens between every menu screen, awful UI design, previous gen style AI, awful rain on windshield effects, i found the more i played the longer the list got, even if i tried to stick to just premium cars, which effectively got me to thinking that Forza3 really had a bigger car list..

In the end, i'm sitting here playing Gran Turismo 5, not Forza 3. I think the reason is obvious, while Forza my be consitently prettier, or feature damage, or handle my fanatec better, i find that GT features the most realistic driving physics i've ever played with. I find myself learning something new all the time with the liscense tests and special events, and i'm loving the lounge-like casual online play. Not only that, i feel that the tracks are much more similar to their real life counter parts, and on the side, the interiors to the premium cars are often quite prettier anyways. xD

When i wanna play a more complete "Game" i may be heading back to forza eventually, however i find the physics in GT5 holding the game up alone, and despite all it's shortcomings, i don't have a problem with that.

 

[Goatsie]

Ima be as straight forward as i can about my expierience

I purchased Forza 2 waiting for the next GT5.

I was suddenly very spoiled by the damage and the livery editor.

Suddenly Forza 3 came out, and thanks to all the fun times with 2, i said "Why not" and spent just as much time in it. I found myself stressed just a bit by the wonky menus and it's fetish with saving between every screen, but the community was fun, the AI was a decent challenge, and i spent way too much time in the livery editor. xD Not to mention, it was my first chance to really get a feel for my Fanatec PWTS, and i thought the driving was perfection at times with that wheel.

GT5 was delayed a year, i was hoping it was to take all the great ideas being tossed out in racing genre and reconsider some options.

Dirt 2 Came out, it was my first time really getting a handle of some amazing Direct X 11 capable racing, i was officially spoiled by the interiors, the damage, and the wonderful windshield effects with wipers, water and dirt. Not to mention, i was amazed with how well the game handled the Fanatec, even on PC. It was about the time i learned the hard way not to strap that wheel to unstable surfaces, much less foldable tv trays, it nearly threw it aside. xD

Finally GT5 came out, of course i picked it up asap. The list of things i was put off about was staggering, things such as loading screens between every menu screen, awful UI design, previous gen style AI, awful rain on windshield effects, i found the more i played the longer the list got, even if i tried to stick to just premium cars, which effectively got me to thinking that Forza3 really had a bigger car list..

In the end, i'm sitting here playing Gran Turismo 5, not Forza 3. I think the reason is obvious, while Forza my be consitently prettier, or feature damage, or handle my fanatec better, i find that GT features the most realistic driving physics i've ever played with. I find myself learning something new all the time with the liscense tests and special events, and i'm loving the lounge-like casual online play. Not only that, i feel that the tracks are much more similar to their real life counter parts, and on the side, the interiors to the premium cars are often quite prettier anyways. xD

When i wanna play a more complete "Game" i may be heading back to forza eventually, however i find the physics in GT5 holding the game up alone, and despite all it's shortcomings, i don't have a problem with that.

I share the same sentiments on the physics. Personally, it trumps "livery editor" and alike features.

 

[Goatsie]

I bought a 360 and Forza to kill time during the wait for GT5, and it's a good game.

I prefer the feel of GT's physics however, and also track selection. Also I prefer GT's slow burn as opposed to Forza 3 where you earn credits, level up and win prize cars much faster.

I think this might be a good metaphor for philosophies in western and eastern cultures; it seems like immediacy is always greater in America. We always need to get everything we want, NOW.

 

[kyleh613]

I think this might be a good metaphor for philosophies in western and eastern cultures; it seems like immediacy is always greater in America. We always need to get everything we want, NOW.

That's a nice way to spin the horrible a-spec mode in a positive light but it's far from the truth.

 

[Zoom!Zoom!]

That's a nice way to spin the horrible a-spec mode in a positive light but it's far from the truth.

I wouldn't say A-spec is horrible. It seem it was down size for the majority of gamers (I serious doubt most of those who got GT4 or F3 finished the SP game) then on the other hand you still got to do a lot of grinding to complete A-spec. If PD was design the game to do a lot of grinding for more hardcore gamers than why cut back on the amount of event compared to other GT series? It's as if one worker designed A- spec events to be completed faster while another involving levels had grinding in mind.

 

[jmx2222]

I've spoken to a lot of people around who have now got GT5, and they are quite disappointed with it - It's fair to say I am a little, and I've been suggesting Forza as an alternative. I only have a 720p xbox, but I have to say I am considering getting a new 1080 one and going over to the dark side. Anyone else feeling this?

