My Contribution for a better driving behaviour!! (How GTS should be played)

[JacksHerer]

Correct me if I am wrong but in F1, you can change line ONLY 2 times (MAXIMUM) in a straight.

I thought it was only once when defending, more than once against the same car is weaving.
If the move is done so late that the attacker has to brake to avoid collision because they are so close when you make the move that they can't move around you - then that would be blocking.

 

[Lord Grey]

I thought it was only once when defending, more than once against the same car is weaving.

You're right about moving once to defend, but I think you're also allowed one move to return to the racing line if you moved off it to defend.

 

[JeffR]

I thought it was only once when defending, more than once against the same car is weaving.
If the move is done so late that the attacker has to brake to avoid collision because they are so close when you make the move that they can't move around you - then that would be blocking.

After reading a lot, you can move twice. 1 to defend, 1 to take the corner before the braking point.

 

[DriftMethod]

You're right about moving once to defend, but I think you're also allowed one move to return to the racing line if you moved off it to defend.

More than one change of direction to defend a position is not permitted. If a driver has moved off the racing line while defending their position, they may move back but must ensure there is at least one car’s width between their own car and the edge of the track.

 

[Lord Grey]

More than one change of direction to defend a position is not permitted. If a driver has moved off the racing line while defending their position, they may move back but must ensure there is at least one car’s width between their own car and the edge of the track.

Great clarification, thanks!

 

[JulesDennis]

More than one change of direction to defend a position is not permitted. If a driver has moved off the racing line while defending their position, they may move back but must ensure there is at least one car’s width between their own car and the edge of the track.

True but this is an F1 rule.In other racing series its not exactly the same -for various reasons-.GTS is not build around F1 rules but either way I know that if you move direction 1000 times during defending,the game penalty system will not give you any penalty for doing so (in fact I cannot recall any title that will punish you for doing something like that).

 

[DriftMethod]

True but this is an F1 rule.In other racing series its not exactly the same -for various reasons-.GTS is not build around F1 rules but either way I know that if you move direction 1000 times during defending,the game penalty system will not give you any penalty for doing so (in fact I cannot recall any title that will punish you for doing something like that).

Correct on the F1. Sorry, I should've quoted JeffR who mentioned the F1 rule and I was clarifying it. Also why I made it one giant link to the F1 site.

Although you won't immediately get a penalty for doing it, GT Sport etiquette video specifically mentions "weaving back and forth to block the path of other cars is prohibited." The general idea of multiple blocking moves is fairly widespread in motorsports. We can now create grief reports for misconduct, so there could be a penalty of some sort from PD.

 

[JulesDennis]

Correct on the F1. Sorry, I should've quoted JeffR who mentioned the F1 rule and I was clarifying it. Also why I made it one giant link to the F1 site.

Although you won't immediately get a penalty for doing it, GT Sport etiquette video specifically mentions "weaving back and forth to block the path of other cars is prohibited." The general idea of multiple blocking moves is fairly widespread in motorsports. We can now create grief reports for misconduct, so there could be a penalty of some sort from PD.

This is speculation mate (if they somehow give a"penalty" after a report).
I know that during a race this kind of "defending" does not get punished because I've seen it with my own eyes.

 

[DriftMethod]

This is speculation mate (if they somehow give a"penalty" after a report).
I know that during a race this kind of "defending" does not get punished because I've seen it with my own eyes.

I agree that we have no idea what, if anything, PD might do with those grief reports, but at least they are getting feedback of unsportsmanlike conduct.

As far as not being punished that you've seen, I'm assuming you mean in a real life race, because obviously some people get away with virtual murder in game. I definitely won't defend the actions (or inactions) of all the race marshals/stewards, but even though it's not always punished, doesn't exactly make it acceptable. This is not unique to motorsports. We've all seen questionable calls in sports and there are even grey areas of the rules that require an interpretation, but that doesn't mean we should do anything that isn't immediately punishable. Didn't people already get banned by PD for other forms of abuse?

No disrespect, but are you saying that it's ok to block by weaving or are you just pointing out that it's a flawed system?

 

[SkinnyJ82]

Need to translate that into french, Italian and Spanish

They speak Portuguese in Brazil!

