Joking and banter with the opposite sex in relationships question

[lbsf1]

Hi guys.

I had a conversation with my Ex today about stuff and the topic of banter came up. She was saying about how her boyfriend was being mean to her, I said she shouldn't take that, she replies with the "nah, its just banter" line.

The rest of the conversation insued with her adamant that her boyfriend being mean is just banter, and that banter is normal and good. Me on the other hand doesn't like banter, I used to get bullied and the bullies say "oh its just banter" when it wasn't. I personally think that if you are with a girlfriend and love her then you shouldn't be mean even jokingly, I think you should always be truthful but never mean banter. I'm not saying you shouldn't joke around with like funny stories, wrestling and stuff, I couldn't live without that kinda joking about, but I just don't like "banter" and playful insults.


Am I right to assume from the above conversation that I am a "nice guy" (the ones who get friendzoned constantly) because I don't enjoy banter in relationships?

I then came up with this example to kind of describe the situation, which she said she kinda agreed with.

I have finally understood "nice guys finish last", guys like me who don't like banter believe we are the "nice guys" because we think banter is kinda mean and thus see guys who banter as "mean guys", but most girls like banter so don't see the "nice guy" as a nice guy in reality and see the "mean guy" as a nice guy. (The terms nice and mean guy are from the "nice guys" perspective)

Opinions please??

Sorry if this makes little sense however I have kinda confused myself with this issue for a couple of years and this conversation has cleared a few things up in my mind and I want to finally get it fully sorted out in my head.

 

[Minty]

People like different things from different people in different kinds of relationships. Your first mistake is assuming that there is any one definition of a "nice" guy or a "mean" guy. There are people out there who are just hurtful and abusive, but that's a different story entirely. Personally, I think the entire idea of feeling bad about being stuck in the "friendzone" is ridiculous. If you're friends with someone of the opposite sex and you can't just be happy with that, maybe the reason people get "stuck" in that situation is because that kind of mentality doesn't exactly scream "mature enough for a committed relationship".

I'll admit, I went through a point where I was down about being stuck in the "friendzone", but after finally letting go of the ridiculous notion that this was the universe punishing me for being a "nice guy", it was pretty easy to just move on. And now she's one of the closest friends I have, and has actually been my wing(wo)man on several occasions. Granted, not to much success, but that was on me.

"Nice guys finish last" is nothing more than a phrase used by people who don't realize that it's on them to find someone who shares a mutual feeling, rather than just constantly being "nice" and just giving up when that's not enough.

 

[PeterJB]

It seems that these days there are people who think they can get away with saying anything by labeling it as banter. I only think it counts as banter if both sides are enjoying it.

 

[W3H5]

Treat 'em mean, keep 'em keen.

Someone had to say it.

 

[Exorcet]

Hi guys.

I had a conversation with my Ex today about stuff and the topic of banter came up. She was saying about how her boyfriend was being mean to her, I said she shouldn't take that, she replies with the "nah, its just banter" line.

The rest of the conversation insued with her adamant that her boyfriend being mean is just banter, and that banter is normal and good. Me on the other hand doesn't like banter, I used to get bullied and the bullies say "oh its just banter" when it wasn't. I personally think that if you are with a girlfriend and love her then you shouldn't be mean even jokingly, I think you should always be truthful but never mean banter. I'm not saying you shouldn't joke around with like funny stories, wrestling and stuff, I couldn't live without that kinda joking about, but I just don't like "banter" and playful insults.

If you were the were "the victim" of the banter and you didn't like it, then you would be right. You're not though, so your friend is right. She's fine with it so there is nothing wrong. 99% of the time the best way to treat a woman is like anyone else.

Am I right to assume from the above conversation that I am a "nice guy" (the ones who get friendzoned constantly) because I don't enjoy banter in relationships?

You're you. You will be compatible with some people and not compatible with other people, all to varying degrees.

 

[Azuremen]

Am I right to assume from the above conversation that I am a "nice guy" (the ones who get friendzoned constantly) because I don't enjoy banter in relationships?

You get friendzoned because you aren't romantically interesting but aren't a bad person. This notion that nice guys get friend zoned is simply idiocy, and generally "nice guys" just finding an excuse to complain about why they aren't getting girls.

The reality is "nice guys" don't get girls because they are generally beta and try too hard to always be agreeable. Sorry, the "yes" man type doesn't attract that many intelligent/interesting girls because it is predictable and boring. And, as @Minty mentioned, being upset because you're in the friendzone is sign maturity is lacking, and maybe indicates a bit of desperation.

As for banter (weird UK English) it is a pretty healthy part of most relationships in my experience. Being able to dryly tell your girl "you're an idiot" when she does something daft removes the feeling of walking on eggshells all the time. It can also be hilarious.

 

[W3H5]

I'm in agreement with Cody (he's always right anyway).

If you treat your girl as a friend, as she should be in a good relationship, then there is nothing wrong with commenting in negativity.

If my wife ask me to do something I don't want to I say "bollocks, you do it." And follow with a chuckle. That doesn't mean I'm being nasty to her and in turn she doesn't see it as such. I give her a reply I would give to any of my friends who would take it in just the same humorous way.

