The GT6 Epic Whining and Crying Thread

[pyrates]

I am really puzzled by the following. How can PD/Sony/whatever strategic mastermind put out a game like GT6 at the time they did?

You know in the next generation you have a competitor like never before (PCars) and at the same time you need your current fan base to shell out good money for new hardware for your next title. So please correct me if I am wrong, but I would either skip a PS3 release altogether or make sure GT6 blows away everybody so that the fans can't wait to spend money on GT7 and a PS4.

But instead they released the worst title in franchise history putting off even the most loyal of their fan base. The most logical explanation is that they wanted to skim the PS3 market before its end. But I wouldn't be surprised if the GT6 profit is much smaller than what they will lose in the next generation from fans they put off.

 

[mister dog]

But instead they released the worst title in franchise history putting off even the most loyal of their fan base. The most logical explanation is that they wanted to skim the PS3 market before its end. But I wouldn't be surprised if the GT6 profit is much smaller than what they will lose in the next generation from fans they put off.

I think the biggest part of GT buyers are just average joes that want a game with pretty cars, or moms buying it for their kids for xmas. Die hards will go and seek their pleasure elsewhere for the full experience, but the GT machine is that big already as a name, that it's guaranteed a couple of million sales anyway with whatever they shelve out.

 

[pyrates]

I think the biggest part of GT buyers are just average joes that want a game with pretty cars, or moms buying it for their kids for xmas. Die hards will go and seek their pleasure elsewhere for the full experience, but the GT machine is that big already as a name, that it's guaranteed a couple of million sales anyway with whatever they shelve out.

The thing is a brand name carries you only so far if there is nothing good behind it anymore. Remember Blackberry?

 

[mister dog]

The thing is a brand name carries you only so far if there is nothing good behind it anymore. Remember Blackberry?

Was a brand like blackberry as established in it's respective world as PD is in the gaming one? I remember seeing those phones being hyped only for a year or 2 whilst GT is a bit like the COD of racing games; so even if their latest games are a disappointment the name sells itself anyhow as it's that established.

In a any case they will have to scale down from what they were before, as the route they are going they are never gonna reach those sales of their first games anymore, but unless Sony takes away it's dollars they don't have to fear much. The publicity machine which other developers are praying for will always be there for PD.

"Looks into glass ball, sees a fancy trailer for GT7 prologue 'coming soon to PS4'!"

 

[pyrates]

Was a brand like blackberry as established in it's respective world as PD is in the gaming one? I remember seeing those phones being hyped only for a year or 2 whilst GT is a bit like the COD of racing games; so even if their latest games are a disappointment the name sells itself anyhow as it's that established.

In a any case they will have to scale down from what they were before, as the route they are going they are never gonna reach those sales of their first games anymore, but unless Sony takes away it's dollars they don't have to fear much. The publicity machine which other developers are praying for will always be there for PD.

"Looks into glass ball, sees a fancy trailer for GT7 prologue 'coming soon to PS4'!"

I would say Blackberry was. But aside from that specific example there are plenty of once huge brands that slowly died because they couldn't deliver what they once stood for. GT has not quite delivered for a decade now. That is a long enough time for loyals to quit and new players that didn't have experience with the great titles to simply not stick with the franchise.

I am really curious about GT7 sales numbers as that will indicate if the series can regain fans. The outcome of the VGT project will also quite clearly show how deep GT's ties with the manufactures really are. I can see GT celebrating its 20th anniversary but after that I am not so sure.

 

[Johnnypenso]

Was a brand like blackberry as established in it's respective world as PD is in the gaming one? I remember seeing those phones being hyped only for a year or 2 whilst GT is a bit like the COD of racing games; so even if their latest games are a disappointment the name sells itself anyhow as it's that established.

In a any case they will have to scale down from what they were before, as the route they are going they are never gonna reach those sales of their first games anymore, but unless Sony takes away it's dollars they don't have to fear much. The publicity machine which other developers are praying for will always be there for PD.

"Looks into glass ball, sees a fancy trailer for GT7 prologue 'coming soon to PS4'!"