I'm driving racing sims on different systems (360,PS3,PS2) and I don't see any kind of "dark side" here or anywhere else

Real Racing Sim Fans do not care about things like I got a PS3/Xbox 360/PC/ PSP! It's only the pleasure of driving that really counts - no matter which system!

Peace

 

[H3avyM3tal]

That's a nice way to spin the horrible a-spec mode in a positive light but it's far from the truth.

Hardly horrible.

I too bought the 360 with F3 to play it, but I have since barely touched that game, as it gives me the feeling of rushing through it. With GT5 I have plenty to do that is not just about racing and going through my 'career', and that in turn is not being helped by the 'vacant' feeling the forza gives off now.

 

[ShylockHolmes]

in all honesty the feeling of driving is way better in GT5 and I'm an xbox fanboy. Oh all xbox 360's are capable of outputting 1080p

 

[McLaren]

You are entitled to your opinion but I asure you I can hear quite well and the cars in GT sound good, many of them are more realistic than Forza in many ways and is a giant leap forward in the sound department from previous Gt games.

I would love to hear which of these cars sound better, actually. B/c even the 5.0 Gallardo in Forza sounds closer than the 5.2 in GT5.

 

[Oversteerin']

in all honesty the feeling of driving is way better in GT5 and I'm an xbox fanboy. Oh all xbox 360's are capable of outputting 1080p

This is actually not technically true. The 360 actually only supports a NATIVE output of 720p, but through firmware updates, has gained to ability to UPSCALE to 1080p. Now, anyone who knows anything about home theater equipment will tell you that there is a huge difference in quality between a scaled HD image and a native HD image.

Without going into a long, boring, technical explanation, the "lamen's terms" explanation is this: a scaled image uses software that analyzes a pixel's surrounding environment and tries to "fill in the blanks." A native image displays true 1:1 mapping of each pixel, creating a sharper, cleaner image. Here's a link to a video that shows a true 1920x1080p image file on both systems, and you can clearly see the difference.

Skip to the 4 minute mark to see the back to back comparisons and you'll save yourself a lot of boring and long-winded fanboyism from the dumbass that made the video. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MakQpMSKP7I

To be totally honest, though, I still think the 360 is a better overall system. The online infrastructure is hands-down better, with a more developed community, better features (like video streaming for movie rentals, the ability to change your gamertag, cross game voice chat, the list just goes on and on and on).

Now, don't get me wrong, I like having a PS3 for the blu-ray player and exclusive titles (like uncharted, GOW, metal gear, GT, etc), but when multiplatform games come out, 9 times out of 10 - I'm getting it for the 360. Between bad ports (though that's the fault of the developers, not the system) and the online system leaving much to be desired, it's just no contest. It is what it is...

 

[12thgear]

I'm not playing fanboy, but just correcting. The Xbox 360 absolutely is capable of 1080p output. Almost no games run at that resolution. The only one I can remember is Virtua Tennis. Most titles will be upscaled, and I've noticed a couple that seem a bit chopper when upscaled to 1080p.

 

[Oversteerin']

I'm not playing fanboy, but just correcting. The Xbox 360 absolutely is capable of 1080p output. Almost no games run at that resolution. The only one I can remember is Virtua Tennis. Most titles will be upscaled, and I've noticed a couple that seem a bit chopper when upscaled to 1080p.

Ugh, I guess what I wrote went over you head. YES, the 360 can output 1080p - but NOT natively. When set to 1080p, what you are seeing on your TV is an upscaled 720p image. Just the same as with an upscaling DVD player set to 1080p, your TV will register a 1080p signal, but it is not TRUE 1080p - it is UPSCALED, ala, NOT 1:1 pixel mapping. Because of this, every game on the 360 that says it supports 1080p on the back is actually using false marketing because it's really just 720p.

The PS3, on the other hand, is capable of outputing 1080p NATIVELY (true 1:1 mapping), and that's the difference. While most games still have a native resolution of 720p (just like on the 360), the ones that support 1080p (metal gear solid 4, GT5, etc.), are being displayed in TRUE 1080p natively and NOT through upscaling. Hopefully, this makes it easier for you to understand. 👍

 

[jgtc_lover]

I too bought a 360 with FM3 during the wait for GT5. I think it's a great game in it's own right, I've played it to near completion and only need 3 more achievements to finish the game.

I never really felt comfortable using my DFGT with prologue and I was reluctant at first to use it with GT5. After playing GT5 with a controller, I didn't think it was that great of a game, it felt pretty average to me. The next day I decided to hook up the DFGT, and oh my god, what a huge difference. I was astounded at how much it felt like driving a real car, and it's so much more fun than with a controller.