 

[JulesDennis]

No disrespect, but are you saying that it's ok to block by weaving or are you just pointing out that it's a flawed system?

I ment the second one off course.

 

[fastone371]

They should also teach people the appropriate time to attempt a pass. Just because you can pull your front bumper up to the rear bumper of the car in front doesnt mean you are faster and should attempt making passes at every corner. You will both go much faster if the behind driver follows and waits for a mistake to make a pass, odds are both will not run a perfect race, even losing a little momentum in a corner can be an opening for the behind driver to get by. There are also places where passes shouldnt be attempted at racing speed, like the first chicane at Monza, yet someone always thinks he can pull off a pass there because they were able to make up 2 feet of distance under braking.

 

[Mirror_man]

They should also teach people the appropriate time to attempt a pass. Just because you can pull your front bumper up to the rear bumper of the car in front doesnt mean you are faster and should attempt making passes at every corner. You will both go much faster if the behind driver follows and waits for a mistake to make a pass, odds are both will not run a perfect race, even losing a little momentum in a corner can be an opening for the behind driver to get by. There are also places where passes shouldnt be attempted at racing speed, like the first chicane at Monza, yet someone always thinks he can pull off a pass there because they were able to make up 2 feet of distance under braking.

of course!

 

[Mirror_man]

This thread has some time (not many).. but as I think it´s always actual...

So it came to my mind to ... "revive it"...

As I guess that driving etiquette is again being forgotten... or dis-considered.... mostly...

 

[GTWelsh]

clean racing !

(Just rewatched, this is actually a mixture of really nice clean racing, small mistakes and some impatience from the people you can see. On the whole from my point of view I think I did well apologised for the contact at the end, was all cool about it )

 

[Mirror_man]

From time to time, I get the conclusion that more people need to read something close to the information I´ve compiled and Published in this Thread!


An this is one of those times!


So, following my instincts, I comment it, so that it comes active and may call the attention to it´s content, and may be useful to those interested in ti (it´s content)!


I hope that those who take a look at it, find what they were looking for, or then simply find something that may interest them!

Additional comments are very welcome also!!

 

[NotThirdReich]

In a contribution to help achieving a more correct driving behavior in GTS... (if we all did like this... we would all love to race online with GTS.. I´m pretty sure...) And... Believe when I say that you will not feel that you´ve just lost your time, if you use it to read these documents... (and learn something more...)

I - 1st pileup of recommended reading( with illustrative images), sincerely I think it is worth to loose just a bit of your time and attention getting some racing behavior instruction...

1st: How to properly overtake and defend your position in Formula 1 :

https://www.topgear.com.ph/news/rac...vertake-and-defend-your-position-in-formula-1

2nd: F1 Metrics - The rules of racing:

https://f1metrics.wordpress.com/2014/08/28/the-rules-of-racing/
II - With the same intention... additionally... 2nd pileup with some rules applied on well know virtual racing lobbies...

1st - in Live for Speed:

Overtaking
O-1: To obtain right of road position in a corner, the overtaker's car must have substantial overlap of the car that is being overtaken, before they reach the corner's turn-in point. Should the overtaking car not have enough overlap, the leading car may resume its racing line without fear of contact.

O-2: The car on the outside has the right to outside room all the way through the corner – right up to the exit point. That car should not be squeezed against the outside towards the exit point.

O-3: The car on the inside has the right to inside room all the way through the corner - right up to the exit point. That car should not be squeezed against the inside towards the apex area. The ahead driver can still battle for the position of course but must do so while maintaining side room for the behind driver. The practice of going up the inside of an ahead car after that car has already turned in, and where there was no established substantial overlap before the turn-in point, is sometimes referred to as barge passing, (i.e. you barge your way past). Understand that barge passing is a high risk manoeuvre for both you and others. You have no rights what-so-ever as a barge passer.