Being polite and proper might work on a date but in daily life with a partner there is no need to be formal. As Cody mentioned, it can create awkwardness which is unnecessary and can be avoided with a bit of 'banter'*.

*Ive never heard 'banter' used in this way before. I would use it to refer to a neutral chat, not something negative or derogatory.

 

[lbsf1]

Thanks for your advice guys. I have no problem with doing the kind of stuff you said, eg the Ex in question works in a shop but CANNOT count change for her life, so I joked around with that a little, that kind of stuff I agree is normal.

What I'm more talking about is in a situation like she was in yesterday where. I asked her if she had a chilled day out, she said "no, he was being mean to me", but then says that she and most girls like a guy being mean to them?? This to me just kind of goes past making occasional jokes, its a guy being an arse to the girl on purpose to the point where she felt that it effected how the day went.

I probably went a bit overboard with the whole "nice guy finishes last" stuff, I was a little emotional at the time of posting it.

I have spoken to a couple of really close female friends (they are brilliant at translating female feelings into words that guys understand). She disagreed with the idea that girls like guys who are make jokes/comments a lot, she said occasional witty stuff is good, but just casual jokes the whole time is not cool. Which is what I was thinking also.

About the term banter, I didn't know if it was also a US term, but it seems not . The way I was using it was to describe just when people (normally group of guys) just make derogatory jokes about each other, I'm not a massive fan of it because it normally ends up in someone getting peed off and then the others going "chill man, its just banter". If you have ever seen The Inbeetweeners TV show the type of jokes they are making about each other is the type of banter I'm talking about. Normally only guys really do it.

 

[INEEDNAWZZZ]

Generally, younger girls tend to go for the more douchey, 'mean' types for the thrill of it; someone who's spontaneous, to-the-point and direct. Even if it means they themselves are at the result of it. Most eventually grow out of it and want a more sensible guy who is a lot more straightforward; seems to me this girl is going through that stage at the moment.

One person I know is in a relationship and yet I've never seen him give her any form of affection or complement, just throwing banter at one another. And yet, they've happily been together for the past 3 years. Seems to me this girl entered this relationship with that mindset in mind, but is now pretty sick of it.

 

[Danoff]

"Banter" examples needed.

 

[Brend]

You get friendzoned because you aren't romantically interesting but aren't a bad person. This notion that nice guys get friend zoned is simply idiocy, and generally "nice guys" just finding an excuse to complain about why they aren't getting girls.

The reality is "nice guys" don't get girls because they are generally beta and try too hard to always be agreeable. Sorry, the "yes" man type doesn't attract that many intelligent/interesting girls because it is predictable and boring. And, as @Minty mentioned, being upset because you're in the friendzone is sign maturity is lacking, and maybe indicates a bit of desperation.

As for banter (weird UK English) it is a pretty healthy part of most relationships in my experience. Being able to dryly tell your girl "you're an idiot" when she does something daft removes the feeling of walking on eggshells all the time. It can also be hilarious.

I totally agree with you on all accounts here. Me and my girlfriend can constantly rip the crap out of each other and because we are in no way shape or form 'worried' or 'scared' of offending the other person it's goddamn hilarious.

 

[lbsf1]

Generally, younger girls tend to go for the more douchey, 'mean' types for the thrill of it; someone who's spontaneous, to-the-point and direct. Even if it means they themselves are at the result of it. Most eventually grow out of it and want a more sensible guy who is a lot more straightforward; seems to me this girl is going through that stage at the moment.

One person I know is in a relationship and yet I've never seen him give her any form of affection or complement, just throwing banter at one another. And yet, they've happily been together for the past 3 years. Seems to me this girl entered this relationship with that mindset in mind, but is now pretty sick of it.

Yeah, the first bit would make sense, she is 16 and I'm 18. It really worried me when she just straight off said to me "Well, you will have trouble finding a girl who doesn't like banter", when refering to her bf who had been playfully insulting her supposedly most of the afternoon. If some people enjoy constant banter that's cool, but yeah, hopefully as I go to uni in the Autumn there will be more who just want the occasional joke and more affection instead.

Edit: By the way, I'm not some boring sod who doesn't laugh. I love messing about but just don't like personal banter.

 

[Azuremen]

Yeah, the first bit would make sense, she is 16 and I'm 18.

Well there is the first problem. Neither of you know what the hell you're doing.

Edit: By the way, I'm not some boring sod who doesn't laugh. I love messing about but just don't like personal banter.

Pretty much every time I've heard someone claim this, they actually are boring. Given the fact you got a little "emotional" because of a friend mentioning personal banter being part of her relationship, I think you just need to be a bit less sensitive, or at least worry less in general about girls.

 

[Danoff]

"Banter" examples needed.

...because I think there is some misunderstanding of the word. Some guys are genuinely mean to their girlfriends, it's not banter if it's really hurtful. If it's banter, it is inherently, by definition, fine.

Note that nobody is talking about "joking" as mentioned in the thread title, as being an issue. Obviously joking is healthy behavior.

 

[Speedy Samurai]

If she laughs and likes it, no harm done. If she is hurt, it's not 'just banter'.