My first Thread - Dear Bernie......

[Northstar]

Still, afaik there were GP's with more than 30 participants. Did the pits for those tracks get rebuilt?

The largest grid was the 1953 German Grand Prix, which was at the Nurburgring so I doubt space was an issue.

 

[TenEightyOne]

Lol, okay, that's a good point XD

Still, afaik there were GP's with more than 30 participants. Did the pits for those tracks get rebuilt?

Most likely back in the day when there weren't fixed "on-track" garages and fuel went in at the side of the track, through a funnel, with the mechanic smoking a cigarette.

 

[DK]

Lol, okay, that's a good point XD

Still, afaik there were GP's with more than 30 participants. Did the pits for those tracks get rebuilt?

Do you mean races with over 30 cars or Grand Prix weekends with over 30 entrants? The last time there were over 30 cars entering a Grand Prix weekend was back in 1992.

 

[ukfan758]

I would just allow re-fueling and get rid of the fuel flow limit. Keep the rest the same.

 

[TenEightyOne]

I couldn't see a better thread to post this in; the drivers are revolting.

They've sent a letter urging "a change of governance" in the sport although they've stopped short of directly invoking the name of Bernie Ecclestone in the spell.

BBC.

 

[RACECAR]

With respect, the fact that you're addressing Bernie through a platform he doesn't even read doesn't bode well for you. Their atrocious Social Media presence (including disallowing one of their drivers to share footage from testing to the fans) should tell you how much Bernie cares.

 

[twitcher]

Maybe we could get this tread title changed to "how to fix F1"??

That way I'd have a spot to put this open letter from the drivers regarding the state of F1.

Otherwise I don't know if I should make a new thread, or...?


Here's the full letter

Dear Formula 1 stakeholders, followers and fans,

“The Grand Prix drivers would like to state our following position: We drivers love our sport! Since childhood, we dreamed of racing the fastest race cars from the top teams on the coolest tracks against the best drivers in the world. We seek competition and love F1 almost unconditionally, which makes us most probably the people with the purest interest for Formula 1, beside our fans.

“Formula 1 is currently challenged by a difficult global economic environment, a swift change in fan and consumer behaviour, and a decisive shift in the TV and media landscape. This makes it fundamental that the sport’s leaders make smart and well considered adjustments.

“We feel that some recent rule changes – on both the sporting and technical side, and including some business directions – are disruptive, do not address the bigger issues our sport is facing and in some cases could jeopardise its future success. We know that among the leaders of the sport – be it the owners, their representatives, the governing body, the teams or other stakeholders – every individual acts with the very best intentions.

“Therefore, the drivers have come to the conclusion that the decision-making process in the sport is obsolete and ill -structured and prevents progress being made. Indeed, it can sometimes lead to just the opposite, a gridlock. This reflects negatively on our sport, prevents it being fit for the next generation of fans and compromises further global growth.

“We would like to request and urge the owners and all stakeholders of Formula 1 to consider restructuring its own governance. The future directions and decisions of F1, be they short or long term, sporting, technical or business orientated should be based on a clear master plan. Such plan should reflect the principles and core values of Formula 1.

“We need to ensure that F1 remains a sport, a closely-fought competition between the best drivers in extraordinary machines on the coolest race tracks. F1 should be home only to the best teams, drivers and circuits, with partners and suppliers fit for such an elite championship.

“Formula 1 has undoubtedly established itself as the pinnacle of motorsport and as such one of the most viewed and popular sports around the world. We drivers stand united, offer our help and support for F1 to keep it as such, and further to make it fit and exciting for many years and generations to come.

“It is important to state that this open letter is intended in the best interests of all and should not be seen as blind and disrespectful attack. Thank you for your attention and granting us the liberty to put our thoughts into words.

“Best regards, Jenson Button, Sebastian Vettel, Alex Wurz, on behalf of the Grand Prix Drivers.”

 

[TenEightyOne]

@twitcher, I linked the letter two posts above yours, I guess we're in agreement on this being the best thread for it

@Famine, would a thread-title-edit be in order as per @twitcher's suggestion above, please?

 

[twitcher]

@twitcher, I linked the letter two posts above yours, I guess we're in agreement on this being the best thread for it

@Famine, would a thread-title-edit be in order as per @twitcher's suggestion above, please?

I totally missed the BBC link in your post, my bad

 

[TenEightyOne]

The reply from Bernie;

 

[twitcher]

The reply from Bernie;

View attachment 529791

Is that actually real, or a joke?

 

[TenEightyOne]

Is that actually real, or a joke?

