Islam - What's your view on it?

[BHRxRacer]

So @BHRxRacer, all 200 of those men were getting it on? That must have been one hell of an orgy.

I'm sure you country must allow gay marriage then, otherwise gays would never be allow to have sex.

I'll respond to that when you move out of Texas.

 

[Chrunch Houston]

I'll respond to that when you move out of Texas.

Texas doesn't arrest gay men for having sex - no state does.

 

[BHRxRacer]

Texas doesn't arrest gay men for having sex - no state does.

Can gay people marry in Texas?


Not sure whether to laugh or cry right now at this hypocrisy.

 

[Chrunch Houston]

Neither does Bahrain.

If only married people can legally have sex, and gay people can not be married, then any gay couple that has sex is breaking the law, and is subject to arrest.

In the U. S. you don't have to be married to have sex legally. So even in parts of the country where gay marriage is not legal, gay sex is.

 

[BHRxRacer]

If only married people can legally have sex, and gay people can not be married, then any gay couple that has sex is breaking the law, and is subject to arrest.

In the U. S. you don't have to be married to have sex legally. So even in parts of the country where gay marriage is not legal, gay sex is.

Read the edited post. I edited it within seconds of posting it when after I re-read your post. Not sure you got the old one so quick, then relied 5 whole minutes later.

 

[Spurgy 777]

False. People caught engaging in a non-martial sex party were arrested. Being homosexual had nothing to do with it. There isn't a special law regarding them. Once again, Bahrain has no homophobic laws. Produce a citation or take back what you said.

So you're trying to argue that Bahrain doesn't have homophobic laws, just incredibly stupid ones that happen to make any gay sex illegal? And is not allowing gays to marry not homophobic?

 

[Chrunch Houston]

.

 

[BHRxRacer]

So you're trying to argue that Bahrain doesn't have homophobic laws, just incredibly stupid ones that happen to make any gay sex illegal? And is not allowing gays to marry not homophobic?

Well first of all that would make 91% of countries in the world homophobic, not just Bahrain. Not sure what you try to prove by singling Bahrain out.

Second of all, if you'd like to argue same sex marriage, make a thread about it.

 

[Spurgy 777]

Well first of all that would make 91% of countries in the world homophobic, not just Bahrain. Not sure what you try to prove by singling Bahrain out.

Well, to some degree, yes actually but were talking about Bahrain, so I'm singling out Bahrain.

Second of all, if you'd like to argue same sex marriage, make a thread about it.

That would be a very short argument, so it's not worth a new thread, and we've already covered it in the homosexuality thread.

 

[BHRxRacer]

Well, to some degree, yes actually but were talking about Bahrain, so I'm singling out Bahrain.



That would be a very short argument, so it's not worth a new thread, and we've already covered it in the homosexuality thread.

It would be a very short argument indeed but I'd rather not get into it.

As to Bahrain, I just find it hilarious that someone from Texas would criticize another country for not legalizing gay marriage. In any case, I think banning same sex marriage and homophobia have nothing to do with each other. Like I said though, I'd rather not get into it.

 

[Chrunch Houston]

Read the edited post. I edited it within seconds of posting it when after I re-read your post. Not sure you got the old one so quick, then relied 5 whole minutes later.

I quoted your first post and noticed the change. It makes no difference to my argument. Gay guys and gals are GETTING IT ON in the great state of Texas - and the government is doing nothing to hunt them down and trying to stop them! Unlike... This is what they mean, when they say the land of the free.

 

[BHRxRacer]

I quoted your first post and noticed the change. It makes no difference to my argument. Gay guys and gals are GETTING IT ON in the great state of Texas - and the government is doing nothing to hunt them down and trying to stop them! Unlike... This is what they mean, when they say the land of the free.

Land of the free*

*Terms and conditions apply; gay marriage not included.

 

[Spurgy 777]

It would be a very short argument indeed but I'd rather not get into it.

