- 548
- Newport Beach, CA
- TurismoSlayer
You're right. But like others have said before, this is their game and we play it.
Simulating everything feature
- Thread starter turismoslayer
- 98 comments
- 5,602 views
- 2,790
- Vancouver, BC
- liampage123
A lot of the whining we do is pointless.
- 1,689
- NY
- SavageEvil
That's what they call it, never understood why PD still uses the term Arcade mode since it's basically select and play, but it still has everything and then some from SP. I prefer arcade because the AI can be turned up to max, and I can get realistic damage, tire wear and fuel consumption and choose the amount of laps, time of day/weather(on certain courses). Arcade mode is pretty much online minus the human opponent element.The point I make is not they are wrong for not doing it my way .. but just
There are so many basic simple things that are wrong with GT that could & should be attended to before these kind of things are tackled. after all I am paying them for this.. lets not forget that ( and that does entitle me to a small opinion on things )
I am all for immersion and getting it as real as possible .. and PD are doing a very very good job .. but if your going to be claim " the real driving simulator " surely the basics are pretty important.
Pc simulators as in GTR2 / RFACTOR / don't consider air temperature in the equation .. why .. because physics are far more important to the realness they are after and once those are correct .. then tackle the likes of nature.
I did also ind it interesting you stated you like to play the " arcade mode " to see how far the simulation goes ..
rFactor and Slightly Mad studios are doing things their way, PD is doing their thing another. For PD getting basic things wrong as you say, why do people still play and get excited for their games? I'm all for criticism and it's fine as long as they are in the correct forum for it, but many go off on tangents because PD didn't add this or didn't remove that or didn't work on this; they are incompetent for it or a myriad of other silly remarks. They are doing things from their perspective and I have reluctantly accepted that.
I have a laundry list of things that I wished PD did, but I have no direct input or bearing on the overall project of a GT game. My focus is to enjoy the best of the good stuff and avoid all the bad things or deal with them. GT5 was full or things that grated on my nerves to no end. I could list exactly how I would layout GT from a players' and tinkerers' point and I can guarantee that if it was made we'd still have the myriad of complaints because it wasn't what this or that player wanted. We all want GT to be how we envision it but forget that it's not our vision, it's PD' s and they are just inviting us into their vision.
Also please we shouldn't measure PD simulation to PC simulation since PC simulators tend not to be for the masses. PD made this game to be enjoyable but close enough to blur the line of game and reality. I'm pretty sure that it's no easy task to build a car driving game that can give you a sense of driving with a damn controller(contrary to what anyone says, it's rubbish). After driving plenty of vehicles it's a serious amount of balancing going on to translate steering wheel controls to a left and right stick movement. I still applaud them for even trying to do these things which many see as trivial but it sure isn't(I did some programming back in the day, not fun in the least, you are ecstatic when you compile and it works as intended but if it doesn't you have to trace after finding the initial stop, then it goes to hell).
I want GT to not have shortcomings in my own eyes but who knows how short is comes up in terms of the developers themselves. What exactly are their goals for this series and game overall?
- 175
- Iowa
- Phreon
Realistic water buildup on track (wet spots, dry spots, puddles, splash) and changing seasons would all be at the top of my list.
Imagine being able to see the Nurb change over the course of a year, driving it in the fall as the trees start to change color/lose their leaves and into the winter with patches of snow and ice... that would be epic.
Imagine being able to see the Nurb change over the course of a year, driving it in the fall as the trees start to change color/lose their leaves and into the winter with patches of snow and ice... that would be epic.
- 331
- Addison, TX
- MX5_Racer_69
Simulating "everything" is great. But atmosphere is one of the last I'd tackle. I'd much rather see them address things like when you go off track and get dirt or sand on your tires, it usually takes at least a lap to scrub all that off the tires and get full grip back. I'd like to see them recognize that different track surfaces have different grip. And where there is a patch on the road, the driver has to experiment with braking to see which line is actually faster. If someone goes off track and comes back on, it should leave dirt on the track that lowers the grip there. Simulate that. Then worry about humidity.