O-4: Where an ahead driver has clearly made a sufficient error to warrant a passing move, a behind driver may attack their position, with due caution and care, regardless of whether there was any pre-existing overlap. E.g. - If the ahead driver brakes too late and drifts out wide of the apex and then has to reduce speed etc. This would be a valid passing opportunity regardless of whether there was pre-existing overlap. However, there is still substantial responsibility on the overtaking driver to take all necessary care to avoid contact. Small errors by the ahead driver may not be sufficient to justify an attacking passing move however. Just because the ahead driver gets a bit out of shape at times does not give you an automatic right to pass uncontested by them or a right to room. You still have to judge if their error provides sufficient opportunity for a safe pass to take place.

O-5: Ahead drivers have the right to choose any line down a straight. The ahead driver may make one move to block the opposing car, and one move to return to the racing line before the next corner - Unless the opposing car has overlap.

O-6: Ahead drivers have the right to take any line through a corner, unless an opposing car has overlap.

Contact
CT-1: Even if the above rules are adhered to at all times, contact between cars is always a possibility.

CT-2: If a driver has breached one of the Rules of Racing, and has resulted in contact and/or a time or position advantage. That driver must apologize, and forfeit the position to the affected driver. If the affected driver is unable to continue, sufficient action should be encouraged at the Server Admin's discretion.

CT-3: If a driver who has breached one of the Rules of Racing is most affected by the incident, this driver has no right to claim any form of position or compensation for this error.

CT-4: Behind drivers are expected to anticipate the possibility that ahead drivers may have longer braking zones, and can make mistakes. Behind drivers should drive accordingly, always maintaining separation.

CT-5: The behind driver has a responsibility to not run into the back of a ahead driver. The ahead driver does not have to try to avoid you. If all else fails, the behind driver should run their own car off the track to avoid such a collision.

CT-6: Malicious or inappropriate braking or slowing is strictly prohibited.


2nd-GT Planet rules for GT6 Online Races:

05: Rules Governing Car Contact:

A: Contacts and collisions must be avoided at all costs.

B: Pushing other cars in turns or pushing them off the track is strictly prohibited.

C: Leaning on other cars is strictly prohibited in any situation.

06: Running into the car ahead of you:
A: The behind driver must take all necessary care and responsibility not to run into an ahead driver.

B: In case you brake too late for a corner or partially lose control of your car, but can prevent an accident by steering into the dirt, grass or a wall, you are expected to do so.

C: The ahead driver must not do any malicious or inappropriate braking or slowing. Leading cars MUST NOT EVER 'brake check' the car(s) behind them because they are following too closely. The ahead driver IS entitled to be slower or use longer and earlier braking zones than others. They are also entitled to turn in earlier or later and/or apex earlier or later.

07: Contact Concessions:
A: If there's contact between drivers that results in the guilty driver making up places on the innocent driver, the guilty driver should immediately allow the innocent driver to pass freely to re-establish their position. This rule should be observed, even if it means the guilty driver has to allow drivers not involved in the incident to pass while waiting for the driver they contacted.

B: If the appropriate contact concession is carried out by the guilty driver then they may avoid or reduce the severity of any penalties that might otherwise apply.

C: If the appropriate contact concession is not carried out by the guilty party then the usual penalties would apply.

D: If you have to slow down to let the other player through, move out of the racing line first before you slow down. Coming to a full stop is not allowed, just continue at a lower pace until the other driver passes you again.

08: Corner Rights:
A: When approaching the turn/apex of turn, the car which "holds" the inner side of turn has entrance-advantage and other driver(s) must refrain from endangering him by his actions.

B: You must establish substantial overlap with the car ahead before they reach the corner's turn-in point to have the right to drive up their inside, or to expect them to leave inside room for you. At least the front of your car should be up to the driver's position in the ahead car. The ahead driver has the right to be fully committed to the racing line of their choice without any interference if there was no substantial overlap before he turned in.

C: If sufficient overlap is established before the turn-in point, then the behind driver has the right to sufficient side room. The ahead driver must also leave sufficient side room for the behind driver. This means that each driver has a right to their respective "line", or side of the track, right up to the exit point. Neither driver should squeeze the other toward the inside or outside of the corner during the apex or exit.

