Rap: Music or not?Music

[BubbleBelly542]

Edit: After kind of discussing this with some friends today I think I see two different types of rap now. There is mainstream where money drugs and women are rapped about mostly, and then there is the better stuff that talks about trouble where they live or bad things happening. I tell you I do respect that type of rap. I wasn't even thinking of that when I posted this. So now you may see I'm not a totally ignorant person.

I have removed my original post as I do not feel the same anymore. Though there may be less real instruments in rap than in rock or other forms of music, I still do hear familiar instruments (nit computer sounds) in rap sometimes. Granted, I don't listen to much rap but I listen to some. I finally have respect for rap (like above, only some). You guys encouraged my to talk to my friends about this.

 

[Northstar]

"Real Music" doesn't exist. It's just something snobs created to feel better about themselves. Music is essentially anything that has rhythm, if banging pots and pans together as a child is considered music I see no reason rap isn't other than the reason listed above.

Listen to what you like, don't waste your time worrying about what other people listen to(unless you have an open mind).

 

[BubbleBelly542]

"Real Music" doesn't exist. It's just something snobs created to feel better about themselves. Music is essentially anything that has rhythm, if banging pots and pans together as a child is considered music I see no reason rap isn't other than the reason listed above.

Listen to what you like, don't waste your time worrying about what other people listen to(unless you have an open mind).

Because pots and pans aren't computers.

And I listen to some rap but I don't respect it and I don't classify it as music.

 

[BubbleBelly542]

Good point though

 

[Joel]

I don't know how you could possibly decide what's "real music".

 

[BubbleBelly542]

I don't know how you could possibly decide what's "real music".

Real music to me has only real instruments (guitars acoustic or electric, bass guitar, drums/percussion, horns, woodwinds, stringed instruments) basically only things you actually play. Even though electric and bass guitars are amplified they can still make sound on their own. Then I classify songs with electronic drum kits (not tracks) was semi-real music because it is still a synthesized sound but if a drummer is actually playing on the electronic set it takes skill.

 

[BubbleBelly542]

Though I guess there are different types of rap. Like rap-rock like Rage Against the Machine or Kid Rock. I'm not referring to that rap.

 

[Northstar]

What do you think of A capella acts?

Or for that matter electronic acts?

Seems like you think that the backbeats appear out of thin air when they don't.

Also, I guess according to you nothing is "real" music, everything you hear, even live get's altered prior to you hearing it.

^^^That is the legendary Abbey Road Studio where The Beatles made Abbey Road. Notice all the buttons? They aren't there to dim the lights, they alter the sound during recording.

For the record, I'm not a fan of rap at all, but I respect it for the impact it's made in the music industry.

 

[dylansan]

My definition of art is anything that looks good. If there's a deeper meaning, great, but there doesn't have to be. A painting works for me if it is aesthetically pleasing, whether or not it is a comment on the problems of society or something.

Similarly, it's music if it sounds good. Some rap songs are actually pleasant to listen to, but too many of them are so much about the words that it might as well not be a song at all. But then, I don't know if many rap songs would be critically praised if they were published as poetry.

 

[BubbleBelly542]

What do you think of A capella acts?

Or for that matter electronic acts?

Seems like you think that the backbeats appear out of thin air when they don't.

Also, I guess according to you nothing is "real" music, everything you hear, even live get's altered prior to you hearing it.

^^^That is the legendary Abbey Road Studio where The Beatles made Abbey Road. Notice all the buttons? They aren't there to dim the lights, they alter the sound during recording.

Acapella is singing, so it's music. It's AI finding not talking.

Electronic music once again depends. If it's someone actually plating electronic drums or a keyboard that's fine but if it's some computer program it's not.

And I know that they have producing but they had to play instruments in the first place to have something to mix.

 

[BubbleBelly542]

Look. I'll just say this. You all have brought up great points that I didn't think of. I have contradicted myself several times so I guess I don't know what to think anymore. You guys win, I'm an idiot.

