- 1,072
- Behind you
So piss off the people most likely to buy your game in the hope of attracting others. Sounds crazy to me, but it probably works. I mean they sold loads of GT7 and most don't play it anymore.
PENALTY SYSTEM IS STILL A PIECE OF ****!!!
- Thread starter Gareth davies
- 6,543 comments
- 442,396 views
- 1,663
- United Kingdom
Player retention doesn’t matter unless your business model relies on micro transactions.
- 2,411
- The failed experiment entitled “California”.
Of course it works. I guarantee everyone here is going to buy a copy of GT7 wether the penalty system is existent or not.
from what I see, the better lobbies are pretty self-policing. It’s the B lobbies which are by far the worst. My Euro Alt account is in the high 20K right now. Has been for a couple days. I’d have it past 30K by now but I keep getting surrounded by the destruction derby types. It sucks. I said it months ago when everyone was complaining about the overly stringent penalty system…..
”it sucks, but it sucks equally for everyone. In the end, we’re gonna miss it”
It’s one of my few comments that has aged well 😂
- 3,836
- Canada
- TPCDangerSashimi
Last month or so I've been playing on a pretty random pattern. A few Daily races on Monday, Tues. then just focus on improving QT. Sometimes one more race later in the week just to see what it's like.
Just to be clear, I'm not playing less because of the penalty system. I'm playing less because everyone is.
It's not the worst it has been. Obviously it's still frustrating. But maintaining a high SR does keep me out of most it. And improving lap times does put me on better grids.
I do laps and when bored I've been hitting Driving School again. And that has helped me more over the last month.
Just to be clear, I'm not playing less because of the penalty system. I'm playing less because everyone is.
It's not the worst it has been. Obviously it's still frustrating. But maintaining a high SR does keep me out of most it. And improving lap times does put me on better grids.
I do laps and when bored I've been hitting Driving School again. And that has helped me more over the last month.
- 2,411
- The failed experiment entitled “California”.
And that's the biggest thing I can do to help myself. Improve my equally time to get out of the midpack. NGP is one of those tracks that is extremely difficult for me to put a "complete" lap together. I'm stuck at 2:05.5 in the 458. I find a couple 10ths when I nail the stadium section...but then I lose it somewhere else. I managed to get this qually on Monday, so it was good until late Tuesday. Now its good for mid-pack at best in high-B lobbies. Which puts me dead-nuts-center of the romper room
- 976
- Indiana USA
- tmsheehan
- ToroSports
Some ACC and PS2 online leagues are good too. Live marshaling with severe penalties.
Open lobbies on ACC and PC2 are not as bad as sanctioned races on GTS but there are still some goofballs. League racing on both is more strict with a few having live marshals which give out stiff penalties.
- 895
- Due West of Europe
Various “incidents” in DR C/ SR S resulted in my SR level dropping briefly into A level.
I say “briefly” because guess what, the driving standard was better in SR A than it was in S!!!
Folk were so busy trying to regain SR that there was an outbreak of civility and most folks had decided to play nicely. There was a couple of pinheads still charging around but by & large it was a breath of fresh air compared to the utter cesspit of S.
I was was therefore able to gain sufficient SR to return to the hallowed ground of S, unfortunately. 🥺
I say “briefly” because guess what, the driving standard was better in SR A than it was in S!!!
Folk were so busy trying to regain SR that there was an outbreak of civility and most folks had decided to play nicely. There was a couple of pinheads still charging around but by & large it was a breath of fresh air compared to the utter cesspit of S.
I was was therefore able to gain sufficient SR to return to the hallowed ground of S, unfortunately. 🥺
- 6,764
- Ontario
- SvennoJ
- SvenZ
Ghosting is still glitchy. Somehow I collided with the front bumper of another car (which had spun around, facing the opposite way) and looked ghosted. However the clunk sound played and I had red SR after the race.
Cars getting reset on the racing line are solid for 1 frame. If you happen to be in that spot at the same time, collision.
Cars getting reset on the racing line are solid for 1 frame. If you happen to be in that spot at the same time, collision.