D: If an ahead driver has clearly made an error to warrant a passing move, a behind driver may attack their position, with due caution and care, regardless of whether there was any pre-existing overlap. However, the overtaking driver must still avoid contact. Small errors by the ahead driver may not justify a passing move. The ahead driver getting a bit out of shape at times doesn't give you an automatic right to pass. You still have to judge if their error allows for a safe pass to take place.

E: Drivers who are using PS3/4 controllers MUST make additional effort in driving due to the fact they can't use side-view, and their perception of the other cars is thereby limited - extreme caution while maneuvering is required. If you are using a controller, you are required to set buttons up for side views as "I didn't see you." is not an excuse if you collide with another driver when racing.


III - On the same theme (more or less..): 3rd pileup of recommended reading:

1st: The-road-racers-guide-to-passing-etiquette;

https://www.windingroad.com/articles/blogs/the-road-racers-guide-to-passing-etiquette/


2nd: Don´t be that guy... the Divebomber!!:

https://www.windingroad.com/articles/blogs/wrr-tv-dont-be-that-guy-the-divebomber/



I sincerely hope it may help those who need to know how it should be the correct altitude for GTS players racing online...

I know it´s only a Game... but even so, it helps.. to understand the way we should try to behave... and to know the things we should keep in mind, and above all: - Respect...

If we all try to follow a bit closer to these "ideas" I´m very sure that driving online with GTS would became a true pleasure for all of us!! (even when we loose or fail... as we´re only Humans!!!)

These are good rules to follow. But isn't Grand Touring different from Formula 1? Because if I remember, Grand Touring is not instant penalization for contact, right? While F1 is most likely your car is out if you contact since it's open wheels right? Correct me if I'm wrong on anything please! Thank you.

 

[simsimsheree]

Two short videos was a joke by Kaz...

If he had cared one damn thing about clean racing, there would have been a ton of challenges about clean overtaking, not weaving, and avoiding contact before you were allowed online in Sport Mode (but allowed online in the open lobby system, so the poor dirty drivers could still get their jollies bashing into people rather than the AI!).

But, guess what..? Nothing. Two videos.

Kaz wants your money. And restricting the dirty (who seem to be the vast majority) wouldn't exactly earn him much.

 

[TT92]

I have said this previously so I will repeat myself here.

The way to encourage better driving is to have a fair penalty system. The way it is at the moment it is just plain wrong.

Punishing the front car because some idiot doesn't know where/how to brake is IMHO just ridiculous.

The game already knows where the braking , entry and exit points of a corner are in the track. Just turn on driving line assists and see that Kaz has very nicely put orange cones at these points. So, if the trailing car makes contact with the lead car inside these zones then it should be their fault *unless there is a 50% overlap* prior to the start of the corner.

With turn 1 incidents then just the first car (the initial instigator) gets penalised and so the remaining ricocheted vehicles are just innocent bystanders to the pile up. Their race is already compromised so further penalisation is pointless (and unnecessary IMHO). Although ghosting could take some of the sting out of this.

The whole point is with an arcade game like this that idiots and children play with hand controllers you will never be able to educate them enough so they can drive properly, therefore, there needs to be a penalty system to "weed out" these types so others can actually have a proper race. Oh and before anyone says anything about the ranking system, I race with all the top ranks and they are some of the worst offenders! The Kamikaze attitude of some of the Asia/Pacific region players I am grouped with you would swear that WWII and the Battle of the Coral Sea is still in full flight ;-)

Also, how many times have any of you been in a Daily and a third of the field hasn't even got a qualifying time? I know I have. So what chance do the rest have at turn one when these people already think they can just jump in a random car/track/tyre combination and be competitive from the first lap? Talk about a recipe for disaster at T1!!!

Just by instigating (and refining) just a few small changes like this and the whole game would be transformed.

My $0.02 worth

 

[Mirror_man]

These are good rules to follow. But isn't Grand Touring different from Formula 1? Because if I remember, Grand Touring is not instant penalization for contact, right? While F1 is most likely your car is out if you contact since it's open wheels right? Correct me if I'm wrong on anything please! Thank you.

Dude. this is mostly a guideline with examples from several areas of Racing, real and online...

Not the rules to be followed... These are mostly suggestions for anyone driving correctly, educated, clean and sportively! Filled with not only good but excellent examples...

