PS4 Overall Volume (Still) Too LowPS4

[OdeFinn]

I think........

It's my own thoughts, speculation and hypothesis based on what we know and how audio recording, production and playback works.

Ok, had to search more, I have missed that era when game studios started to waste ram, last infos which I have seen long time ago were explaining their (not SMS, but developer) need to use compressed audio internally due memory savings which they get by doing it and leaving lot free RAM for actual game engine, 1:5 - 1:10 more memory to use.

 

[Scaff]

Ok, had to search more, I have missed that era when game studios started to waste ram, last infos which I have seen long time ago were explaining their (not SMS, but developer) need to use compressed audio internally due memory savings which they get by doing it and leaving lot free RAM for actual game engine, 1:5 - 1:10 more memory to use.

Audio has pretty much always been compressed for games, that only started to change with the last generation of console's.

Titles need to ideally offer both, as without compressed audio anyone now running an audio system that can't reproduce full range audio (the majority) will not get the lower bass and higher treble frequencies. So the audio will sound too quiet and weak.

However if they only include compressed audio then those with systems that can process full range audio miss out on the detail that can be present.

As such every title should have both.

 

[ThaFlash_LA]

On a zero dB scale (which my receiver runs) I set it to -25 with PC2 and -26 with AC, the two are almost identical in output via my system.

How are you running your audio? I need to put PC2 at least 15db higher on my denon receiver compared to any other game on my PS4 for comparable levels. I"m running straight HDMI uncompressed, with LFE effects in the game at 100. Plus, I need to increase subwoofer level by 1db to get any response out of it in PC2. Meanwhile, if I play Wildlands, or any movie with my subwoofer levels at 0db, my entire home shakes and my dog thinks someone is knocking at the door.

AC runs really loud for me, but that's on my Xbox oneX, and that thing is just louder than the PS4 in general.

PC2's audio quality is fine, I have nothing against it, it's just really low, and has no LFE response unless specifically boosted. I'm not a fan of all the engine note recordings, but the quality of them is perfectly fine.

 

[Scaff]

How are you running your audio? I need to put PC2 at least 15db higher on my denon receiver compared to any other game on my PS4 for comparable levels. I"m running straight HDMI uncompressed, with LFE effects in the game at 100. Plus, I need to increase subwoofer level by 1db to get any response out of it in PC2. Meanwhile, if I play Wildlands, or any movie with my subwoofer levels at 0db, my entire home shakes and my dog thinks someone is knocking at the door.

AC runs really loud for me, but that's on my Xbox oneX, and that thing is just louder than the PS4 in general.

PC2's audio quality is fine, I have nothing against it, it's just really low, and has no LFE response unless specifically boosted. I'm not a fan of all the engine note recordings, but the quality of them is perfectly fine.

PS4 Pro running LPCM straight into a Sony ES series reciever and then to a set of B&W 600 series front speakers, Monitor Audio Radius centre and rears, and a Monitor Audio sub. So it's roughly a £2k set-up, which people shouldn't need to have to get good audio.

Tactile is a Reckhorn setup with the feed coming from the sub LFE feed via a splitter.

I do run the LFE at 100 in PC2, but that's it.

 

[ThaFlash_LA]

That’s very odd. I’m using the same settings, using Boston lynnfield VR’s, vr10 center and vrs surrounds with a 12” velodyne powered sub. Are your speakers 8ohm?

Maybe AC has a low mix on PS4 too... I’d like to try pc2 on the Xbox to see how it compares on that platform.

 

[Scaff]

That’s very odd. I’m using the same settings, using Boston lynnfield VR’s, vr10 center and vrs surrounds with a 12” velodyne powered sub. Are your speakers 8ohm?

Maybe AC has a low mix on PS4 too... I’d like to try pc2 on the Xbox to see how it compares on that platform.

Yep all 8 ohm.

 

[ThaFlash_LA]

Yep all 8 ohm.

I’m going to do a dB comparison today between pc2, gt:s, ang GR:Wildands on the PS4, then AC, and Forza 7 on the Xbox, all at the same reference level.

Unfortunately I don’t think I have a way of measuring the LFE levels, but all the racing games except AC have no bass anyways.

