Is this it?

[MeanElf]

@breyzipp you need to step away from your longterm GT relationship, and buy a competitors game to finally open your eyes and realize how oudated GT has become...

He did say that he bought FH2 on an XBOne.

...and i certainly wouldn't spend 400 bucks on a console for it like i used to do.

Just a thousand or so on a gaming PC plus regular upgrades instead?

 

[mister dog]

He did say that he bought FH2 on an XBOne.

I was talking in general.

 

[breyzipp]

Sony have a great thing in the PS4 but if they have nothing compelling in this market at the moment and I think PD has failed long enough now to realise they can no longer be relied upon to be the definitive driving game for Playstation. I think it is time for Sony to either beg iRacing to come to Playstation or pay one of the better developers like iRacing or Kunos to make a real racing sim for PS4.

Well Dirt Rally feels pretty damn realistic to me (I play the XBox One version) and it's available on PS4 as well. Assetto Corsa supposed to be great on PC and comes to consoles on aug '16 too. And well, we can still wait 6 months and see what GT:S will turn out to be. If skid marks and dynamic grass will make it in that will be something already too (the single tone tarmac on other tracks than some parts of the Ring still annoys me a lot though, Forza does that incredably believable). On the positive side what I did like in GT:S was the spectators on the Ring. I think it's the first game that does that? Forza and GT6 both didn't have it I think.

sidenote : Assetto Corsa is also something I'm looking forward a lot to that too.

 

[ynot]

I used to play a lot of GT5 and GT6 but because PD didn't release a next gen title soon I made the "temporary" jump from PS3 to XBox One. Started with Forza Horizon 2 (great chill out game) and then Forza 6. Meanwhile got Project CARS and Dirt Rally as well on the XBox but all "temporary" because I thought I would eventually jump back to GT and buy a PS4 especially for it. I now play both Forza 6 and Dirt Rally a lot but I'm also looking forward to Assetto Corsa later this year (either PS4 or XBox One).

Now... I honestly don't know where to begin. This GTS unvealing of the last few days. From the gameplay videos I haven't seen anything that makes me want this game. Just at the time Forza 6 release the NASCAR expansion with the Miami-Homestead Speedway track, PD shows off this Northern Island Speedway. Now Homestead is certainly not one of my favorite tracks in FM6 but the graphics sure seem vastly superior than those of Northern Island. The asphalt even looks like a 1 tint texture from 10 years ago. Seriously, is this what we have been waiting for? Just now I also watched the facelifted Willow Springs video (one of my favorite tracks of GT6 that I really miss in FM6) and the same story here, the graphics don't look interesting at all and the interior of the R8 looks sub par. Are FM6 graphics that good to the point that my personal bar has been raised that high? Also the sound of the R8 or the 458 GT3 at the Nurburgring video, it's just pathetic.

The only thing that looked good to me are the close-up shots of the trailers (Mazda MX-5 from the old trailer) and I like the photoshoot locations to place cars. But.... that's it. Nothing that has anything to do with the racing itself.

Now I'm certainly not a FM6 fanboy, I really dislike Turn 10 and their pigheaded attitude with a passion and I was seriously looking forward to someday come back to PS4 and GTS. But there isn't anything that looks interesting. The PS4 is hands down the technically stronger console, I was so certain PD would show us something that blows FM6 out of the water. Seriously, what a huge disappointment.

Still, I *want* to like this game though and I want to move over to PS4 again, but... pfffff. Maybe I'm stuck with Turn 10 longer than I expected. Or maybe Assetto Corsa or Project CARS 2 at some point will be the games that really persuade me to make the step.

Pffff... certainly not feeling good about this.

No video game is going to please everyone. One person says it's the best thing ever and another say's it's the worst and how bad it is. You will have to wait until it is closer to release date to really tell. I will buy it for sure as I am so used to the GT interface and how the cars handle. I have Project Cars and Driveclub on PS4, tried The Crew and deleted it right away. Projects Cars and Driveclub were fun at first but I am back to GT6. GT6 is just a better game.

 

[breyzipp]

No video game is going to please everyone. One person says it's the best thing ever and another say's it's the worst and how bad it is. You will have to wait until it is closer to release date to really tell. I will buy it for sure as I am so used to the GT interface and how the cars handle. I have Project Cars and Driveclub on PS4, tried The Crew and deleted it right away. Projects Cars and Driveclub were fun at first but I am back to GT6. GT6 is just a better game.