Glad you agree that gay marriage should be legal everywhere

As to Bahrain, I just find it hilarious that someone from Texas would criticize another country for not legalizing gay marriage. In any case, I think banning same sex marriage and homophobia have nothing to do with each other. Like I said though, I'd rather not get into it.

Did he say it was fine in Texas? And even if he thought gays shouldn't marry, why can't he still criticize the fact that that indirectly makes gay sex illegal in Bahrain?

 

[Joel]

Land of the free*

*Terms and conditions apply; gay marriage not included.

Don't cut yourself on that edge.

 

[BHRxRacer]

Did he say it was fine in Texas? And even if he thought gays shouldn't marry, why can't he still criticize the fact that that indirectly makes gay sex illegal in Bahrain?

"You don't throw rocks when your house is made of glass". Is that how you say it in English?

Don't cut yourself on that edge.

I'm sorry I don't understand what you mean.

 

[Chrunch Houston]

Land of the free*

*Terms and conditions apply; gay marriage not included.

I guarantee you do not want to compare personal freedoms with an American.

Here in Texas you can create the equivalent of marriage with just a few contracts.

Not only can you enter into those signed agreement, you can have all the sex you want. And it is all legal.

How about there? Shut up and go to bed.

 

[BHRxRacer]

I guarantee you do not want to compare personal freedoms with an American.

Here in Texas you can create the equivalent of marriage with just a few contracts.

Not only can you enter into those signed agreement, you can have all the sex you want. And it is all legal.

How about there? Shut up and go to bed.

I'm sorry I called you out on your hypocrisy.

 

[Chrunch Houston]

I'm sorry I called you out on your hypocrisy.

I know we don't agree - sorry for telling you to shut up - I am going to bed.

You are wrong though.

 

[Spurgy 777]

"You don't throw rocks when your house is made of glass". Is that how you say it in English?

Yes, but it doesn't apply here, not only are your laws worse than Texas, which says a lot, he can just as easily attack Texas for the same reasons if he wants to. The fact that he happens to live their is meaningless, it's not like he makes the laws. The only way he would be a hypocrite is if he defended not allowing gays to marry in Texas, but then saying they gay marriage should be allowed in Bahrain, which he hasn't done.

 

[BHRxRacer]

not only are your laws worse than Texas

That's subjective/debatable.

Yes, but it doesn't apply here, , which says a lot, he can just as easily attack Texas for the same reasons if he wants to. The fact that he happens to live their is meaningless, it's not like he makes the laws. The only way he would be a hypocrite is if he defended not allowing gays to marry in Texas, but then saying they gay marriage should be allowed in Bahrain, which he hasn't done.

Um. It would be like Ferrari making fun of Mclaren for producing **** cars. They didn't say they're doing any better themselves...

 

[Spurgy 777]

That's subjective/debatable.

With regards to the laws were discussing, not really, unless you can think of non-religious reasoning (or in other words just reasoning) as to why gay marriage shouldn't be allowed, and why gay sex should effectively be made illegal under any circumstance.

Um. It would be like Ferrari making fun of Mclaren for producing **** cars. They didn't say they're doing any better themselves...

You don't get the point, Chrunch doesn't make the laws in Texas, therefore he's not a hypocrite for criticising similar laws elsewhere. In your example, Ferrari are the ones making their own bad car, which would make them hypocrites if they criticised other teams bad cars.

 

[BHRxRacer]

You don't get the point, Chrunch doesn't make the laws in Texas, therefore he's not a hypocrite for criticising similar laws elsewhere. In your example, Ferrari are the ones making their own bad car, which would make them hypocrites if they criticised other teams bad cars.

Ok, how about a Ferrari fan making fun of a Mclaren fan because the latter's favourite team has been making **** cars?

Look, we don't really disagree on anything here so let's ignore it. I just think people should fix flaws in their own system first before criticizing others for having the same flaws. At least Bahrain isn't pretending to be "land of the free".