 

[Scaff]

I’m going to do a dB comparison today between pc2, gt:s, ang GR:Wildands on the PS4, then AC, and Forza 7 on the Xbox, all at the same reference level.

Unfortunately I don’t think I have a way of measuring the LFE levels, but all the racing games except AC have no bass anyways.

Wildlands is louder on PS4 for me, but different titles do have different audio levels.

FPS tend to have more compression than a lot of others.

I've no issue with bass levels on racing titles, see the list in my signature.

What reciever are you running?

 

[ThaFlash_LA]

I have a Denon S920w.

Here's what I just measured. Edit #2: Volume was set to -45.0 on my receiver.

PS4 main menu:

GT Sport Menu Music:

GT Sport Race:

PCars 2 Race:

AC Main Menu (Xbox):

AC Race:

Forza Menu:

Forza Race:

Wildlands is much louder, and it wouldn't make a good comparison to see average db levels. But I think I can measure LFE on this app, I'll have to see how consistent it is. Apparently, according to a NIOSH study, it's relatively decent for measuring sound levels, at least for comparisons against it's own readings.

As you can see, PCars average is well below GTS. I used the AM Vantage GT3 and cockpit view on nurburgring GP for everything except AC, and I used the SLS AMG for that one. I mistakenly thought all the games had the Vantage.

Edit: I have my subwoofer level tuned for movies. It's good on AC, maybe a hair below what I'd like, good on FPS games, great on movies, but low on racing games. Turning it up to be good on my racing games makes it overpowering on movies... and probably at a realistic level on Wildlands. Unfortunately, I can't put a hotkey to change the subwoofer levels with one touch.

 

[Scaff]

I have a Denon S920w.

Here's what I just measured. Edit #2: Volume was set to -45.0 on my receiver.

PS4 main menu:

GT Sport Menu Music:

GT Sport Race:

PCars 2 Race:

AC Main Menu (Xbox):

AC Race:

Forza Menu:

Forza Race:

Wildlands is much louder, and it wouldn't make a good comparison to see average db levels. But I think I can measure LFE on this app, I'll have to see how consistent it is. Apparently, according to a NIOSH study, it's relatively decent for measuring sound levels, at least for comparisons against it's own readings.

As you can see, PCars average is well below GTS. I used the AM Vantage GT3 and cockpit view on nurburgring GP for everything except AC, and I used the SLS AMG for that one. I mistakenly thought all the games had the Vantage.

Edit: I have my subwoofer level tuned for movies. It's good on AC, maybe a hair below what I'd like, good on FPS games, great on movies, but low on racing games. Turning it up to be good on my racing games makes it overpowering on movies... and probably at a realistic level on Wildlands. Unfortunately, I can't put a hotkey to change the subwoofer levels with one touch.

What app is that and I will let you have my readings

 

[ThaFlash_LA]

noisee, on an iphone X, but all that matters is difference in output across the system. the microphone was pointed at the tv, just in front of where I'm sitting.

 

[Scaff]

OK mine are as follows.

Initial Test at -35dB with a HTC M8 I use for UDP apps on AC and PC/PC2, position in by my wheel in the phone mount I use - so its the exact same for all.

GTS: Average 52 / Max 71
AC: Average 43 / Max 69
PC2: Average 37 / Max 58
WRC7: Average 46 / Max 74
Gravel: Average 32 / Max 66

I then tested AC and PC2 at the levels I normally run them at to see if it sounding close to the same was in my head or not.

PC2 @ -25: Average 48 / Max 66
AC @ -27: Average 49 / Max 72

The GTS, AC and PC2 were all done with cockpit view, Toyota GT86 at Brands Hatch GP and my personal 'mix' in terms of audio levels in-game for all three (which has been set to give the best tactile effect I can get). The one thing that was noticeable off the bat was that tyre squeal in GTS and AC is much louder and responsible for the max readings.

In terms of bass (quite easy to tell via the tactile when these differ) is that at the same reference volume (-35) GTS and PC2 were quite close, mild engine vibration and rumble strips could be easily felt, AC however felt much more in your face (or is it arse) and too much for what is a road car (having driven a GT86 then don't attempt to take you fillings out when idling - yet the AC one does - however I have found this to be a common issue with most of the 'daily driver' road cars in AC).