Yes there is a lot of things I like in GT that I miss in Forza (like I said earlier, I hate Turn 10 and their pigheaded attitude with a passion). On the graphics and sound side, I don't miss anything from GT, Forza 6 does that far better. What I miss though is mainly things from the gameplay or the interface. For example dynamic weather and pit stop tyre choices, or the sorting and filtering options on the garage along with the stockyard. Forza 6 now officially has 605 unique cars since the NASCAR expansion and the garage can only hold 600 of them (no stockyard whatsoever). I mean how friggin rediculous is that? A game having more cars than the garage or storage can hold...

 

[ynot]

Yes there is a lot of things I like in GT that I miss in Forza (like I said earlier, I hate Turn 10 and their pigheaded attitude with a passion). On the graphics and sound side, I don't miss anything from GT, Forza 6 does that far better. What I miss though is mainly things from the gameplay or the interface. For example dynamic weather and pit stop tyre choices, or the sorting and filtering options on the garage along with the stockyard. Forza 6 now officially has 605 unique cars since the NASCAR expansion and the garage can only hold 600 of them (no stockyard whatsoever). I mean how friggin ridiculous is that? A game having more cars than the garage or storage can hold...

That is dumb about the number of cars. GT6 has what, 1500 now or something like that. Garage holds 500 I think it is. I have only 400+ cars and no others I want to buy. I bet I use 30 to 50 on a regular basis so the 500 limit works for me. Sounds are not that important to me as gameplay. Sounds are nice though don't get me wrong. Premium cars are not that important since I drive on hood view. Ease of use, drivability of the cars, ease of creating lobbies for our club to race in, being able to type messages in the lobby, and the community section are what I like. GT6 graphics are nowhere near Project Cars but it is the better game still. Got bored with PCars right away but still play GT6 for hours on end. Really looking forward to GT Sport and then GT7 to follow after that. They better not wait 2 years again for GT7 or the PS4 will be 4 years old by then.

 

[VXR]

Turn 10's pigheaded nature? Please elaborate, because I'm not sure they suffer with one. Stating that you expected PD to blow Forza out of the water when they're miles behind in several areas strikes me as more pigheaded.

 

[breyzipp]

Turn 10's pigheaded nature? Please elaborate, because I'm not sure they suffer with one. Stating that you expected PD to blow Forza out of the water when they're miles behind in several areas strikes me as more pigheaded.

Not sure where to begin. Okay. Many cars don't have a division so they can't be raced in the proper one, corner cutting not adressed, attempt to adress corner cuttting results in these ugly unrealistic barriers, pathetic wheel support, maps like Monza having faulty track limits, more unique cars available than there are places in your garage, completely broken credits system, SUVs banned from online play, VIP membership not rewarding enough, etc etc etc. The list really goes on and on.

Why do I call them pigheaded? Because the car divisions problem has been addressed by the community from day one on and it's in fact really easy to fix (just assign the proper cars to the proper divisions or create some new ones like 1930 Grand Prix, Daytona Prototypes, 1990s Grand Prix, 1990s IndyCar, etc etc). But no they just give us the middle finger, put some high priced expansion packs and DLCs on the market and make this big fanfare about the Apex Win10 spin-off. Meanwhile their so called community managers just play their own game on twitch instead of managing their community FFS. Yeah I really do hate them. I also play Codemaster's Dirt Rally, the community feedback from that CM is way better than the non existing one from Turn 10. I WANT GTS to blow FM out of the water yes so I can just put that chapter to rest, buy a PS4-4K and happily play GTS.

 

[Akouhi]

GTS last show was 50% developped announced K.Yamauchi ...

 

[breyzipp]

Well tbh this is a video that already looks a bit better than what I've seen so far :

https://www.gtplanet.net/exclusive-mazda-roadster-tackles-brands-hatch-in-gt-sport/

The tire screetching sounds decent (that is something that is really pathetic in Forza) and I like the evening sun lighting as well. Still far from making me want to buy the game though.

 

[AleksandarSRB]

Well Dirt Rally feels pretty damn realistic to me (I play the XBox One version) and it's available on PS4 as well. Assetto Corsa supposed to be great on PC and comes to consoles on aug '16 too. And well, we can still wait 6 months and see what GT:S will turn out to be. If skid marks and dynamic grass will make it in that will be something already too (the single tone tarmac on other tracks than some parts of the Ring still annoys me a lot though, Forza does that incredably believable). On the positive side what I did like in GT:S was the spectators on the Ring. I think it's the first game that does that? Forza and GT6 both didn't have it I think.

sidenote : Assetto Corsa is also something I'm looking forward a lot to that too.