 

[Spurgy 777]

Ok, how about a Ferrari fan making fun of a Mclaren fan because the latter's favourite team has been making **** cars?

Another swing and a miss, that would only be true if Chrunch supported the law in Texas, try another analogy.

Look, we don't really disagree on anything here so let's ignore it. I just think people should fix flaws in their own system first before criticizing others for having the same flaws. At least Bahrain isn't pretending to be "land of the free".

Well it seems we disagree on whether gay marriage should be allowed, and whether pre-marital sex should be legal, although it's hard to tell, because you seem to enjoy being awkward and vague. And according to your logic, I can criticise you on both because they're both legal in this country, lucky me. Also, what's stopping Chrunch for criticising the law in both Bahrain and Texas?

 

[BHRxRacer]

Another swing and a miss, that would only be true if Chrunch supported the law in Texas, try another analogy.



Well it seems we disagree on whether gay marriage should be allowed, and whether pre-marital sex should be legal, although it's hard to tell, because you seem to enjoy being awkward and vague. And according to your logic, I can criticise you on both because they're both legal in this country, lucky me. Also, what's stopping Chrunch for criticising the law in both Bahrain and Texas?

I'm running out of energy for the day.

We don't disagree that pre-marital should be legal. Everybody does it here anyway. Hell, freaking prostitution is in your face here, and nobody really does anything about it. Ideally, I don't think anything should be banned. Regulation > banning.

I am a little vague because I don't want to share all of my beliefs. I share one tiny part, and everybody starts a misquoting rampage.

 

[Famine]

@BHRxRacer - you're dissembling the issue to confuse it.

In Bahrain, two homosexuals can't legally have sex because sex isn't allowed outside marriage and homosexuals can't marry each other.
In Texas, two homosexuals CAN legally have sex, because sex IS allowed outside marriage and whether or not homosexuals can marry isn't relevant to that notion (though they can't and they ought to be able to).

Since homosexuals aren't allowed to have sex in Bahrain, that makes Bahrain's laws more homophobic than Texas's - which allow them to have sex, but (just like Bahrain) not marry one another.

 

[BHRxRacer]

@BHRxRacer - you're dissembling the issue to confuse it.

In Bahrain, two homosexuals can't legally have sex because sex isn't allowed outside marriage and homosexuals can't marry each other.
In Texas, two homosexuals CAN legally have sex, because sex IS allowed outside marriage and whether or not homosexuals can marry isn't relevant to that notion (though they can't and they ought to be able to).

Since homosexuals aren't allowed to have sex in Bahrain, that makes Bahrain's laws more homophobic than Texas's - which allow them to have sex, but (just like Bahrain) not marry one another.

More homophobic, less homophobic. They're both homophobic by your definition.

And no I'm not disassembling it. I'm just saying there isn't a special place in hell/prison in Islam/Bahrain for homosexuals.

I believe premartial sex should be legal for gays and straights. Marriage is a different issue. The definition of "marriage" is father, wife and their biological children. That's how the word came about, and that's how religion sees it. Atheist "marriage" is just as laughable as homosexual marriage. If you want to have kids, nobody should stop you. If you're gay and you'd like to adopt kids, go through the adoption agency's tests. If you'd like some kind of a legal binding to cover custody and what not, don't call it "marriage". That's my opinion. Happy?

 

[Azuremen]

And no I'm not disassembling it. I'm just saying there isn't a special place in hell/prison in Islam/Bahrain for homosexuals.

Just a general place simply because they are that.

 

[Famine]

More homophobic, less homophobic. They're both homophobic by your definition

Or any definition. Now let's look at what you actually said:

Bahrain has no homophobic laws.

Guess you were wrong. It has them - and it has more of them than Texas. You've admitted both things, so let's move on.