It's very real

BBC

 

[twitcher]

At this point it's hard to tell what reality is, so I thought I'd clarify

Is it just me or does that letter seem like Bernie is just saying exactly what everyone wants him to say, and then passing the buck at the same time. The way I read it, it's almost as though he's implying the situation is the driver's fault?

 

[rono_thomas]

At this point it's hard to tell what reality is, so I thought I'd clarify

Is it just me or does that letter seem like Bernie is just saying exactly what everyone wants him to say, and then passing the buck at the same time. The way I read it, it's almost as though he's implying the situation is the driver's fault?

Most definitely implying that it is others faults..

 

[TenEightyOne]

Who's a windbag? The drivers is, at least that's today's Sez Bernie.

 

[rono_thomas]

Who's a windbag? The drivers is, at least that's today's Sez Bernie.

The article strikes me, Kaz has his GT, Bernie has his F1, and now the FIA partnership - Soul mates may have found they, hmmmmn!

 

[RACECAR]

The article strikes me, Kaz has his GT, Bernie has his F1, and now the FIA partnership - Soul mates may have found they, hmmmmn!

Except Bernie owns Formula One Management (FOM), not the FIA

 

[rono_thomas]

Except Bernie owns Formula One Management (FOM), not the FIA

Yea some very vague dots there, very very vague. But. (Just the decision making process) - and that's worked tremendously well.

 

[wowbaggerBR]

As far as I'm concern, the solution is WEC, or any other motorsport discipline which floats your boat, really. Leave F1 as it is, since it isn't designed to be an entertaining sport anymore.

 

[RACECAR]

Yea some very vague dots there, very very vague.

Not sure what's vague about the difference between a Commercial rights holder for F1 (FOM) and a Santioning body (FIA). Seems pretty obvious.

 

[Samus]

Yea some very vague dots there, very very vague. But. (Just the decision making process) - and that's worked tremendously well.

What exactly are you getting at here?

 

[Cap'n Jack]

As far as I'm concern, the solution is WEC, or any other motorsport discipline which floats your boat, really. Leave F1 as it is, since it isn't designed to be an entertaining sport anymore.

As good as the WEC is, you're going to have a hard time getting the masses to enjoy endurance racing. It's more of a niche for the hardcore motorsports fan, the way I see it.

Same reason why 20/20 cricket has gained a huge following recently, over the traditional test matches.

 

[wowbaggerBR]

As good as the WEC is, you're going to have a hard time getting the masses to enjoy endurance racing. It's more of a niche for the hardcore motorsports fan, the way I see it.

Same reason why 20/20 cricket has gained a huge following recently, over the traditional test matches.

That's why I said you can choose any other racing. And I was saying this to whoever likes motorsports. Bring new people to enjoy racing nowadays is delusional, at best.

Masses don't enjoy racing. The trend now isn't around the car as a means to free people as it once was. For the most people, cars are bad things and racing is pointless.

 

[Cap'n Jack]

Okay. To be quite honest I don't get what you're saying. How is WEC the solution (especially when it's harder to get into, which was my original point)? Why should people favour it, or any other series, over F1? Why shouldn't F1 face its current issues so it can thrive long into the future?

 

[wowbaggerBR]

Okay. To be quite honest I don't get what you're saying. How is WEC the solution (especially when it's harder to get into, which was my original point)?

That's why I said you can choose any other racing, WEC is great, but probably isnt't for everyone.

Why should people favour it, or any other series, over F1?

Anyone who follows F1, and sees himself as an enthusiast, would probably like WEC because of a no-🤬 regulations, technological advanced cars, great drivers and close racing throughout the field.

I'm an example of this shift, and many of my friends are as well. And mind that here, in Brazil, WEC and Le Mans coverage is non-existant.

Why shouldn't F1 face its current issues so it can thrive long into the future?

It should, but it won't. F1 is lacking interest for some years now, everyone knows why, what are the reasons, and yet, no action to change the situation has been taken. The situation is bleak, and yet year after year, you heard things like "you know what? We may ditch Monza, and Spa...". Come on, is beyond salvation for quite some time now.

F1 won't change because is waaay too comited with this international jet-set. Is a way of life, something that Jo Ramirez, waaay back, said brilliantly: "F1 is great, what ruins it is the racing".

 

[TenEightyOne]

It should, but it won't. F1 is lacking interest for some years now

Source required. Other figures suggest that it continues to be the most watched serial sports series in the world. It even manages 4m viewers in the UK alone (Bahrain figures).

