Performance points must go!

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Tenacious D
I like A Spec points too, and don't see why we can't have both.
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If we have both and the A-Spec points are still affected by your choice of vehicle, power, weight, etc...the PP system would still be useless as it's doing the exact same thing, albeit you're not "rewarded" with anything in return.
 
keep the A-spec points for the single player game but add a online scoreboard for the bragging rights :)

just keep that PP system the hell away from my single player game let me choose my level of competition.
 
The difference between A Spec and Performance Points is that PP is meant to be a limiter as well as a gauge of "homologation," or making sure different makes of cars have similar lap performance. A Spec is even rougher, and is also meant to be an indication of skill in taking lesser cars against better cars to win a race.
 
Not only that... A-Spec was a very rough approximation of what finally became "Performance Points". A-Spec was horribly unbalanced, and sometimes gave you 200 point races that were ridiculously easy and some 100-150 point races that were ludicrously hard.

Performance Points are more refined in that they take into account more factors than A-Spec and give a more balanced field. Yes, there are some cars that come off better under Performance Points, but it's not to them having a ridiculous power or weight advantage (you can trim PPs to get almost any car to the same power/weight/grip ratio), it's just that it's easier to make them handle and accelerate better with the limited control you have over transmission, suspension and tires in GT5P.
 
o SIZE13CHOOK o
The PP sysytem needs to be in place to regulate different aspects of racing.If you dont like it go play GRID.:)
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let people regulate for themselves. if i want to race a 1500bhp monster in the sunday cup thats my choice i dont want the game interfering.
 
niky
Not only that... A-Spec was a very rough approximation of what finally became "Performance Points". A-Spec was horribly unbalanced, and sometimes gave you 200 point races that were ridiculously easy and some 100-150 point races that were ludicrously hard.

Performance Points are more refined in that they take into account more factors than A-Spec and give a more balanced field. Yes, there are some cars that come off better under Performance Points, but it's not to them having a ridiculous power or weight advantage (you can trim PPs to get almost any car to the same power/weight/grip ratio), it's just that it's easier to make them handle and accelerate better with the limited control you have over transmission, suspension and tires in GT5P.
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Agree with what you are saying, but PD could use the same thing that goes on in real life... weight, power and engine displacement restrictions and it would be easy... no performence points, just maximum or minimum allowed. Simple and like in real life.
 
Aloha62_2
let people regulate for themselves. if i want to race a 1500bhp monster in the sunday cup thats my choice i dont want the game interfering.
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Not agree. What's the challenge on racing a 150bhp cup with a 1.500bhp car? I think that's not the spirit.

On the first PSX Gran Turismo games this was a problem, because the restrictions for the cups/races were poor and you could choose a very powerful car. That was changed and, for exmple, on GT4 the specifications for every race were more restricted.

A-spec and/or PP is needed. Or something similar. I don't see any incentive in racing against not "similar" cars.

Restrictions are needed on "history" and online mode.

If you like to race a 1.500bhp against sensible cars I respect it, is your opinion and your option. But leave that to the Arcade mode, not the main ones were you have to prove your real skills and advance :)
 
The pp system must stay.
It is the best way to level the competetion, cant think of a more fair system,if you want all hp then you must take away elsewhere.
 
I think restrictions should be enforced the first time you try a Sunday Cup or Gran Turismo World Championship. After you win the trophy, the restrictions should become optional to abide by.
 
newnikita
Not agree. What's the challenge on racing a 150bhp cup with a 1.500bhp car? I think that's not the spirit.
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thats always been a fun part of gt to me.

i was very happy with gt4's system of limits removing that choice would be a mjaor downside for me.

keep it for online if you must i dont care in the slightest about multiplayer just keep it the hell away from my own game.
 
Aloha62_2
thats always been a fun part of gt to me.

i was very happy with gt4's system of limits removing that choice would be a mjaor downside for me.

keep it for online if you must i dont care in the slightest about multiplayer just keep it the hell away from my own game.
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Agreed, Its always been fun in the GT games to just tune the hell out of a car and throw it round an event just for the heck of it. For those of you who think its not in the spirit or whatever, you don't HAVE to use a car with a massive performance advantage, but having the option should be there.

The restrictions on GT4 bugged me to be honest, not being able to use Racing tires in hardly any events, grrrrr!
 
In my opinion, I am really hoping PP was a temporary thing established by PD as an alternative to what goes on in GT mode, so that PD doesn't show their hand with their INCREDIBLE GT MODE!!!
 
niky
Not only that... A-Spec was a very rough approximation of what finally became "Performance Points". A-Spec was horribly unbalanced, and sometimes gave you 200 point races that were ridiculously easy and some 100-150 point races that were ludicrously hard.