- 325
- Louisiana
Yup, my experience is A+ lobbies seem to be fine. People mostly race with their head on straight above 50K DR. Plus, no more pissed off people for getting a penalty from another driver's mistake. See my last Nations race. There were a couple of times contact penalties would've made that race a total mess. Instead, it worked itself out.
Looking back I cannot think of a race this season where a bad penalty ruined my race. Before that, it happened often. So, kind of enjoying this system myself.
B and A lobbies (very thirsty racing), good luck. Contact to pass seems to be a way of life. That's just as, if not more, aggravating.
- 6,764
- Ontario
- SvennoJ
- SvenZ
Nice it works out for the A+ folks, yet I haven't had a single 'normal' race yet this week. Barge pass is the norm and there are always people fighting on the track. It's not GT Sport anymore, it's GT Fight Club.
PD is mostly to blame. The game doesn't teach racing skills at all. When I said something to one of the many dive bombers T-boning me off they reply with "I had the inside and I got the clean race bonus". And when you come alongside it's like your car is a rare earth magnet sucking the other car into you to push you off the side. My reflexes to steer into a car coming from the side are so automatic now that when they get ghosted for side swiping I go off the other side. But if you don't, you're in the grass or wall...
SR is still completely broken as well. I went to SR.B in one race, just for touching a couple rear bumpers of people fighting each other in front of me in traffic. Can't avoid them, try to brake and the car behind just bumps you into them.
Big Willow next week, at least that track will quickly weed out the crash kiddies. Tracks with walls are the worst now.
PD is mostly to blame. The game doesn't teach racing skills at all. When I said something to one of the many dive bombers T-boning me off they reply with "I had the inside and I got the clean race bonus". And when you come alongside it's like your car is a rare earth magnet sucking the other car into you to push you off the side. My reflexes to steer into a car coming from the side are so automatic now that when they get ghosted for side swiping I go off the other side
. But if you don't, you're in the grass or wall...SR is still completely broken as well. I went to SR.B in one race, just for touching a couple rear bumpers of people fighting each other in front of me in traffic. Can't avoid them, try to brake and the car behind just bumps you into them.
Big Willow next week, at least that track will quickly weed out the crash kiddies. Tracks with walls are the worst now.
- 1,230
- Michigan
- KosmoKazi
I agree. High-A lobbies are much better overall and the penalty system being 'off' is better IMO... it was doing more damage than good. It double-penalized the clean guys more or less, while the offenders still got their advantages when punting.
I haven't really had issue with the 'marshaling' of the game since they turned them off. I do think it makes a difference where you are on the DR spectrum, as I'm sure it's messier at lower-A and B level DR lobbies. That's not a knock against anyone in those ranks, but it is a statement that there are more idiots per capita in those rooms, and if you're legitimately matched at that pace, it's frustrating to compete against them.
I do find it interesting how much more 'aware' and able to manage my situation I am, when I drop in a B/low-A room now, compared to when I was struggling to punch through to A rating... you do learn how to protect yourself a bit, though of course sometimes there are people that are just going to destroy anyone's race no matter what.
- 5,662
- Ulricehamn
- 1,230
- Michigan
- KosmoKazi
That’s true. You do see people you “know” …about 50% of the grid in every race. Especially in NA.
- 6,764
- Ontario
- SvennoJ
- SvenZ
Yes, the anonymity in lower ranks makes people not give a crap. You also get a lot of new alt accounts moving through or alt accounts just to 'have fun'. People that return race after race start to behave as they know (or quickly find out) they can't pull the same **** again and again. However some just make another account or go to a different race :/
You see it with free to play games as well. If you can always make a new account, then there are no consequences to your actions. If you're stuck with the same name and group, you learn to behave.
The other problem is matchmaking which only really works for the highest level of DR/SR. Any lower and you get random matches with completely differently paced grids. Every SR tier has fast people up front, yet the higher the SR goes, the slower the back becomes and the higher the spread in ability and speed. That often causes chaos in T1 and with fast non qualifiers starting behind D/S qualifiers.