GT6 have spectators when you select 24h course.

 

[Samus]

This 50% thing just isn't going to go away is it?

 

[breyzipp]

GT6 have spectators when you select 24h course.

Yes but I ment on the ring. I don't recall seeing spectators on the ring in FM6.

 

[UkHardcore23]

This 50% thing just isn't going to go away is it?

50/50

 

[Johnnypenso]

50/50

I think it's time to update your sig

 

[7HO]

Well Dirt Rally feels pretty damn realistic to me (I play the XBox One version) and it's available on PS4 as well. Assetto Corsa supposed to be great on PC and comes to consoles on aug '16 too. And well, we can still wait 6 months and see what GT:S will turn out to be. If skid marks and dynamic grass will make it in that will be something already too (the single tone tarmac on other tracks than some parts of the Ring still annoys me a lot though, Forza does that incredably believable). On the positive side what I did like in GT:S was the spectators on the Ring. I think it's the first game that does that? Forza and GT6 both didn't have it I think.

sidenote : Assetto Corsa is also something I'm looking forward a lot to that too.

Assetto Corsa is okay. Standard the graphics are not that great. It has nice FFB and the physics pass for a sim and are better than typical console racers but still not the best. Some people like the sounds but I don't. Other than driving physics and FFB it really doesn't have anything going for it and it gets boring pretty quickly. I occasionally use it for a hoon but I always get bored quickly. What I am interested in seeing is if the online servers on PS4 are good and if there is good racing on PS4. I haven't been able to find any good online racing in Assetto Corsa yet and that is disappointing considering I can often find fun pickup racing still in Race07.

For people who don't PC sim race they might have no idea what they are missing out on and I guess that is an important consideration because many people have no idea how good sim racing can really be and how many modern PC sim racing features are missing from console games. Things like tracks that rubber in and heat up realistically as the car passes over it, that is the thre rubber goes on and the heat goes into the track realistically where the tyres make contact. Realistic marbles, dirt and other items going onto the track, collecting on tyres and being thrown back off onto the track. Dynamic weather conditions and sun/shadow modelling based on reality that has a realistic impact to track temperatures with shadowed parts being cooler than parts in direct sunlight which effects grip based on the rubber build up. Realistic damage modelling, realistic collision modelling although no one has completely nailed these some are very good. And new features are appearing all the time. Admittedly no sim has everything yet but some are getting close.

The difference between these sims and the typical GT style console game is in GT you are kind of driving something like a car you dream about and you quickly bump your way to the front without consequence and then hotlap at the front, there is no racing, there is no rush, it's just another racing game. But in these other sims it is a simulation, it is like the real thing, it is racing, it is intense, there are consequences to mistakes, there is so much more to think about and things like weather and track conditions will effect your setup race to race just like in real life. Winning is an achievement. The real victory is running a good clean race and it doesn't matter where you finish especially in a good race with good battles. After a great race the sweat is dripping off you and you are incredibly excited about the battles you had and your result, you are pumped because it was intense. Or maybe you get crashed out by someone else and you feel like you would if this happened in real life. There is just no comparison.

 

[Johnnypenso]

Assetto Corsa is okay. Standard the graphics are not that great. It has nice FFB and the physics pass for a sim and are better than typical console racers but still not the best. Some people like the sounds but I don't. Other than driving physics and FFB it really doesn't have anything going for it and it gets boring pretty quickly. I occasionally use it for a hoon but I always get bored quickly. What I am interested in seeing is if the online servers on PS4 are good and if there is good racing on PS4. I haven't been able to find any good online racing in Assetto Corsa yet and that is disappointing considering I can often find fun pickup racing still in Race07.

For people who don't PC sim race they might have no idea what they are missing out on and I guess that is an important consideration because many people have no idea how good sim racing can really be and how many modern PC sim racing features are missing from console games. Things like tracks that rubber in and heat up realistically as the car passes over it, that is the thre rubber goes on and the heat goes into the track realistically where the tyres make contact. Realistic marbles, dirt and other items going onto the track, collecting on tyres and being thrown back off onto the track. Dynamic weather conditions and sun/shadow modelling based on reality that has a realistic impact to track temperatures with shadowed parts being cooler than parts in direct sunlight which effects grip based on the rubber build up. Realistic damage modelling, realistic collision modelling although no one has completely nailed these some are very good. And new features are appearing all the time. Admittedly no sim has everything yet but some are getting close.