Performance Points are more refined in that they take into account more factors than A-Spec and give a more balanced field...
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Thank you for reminding me of that. The A Spec point system was the worst gauge of performance measurement ever devised.

snowboardfan
The restrictions on GT4 bugged me to be honest, not being able to use Racing tires in hardly any events, grrrrr!
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Hrm... S Class tires felt pretty good to me in GT4 to be honest, so when I got used to them, I didn't miss racing tires so much. On top of that, in Arcade Mode, you could create just about any race you wanted with any track and any cars - though not from your garage specifically. In fact, I spent a lot of time in Arcade Mode.
 
Tenacious D
Hrm... S Class tires felt pretty good to me in GT4 to be honest, so when I got used to them, I didn't miss racing tires so much. On top of that, in Arcade Mode, you could create just about any race you wanted with any track and any cars - though not from your garage specifically. In fact, I spent a lot of time in Arcade Mode.
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Well yes, you could do that, but I don't play GT for the Arcade mode, I play it for the all encompassing 'main' mode. Flinging a 1000bhp Supra round a track on R5's was great fun, trying to get it to stop and/or corner on S1's was not. I know I could just tune it down and have it with no more than 500bhp, but surely we should be able to choose what tires we want like we could in GT1 etc.

At the end of the day it comes down to personal preference. If you like racing cars stock with N1's on them for a real challenge then more power to you, but for me GT has always been about the choice. As a result, PP should go IMO for the main mode.
 
I still don't get the problem though, unless you wanted a money/car reward at the end of it rather than some A Spec points. The race is the same, but you get to determine the challenge and even the tires used. And then you could still cheat in the pre-race setup screen, have the bots using N1s and you could have R5s and a crazy power/weight bonus. The reward for me was setting up a challenging race and pulling out a tought win.
 
balang_479
Agree with what you are saying, but PD could use the same thing that goes on in real life... weight, power and engine displacement restrictions and it would be easy... no performence points, just maximum or minimum allowed. Simple and like in real life.
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One hopes that they'll have the restrictions for weight, power and tires be separate items instead of clumped together... but we'll never know till GT5 comes out.

Turn your face towards Mecca and say 1,000 Hail Marys. It may happen. :lol:
 
^You meant to say "God is Great" a thousand times?

I pretty much face Mecca five times a day and say that, but a thousand times?
Woah...:nervous:
 
Hey all, I haven't posted on here for a very long time, but read regularly.

It strikes me that the simplest way to hold races for the full GT5 is to have a mix of restricted and non-restricted racing.

It wouldn't be hard to have a room for Japanese FR cars with under 450 HP, and a weight restriction.

Equally, they can run some races with looser rules, so it's just anything over 800 hp or whatever.

In private races I have no doubt they'll allow the host to set the rules and everyone else must match them. (much like in COD4 or killzone2).

In fact, maybe there will be public races with host-decided entry conditions, so i could run a race purely for stock Chevy Lacetti's round the top gear track..?

I don't think PP is the way to do it- in a game played by petrolheads and auto-fanatics everywhere, there is no need for an abstract figure derived from the car's specs, when you could just limit the specs themselves?!
 
I had posted this in another thread, but I think it's worth of note, there seems to be no references to performance points, similar to what was used in Prologue.
I would assume if the system was intended to be kept, that there would be a way to filter what cars to use. :)


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I haven't played GT5 Prologue, so I don't know how the system worked there, but for GT5 I hope that in addition to restrictions (there has to be some technical restriction sometimes) PD for races will use something like the odds system of Enthusia Professional Racing (EPR - PlayStation 2). That worked wonderfully, one could tell immediately how competitive was the car relatively to the rest of the grid, and worked most of the time.

Actually, since some of the Enthusia staff is seemingly working for GT5, I won't be surprised if there will be a similar system.
Of course, A/B-Spec points could (and will) still be in the game (like Enthusia points!).
 
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I kinda liked the idea of PP but I do think it needs major improvements. Whatever PD does I'm sure they know what they are doing.
 
FlourescentBlak
I kinda liked the idea of PP but I do think it needs major improvements. Whatever PD does I'm sure they know what they are doing.
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Yeah PP is a good but flawed idea. The older power limit idea was better and provided fair races. PP tends to favour a make or model of car and everyone quickly works it out and you end up racing a fleet of the same cars.
 
No matter what they do, I hate the options to change the weight and the max. power of the car in GT5P. It's not appropriate in a real driving simulator. I never change weights. I like to drive cars the way I would in real life, with their real weight. With this feature, the game becomes more arcade-like.
 

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