Still more MINIs on the way.... Coupe pantent drawings are out.

[MatskiMonk]

Understeer.

I am admittedly a massive BMW enthusiast, or fanboi, or whatever... but seeing somebody that is clearly an Audi fan point out the shortcomings of FWD is quite amusing...

 

[AudiMan2011]

I am admittedly a massive BMW enthusiast, or fanboi, or whatever... but seeing somebody that is clearly an Audi fan point out the shortcomings of FWD is quite amusing...

B7 RS4 and Gen 1 R8 would disagree with you.

 

[synchromesh]

B7 RS4 and Gen 1 R8 would disagree with you.

Understeer can be avoided if engineers put thought into their suspensions and tires.

 

[Bo]

Understeer.

...Is something that's built into FWD cars through setup because of their natural tendency to oversteer, and compounded by torque steer which is very easy to overcome with basic engineering.

 

[SlipZtrEm]

B7 RS4 and Gen 1 R8 would disagree with you.

I'd hardly include the R8 as evidence that Audi struggles to minimize understeer on their majority front-engined, front-biased range, brilliant as it may be. There's a reason the terribly-damped, over-stiff, communication-free cliche exists for most of Audi's S or RS cars...

I'm also not sure why people are writing off the Superleggera as some plowing, torque-steering disappointment already, when there's been plenty of proof of BMW making sure current MINI's are anything but. Also: have people seen this thing? It's fantastic looking in person, and usefully smaller than the current hatch.

If front drive was good enough for this, twenty years ago:

I'm sure BMW will manage.

 

[MatskiMonk]

B7 RS4 and Gen 1 R8 would disagree with you.

Oh, don't get me wrong, I'd never say Audi made bad cars... and the ones you mentioned... well the R8 (ugly though it is), is/are very capable cars. But even my lowly 120d is RWD, if the driven wheels are so much of an issue for any enthusiast, BMW surely has to be the option...

Anyway, no quarrel intended 👍 , I just thought it was funny. If I wanted to argue with Audi fans, that's what BMW forums are for..

 

[Venari]

People can make great FWD cars - the R53 was one of them, and would have been even better with an alloy engine. Go ahead, like the later ones if you like, but they're nowhere near as good as they should be.

It's a two seater, why don't they just lump the whole lot powertrain backwards by 2 metres?

Superleggera means 'very light'. Electric motors aren't and there will be one too many power sources in the car if you fit both.

Figuring out the dynamics of that mess of power is a complex calibration task, and totally unnecessary. You want a 'sports car'? Buy an MX-5. Simple, elegant, pure.

IMO, BMW have lost their way. And I worked for them - worst career decision I ever made.

 

[Eunos_Cosmo]

I saw the Superleggera concept at Detroit and it was really, really, *really* beautiful. The size and proportions are absolutely perfect. It's just a very pretty thing. Sadly I doubt the production version will be nearly as good.

 

[MatskiMonk]

IMO, BMW have lost their way. And I worked for them - worst career decision I ever made.

You should have been a shareholder instead, you would have a different opinion.

 

[Joey D]

For being FWD the MINI handles exceptionally well and I believe Fifth Gear even put the two up against one another in a "shootout" of sorts. The Cooper actually beat the MX5 around the track they were using and while it's just one track, I think it shows that the MINI can hold it's own against the MX5 even if the MX5 is better in some situations.

Here's the YouTube clip if anyone is interested.


I still find it funny when people slag on FWD, it's not the 1980's any more and manufactures know how to make FWD cars handle extremely well, even cheap ones.

 

[niky]

FWD has one deficit versus RWD... Understeer under power. Which means that you will be lifting off midcorner to get more front end bite, or jumping off midcorner to induce oversteer... unlike RWD... Oh, wait...

No, it means you can't jump on the gas early on the exit, because you'll start to drift off your racing line... unlike RWD... Oh, wait...