So now I've decided any racing game without a wheel is not worth playing. I'm not going to lie, if I had a wheel compatible with the 360 I'd probably still be playing FM3.

 

[12thgear]

I know what upscaling is, thanks. What you say does apply to nearly every piece of Xbox 360 software, but there are a handful of exceptions that render at a true 1920 x 1080. Again, the only one I can reference from actual experience is Virtua Tennis 3.

Ugh, I guess what I wrote went over you head. YES, the 360 can output 1080p - but NOT natively. When set to 1080p, what you are seeing on your TV is an upscaled 720p image. Just the same as with an upscaling DVD player set to 1080p, your TV will register a 1080p signal, but it is not TRUE 1080p - it is UPSCALED, ala, NOT 1:1 pixel mapping.

Because of this, every game on the 360 that says it supports 1080p on the back is actually using false marketing because it's really just 720p. The PS3, on the other hand, is capable of outputing 1080p NATIVELY (true 1:1 mapping), and that's the difference. While most games still run in 720p, just like on the 360, titles like metal gear solid 4, GT5, etc., are actually displaying a TRUE, NATIVE 1080p signal. Hopefully, this makes it easier for you to understand. 👍

 

[Daddybird]

I too bought a 360 with FM3 during the wait for GT5. I think it's a great game in it's own right, I've played it to near completion and only need 3 more achievements to finish the game.

I never really felt comfortable using my DFGT with prologue and I was reluctant at first to use it with GT5. After playing GT5 with a controller, I didn't think it was that great of a game, it felt pretty average to me. The next day I decided to hook up the DFGT, and oh my god, what a huge difference. I was astounded at how much it felt like driving a real car, and it's so much more fun than with a controller.

So now I've decided any racing game without a wheel is not worth playing. I'm not going to lie, if I had a wheel compatible with the 360 I'd probably still be playing FM3.

I really hope the Fanatec wheel that comes out next year will be supported to play FM4, that would be awesome.

 

[Spade13]

To be honest, I really enjoyed Forza 2! Sure the graphics weren't great and lack of cockpit view on any car was disappointing, but the key point was that the physics were great and the cars were just a joy to drive! I played Forza 3 and the graphic update and cockpit view is nice, I feel like the game is overall stepping away from racing simulator to arcade racer. Going around corners just felt easier than it did in Forza 2, even with all the assists off. Plus why did they bring the stupid Rewind Feature in the game?

Forza 4 looks great, but it looks even more like an arcade racer than Forza 3! I was disappointed in GT5, but atleast they kept the realism and hardcore elements in there instead of trying to open up and turn it into an arcade racer.

 

[phil-t]

I didn't want to join in silly vs misinformed nonsense, but I will just point out the 360 can natively render at 1080p, there are in fact some games that are 1080p, and HD-dvd's where natively processed and output at this resolution.

And the problem with fm3 physics is the grip levels, they are very much on the high side of real life (being kind). The actual complexity of them is actually very high, and saying its an arcade game is incredibly misplaced.

 

[Murcie_LP640]

I enjoy both Forza 3 and GT5. I love Forza 3 for its accessibility and tuning options and I love GT5 for the physics.

That said, if I have to choose between one or the other it's definitely Gran Turismo 5. Lack of uniformity between standard cars or not, it has a much much larger selection of cars and those physics are second to none. But I certainly respect Forza 3 and find it a great improvement compared to the (in my opinion) boring Forza 2.

 

[Bogie 19th]

This is actually not technically true. The 360 actually only supports a NATIVE output of 720p, but through firmware updates, has gained to ability to UPSCALE to 1080p. Now, anyone who knows anything about home theater equipment will tell you that there is a huge difference in quality between a scaled HD image and a native HD image.

Without going into a long, boring, technical explanation, the "lamen's terms" explanation is this: a scaled image uses software that analyzes a pixel's surrounding environment and tries to "fill in the blanks." A native image displays true 1:1 mapping of each pixel, creating a sharper, cleaner image. Here's a link to a video that shows a true 1920x1080p image file on both systems, and you can clearly see the difference.

Skip to the 4 minute mark to see the back to back comparisons and you'll save yourself a lot of boring and long-winded fanboyism from the dumbass that made the video. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MakQpMSKP7I

To be totally honest, though, I still think the 360 is a better overall system. The online infrastructure is hands-down better, with a more developed community, better features (like video streaming for movie rentals, the ability to change your gamertag, cross game voice chat, the list just goes on and on and on).

Now, don't get me wrong, I like having a PS3 for the blu-ray player and exclusive titles (like uncharted, GOW, metal gear, GT, etc), but when multiplatform games come out, 9 times out of 10 - I'm getting it for the 360. Between bad ports (though that's the fault of the developers, not the system) and the online system leaving much to be desired, it's just no contest. It is what it is...