Overall at reference levels the difference between AC and GTS is significantly more for me that between AC and PC2, PC2 is the quietest of the three, but not by a level that I would call massive (Gravel gets that crown in this test).

 

[ThaFlash_LA]

I was deliberately trying not to get too much tire squeal and focus on the straights to get the engine noise. I was also typically resetting my graphs to the straights to get more relevant readings.

I also think I’ve adjusted tire noise down in whichever games allow it, and maxed out the engine noise. I also have music turned off.

In pc2, the pit crew was by far the loudest, so I turned that off.

In terms of bass, yeah, pc2 and gts are similar... well I actually get better response from PC2 in terms of engine bass. And AC... yeah, you’re hearing everything about the car in that game.

I didn’t use my wheel because I didn’t want the motor and fans to throw off the readings. Not sure if they would, but it’s a non issue on the controller, that’s also why I wasn’t getting tire squeal, because I can’t drive with a controller since using a wheel.

 

[ThaFlash_LA]

And here’s wildlands.

The solid high line is emptying an lmg mag, outdoors, no canyon echo.

The next spike is when I gently set down the controller, and the next spike is me clicking the buttons for the screenshot. Both of which are higher than PC2 at the same volume.

 

[xXMann07]

*Cracks knuckles* I'll get right on that.

Jokes aside, no one here works for SMS so wording your frustration like that is quite silly. Especially after five pages of discussion on the matter.

Thanks! I will keep that in mind.......

 

[yogi bear]

I think........

It's my own thoughts, speculation and hypothesis based on what we know and how audio recording, production and playback works.



I simply offered an explanation based on the avaliable evidence.


I agree.


Technically it's not crappy sound, you should have taken the ''technobabble" on board.


I'm not Ian Bell, if you want to address him then tag him (he's a member) rather than addressing your anger at me.

Oh and AC has enough if its own audio issues.

I'm sorry you thought I was angry at you, I was under the understanding Ian bell and his team monitored posts like this... please accept my apologies. If you have the means to forward this to Ian bell and his team, please do so.

 

[DesertPenguin]

@yogi bear all you have to do is tag @IanBell

 

[Gr8_Lakes]

@ThaFlash_LA , @Scaff , THANK YOU!!! This is actual data that proves what several of us (without the technical ability) have been complaining about. It may not change anything, but at least we know our claims are now backed by some scientific data. Personally, I wasn't able to do any sim-racing the past couple months. Having just returned this past week, I was reminded just how disappointing the volume level is on Project Cars 2. Frankly, I'm shocked it hasn't been corrected yet.

 

[yogi bear]

@yogi bear all you have to do is tag @IanBell

Uummmm.... I don't know how to. I'm a senior citizen y know.

 

[Georgeagea]

Dear Mr @IanBell, please look down on us mere consumers, who paid huge amount of money, bought your game and backed it up since the launch.
We have the RIGHT to some minimum enjoyable audio experience on the PS4. The game is really really low on volume on the PS4 using high-end USB headphones. This is detracting a lot from the overall experience.
Please make your best to fix it. After some patches, we were hoping for some kind of a fix but we were left disappointed.
Thank you.

 

[Sick Cylinder]

Dear Mr @IanBell
We have the RIGHT to some minimum enjoyable audio experience on the PS4. The game is really really low on volume on the PS4 using high-end USB headphones. This is detracting a lot from the overall experience.
Please make your best to fix it. After some patches, we were hoping for some kind of a fix but we were left disappointed.
Thank you.

Agreed!

@IanBell the volume of PC2 is also very, very low for those of us who listen via a lower cost 5.1 home cinema setup. The mix is poor so even when I crank up the volume (when the family go out!) the sound is uninvolving and not immersive.

SMS can do this right - on PC1, the sound was excellent through my system. When the family went out and I cranked up the volume, the sound and volume were excellent - truly immersive - it was easy to lose myself, imagining that I was at the wheel of a classic race car.

Please fix this - I like the car and track list and don't want to be forced onto another game by the sound problems with PC2.

 

[Wolfe]

I think we can settle that the volume is low for just about everyone except for those with a setup like @Scaff's. My setup is as follows:

PS4 -> HDMI -> Monitor -> 3.5mm out -> Computer speakers with subwoofer (2.1)

When I played PCARS1, I turned the monitor's volume down from 100 to 75 because it was louder than most other games and my computer speaker volume knob is a little finicky in its low range. Playing PCARS2, I have the monitor on 100, the volume knob near max, and I have to turn the volume lower than normal on the PS4's MP3 player to balance the music with the engine sounds. And there's not very much bass coming from my subwoofer.