A lot of FWD card are junk around the racetrack... because they're designed not to corner very well.*

Most MINIs are pretty good around the racetrack, and are very playful, because they are designed to corner very well. The only issue is that, at the very limit, you will get understeer under power (that's why you trailbrake, though, exit corner at a sharper angle, ride the power out) and there's a few degrees too much rear camber for my taste.

Worst MINI I've ever driven is the Countryman ALL4 S JCW. It's one of the (not so) few times I've said to myself "You know, this thing would be so much more fun if it were FWD."

Only issue I would have with the Superleggera is perhaps the hybrid system... which is all fine and dandy in a big sports sedan... but the extra weight of the hybrid ruined the CR-Z (which is great to drive, otherwise), and I fear it might... might... make the Superleggera a bit less sprightly than the regular MINI hatch.

*ergo, designed simply to understeer... a trait shared with many rear wheel drive vehicles, as well...

 

[SVPSkins]

Haven't had any problems yet? And do you love those sexy switches on the dash?

the '66 mini plays up now and again, as expected being so old and yes i love the switch on the dash =)

 

[synchromesh]

Even with all season tires (no season tires) my '06 Mini Cooper handles better than anything else my family has ever owned. No understeer that I've really noticed.

 

[VXR]

Using the B7 RS4 to prove Audi can make fun cars is really painful. That one appears to have been a peak for the company before it retreated back into safe, super competence.

 

[SVX]

Understeer.

Last time I looked we don't live in the 70s any more.

 

[AudiMan2011]

A Mini... sedan?
http://www.roadandtrack.com/new-cars/future-cars/news/a28808/mini-sedan-rumor/

 

[Kitten]

Okay. I lost faith on Mini Cooper...

 

[05XR8]

It's like the Morris hatchbacks they are everywhere.

 

[Nessy]

Well they did have the Wolseley Hornet, back in the day.

 

[The87Dodge]

Honestly, I'm kind of excited to see a Mini sedan. There has not been one since 50 years ago, and I'm curious about how it will look. I hope Mini doesn't screw it up.

 

[VXR]

Judging by the new models released so far, the design language will ruin it.

The best looking current one is the Clubman and then only from the front.

 

[MatskiMonk]

The only rendering I've seen of a saloon treatment, that didn't look like total garbage, of any MINI was this one..

Personally I think BMW are going to have a really hard time getting this to look right, the typical rounded tail-end of the MINI family just doesn't suit a saloon shape IMHO.

 

[VXR]

That rendering does look very good. It helps being based on the last model. THe bulbous style of the new one is likely to sit ill at ease with a three-box shape.

 

[05XR8]

All I see them doing is, cutting the rear windows and making it a hatch with a rear deck like a Hyundai Accent

 

[catamount39]

The only rendering I've seen of a saloon treatment, that didn't look like total garbage, of any MINI was this one..

Personally I think BMW are going to have a really hard time getting this to look right, the typical rounded tail-end of the MINI family just doesn't suit a saloon shape IMHO.

That's not SO bad...I suppose. If it looked like that it wouldn't be too terrifying.

 

[Roger the Horse]

Mini saloon. There has not been one since 16 years ago

Fixed.

 

[XJ40]

The only rendering I've seen of a saloon treatment, that didn't look like total garbage, of any MINI was this one..

If you look at it one section at a time it's fine, but as a whole..... It's less than the sum of it's parts.

 

[TexRex]

Well they did have the Wolseley Hornet, back in the day.

And was it Crayford that stuck a Hornet boot on the back of a Mini? I could be wrong about it being Crayford, perhaps confusing their convertible Hornets, but I know someone did and that brings it back around to Mini. There's also the Ecurie de Dez, Buckle Monaco and the Broadspeed GT that used Mini front clips with reworked sheetmetal aft of the cowl.

 

[Nessy]

And was it Crayford that stuck a Hornet boot on the back of a Mini? I could be wrong about it being Crayford, perhaps confusing their convertible Hornets, but I know someone did and that brings it back around to Mini.