And no I'm not disassembling it. I'm just saying there isn't a special place in hell/prison in Islam/Bahrain for homosexuals

That'll be exactly what dissembling is. People took issue with you saying:

Bahrain has no homophobic laws.

when it clearly does. Since then you've been talking around other points, including bringing in Texas marriage laws, to entirely disguise the fact you said this false statement.

That's what dissembling is. Recognising that this original statement was inaccurate would be of benefit to you.

I believe premartial sex should be legal for gays and straights.

Good. I'll assume you didn't leave out other groups on purpose.

Marriage is a different issue. The definition of "marriage" is father, wife and their biological children. That's how the word came about, and that's how religion sees it.

Oooh, wrong on both counts. The word predates religion and merely means "to provide with a husband or wife". It doesn't mention genders or children.

Just because some religions have come in and redefined it doesn't mean they get to pretend it never meant anything else.

Atheist "marriage" is just as laughable as homosexual marriage.

I'm an atheist. I got married.

If you want to have kids, nobody should stop you. If you're gay and you'd like to adopt kids, go through the adoption agency's tests. If you'd like some kind of a legal binding to cover custody and what not, don't call it "marriage".

Given that marriage is the provision of a husband (and this word means "houseowner") or wife (and this word means "vagina") and there's no mention of children, anyone who signs a contract (thus requiring a consenting partner) that endows them with a husband or a wife can call that occasion a "marriage".

That's my opinion.

Doesn't mean it's right, justifiable or supportable. See this link for more.

Happy?

Perpetually. My wife and children too, laughable though they are.

 

[KSaiyu]

Technically speaking, pre-marital sex is illegal here (gay or straight). I disagree with that. I think it's ridiculous to force people into certain lifestyles. However you'd be surprised to know that they never actually enforce that law, or any of those annoyingly strict laws that you may bring up. Here:
http://bahrain.shafaqna.com/researches/item/590-top-10-sin-cities-in-the-world.html

Wait...

False. People caught engaging in a non-martial sex party were arrested. Being homosexual had nothing to do with it. There isn't a special law regarding them. Once again, Bahrain has no homophobic laws. Produce a citation or take back what you said.

Just homophobic interpretations of them then?

 

[BHRxRacer]

Or any definition.

Nope. Not by my definition.

Now let's look at what you actually said:Guess you were wrong. It has them - and it has more of them than Texas. You've admitted both things, so let's move on.

Nope, nope and nope. But yeah let's move on.

That'll be exactly what dissembling is. People took issue with you saying:when it clearly does. Since then you've been talking around other points, including bringing in Texas marriage laws, to entirely disguise the fact you said this false statement.

I did not. He claimed Bahrain bans gay sex (exclusively) and thus it's homophobic. The first part is wrong, so the second part follows.

Oooh, wrong on both counts. The word predates religion and merely means "to provide with a husband or wife". It doesn't mention genders or children.

Did I say it doesn't predate religion? Tricked you keeping count of the conclusions you jump to?

Husband and wife, not husband and husband. It doesn't have to mention children, it's implied. Oh wait that's right, nitpicking. Let's make a truth table for everything.

Just because some religions have come in and redefined it doesn't mean they get to pretend it never meant anything else.

What did it mean then, before the 20th century?

Given that marriage is the provision of a husband (and this word means "houseowner") or wife (and this word means "vagina") and there's no mention of children, anyone who signs a contract (thus requiring a consenting partner) that endows them with a husband or a wife can call that occasion a "marriage".

Do gays have vaginas? Can they "marry" then by that definition?

For the record I never implied can't get married by the original non-religion definition.

Doesn't mean it's right, justifiable or supportable. See this link for more.

It doesn't have to be

Perpetually. My wife and children too, laughable though they are.

Give my best to them.

Just homophobic interpretations of them then?

Does that include banning gay marriage? If so, then yes it's "homophobic".

edit

Forgot to quote something from @Famine

If by other groups you mean incest marriage and necrophiliac marriage, yes I left those two out on purpose.