And of course you are right!

Two short videos was a joke by Kaz...

If he had cared one damn thing about clean racing, there would have been a ton of challenges about clean overtaking, not weaving, and avoiding contact before you were allowed online in Sport Mode (but allowed online in the open lobby system, so the poor dirty drivers could still get their jollies bashing into people rather than the AI!).

But, guess what..? Nothing. Two videos.

Kaz wants your money. And restricting the dirty (who seem to be the vast majority) wouldn't exactly earn him much.

Of course, Sheree! If not all of that.. most of that.. surely... (the money.. mostly...) but we never know.. a miracle may come up someday.. like a lightning striking his soul... meanwhile al we can doo is brag about it, and give suggestions to people behave correctly.. also some of these rules are applied in private lobbies... for example...

I have said this previously so I will repeat myself here.

The way to encourage better driving is to have a fair penalty system. The way it is at the moment it is just plain wrong.

Punishing the front car because some idiot doesn't know where/how to brake is IMHO just ridiculous.

The game already knows where the braking , entry and exit points of a corner are in the track. Just turn on driving line assists and see that Kaz has very nicely put orange cones at these points. So, if the trailing car makes contact with the lead car inside these zones then it should be their fault *unless there is a 50% overlap* prior to the start of the corner.

With turn 1 incidents then just the first car (the initial instigator) gets penalised and so the remaining ricocheted vehicles are just innocent bystanders to the pile up. Their race is already compromised so further penalisation is pointless (and unnecessary IMHO). Although ghosting could take some of the sting out of this.

The whole point is with an arcade game like this that idiots and children play with hand controllers you will never be able to educate them enough so they can drive properly, therefore, there needs to be a penalty system to "weed out" these types so others can actually have a proper race. Oh and before anyone says anything about the ranking system, I race with all the top ranks and they are some of the worst offenders! The Kamikaze attitude of some of the Asia/Pacific region players I am grouped with you would swear that WWII and the Battle of the Coral Sea is still in full flight ;-)

Also, how many times have any of you been in a Daily and a third of the field hasn't even got a qualifying time? I know I have. So what chance do the rest have at turn one when these people already think they can just jump in a random car/track/tyre combination and be competitive from the first lap? Talk about a recipe for disaster at T1!!!

Just by instigating (and refining) just a few small changes like this and the whole game would be transformed.

My $0.02 worth

Of course, you´re right, TT! But as the Penalization system keeps heading the wrong way (getting worse mostly everytime it is updated...) we have mostly 3 ways...

1st stop playing Sport Mode
2nd play Sport Mode the way we hate the others to play and become real good at it...
3rd Play Sport Mode as it should be played and keep trying that bit by bit people will come to sense and understand that their racing atitude is wrong...

I´m on the 3rd choice... but have already been thinking on following the 1st... as the 2nd... is not me.. simply... that would be giving up trully...

 

[Bojador]

From time to time, I get the conclusion that more people need to read something close to the information I´ve compiled and Published in this Thread!


An this is one of those times!


So, following my instincts, I comment it, so that it comes active and may call the attention to it´s content, and may be useful to those interested in ti (it´s content)!


I hope that those who take a look at it, find what they were looking for, or then simply find something that may interest them!

Additional comments are very welcome also!!

Since you asked, and I understand this may require a lot of effort, having some video examples of actual GTS races with good and bad examples to discuss, say on a weekly/bi-weekly basis, would be a great addition to this subject and would allow people like me to better understand if we are in fact behaving properly on the track or not.

Thanks for the articles btw. Very informative!

 

[simsimsheree]

Simply put, there is no way for a game to have the same penalties as real racing.

A) technically, it's impossible. I doubt even a supercomputer could keep track of 30 cars or so, and figure out who had overlaps, who dive-bombed, who brake checked, who weaved down a straight, who made multiple blocks...

B) there's no real world consequences. No team is going to drop you, no steward is going to black flag you, nobody has to pay for repairs, nobody ends up in hospital with millions in debts. And nobody dies.

So, let's just forget about real world rules.

But I can tell you what worked, in room after room, year after year in GT5 and GT6. We had the cleanest racing, night and day, year after year...