I honestly don't know. There are Mini coupes in existence though (I believe made by Morris/Austin), so maybe it was them that created the idea. Thanks for bringing the Ecurie de Dez and Buckle Monaco to my attention (never seen them before), and you gotta love the Broadspeed GT. 👍

 

[05XR8]

http://www.goauto.com.au/mellor/mellor.nsf/story2/6E8224969AC81C23CA257FD5002001E7

FUTURE Mini models will be digitally personalised to adapt to the driver and will be part of large-scale car-sharing operations, as previewed by the Mini Vision Next 100 concept that was revealed in Germany overnight.

The BMW Group-owned brand has used the motto, 'every Mini is my Mini' for the latest interpretation of future urban mobility that showcases a “particular take” on autonomous car-sharing.

When the self-driving Mini arrives to pick up its occupant, it identifies the person and adapts immediately to the driver's preference and tastes through “fully connected digital intelligence” and can be called on any time of the day or night.

The company says that in the future people may be attracted to the Mini brand but may not have the need to own a car, hence the design team's focus on car-sharing and a concept that was “instantly adaptable” and available whenever and wherever they need it.

The concept has a silver skin the company refers to as a blank canvas that is utilised differently depending on the user. Elements including the colour of the roof and the lighting in the cabin respond differently to each individual user.

It uses “projections adapted to the driver in terms of colour, graphics and content to create a personalised experience and customised package of on-board information”, according to Mini.

Mini is calling the circular centre instrument cluster familiar to Mini owners the Cooperizer, which is illuminated and personalised for driver's tastes relating to communications, entertainment and autonomous driving.

An 'Inspire Me' button uses downloaded user data to provide information or inspiration that may be of interest to the driver, such as the work of an artist they admire or to recommend a more challenging driving route and switching to John Cooper Works performance mode.

The car-maker says that in the future, “driving in a Mini must still be fun to the extent that drivers will prefer to drive themselves – as often as possible”.

Future Minis will retain their go-kart feeling and even take it to a new level, the company says, and a clear glass front end of the concept gives a dynamic view of the road and augmented reality displays show a route or driving line.

No information was provided on the powertrain aside from the fact that it produces zero emissions.

Mini says the concept has a smaller footprint that is closely aligned to the first Mini from 1959 thanks to a “reduced need for crash zones in the future”, presumably due to mostly autonomous driving.

There is a full-width bench seat up front, and the steering wheel and pedals slide to adjust their position depending on whether it will be driven autonomously or by a person. If the Mini is parked in a tight space, the doors will automatically open as wide as they are able to within the restricted confines, a feature that is similar to the falcon-wing doors from the Tesla Model X.

Mini believes that with the more widespread use of a shared car networks, interiors will need to far more hard-wearing.

The concept uses recycled aluminium and plastic in the floor area, roof lining and side panel trim, as well as far less common materials such as brass, basalt and cellulose rather than traditional and less sustainable interior materials including wood and leather. Seats are covered in “robust” knitted Alcantara.

Mini says it has used elements of “analogue design” in the wheels, the outer surface of which does not move with only a disc behind it turning with the tyre, giving the effect of a piece of “mechanical jewellery”.

The car-maker talks of a future where the driver, or user, becomes part of the “Mini community” and it has a vision of what it describes as “experience sharing”.

“For example, if a Mini user in the future is interested in a certain type of art and a friend gets hold of some last-minute tickets to a preview for an exhibition they might like. The Vision Vehicle identifies what’s involved, and coordinates and organises the whole excursion. The drive itself becomes part of a perfectly arranged service.”

Head of Mini Design Anders Warming said the concept takes the brand well into the future while retaining its core values.

“The Mini Vision Next 100 shows how Mini’s unique take on the world could look in the future. The driving experience remains the emotional centrepiece, with effortless and seamless services grouped around it.”

The concept was revealed at the same time as BMW Group sister brand Rolls-Royce's vision of the future and follows the BMW Vision Next 100 coupe from March this year. A Motorrad motorcycle concept of a similar theme is set to appear in Los Angeles later this year.