I see it all the time while not qualifying. SR.S always has the slowest starts, you have to tip toe through the first set of corners. SR.B has the fastest starts. DR is pretty random. A D/B driver often races like an A/S driver, reset for driving into the back of too many very early braking D/S drivers.
Anonymity is bad, DR resets are bad, harsh SR deductions for touching an accident, brake check or someone braking far too early or in a place that needs no braking at all, are bad, filling up slow rooms with faster lower SR players is really bad, penalizing the right thing (steering into a wall or off track to avoid hitting someone) is completely opposite of the etiquette videos. The only penalties the game dishes out now are for avoiding people... (You can still take as many short cuts as you like, as long as you touch another car first)
You see it with free to play games as well. If you can always make a new account, then there are no consequences to your actions. If you're stuck with the same name and group, you learn to behave.
The other problem is matchmaking which only really works for the highest level of DR/SR. Any lower and you get random matches with completely differently paced grids. Every SR tier has fast people up front, yet the higher the SR goes, the slower the back becomes and the higher the spread in ability and speed. That often causes chaos in T1 and with fast non qualifiers starting behind D/S qualifiers.
I see it all the time while not qualifying. SR.S always has the slowest starts, you have to tip toe through the first set of corners. SR.B has the fastest starts. DR is pretty random. A D/B driver often races like an A/S driver, reset for driving into the back of too many very early braking D/S drivers.
Anonymity is bad, DR resets are bad, harsh SR deductions for touching an accident, brake check or someone braking far too early or in a place that needs no braking at all, are bad, filling up slow rooms with faster lower SR players is really bad, penalizing the right thing (steering into a wall or off track to avoid hitting someone) is completely opposite of the etiquette videos. The only penalties the game dishes out now are for avoiding people... (You can still take as many short cuts as you like, as long as you touch another car first)
- 2,219
- Tennessee
- NoStopN
- 3,836
- Canada
- TPCDangerSashimi
I mentioned this way back but the problems with the GT penalty system (and every other game) are a reflection of real life racing. The uncertainty of rules stems from the FIA. Track limits, overtaking, contact, intentional dirty driving, etc.... None of this is clear, maybe even less clear in real life racing.
Watching the F1 season, it's clear how flawed the real life system is. FIA needs to be better. They have the technology. But they use it like stereotypical old people do. To confirm their opinions. Instead of using the data.
Watching the F1 season, it's clear how flawed the real life system is. FIA needs to be better. They have the technology. But they use it like stereotypical old people do. To confirm their opinions. Instead of using the data.
- 2,027
- Bristol, UK
- OJBrit
Indeed. B is the biggest pool of drivers. I may have seen the same person twice once, but rarely do I see a name I recognise.
- 4,962
- Nelson, England
- GTP_ASH32
As has been said DRB driver rooms are indeed a mess, contact penalties need to come back to stop this. 
PD should also use stuff like this to show how not to drive. If anyone sees this driver I recommend not overtaking them, just wait for them to crash or someone else to sort them out.
PD should also use stuff like this to show how not to drive. If anyone sees this driver I recommend not overtaking them, just wait for them to crash or someone else to sort them out.
- 6,764
- Ontario
- SvennoJ
- SvenZ
I was looking forward to Big Willow, but racing there today quickly changed my mind. Just another one make with dive bombing RS.0.1s. Plus the reset is horribly broken. Get bumped off in the final turn and I lost 22 seconds on my lap time before the game decided to put me back on the track. (I ended up stuck behind a wall)
How is Brand's hatch? I don't really like GR.4, but if it's not a one make I'll give it a shot.
Matchmaking should put all the meta cars together in one room, all the others in different rooms. I used the Huracan at Monza, which could keep up decently with the meta car. Still not that much fun with all the same cars on the track.
Maybe it's time for another long break.
How is Brand's hatch? I don't really like GR.4, but if it's not a one make I'll give it a shot.
Matchmaking should put all the meta cars together in one room, all the others in different rooms. I used the Huracan at Monza, which could keep up decently with the meta car. Still not that much fun with all the same cars on the track.
Maybe it's time for another long break.