The difference between these sims and the typical GT style console game is in GT you are kind of driving something like a car you dream about and you quickly bump your way to the front without consequence and then hotlap at the front, there is no racing, there is no rush, it's just another racing game. But in these other sims it is a simulation, it is like the real thing, it is racing, it is intense, there are consequences to mistakes, there is so much more to think about and things like weather and track conditions will effect your setup race to race just like in real life. Winning is an achievement. The real victory is running a good clean race and it doesn't matter where you finish especially in a good race with good battles. After a great race the sweat is dripping off you and you are incredibly excited about the battles you had and your result, you are pumped because it was intense. Or maybe you get crashed out by someone else and you feel like you would if this happened in real life. There is just no comparison.

For pickup racing the newly created Sim Racing System offers continuous races in several car/track combinations with driver rating systems under development. Any server that has "MR" (Minorating) attached also offers up it's own driver rating system. Race2Play has really good racing on AC in my experience. Champion Motorsports organizes some really good races. Right now they are running an Historics series with the Porsche 550A mod at Bridgehampton for example. RaceDepartment also organizes racing in AC. Tons of options.

 

[Imari]

I think you should not judge Gtsport on an early build especially in the visual department.

They just held a PR event specifically so that people could judge the game.

This 50% thing just isn't going to go away is it?

As someone else said, 50% is the new placeholder.

 

[Aggserp4]

I don't play any other racing games apart from GT but I've tried a few and it really looks like it's falling behind. Even console simulator games, such as the F1 series, are much better in the realism department. What @7HO said is true and I really hope GT Sport becomes a full-blown simulator at last. I don't care about the lack of cars really. They said it's going to be an e-Sports oriented game and therefore 140 cars is an okay number. As for the technical limitations I'm pretty sure the PS4 is capable of handling all those simulation aspects. Even the PS3 was capable as proven by the aforementioned F1 series.
I think it's time for GT to turn into the "real driving simulator" that it's supposed to be.

 

[7HO]

For pickup racing the newly created Sim Racing System offers continuous races in several car/track combinations with driver rating systems under development. Any server that has "MR" (Minorating) attached also offers up it's own driver rating system. Race2Play has really good racing on AC in my experience. Champion Motorsports organizes some really good races. Right now they are running an Historics series with the Porsche 550A mod at Bridgehampton for example. RaceDepartment also organizes racing in AC. Tons of options.

I'll have a look but like I said I get bored with Assetto Corsa quick because the sim is so lifeless. The track isn't really dynamic and the only good track options are the ones that don't get ridiculously grippy like old. Other than half decent physics and nice FFB, oh and awesome gravel traps, it doesn't have anything going for it and it is just disappointing now after playing much more realistic sims.

 

[crowhop]

Ditching on GT Sport sighting graphical doubts is going to look foolish. GTS will look great. All GT games look great.

My question is the actual GAME:

Are they seriously still using that same tire squeal noise? It is nails on a chalkboard for me by this point. After having played Assetto Corsa, Project CARS and even iRacing, that tire noise is far and away my biggest complaint with the entire GT Series.

Also, what of the physics? Will the game offer elite, next-level sim physics? I have serious doubts.

And, finally, what of the racing? Will the AI be any good at all? GT has been historically inept at making decent AI to race against. Has this changed?


The game will look great and be visually beautiful. Of that I have no doubt.
But will it actually be worth playing?

 

[imported_traind]

I'll have a look but like I said I get bored with Assetto Corsa quick because the sim is so lifeless. The track isn't really dynamic and the only good track options are the ones that don't get ridiculously grippy like old. Other than half decent physics and nice FFB, oh and awesome gravel traps, it doesn't have anything going for it and it is just disappointing now after playing much more realistic sims.

One feature that Assetto Corsa (AC) has in spades-- at least as far as PC sims-- is a great road car selection. Only Simraceway compares in selection on PC but AC is current and still being improved while Simraceway seems to have fallen away.

AC also has laser scanned tracks-- not a plus vs iRacing but against most sims it is. And the modding community is in full force with AC-- if you like mods.

