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[Boz Mon]

Me and one of my friends have been having a friendly competition between us for about a month now. The current competition is you can use any car but the budget is $100k for car/parts/oil change. I have been working on it a bit but I cant seem to get a good car. We are having the race at seattle circuit. So far, I have an S2000 which is my best car, I can only get a 1:33.xxx with it. I also have a Supra RZ which has a bit too much power, at least I think. And finally an FD RX-7 which is decent. I need to get my lap times down around 1:29.xxx. So I need some opinions on what cars to use. I am a better driver than him, but he seems to be able to tune the car better for his liking. If I use his car, I can put up a better lap than him. I also do not know what car he is using yet....

Edit: I just remembered, any and all Miatas are not allowed, as well as either of the Opel Speedsters

 

[PF]

I'd look at ... oh jeez, this is tough.
I would divide this problem into tunes based on the car price (eg, 10 mile NSX) against those based on tuning price (eg, Evo 92 + the dog's bollocks).
Sadly, I do not have the skill to answer this question, so would look to the clever people on this forum to sort it out. As you have done. Good luck amigo. Pls update if possible.

 

['92_NSX_Type_R]

Well for the S2000 I do have a tune that will get very very good lap times, If you Want I can PM it to you.

 

[Boz Mon]

That would be awesome if you could PM me that tune 👍

 

[Duke]

For that price range, I'd say pick up the used '96 Corvette Gran Sport, add racing suspension and sticky tires, spend the rest of the money reducing weight, and go to town on him.

 

[PARAGON GT]

There isn't much that you couldn't build with a 100K budget.

A '99 R34 is a nice choice as is the Lotus 190 Sport.
Both cars have tremendous potential. And with the proper tuning can pull some amazing lap times. (especially the Lotus)

 

[Boz Mon]

Good ideas guys. I had some other questions too.

1. whats an average lap time for Seattle for a car of this caliber?
2. Should I go with high HP or just go for the handling route?
3. should I even consider the supra or the FD? Both have well over 400hp but wheelspin is killer in lower gears.

My suspension tuning is my downfall, I can drive but my tuning sucks.

Edit: what is "the dogs bollocks?"

 

[Loon]

Good ideas guys. I had some other questions too.

1. whats an average lap time for Seattle for a car of this caliber?
2. Should I go with high HP or just go for the handling route?
3. should I even consider the supra or the FD? Both have well over 400hp but wheelspin is killer in lower gears.

My suspension tuning is my downfall, I can drive but my tuning sucks.

Edit: what is "the dogs bollocks?"

Not sure about the lap times, but Seattle is really nothing but right angle corners for the most part, with straights in between. Have you thought about an EVO? I imagine it would work great there. And even if the wheelspin is a bit of a problem, it'll still be fast since it's AWD.

 

[Duke]

1.) Dunno.

2.) You'll need a little of both handling and power, because Seattle has some loooooong straights. You can't afford to neglect either.

3.) Supra, no, FD, yes. I've never had a big-power Supra handle worth anything.

4.) You don't want to know.

 

[Tornado]

Used Esprit would be a good option as well, and any used NSX similarly. If you want to get crazy you can use a used TVR, but they are shifty and crazy handling at places like Seattle.

 

[Boz Mon]

what do you guys think are the parts that I HAVE to buy? I was thinking at least, sticky tires, trans, suspension, possibly a spoiler, and brakes?

 

[Duke]

That's a good start, but don't buy brakes unless you find braking to be a problem. LW1 is a real bargain, because losing weight helps everywhere.

 

[Tornado]

In some cases the only thing you will need is a spoiler, sticky tires and lighter weight. If you aren't that good with tuning, I wouldn't suggest spending money on the suspension as that will eat up a quarter of your budget by itself. Only worry about transmission if you are having trouble with traction or run out of RPM before the end of either of the two big straightaways (or if you have money left over), because the full racing tranny is expensive as well.

 

[Green_Flag]

buy a viper and give it a race exhaust and a race chip

 

[Boz Mon]

I bought an EVO RS TME and worked it a bit. The best I could do was a 1:33.8 which is a shave slower than my current best in the S2k. I also bought a skyline and worked it a bit and got a fastest time of 1:32.4xx which is now my current best time. Now I will try an NSX and hopefully a Corvette GS will pop up

@ 92 NSX, I could still go for that S2000 tune. Thanks in advance

 

[Austin343]

I have a couple crazy ideas... there are two particular bargain cars I'm thinking of that should perform reasonably here. If you can drive it, the Buick Special has enormous power for 58,000. But I think an even better car would be the 33,xxx Cr. HPA Golf R32. Add a turbo to that thing and you have yourself a powerful 4WD monster.

I suspect that the used cars may still end up being faster, though, since the depreciation is so ridiculous.

 

[Duke]

I thought the HPA Golf was going to be a blast, and it is a bargain, but boost lag makes it practically undrivable.

 

[Tornado]

If you can drive it, the Buick Special has enormous power for 58,000. But I think an even better car would be the 33,xxx Cr. HPA Golf R32. Add a turbo to that thing and you have yourself a powerful 4WD monster.

Something as dowdy as a Camaro SS with a spoiler could probably take both of those cars. The HPA has a terrible power curve, and the Buick drives like a Buick.


Oh, and what about a Camaro SS? Strap on a supercharger, stage two lighten it, add racing hards and a spoiler and you got mean machine with about $40,000 still left over.

 

[Boz Mon]

I got some updates, issues, and general concerns. First off, I tested about 5 cars today.