3 simple rules:

ALL contact is the fault of the trailing car.
ALL contact that ends in gain of position, the immediate self-penalty is to return the position, as soon as it is safe to do so.
Only one move to block (no Verstappening!), no weaving.

That's all it takes. Remove the advantage to contact (the gain in position) and you remove the incentive.

Is it realistic? Of course not. But neither is not getting a drive through, or a black flag, or being kicked off your team, or not having your racing license suspended. So there goes realism!

But those three simple rules made the clean racing room culture of GT6 work. Everyone is a steward...

 

[fastone371]

It still seems to me that turning on damage might work in sport mode. What good does it do risking contact to gain position if your car is 10 seconds per lap off the pace? Some innocent victims will be penalized but they are now, I was spun 2 times on the first lap in the Group 2 race yesterday by over zealous brakers, my race was effectively over anyway, probably same result as if damage were on but the offenders got away with less penalty than me, probably not the case if damage was on. It may also help with hitting the wall at tracks like Blue Moon where not much time is lost hitting the wall, usually if your a second behind they slow enough after hitting the wall that you are at their bumper, realistically more time should probably be lost.

 

[Sven Jurgens]

Simply put, there is no way for a game to have the same penalties as real racing.

A) technically, it's impossible. I doubt even a supercomputer could keep track of 30 cars or so, and figure out who had overlaps, who dive-bombed, who brake checked, who weaved down a straight, who made multiple blocks...

B) there's no real world consequences. No team is going to drop you, no steward is going to black flag you, nobody has to pay for repairs, nobody ends up in hospital with millions in debts. And nobody dies.

So, let's just forget about real world rules.

But I can tell you what worked, in room after room, year after year in GT5 and GT6. We had the cleanest racing, night and day, year after year...

3 simple rules:

ALL contact is the fault of the trailing car.
ALL contact that ends in gain of position, the immediate self-penalty is to return the position, as soon as it is safe to do so.
Only one move to block (no Verstappening!), no weaving.

That's all it takes. Remove the advantage to contact (the gain in position) and you remove the incentive.

Is it realistic? Of course not. But neither is not getting a drive through, or a black flag, or being kicked off your team, or not having your racing license suspended. So there goes realism!

But those three simple rules made the clean racing room culture of GT6 work. Everyone is a steward...

A) That's really easy for a computer to do, except the server does absolutely nothing. The clients determine the penalties and they don't have any resources left after rendering the game. Penalties are only assigned on contact, anything prior or after is not looked at.

Clean racing works in rooms among friends, yet it is very biased. If the host doesn't like you, any excuse will do to boot you while himself and his buddies can get away with murder. At least an computer is unbiased and if programmed right, can see the whole picture.


Your simple rules, simply fail. I see brake checks happen on a daily basis, dirty blocks, deliberate ramming in corners to prevent over takes, or simply someone losing control and clipping the car behind on the way out. It is slowly getting better. Brake checks and people lingering in corners doesn't give the victim penalties anymore like it used to. Side by side contact, especially from dive bombs and bump passes still need work.

Forcing a player to give back a position is a good idea, yet the penalty system first needs to be improved to correctly assign blame. Knowing how it works (client decides and only guesses what happened on the other client) it would likely force both players to let the other go first

It still seems to me that turning on damage might work in sport mode. What good does it do risking contact to gain position if your car is 10 seconds per lap off the pace? Some innocent victims will be penalized but they are now, I was spun 2 times on the first lap in the Group 2 race yesterday by over zealous brakers, my race was effectively over anyway, probably same result as if damage were on but the offenders got away with less penalty than me, probably not the case if damage was on. It may also help with hitting the wall at tracks like Blue Moon where not much time is lost hitting the wall, usually if your a second behind they slow enough after hitting the wall that you are at their bumper, realistically more time should probably be lost.

I've made great comebacks after getting bump off straight into a wall. With damage that would not be possible. And while the attacker might get some damage as well, expect pit manoevers to happen more frequently while it solves nothing about someone not leaving the other driver any room and pushing them off the track.