 

[RodolphoPNeto]

This 50% thing really bothers me.

If you have the world watching your steps and a whole community counting the days to buy your product, you can't release something that is "ok" or "fine".

Everyone here is thinking "it's only 50%, it'll be better". That might be the case, but it's not the best first impression for something this big. Perhaps the best way to go would be to blow everyone's head off?

And it wouldn't take too much to do that either - gfx and sound on par with the competition (not better, "as good as"), + damage and livery editor would be enough for that. Still hoping for the best, let's see.

 

[7HO]

All GT games look great.

Which GT game looks great? I think none of them look great compared to modern games. I think they all look terrible now and I seriously doubt GTS will look good for anything other than the intros or photo mode which I completely skip.

One feature that Assetto Corsa (AC) has in spades-- at least as far as PC sims-- is a great road car selection. Only Simraceway compares in selection on PC but AC is current and still being improved while Simraceway seems to have fallen away.

AC also has laser scanned tracks-- not a plus vs iRacing but against most sims it is. And the modding community is in full force with AC-- if you like mods.

Unfortunately I don't have a lot of interest in the road car selection and I don't think it is all that great as most of the cars I would want to drive are missing and I pretty much stick to the BMW's. I'm into the racing simulation side of things so I'm into race cars and I think the road cars drive rubbish.

I think it is cool that AC has laser scanned tracks but I wish they would put a bit more effort into completing them, I guess you get what you pay for and AC doesn't have the userbase to build great tracks cheap and AC is a cheap game compared to something like IR. Perhaps when it is on console if lots of people buy it they will spend more time to give it more polish. As far as mods go most of them are disappointing, even some of the official content is disappointing

 

[dacc10]

Which GT game looks great? I think none of them look great compared to modern games. I think they all look terrible now and I seriously doubt GTS will look good for anything other than the intros or photo mode which I completely skip.

GT games usually look great compared to other games in the same generation of consoles... In this generation, as far as I know, it will probably be beaten only by Driveclub.

Unfortunately I don't have a lot of interest in the road car selection and I don't think it is all that great as most of the cars I would want to drive are missing and I pretty much stick to the BMW's. I'm into the racing simulation side of things so I'm into race cars and I think the road cars drive rubbish.

But that's what this game is all about, the mix between road and race cars. It's more about the car culture in general rather than just racing focused game. There will always be lacking some race cars, and the same happens to road cars.

 

[7HO]

GT games usually look great compared to other games in the same generation of consoles... In this generation, as far as I know, it will probably be beaten only by Driveclub.

Have you seen Forza lately? I'm pretty confident that Forza and PCARS will both look better and I wouldn't be surprised if Assetto Corsa even looks better.

But that's what this game is all about, the mix between road and race cars. It's more about the car culture in general rather than just racing focused game. There will always be lacking some race cars, and the same happens to road cars.

We are talking about GT Sport not GT7. The thing that makes GT Sport not a prologue and worthy of being considered a full featured stand alone title is the FIA racing esports side of it. I guess that is where the difference of opinion is coming from, some people want this to be GT7 but it isn't GT7, it is GTS. I personally want GTS to take the esports thing seriously and not be an arcade racer. The Gran Turismo name has a lot of strength to it and it has the potential to launch sim racing as an esport and I fear they will instead launch arcade racing as a esport, I guess if they do it that way then at least they have a fair claim to being ground breaking because iRacing is already an esport with big dollar world championships and TV broadcasts of events but iRacing is a sim and I am not aware of any arcade racer that is an esport. Personally I was hoping for the FIA association to bring some seriousness to the racing but what I saw the other day was a joke, the same old bumper car racing and pathetic live race officiating and very low driving standards that are equal to the lowest levels of rookie racing in a real sim.

 

[TeamCZRRacing]

Which GT game looks great? I think none of them look great compared to modern games. I think they all look terrible now and I seriously doubt GTS will look good for anything other than the intros or photo mode which I completely skip.



Unfortunately I don't have a lot of interest in the road car selection and I don't think it is all that great as most of the cars I would want to drive are missing and I pretty much stick to the BMW's. I'm into the racing simulation side of things so I'm into race cars and I think the road cars drive rubbish.