1. Evo RS TME-had the balls to go but pushes like mad on exit. In the small amount of time I drove it, I got a 1:33.8xx

2. 99 Skyline R-34- this is probably going to be my fallback if my 1st choice falls through. It pushes a bit but I could probably correct it. Best of 1:32.7

3. Honda NSX- I spent all but $1190 on it, and it just doesnt have the balls to go Bah, 1:38.1

4. The S2k tuned by '92_NSX_TypeR. Great all around car but once again, no balls. I need more speed

This is where this car comes in. It has power, and decent handling, but needs some fine tuning. What is it? The Ford Mustang Cobra R. I managed a 1:31.8 with it. With some tuning, and driving style changes I can get a good time with this car.

There is one issue...I figured out what my competition is. Just as Duke suggested, he is using the Corvette Grand Sport. I drove it too. Not just a GS, THE GS that he will be using against me in our competition. It seems like it handles better than my Cobra. Turn in is effortless, and push is minimal. His BEST lap with it so far is a 1:30.8 so I need to shave just over a second from my best time to beat him. I think its doable. So any other opinions about the general situation, or tips on getting the ole cobra to handle?

Edit: I forgot to add, one of the rules that we decided on, along with no Miatas, and Opel Speedsters, you cannot use any special model cars, so the volkswagen you guys are discussing is out

 

[Duke]

The VW would be non-competitive anyway. It understeers like a barge on the throttle and the boost goes out for a sandwich and then comes back from lunch like a sledgehammer. It might be fine for a drag racer but it's useless as a road racer.

The Cobra R is one of my favorite cars and I get along well with it, but you may have better luck overbuilding a Camaro SS. They can be had for DIRT cheap on the used lots and they are not expensive new. They can make huge power for not much money and they handle well with the lower tiers of suspension work. Try one of those with mid-grade suspension, LW2, and then spend the rest on power and a wing.

Do you have a tire limitation, or is that only by budget? Each tire grade should be worth about a second on Seattle.

On the Cobra, I haven't really tinkered with mine in GT4. I would imagine lowering it a bit - but not slammed - and stiffening up the swaybars at both ends would help. Most of your benefit is going to come from driving it the way it likes to be driven:

• Brake hard ina straight line and let up at turn in
• Coast a bit to let it settle
• Feed the power back after you unwind most of the steering

It seems to like one input at a time, and it doesn't mind sliding around a little. One other thing it might need is a transmission - it's geared incredibly tall. In fact, in GT3 I ran the entire PD Cup in one without ever going above 4th gear. You may want to try the close ratio trans, or the full race trans with a steeper final drive.

 

[Boz Mon]

It seems to have the power for the tranny, I think it gets into 5th gear by the end of the straight. The only tire limitation is budget, and because the car is so expensive (almost 40 grand) that doesnt leave much for tires, suspension, tranny, and engine work. The wheelspin in the lower gears is not as much as I thought it would be. That being said, I think it might be the stock trans that is helping me by being very long with the lower gears keeping me from spinning out.

If a Camaro pops up in the used cars sometime soon, I will try that too, but this cobra seems like it may be the car to use, especially after driving the competition. I need a solid second to be at the time to beat. I think I can do this

 

[Tornado]

The Camaro SS new is only $22,000. Waiting for the Z28 to pop up would be a waste, as it wouldn't be as powerful or handle as well; nor would it be particularly cheaper.

 

[Boz Mon]

I'll look into that... This mustang is starting to make me angry. I moved some parts around so I could buy the semi close trans, and it seems like that made me slower. This thing is plowing on corner exit slowing me down a lot. I dont know what to do about it. My new best is 1:31.5xx down .3xx. It has the power, I just cant get it to handle worth a crap. Heres a rundown of what I have done to the car

Soft tires
racing suspension
weight stage 1 and 2
racing chip
racing flywheel
oil change
NA tune 1
semi close trans
semi racing exhaust

I will see what that camaro will do but if anyone has a tune for this car, I would gladly accept it

 

[Duke]

Negative camber up front - 2 to 3 degrees. Also, soften the front dampers in rebound, and maybe consider a stiffer rear swaybar.

 

[Tornado]

Stock, the Camaro understeers rather heavily, but here is something that might help you out with that.

Due to how cheap power parts are for the Camaro and how cheap it is to buy, you could probably nearly go all out parts wise with plenty left over for handling (probably get it over 550 BHP with $50,000 left over).

 

[Rotary Junkie]

The Camaro loves understeering.

That said, try setting the ballast balance to 50 with no ballast, and running something like 11.6 front and 9.0 rear springs. 2.5 degrees of front camber, 0.5 rear.

It should help. It's a nose-heavy car, work to get weight off the nose. Setting the ride height nose-high may also help some.

 

[Tornado]

I'm starting to wonder how much of an effect the Camaro's understeer would even have at Seattle. Maybe the uphill right after the intersections, but otherwise most of the other corners seem to slow or downforce oriented to make much difference.

 

[Rotary Junkie]

I'm starting to wonder how much of an effect the Camaro's understeer would even have at Seattle. Maybe the uphill right after the intersections, but otherwise most of the other corners seem to slow or downforce oriented to make much difference.

Remember that thread you linked to?

Yeah... I had massive problems with understeer at New York and Seattle is much the same just with jumps and more elevation change.

 

[Tornado]

Seattle has a lot more high speed corners, though. I dunno, really. Just thinking aloud.

 

[PARAGON GT]

I still say look for an Elise 190 sport. It's ultra light and handles like its on rails.
I'm sure that its higher price tag is more than compensated by its handling ability.

Or the '92 NSX Type-R is good in the corners too . . . Although at 44.xxx credits, it might be a little too steep for the budget.

I'd love to give both of them a shot, but right now I'm 17 hours into the 24 Hours at Sarth 1 endurance race.
And as interested as I am to see which car would be faster . . . I have a little too much time invested in my current race. (It's my first one ran completely in A-spec)