- 250
- Desert
Simulate everything... except function collision physics with other cars.
Yeah how about we focus on things that affect the core gameplay, first.
K?
Joking aside. Like I said in my thread. PDs goals are so big, they should get extra hands to help with the non core features of the next game.
Yeah how about we focus on things that affect the core gameplay, first.
K?
Joking aside. Like I said in my thread. PDs goals are so big, they should get extra hands to help with the non core features of the next game.
- 974
- GOTHEBURG
oil, debrese is as important...but also warning flags, safetycars, standing start, lights at start instead of 3..2..1, a little more simulate racing would be fun too.
PD know all this and of course will blow us away in gt7 with all new gen stuff they can do. If not GT7 then 8 or 9. I guess we love the series because it is never finished and the better it gets the more details we like to be included and so does PD. They prioritize what and how and we push for our thoughts through forums like this. Money and capacity and technical shortcomings will always be our problem. Sounds...one day in GT10 all cars will sound the same. Electrical cars will be a fact
PD know all this and of course will blow us away in gt7 with all new gen stuff they can do. If not GT7 then 8 or 9. I guess we love the series because it is never finished and the better it gets the more details we like to be included and so does PD. They prioritize what and how and we push for our thoughts through forums like this. Money and capacity and technical shortcomings will always be our problem. Sounds...one day in GT10 all cars will sound the same. Electrical cars will be a fact
- 235
- Tennessee
- AGNT009
What we will likely get is 3-5 canned weather changes per track or the whole game. You'll then have to memorize the starting conditions and then know what the game will change it to. Kaz isnt going to put the feature in and not have it be noticible. I suggest everyone research all the PC game NASCAR Racing 2003 game articles and how setup tuners modify their setups for weather. In the league I raced that game in, weather was locked at 70 degrees because if you're not a NASCAR crewchief, you are clueless on how to chase the weather and changing track conditions. People have the game now, is anyone noticing a difference in car handling from beginning of race to the end yet?
- 7,765
- Yorkshire
- ScapeGoat4U
- WhippingBoy
If they really wanna "simulate everything", a good start would be to simulate some actual motorsport series. Evolution Studios done a great job on the PS2 with their official WRC games in that regard, the stats & point tables were very good. I'd like to see that kind of thing in Gran Turismo rather than accurate star maps!
- 1,689
- NY
- SavageEvil
I forgot to add, I wonder when they will start taking into account the weight of the driver? Perhaps we can use our own vitals for our drivers and have our weight directly input in the game. It may not seem like much but weight of the driver factors in to racing, there aren't many heavy drivers out there if any at all. Hey it's something to think about especially with lightweight cars like Lotus' and Karts.
- 4,605
- United States
- carracerptp
- 23
- United Kingdom
- lordsinister17
Pretty much agree with the other post. Even though im 140 pounds and 6' , no ones gonna take that as honesty for online racing, as my psn mail box is inundated with such mail .
- 2,833
- 28,470
- Windsor, Ontario, Canada
- Johnnypenso
Except I'm only 4'8" and 78 lbs...
- 548
- Newport Beach, CA
- TurismoSlayer
I was thinking this last night. Especially the height. Might give a different perception in interior view. I noticed my driver in the interior view on a replay was sitting at least 6 inches forward from the seat back and his knees were almost touching the dash. What the hell? Grandpa Bob must have been driving.
- 4,552
- Australia
It looks they're focusing on eye candy like they always do - I don't think temperature will have much of a realistic impact on performance without completely redoing the tyre model.
Like many, I would rather PD prioritise and seriously address sounds, AI, and race formats (qualifying, standing starts, proper rolling starts) by allocating the staff and resources to do so.
- 548
- Newport Beach, CA
- TurismoSlayer
Have they not already re-done the tire model??
- 4,552
- Australia
I don't believe so. I've heard nothing about tyre pressures either.