 

[tonderai]

I I guess talking fast could be hard

GO ROCK!

This right here demonstrates that you do not have a clue what rap is all about which makes me wonder the point of your misinformed thread? You certainly made it clear in your post what you like so are you looking to learn more about rap or just to critique the artform without any research or evidence based knowledge? Baffled. Anyways, rappers are not about fast talking as you suggest rather they encompass a range of skills most importantly writing. I dont just mean creating verses with words that rhyme at the end of each line but rather creating deep multi syllable patterns which maintain rhythm, fluent logic or meaning, creating metaphor, social commentary and so on. There are so many different styles to the genre. They also have to master 'flow' which is unique to them and in a saturated market this is no easy feat. Rockers use guitars, rappers use their voices. Are human vocals not music? Some of the best 'poets' in our generation are rappers. I dont even like his music but you have to respect the way Eminem can put words together in deliberate rhythm without compromising the point he is trying to make. Just one of many. Maybe you should try puttimg together two meaningful bars yourself and see how easy it is. As for the drum beats...well .... I think we should just leave it here for now. Oh by the way I like rock too.

 

[astrosdude91]

/Thread.

 

[Joel]

/Thread.

 

[Prosthetic]

These "my music is better" arguments are retarded.

How about you just focus on what you like... Its not like anyone really cares if you don't think <insert genre here> is real. And if they do... they are idiots.

Seriously... What is the point of this thread?

 

[BubbleBelly542]

Rockers can wrtte songs just as good as rappers. As they have instruments to back it up.

 

[BubbleBelly542]

These "my music is better" arguments are retarded.

How about you just focus on what you like... Its not like anyone really cares if you don't think <insert genre here> is real. And if they do... they are idiots.

Seriously... What is the point of this thread?

I'm not saying mine is better. I said I listen to rap and I really do, and I don't listen to country or classical music but I have more respect for those than I do rap.

 

[Racedude]

If it's someone actually plating electronic drums or a keyboard that's fine but if it's some computer program it's not.

I think it depends on the way of using the program. You have to synchronize beats and notes and stuff to make a good song. There's effort. There's soul. There's art. There's music.
If you just loop a percussion set and a vinyl scratch for 5 minutes and think that's music, then you are wrong. That takes 20 minutes. You feel nothing from the song. There's no art. There's no music.

Examples of good electronic music:

Lower The Moon - Daniel N.
Clint Eastwood - Gorillaz
Night Crusaders - Anonymous
Satoshi Tomiie - Love in Traffic (John Creamer Mix)

 

[DK]

I'd advise you to use the "Edit" button in the bottom right corner of your posts, Bubblebelly, instead of double-posting.

As for my opinion on rap, I like some of it, e.g. Eminem, Dr. Dre, 2pac. Any of that overly autotuned crap turns me off completely. I also hate songs that repeat the same lines over and over again. I'm not talking about choruses. I'm talking about crap like this:

 

[BubbleBelly542]

I'd advise you to use the "Edit" button in the bottom right corner of your posts, Bubblebelly, instead of double-posting.

As for my opinion on rap, I like some of it, e.g. Eminem, Dr. Dre, 2pac. Any of that overly autotuned crap turns me off completely. I also hate songs that repeat the same lines over and over again. I'm not talking about choruses. I'm talking about crap like this:
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VUjdiDeJ0xg">YouTube Link</a>

I didn't know how because I'm on the app.

 

[NINE_HUNDRED]

Mainstream rap is awful these days (Lil Wayne etc ) But there are some good, lesser known ones out there.

Immortal Tech
Talib Kweli
Old Mobb Deep
Juru the Damaja

And obviously a lot more.

 

[Joker-GTBR]

If you rants about rap, come to Brazil and listen to what we call "funk". You will love rap.