False, the Xbox 360 supports native 1080p output, as well as upscaled.

 

[12thgear]

To be honest, I really enjoyed Forza 2! Sure the graphics weren't great and lack of cockpit view on any car was disappointing, but the key point was that the physics were great and the cars were just a joy to drive! I played Forza 3 and the graphic update and cockpit view is nice, I feel like the game is overall stepping away from racing simulator to arcade racer. Going around corners just felt easier than it did in Forza 2, even with all the assists off. Plus why did they bring the stupid Rewind Feature in the game?

You know, I didn't give Forza 2 a fair shake because at the time I didn't have a wheel for the Xbox. So I ended up playing on the PC, or revisiting GT4 and Prologue. I may have to go back and try Forza 2 with the wheel. It seems to be getting some love lately.

 

[Daddybird]

I don't feel FM3 is more arcadey than FM2 at all, if you count all the assists and rewind as arcade it wouldn't be fair, you can turn them off.

More people day FM3 is supposed to be more arcade than FM2, but I felt they're pretty similar and I think FM3 is a way better experience overall, even with some issues.

And before I get a flame (oh I won't, I'm not in the GT5 board) I drive cars fast in real life on real tracks and I do think GT5 is more realistic with a wheel, but I play videogames to have fun and Forza is a perfect bland of realism and fun to me.

 

[phil-t]

I don't feel FM3 is more arcadey than FM2 at all, if you count all the assists and rewind as arcade it wouldn't be fair, you can turn them off.

More people day FM3 is supposed to be more arcade than FM2, but I felt they're pretty similar and I think FM3 is a way better experience overall, even with some issues.

And before I get a flame (oh I won't, I'm not in the GT5 board) I drive cars fast in real life on real tracks and I do think GT5 is more realistic with a wheel, but I play videogames to have fun and Forza is a perfect bland of realism and fun to me.

Yep, GT5 for me feels very lively and entertaining with it's (probably unrealistically low) grip levels and the way it slides just feels good, as they've made it nice and controllable.

I think FM3 physics + grip level tweaking and the like and it'll be much more entertaining..

 

[Bogie 19th]

Yep, GT5 for me feels very lively and entertaining with it's (probably unrealistically low) grip levels

I have found GT5 to high unrealistically high grip.

 

[zerolight]

I'm a long time PS3 and 360 owner and Forza 3 player. The more I play GT5 the more I feel it's a little underwhelming - I miss the huge community aspects of F3 - Tunes and Paints in particular, cockpits on all cars, and the more detailed tracks. I think they are both fairly close in terms of handling. It's a hassle to switch wheels back and forth on my wheelstand pro, so the MS Wheel is sitting in a corner and F3 goes unplayed.

I'm very tempted to eBay GT5 and my DFGT (both a week or so old and had only a little use) and just going back to Forza. Leave the PS3 for GOW.

 

[Greyum]

If the game is rubbish on the pad, then no dice. I don't like gaming steering wheels and have no room for one anyway.

Say what you like about FM3, but it's fantastic on the pad.

QFT 👍

After waiting all this time for GT5, I can safely say that it one of the biggest disappointments of this generation. Yeah, premium cars look great (without the awful shadows spoiling them) and yeah, the physics are great...with a wheel. With a pad the driving sucks, and really, all GT5 has going for it is the driving.

• Racing against AI is awful, with the same on-rails crap we always had. You either win by a mile or struggle to even keep up.
• Standard cars look poor and best, and at their worst, just like PS2 models (oh wait...)
• Menus are badly designed, and the music...
• Same-old progression system, just putting in levels to meet this time.
• Sound is still weak
• Difficulty is woefully inconsistent
• The shadows and shimmer are awful. Prologue looked better and cleaner.
• No hood cam while driving...WTF?
• Unable to change or paint wheels on standard cars
• Can't paint cars a certain colour until you bought a previous car of that particular colour, and even then it costs you...stupid idea.

I don't know what they did for 6 years - maybe just worked on the premium cars and their handling, forgetting there needs to be a game in there. All this crap from Kaz now about "this is only the beginning"...er, yeah, you're right - couldn't get much worse as a start. The whole game just feels like it is stuck in a time warp.

All this "if you are a real sim racing fan you wouldn't care about this or that" is rather short-sighted. For one, neither GT5 or Forza 3 are sims. They are games that give the impression you are driving a car - BIG difference. GT5 may nail the actual driving, but as a game it sucks. Never again am I going to fall for such hype and promise.