- 548
- Newport Beach, CA
- TurismoSlayer
New tire model, in cooperation with Yokohama Rubber Co.? I may be wrong but I think they have completely redone the tire model.
- 241
- Arizona
- MACHINE1121
I haven't seen it specifically mentioned, but does anyone think they will consider the effects of elevation? At Eiger or Matterhorn, engines should produce less horsepower, and there should be less drag and less downforce. The incorporation of just a standard atmosphere table would be a very simple thing to do. They need to get this right if we every want to see Pikes Peak modeled correctly as potential DLC (Given all the new Pikes Peak cars, I'm hopeful). There is a reason that Pikes Peak cars have a massive amount of horsepower.
http://autos.yahoo.com/blogs/motoramic/peugeot-pikes-peak-racer-packs-875-hp-taking-174743494.html
Regarding the humidity, I think one of PD's main objectives is to affect the lighting. The dry desert environment of Willow Springs should look very clear with intense sunlight, while the Florida humidity of Daytona should produce a slightly hazy effect. Other tracks are likely somewhere in between with high probability of fog in places like Spa and Nurburgring. Secondarily, high humidity will produce denser air, which should increase drag and downforce.
I hope PD improves the sound as GT6 receives updates and GT7 eventually gets released because it is a very important factor for immersion, but I'm very happy they're digging deep in the the atmospherics. I just hope they get it right.
http://autos.yahoo.com/blogs/motoramic/peugeot-pikes-peak-racer-packs-875-hp-taking-174743494.html
Regarding the humidity, I think one of PD's main objectives is to affect the lighting. The dry desert environment of Willow Springs should look very clear with intense sunlight, while the Florida humidity of Daytona should produce a slightly hazy effect. Other tracks are likely somewhere in between with high probability of fog in places like Spa and Nurburgring. Secondarily, high humidity will produce denser air, which should increase drag and downforce.
I hope PD improves the sound as GT6 receives updates and GT7 eventually gets released because it is a very important factor for immersion, but I'm very happy they're digging deep in the the atmospherics. I just hope they get it right.
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- 2,258
- Adelaide, South Australia
- s_dawg4
And tyre width! In GT5 I put different rims on my 1200 (VW) but the wheels and tyres stayed the same width as the manufacturers. WTF is with that??
Tyre width plays a big part in the handling of a car too!
- 6,425
- KCCO
That is a joke right? NASCAR and weather in the same sentence? No, invalid argument...
The average human consumes 7 liters of air every minute, where as a car (say a 3 liter v6 at 1.5 gpm and cruising in 6th at 3000 rpm .. A four stroke too..) will consume an average of 450 liters with a steady foot. Note, this is under the assumption that the oxygen in the air is at 20% levels.
The car has more oxygen that it can loose than the human, as asphyxiation will occur resulting in death. With a decrease in available oxygen, as you mentioned, a car will lose power due to the efficiency decreasing, causing excess exhausts. Just about every car past 1965 has an O2 sensor, controlled by the computer which will determine how fast to rotate the camshaft to allow for more or less oxygen. The fuel injectors are also limited or increased, adding more gasoline to the cylinders. The spark plugs a re also measured to determine optimal firing ranges, in the measurements of pico-meters I would assume. So with an increase in altitude, your o2 sensor is controlling how much power will be created.
And I didn't even get to the second or third stage o2 sensors....
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- 6,425
- KCCO
- 548
- Newport Beach, CA
- TurismoSlayer
Looks as though you're from Georgia, you would know the difference. :-)
- 6,425
- KCCO
Tacoma is just as wet from what I hear.... No pun intended..
- 548
- Newport Beach, CA
- TurismoSlayer
Haha! Yeah, mixed with cold and you got yourself a perfect recipe for an atmospheric changing race at the Seattle circuit...or maybe not.
- 4,605
- United States
- carracerptp
In oval racing times are measured in hundredths of a second, whether has a huge effect.
What engine can do that? You mean changing the timing right (phasing). Most of the changes would be in the fuel/air mix anyway.