I think it is cool that AC has laser scanned tracks but I wish they would put a bit more effort into completing them, I guess you get what you pay for and AC doesn't have the userbase to build great tracks cheap and AC is a cheap game compared to something like IR. Perhaps when it is on console if lots of people buy it they will spend more time to give it more polish. As far as mods go most of them are disappointing, even some of the official content is disappointing

GT1 and 2 look great for PS1, GT3 and 4 look great for PS2, GT5 and 6 (at least, premium cars and tracks) look great for PS3.

 

[dacc10]

Have you seen Forza lately? I'm pretty confident that Forza and PCARS will both look better and I wouldn't be surprised if Assetto Corsa even looks better.



We are talking about GT Sport not GT7. The thing that makes GT Sport not a prologue and worthy of being considered a full featured stand alone title is the FIA racing esports side of it. I guess that is where the difference of opinion is coming from, some people want this to be GT7 but it isn't GT7, it is GTS. I personally want GTS to take the esports thing seriously and not be an arcade racer. The Gran Turismo name has a lot of strength to it and it has the potential to launch sim racing as an esport and I fear they will instead launch arcade racing as a esport, I guess if they do it that way then at least they have a fair claim to being ground breaking because iRacing is already an esport with big dollar world championships and TV broadcasts of events but iRacing is a sim and I am not aware of any arcade racer that is an esport. Personally I was hoping for the FIA association to bring some seriousness to the racing but what I saw the other day was a joke, the same old bumper car racing and pathetic live race officiating and very low driving standards that are equal to the lowest levels of rookie racing in a real sim.

From what I've seen, in Forza cars look "plastified" to me, don't know if it's the lighting engine, if it's the textures, but they look kind of weird to me. Someone with PCars will be able to compare both games, but from what I've heard, they look good at the same level, that maybe one looks better in some things and the other in others. So yeah, the only game that clearly beats GTS and all it's competitors is Driveclub, the rest is pretty much even between them.

But then, if it was only focused on racing, a great percentage of the players wouldn't bother to buy it. A great part of the GT fanbase comprises casual players, who don't have time to invest in the game so they can be "professional" sim racers. Then, you have those that don't have enough money to buy a wheel. Some of them play these games just because they love cars, to drive some of their dream cars, etc. The moment you scrap road cars from a GT game, you loose a huge part of the community.

 

[gtracedriver1]

Which GT game looks great? I think none of them look great compared to modern games. I think they all look terrible now and I seriously doubt GTS will look good for anything other than the intros or photo mode which I completely skip.



Unfortunately I don't have a lot of interest in the road car selection and I don't think it is all that great as most of the cars I would want to drive are missing and I pretty much stick to the BMW's. I'm into the racing simulation side of things so I'm into race cars and I think the road cars drive rubbish.

I think it is cool that AC has laser scanned tracks but I wish they would put a bit more effort into completing them, I guess you get what you pay for and AC doesn't have the userbase to build great tracks cheap and AC is a cheap game compared to something like IR. Perhaps when it is on console if lots of people buy it they will spend more time to give it more polish. As far as mods go most of them are disappointing, even some of the official content is disappointing

Last gen GT was miles ahead of anything of its time. In fact I would say the attention to detail is still right up there will current games if not more



Sure the GTS trailer was not OMFG. Infact from the newer build available from day2, day3. It was better than the trailer videos, Green hell trees have been updated and in the trailer they were using the older build for gameplay trailer

Let us wait for the dev to add everything. It is still WIP. Hopefully at E3 we will see at least see a more polished trailer. Something like this would be great

 

[FordGTGuy]

From what I've seen, in Forza cars look "plastified" to me, don't know if it's the lighting engine, if it's the textures, but they look kind of weird to me. Someone with PCars will be able to compare both games, but from what I've heard, they look good at the same level, that maybe one looks better in some things and the other in others. So yeah, the only game that clearly beats GTS and all it's competitors is Driveclub, the rest is pretty much even between them.

But then, if it was only focused on racing, a great percentage of the players wouldn't bother to buy it. A great part of the GT fanbase comprises casual players, who don't have time to invest in the game so they can be "professional" sim racers. Then, you have those that don't have enough money to buy a wheel. Some of them play these games just because they love cars, to drive some of their dream cars, etc. The moment you scrap road cars from a GT game, you loose a huge part of the community.

All the cars in Forza are designed to look waxed.

Believe it or not but a waxed car can definitely resemble shiny plastic, that doesn't mean it is shiny plastic.