So yeah, I made the switch. One week and about 25 hours into GT5, I sold the machine I bought at launch just for Gran Turismo and am now having loads of fun with Forza 3 - it's a much better GAME, with far more exciting races, cars you actually want to own, and swift progression. Even better, if I just want to mess about, I can use any car on any track in single race mode. Actually, even better is the fact that it only cost £12.47 for 500 consistent cars, better environments, ability to change any part on ALL cars, ability to paint cars any colour and put any design on any of them...

Lesson learned.

 

[Daddybird]

When I played FM3 for a year to ease the wait for GT5 I started to realize that I didn't miss GT at all, I actually loved FM3, no real disappointments mostly pure fun.
Then I played GT5 and it was the other way around... I can't even believe it's made by PD.

 

[Superman_]

I've played all gran turismos (since the second) Sold my PS2 awhile ago. Bought the PS3 again this year in anticipation for Gran Turismo 5

Over the years I had a 360 and I owned both Forza 2 and 3. I have to say that Forza and the 360 controller makes for a good combination. Last week when I first played Gran Turismo 5 I realized the controls were not good at all... Especially after being used to the 360 controller and forza series..

So I bought a 360 to ps3 controller adapter along with a wired controller, remapped the controls to be similar to Forza 3. Now it's so much easier to to drive the vehicles, it almost feels as if I'm cheating. Rumble support is far superior as well. Only draw back is you don't have sixaxis on the 360 controller so you can't use it on every game. Can't wait to try this on a first person shooter though.

I highly recommend getting this adapter for anyone who is making the switch to the ps3 and getting gran turismo. just go to amazon and type in XCM cross battle adapter.

 

[donnie707]

QFT 👍

After waiting all this time for GT5, I can safely say that it one of the biggest disappointments of this generation. Yeah, premium cars look great (without the awful shadows spoiling them) and yeah, the physics are great...with a wheel. With a pad the driving sucks, and really, all GT5 has going for it is the driving.

• Racing against AI is awful, with the same on-rails crap we always had. You either win by a mile or struggle to even keep up.
• Standard cars look poor and best, and at their worst, just like PS2 models (oh wait...)
• Menus are badly designed, and the music...
• Same-old progression system, just putting in levels to meet this time.
• Sound is still weak
• Difficulty is woefully inconsistent
• The shadows and shimmer are awful. Prologue looked better and cleaner.
• No hood cam while driving...WTF?
• Unable to change or paint wheels on standard cars
• Can't paint cars a certain colour until you bought a previous car of that particular colour, and even then it costs you...stupid idea.

I don't know what they did for 6 years - maybe just worked on the premium cars and their handling, forgetting there needs to be a game in there. All this crap from Kaz now about "this is only the beginning"...er, yeah, you're right - couldn't get much worse as a start. The whole game just feels like it is stuck in a time warp.

All this "if you are a real sim racing fan you wouldn't care about this or that" is rather short-sighted. For one, neither GT5 or Forza 3 are sims. They are games that give the impression you are driving a car - BIG difference. GT5 may nail the actual driving, but as a game it sucks. Never again am I going to fall for such hype and promise.

So yeah, I made the switch. One week and about 25 hours into GT5, I sold the machine I bought at launch just for Gran Turismo and am now having loads of fun with Forza 3 - it's a much better GAME, with far more exciting races, cars you actually want to own, and swift progression. Even better, if I just want to mess about, I can use any car on any track in single race mode. Actually, even better is the fact that it only cost £12.47 for 500 consistent cars, better environments, ability to change any part on ALL cars, ability to paint cars any colour and put any design on any of them...

Lesson learned.

you said right there: "all gt5 has going for it is the driving".....to me....that is the make or break for a game.....the driving in gt5 is is unparallel....it feels so natural.... just like the real thing. each car that ive driven irl handles just like it in the game. dont get me wrong...im HUGE on modding cars(i have a supratt IRL and love modding it)....but if the cars in forza dont even handle like their real life counter parts(all same drive train classes handles the same wtf)then that is where it counts the most......the driving. sure its nice to have a nice looking car in a race....but who gives a **** if it handles just like the next rwd car.

gt5 is the best console sim hands down....that seems to be a turn off for ppl who just wants to get into a game without putting any real effort into learning how to drive.....gt5 has a steep learing curve(if you actually drive like your suppose to and not play the game like a destruction derby)...it can be VERY rewarding the sensation you get when youve knocked a whole second off your last lap and youre in the zone....no other driving game jas given me that feeling except for the gt series.....it is hands down the best sim racer out there....and again...that might not be for everyone...so to each his own