The real problem is penalty scrubbing during the race. Slowing down creates more accidents and people are now slowing down on the racing line to shave it down bit at the time while blocking traffic behind. A mandatory stop and go in the pit or always add to finish would remove half the incidents that are happening now. If you can't get rid of penalties during the race, I bet you people will become more careful to avoid getting them. (Or simply quit early, as what would happen with damage)

 

[Alpha Cipher]

A) That's really easy for a computer to do, except the server does absolutely nothing. The clients determine the penalties and they don't have any resources left after rendering the game. Penalties are only assigned on contact, anything prior or after is not looked at.

Clean racing works in rooms among friends, yet it is very biased. If the host doesn't like you, any excuse will do to boot you while himself and his buddies can get away with murder. At least an computer is unbiased and if programmed right, can see the whole picture.


Your simple rules, simply fail. I see brake checks happen on a daily basis, dirty blocks, deliberate ramming in corners to prevent over takes, or simply someone losing control and clipping the car behind on the way out. It is slowly getting better. Brake checks and people lingering in corners doesn't give the victim penalties anymore like it used to. Side by side contact, especially from dive bombs and bump passes still need work.

Forcing a player to give back a position is a good idea, yet the penalty system first needs to be improved to correctly assign blame. Knowing how it works (client decides and only guesses what happened on the other client) it would likely force both players to let the other go first




I've made great comebacks after getting bump off straight into a wall. With damage that would not be possible. And while the attacker might get some damage as well, expect pit manoevers to happen more frequently while it solves nothing about someone not leaving the other driver any room and pushing them off the track.

The real problem is penalty scrubbing during the race. Slowing down creates more accidents and people are now slowing down on the racing line to shave it down bit at the time while blocking traffic behind. A mandatory stop and go in the pit or always add to finish would remove half the incidents that are happening now. If you can't get rid of penalties during the race, I bet you people will become more careful to avoid getting them. (Or simply quit early, as what would happen with damage)

Just wanna add to this, GTS lobbies aren't really any better than a B-A SR race tbh, even if the lobby title literally screams "FAIR ONLY PLEASE !!!!!!!!!"
The only time lobbies get as organized as Sport mode races are in organized racing leagues, which is what I think he desperately wants, but doesn't really make an effort to find one and attend in despite an active Online Racing and Leagues forum. I wonder why

 

[Mirror_man]

Simply put, there is no way for a game to have the same penalties as real racing.

A) technically, it's impossible. I doubt even a supercomputer could keep track of 30 cars or so, and figure out who had overlaps, who dive-bombed, who brake checked, who weaved down a straight, who made multiple blocks...

B) there's no real world consequences. No team is going to drop you, no steward is going to black flag you, nobody has to pay for repairs, nobody ends up in hospital with millions in debts. And nobody dies.

So, let's just forget about real world rules.

But I can tell you what worked, in room after room, year after year in GT5 and GT6. We had the cleanest racing, night and day, year after year...

3 simple rules:

ALL contact is the fault of the trailing car.
ALL contact that ends in gain of position, the immediate self-penalty is to return the position, as soon as it is safe to do so.
Only one move to block (no Verstappening!), no weaving.

That's all it takes. Remove the advantage to contact (the gain in position) and you remove the incentive.

Is it realistic? Of course not. But neither is not getting a drive through, or a black flag, or being kicked off your team, or not having your racing license suspended. So there goes realism!

But those three simple rules made the clean racing room culture of GT6 work. Everyone is a steward...

Sherre... I don´t know how deep you´ve digged into the thread... but between the info I share there, you may also find rules from online racing leagues... one for Live forSspeed and the other coming.... from GTPlanet GT 5 and 6 Racing Leagues... tooo!!!

 

[Mirror_man]

Want to know about racing Etiquette???


well .. i´m sure you wil find lots of infos and inspiration in this "old" GT Planet thread !


between the info I share there, you may also find rules from online racing leagues... one for Live forSspeed and the other coming.... from GTPlanet GT 5 and 6 Racing Leagues... tooo!!!

 

[GaLbaNoryes]

Thank you for this. Wish the game told me what exactly makes me "look bad" instead of "don't crash I guess lol".