 

[Nicksfix]

For the record, I'm not a fan of rap at all, but I respect it for the impact it's made in the music industry.

You beat me to it Justin.

I will go as far to say that there are some rap songs out there that are not all that bad,but you'll never see a Rap CD in my collection of music.

 

[Hollidog]

I used to be in the same boat as the OP, I used to hate rap and argue with my friend who is African and loves rap about how it wasnt real music etc etc. Then I started getting into house and funk kind of music and then softcore-ish rap stemmed from that.

Now, rap and hip hop is pretty much all I listen too. However, it is an absolute must that you avoid the mainstream at all costs. It is all trash, Chris Brown, Taio Cruz, Jason Duruollo, Pitbull, its all ****, just the same mindless crap repeated over and over. Dont even get me started on Nicki Minaj. The only exception to this rule is Kanye West, before he got big he used to be a lot better. With Late Registration probably being his best album. Outkast is also really good but they arent that mainstream.

The key with hip hop and rap is you have to find a genre or a group of artists that you like. There are so many different forms out rap that it is hard to get on to one that really suits you. Personally my favorite is kind of soul/jazz style backing tracks with some good rhymes over it. Love some piano in any rap song. Basically, a good beat, with some great flow is what it is all about. Eminem is really good at this.

Watch this;

And read this with it;
http://www.howtorapbook.com/eminemloseyourselfhowtorap.pdf

Once you get it, you really appreciate it.

 

[MercilessOne]

Check it. Seems 'real' to me.

 

[F1GTR]

Madvillain - Madvillainy
Deltron 3030 - Deltron 3030
Kanye West - College Dropout, Late Registration, My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy
Eminem - Slim Shady LP, Marshall Mathers LP
Nujabes - Metaphorical Music

A short list to help you on your quest for musical enlightenment, OP.

 

[Omnis]

I've been loving the Swim Team crew recently. Open Mike Eagle and Dumbfoundead are great. The best hip hop is stuff like this where guys just set up in a record store and jam.



Dumb has a hilarious track about the rapper archetypes too.

 

[CAM]

I find precious little rap appealing these days. Most of what I enjoy is rap slow enough for a white kid like me to keep up with . The only current rapper I really like listening to is Chip tha Ripper (Fat Raps and Baby Man are my favorites), but I do like a lot of the old school rap favorites. Tone Loc and Run DMC are pretty good, and Bust a Move by Young MC is always a fun song 👍.

 

[Live_Fr0m_NY]

Heres 3 recent rap albums in which the music is almost ENTIRELY created by a live band... Guitarist, Bassist, Drummer, Keyboardist, Horn section and the whole nine...

Curren$y - Pilot Talk
Curren$y - Pilot Talk 2
Ski beats - 24 hour karate school

Heres some standout cuts... Is this MUSIC???



That horn section is incredible... ^^^




Then there is a forthcoming album from Curren$y titled "Muscle Car Chronicles" entirely produced by indie folk/rock artist Sean O' Connell...

 

[CAM]

Heres 3 recent rap albums in which the music is almost ENTIRELY created by a live band... Guitarist, Bassist, Drummer, Keyboardist, Horn section and the whole nine...

Curren$y - Pilot Talk
Curren$y - Pilot Talk 2
Ski beats - 24 hour karate school

Then there is a forthcoming album from Curren$y titled "Muscle Car Chronicles" entirely produced by indie folk/rock artist Sean O' Connell...

Heres some standout cuts... Is this MUSIC???
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7kvpSk8rjkc">YouTube Link</a>
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j_rJi1kte7c">YouTube Link</a>
That horn section is incredible... ^^^
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BvOK1tn6eLM">YouTube Link</a>
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nf6vSHsNncg">YouTube Link</a>
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=in8I0ztyL6Y">YouTube Link</a>

Curren$y is featured in Fat Raps, the song I posted in the previous comment 👍. Great song, he's a good rapper.