 

[Harry Freq]

I think we can settle that the volume is low for just about everyone except for those with a setup like @Scaff's. My setup is as follows:

PS4 -> HDMI -> Monitor -> 3.5mm out -> Computer speakers with subwoofer (2.1)

When I played PCARS1, I turned the monitor's volume down from 100 to 75 because it was louder than most other games and my computer speaker volume knob is a little finicky in its low range. Playing PCARS2, I have the monitor on 100, the volume knob near max, and I have to turn the volume lower than normal on the PS4's MP3 player to balance the music with the engine sounds. And there's not very much bass coming from my subwoofer.

I have a very similar setup like Scaff's and while volume is not an issue i just think the sound is not very good in the game.

 

[Gr8_Lakes]

I have a very similar setup like Scaff's and while volume is not an issue i just think the sound is not very good in the game.

I'm not trying to be offensive, but why would you say volume isn't an issue when you're using a highly modified sound system? How would you know if volume is a problem? Maybe you'd be better off saying, "Volume isn't a problem for me, because I've invested several hundreds of dollars into additional sound equipment." My point is, some of us would like the problem corrected. That's hard to get done when people say there is no problem.

 

[Harry Freq]

I'm not trying to be offensive, but why would you say volume isn't an issue when you're using a highly modified sound system? How would you know if volume is a problem? Maybe you'd be better off saying, "Volume isn't a problem for me, because I've invested several hundreds of dollars into additional sound equipment." My point is, some of us would like the problem corrected. That's hard to get done when people say there is no problem.

Jesus Christ when i said volume isnt an issue its clear i was talking about my setup! Also when you start with im not trying to be offensive usually follows by being offensive...

The game has audio problems wether you have an amazing surround sound, Astro A50s (which i also use at night and volume is an issue) Audio Technica ATH M50s (Which i also use plugged into the amp at night) a cheap 5.1 setup, Soundbar, TV speakers or a cheap set of cans. Turning up the volume does not hide the poor sound if anything it shows it up more. God knows where you get the game has no problem from!

 

[Georgeagea]

God knows where you get the game has no problem from!

Ok guys I think we're all in the same trench after all.
@Harry Freq Yeah man you're right but you gotta understand also where he is coming from. He's the OP of this thread and probably many other in PCars forums and yet the issue is neglected all the time.
I'm sure that at one point he even PM Ianbell, same as I did too, many times about this issue and yet they keep neglecting it.
When checking their forums, you will see lots of people claiming that "there is no issue" which could be the reason why it's being overlooked.
So yeah he seems a bit sensitive to this.

 

[Scaff]

I have a very similar setup like Scaff's and while volume is not an issue i just think the sound is not very good in the game.

I think the soun dis very, very mixed in PC2.

some sound excellent, others sound bloody appalling.

However I'm rapidly coming to the view that almost no console racing title has consistently good audio across the board.

 

[Georgeagea]

However I'm rapidly coming to the view that almost no console racing title has consistently good audio across the board.

In the exception of the menu single ear sound/music bug (which is irrelevant), I find AC to be absolutely brilliant on the sounds department. Each car feel distinctive and loud.

 

[yogi bear]

I think the soun dis very, very mixed in PC2.

some sound excellent, others sound bloody appalling.

However I'm rapidly coming to the view that almost no console racing title has consistently good audio across the board.

I'll say it again, cause it gets lost in the technobabble debate... p1 sound was fine!!,,, why did they mess with it?
Any other reasonable thoughts? And please don't use this thread to brag about your sound system, most of us are using a USB headset.

 

[Harry Freq]

I think the soun dis very, very mixed in PC2.

some sound excellent, others sound bloody appalling.

However I'm rapidly coming to the view that almost no console racing title has consistently good audio across the board.

I dont remember ever thinking PCARS had terrible sound not enough to vent frustration on the web. Is PCARS 2 on PC different to the console version sound wise?

We seem to be at a stage where Graphics & Physics are all getting better while Sound is left behind in the dust.