 

[MatskiMonk]

Why do people here like F1? I'd be curious to hear why, in the context of what it offers that other motorsport doesn't.

 

[05XR8]

My one suggestion for F1:
Hand out points from 1st Place to last finisher.

 

[TenEightyOne]

My one suggestion for F1:
Hand out points from 1st Place to last finisher.

Because that would fix... what?

Why do people here like F1? I'd be curious to hear why, in the context of what it offers that other motorsport doesn't.

I don't exclusively like F1 but it's been a passion since I was a very small child. It started out with the loud, fast cars and equally loud, fast personalities, now I love the minutiae of the engineering just as much.

It has a certain je ne sais quoi, although I don't know what.

 

[twitcher]

Why do people here like F1? I'd be curious to hear why, in the context of what it offers that other motorsport doesn't.

Ooh oh I'll have a go!

I've watched racing basically my whole life (born in '85). F1 was the first form of racing I was introduced to when my dad would watch it.

When I was about 8, I discovered NASCAR and Indycar (or whatever it was called back then). NASCAR, I can't lie, I liked because of the crashes. I used to build 1:24 scale models, and then use a lighter to melt them and make it look like they got in huge wrecks....except my precious #3 . Indycar I liked because it was in places that I recognized (like Toronto, Vancouver) and while I never actually watched Indy Toronto, I was downtown while it was on and still remember hearing the cars.

Even back then, I remember my dad telling me "F1 is the best, because that's the way it is."

In my late teens, I stopped following most racing as I was busy with other things, plus it was just tough to follow unless you were completely into it. In 2004 and 2005, I was in Montreal for the summers, so took the opportunity to go to a GP. That's when I got back into following F1, although I ended up going to a GP only in '04, as it was actually a bit of a disappointing experience (payed a lot of money to spend all day sitting on hard ass metal bleachers, frying in the sun...watching a big screen on the other side of the track. Best part of the whole weekend was seeing the classic F1 cars, which happened to be staged right behind the bleacher I was sitting in. Got right up close to them, chatted with some of the mechanics. Sadly, that was before I fully understood what I was looking at, and I think I've since lost all the pictures I took.). The atmosphere in Mtl was pretty special though, and even friends who didn't follow racing at all, remarked on how cool all the events in the city surrounding the GP were.

Since that time, I losely followed F1 and NASCAR simply because they were the most prevelent, and therefor easy to keep track of. Living in Canada, and being an infrequent cable subscriber, following other forms of racing basically wasn't an option. If it weren't for games like Gran Turismo, I wouldn't even know about many other forms of racing.

In the last few years, I've turned into a "hardcore" Motorsports fan, for 2 reasons. One, racing games like GT. Actually getting into racing online, studying tuning guides and racecraft guides - the commonalities between the real and the virtual have really cultivated my interest in racing. Two, if the internet; specifically being able to watch replays of various races, at my convenience. I've never been one to schrdule my life around TV watching, but now that I can catch up on a weekend's worth of racing over the following week, or watch an endurance race in segments, I find myself getting really into everything. All the websites and blogs really help too.

So basically, I say all that to say that I'm an F1 fan by "default". I follow it, and considered it the pinnacle simply because I didn't know anything else. Now that I follow basically everything, and I mean everything, I become less and less impressed with F1 With each passing day. That's not to say I dislike F1, just that I don't hold it in as high a regard.

F1 lacks the wheel to wheel action, and relatability of GT and Touring Car racing, or MotoGP and WSBK. To me, it lacks the diversity of strategy, and attrition, of endurance racing. It lacks the danger of racing on gnarly tracks like The Nordeschleif, Bathurst, Le Mans, Macau, Road Atlanta, Watkins Glen, etc etc. in terms of racing that brings me to the edge of my seat, screaming in angst at the TV, yelling "Holy 🤬" when no one else is around, F1 barely cracks my top 10.

I used to consider F1 as the pinnacle because that's what everyone, including F1 itself, told me it was. Now that I have some context, I no longer feel that way. I think a lot of people hold F1 in that regard because it has the most "noise" surrounding it - but I feel it is viewed as "the best racing" for everything but the actual racing. I don't even really considered F1 drivers as the "best in the world." They're the best at their niche, which is single seater, open wheel, high downforce, on smooth tracks - but they're not the best on an oval, they're not the best on dirt/snow, they're not the best in a GT or Touring Car (eg I have a really hard time believing that any of the current crop of F1 drivers could hop in a V8SC and keep up with the pointy end of that field around Bathurst).

TLDR; F1 doesn't really offer me anything that other series don't - it's just another on the list of series to follow and watch.