- 1,736
- Willow Springs
- schlafhund
Where are you experiencing divebombs? Into turn 3 just before the Budweiser Balcony?
- 6,764
- Ontario
- SvennoJ
- SvenZ
- 1,736
- Willow Springs
- schlafhund
Oh, man. What a shame. With respect given, Big Willow racing is extraordinary.
- 415
- North Bohemia
As has been said DRB driver rooms are indeed a mess, contact penalties need to come back to stop this.
PD should also use stuff like this to show how not to drive. If anyone sees this driver I recommend not overtaking them, just wait for them to crash or someone else to sort them out.
Wow, what a clown. But this is nothing compared to DR B in EMEA.
Basically if there's someone within 1s behind you, there's a 90% chance they will dive and use you as a wall in the next slow corner. If you're lucky, you just lose one position but most of the time your race is ruined. And the biggest kick in the nuts is that because side contact is completely ignored, players like that usually finish blue and so the game basically tells them they have done nothing wrong. But this only goes for SR 99!!! Surprise PD, the highest sportsmanship rank in this game is BY FAR the filthiest cesspool of filthy filth in this game. The **** people are capable of doing to gain a position is just mind blowing. Once you drop to SR A or lower the races are actually much more enjoyable and people are way cleaner. But how are they supposed to know that this is not how racing is done? The game certainly doesn't do anything to teach them. Are people in Japan so well-behaved and obedient that simply telling them: "Don't do anything that would make you look bad" is enough? Is this why PD think that making us watch two videos actually qualifies us for racing? Do they not know that there is a lot of people on this planet who don't give a crap about how they look if they win? Seriously, the biggest problem of the Sport mode is not the penalty system (which was also a big fail and so PD have turned it off completely) but it's actually the SR system. I really hope that GT7 will have all this sorted out but I'm realistic and I do not expect anything different from GTS except for slightly better graphics and maybe more content. I actually kind of expect that the "penalty system" we have now is what PD will use in GT7 as well. Because then there will be no "This penalty system sucks" YT videos. Anyway, I do not intend to purchase that game when it comes out or any time soon.
- 4,962
- Nelson, England
- GTP_ASH32
There are a lot of Trophys but I'm not sure why, it probably is a tiny bit faster (I have not used it yet) but it's lack of straight line speed means you'll pass any that you are faster than in most other cars unless they are dirty drivers. Same deal with the 4C, but mostly because any mid-pack runners in this will likely crash. Top guys will chose one of these and beat you, but they'd do that if they were using a Mazda or Aston too, which are slightly the worst two of the cars I've tried so far, lots of cars around the same pace here.
Edit:- Trophy is about 3 tenths faster over a lap than anything else I've tried, until you end up behind another car then it's not so good and I was only stuck behind other Trophys and a WRX, if someone would have had an FF or the Jag or Ferrari then I'd have probably been stuck forever unless they made a big error.
Don't use the Evo, it's still awful to drive and slower than anything I've tried.
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- 5,662
- Ulricehamn
- 921
- United States
- Blood_Raven_70
After watching Tidgney's video and him commenting on that fact, I went back and tried qualifying again with the TT. I knocked 2-3 seconds off my total time. Plus, I was quicker on the straight coming up to Hawthorn by a few MPH. As well, the TT is a bit more stable and I can get on the throttle quicker coming out of turns without upsetting the car.There are a lot of Trophys but I'm not sure why, it probably is a tiny bit faster (I have not used it yet) but it's lack of straight line speed means you'll pass any that you are faster than in most other cars unless they are dirty drivers. Same deal with the 4C, but mostly because any mid-pack runners in this will likely crash. Top guys will chose one of these and beat you, but they'd do that if they were using a Mazda or Aston too, which are slightly the worst two of the cars I've tried so far, lots of cars around the same pace here.
I haven't run a race there, yet; but I'm planning on doing a few later today (family stuff to do in a bit).
- 3,262
- Canada
What I see in the videos above is what i said would happen when they removed penalties for side contact. One can throw it in, use the car ahead as a brake, both make the corner and remove an opponent without consequences. It is, of course, abused.