There was a time in North America, albeit not as prolongued as GT's reign in the gaming market, that a BlackBerry was the phone to have. If you didn't have one you weren't cool or hip or up to date technologically. It all came crashing down rather quickly because BB misjudged the marketplace just as PD has misjudged the changing gaming marketplace and the maturing of it's core audience.

 

[Jay84]

To put this entire thread into one sentence: "All these months later we STILL have a half finished game"

 

[Ameer67]

To put this entire thread into one sentence: "All these months later we STILL have a half finished game"

Sad, but I'm guessing that's how it's going to be unfortunately.

 

[86Debris86]

To put this entire thread into one sentence: "All these months later we STILL have a half finished game"

Sad, but I'm guessing that's how it's going to be unfortunately.

I have still have faith that GT6 will get a lot better and things like camber, frame rate drops, sounds, crashing/freezing etc will be fixed. Trouble is I think that won't be for at least 6 more months, maybe a year. And I do mean at least. Waaaaay too late.

PD may just write off GT6 all together instead. In which case, as I've said before, GT7 will have to be almost perfect from launch in order to win me back.

 

[TokoTurismo]

I hope the interviews are so hard on Kaz, that the only thing he can do... Is laugh...

 

[Ameer67]

I hope the interviews are so hard on Kaz, that the only thing he can do... Is laugh...

Or say: "It's technically possible..."

 

[NLxAROSA]

Was a brand like blackberry as established in it's respective world as PD is in the gaming one?

Yes it was, but another good example: Nokia. And those two companies didn't even really make bad or half-baked products, they were actually quite decent. Still they were eaten alive by the competition (iOS first and then Android).

 

[Brend]

The thing is a brand name carries you only so far if there is nothing good behind it anymore. Remember Blackberry?

I have a Blackberry Q10 and it's amazing.


To answer your question though, I think that GT6 was basically 'free money' for PD and Sony, they may have spent a bit on making it but at the end of the day, most of the new assets will be PS4 quality with a few tweaks. GT6 seems like a stop gap because I fear it is.

 

[CeeJay]

I'm really trying hard not to be cynical but the fact I can go to Amazon and STILL see GT6 being advertised with 3 bullet points about the game content that is still nowhere to be found in the actual product is troubling. They haven't removed that or qualified it with *to be added at a later date* or something to let the customer know this is NOT a part of the game as of this date.. but they did updated the game page to include a blurb about the KAZ movie:

"Through the support of PlayStation, Kaz's journey has forever changed the gaming and automotive landscape and in doing so, has redefined how we perceive the relationship between art, entertainment and culture."



If we were in the GT4 era I might want to discuss Kaz and PD in this light but with what GT6 has accomplished I just balk at the "art/entertainment/culture" stuff being placed under what could technically be called false advertising. I just don't like this at all..

I keep waffling between total cynicism and thinking.. well, maybe Kaz and PD will pull it together and fix this.. but I just don't know anymore. I really REALLY miss the GT2 - GT4 days.. man I almost worshiped GT back then.

 

[Agent_47]

I'm really trying hard not to be cynical but the fact I can go to Amazon and STILL see GT6 being advertised with 3 bullet points about the game content that is still nowhere to be found in the actual product is troubling. They haven't removed that or qualified it with *to be added at a later date* or something to let the customer know this is NOT a part of the game as of this date.. but they did updated the game page to include a blurb about the KAZ movie:

"Through the support of PlayStation, Kaz's journey has forever changed the gaming and automotive landscape and in doing so, has redefined how we perceive the relationship between art, entertainment and culture."



If we were in the GT4 era I might want to discuss Kaz and PD in this light but with what GT6 has accomplished I just balk at the "art/entertainment/culture" stuff being placed under what could technically be called false advertising. I just don't like this at all..

I keep waffling between total cynicism and thinking.. well, maybe Kaz and PD will pull it together and fix this.. but I just don't know anymore. I really REALLY miss the GT2 - GT4 days.. man I almost worshiped GT back then.

Same here. I sold the game because I'm sick of sitting here waiting for them to give us the game that they promised. I miss GT2 and GT4. I remember three other kids on my block had it. Our parents would get together, drink and shoot pool until 2am listening to music and we would sit and play GT2, GT3 and GT4 all night.

 

[Johnnypenso]

If this doesn't make you whine and cry (I know I did) about GT6 nothing will. This is from Grid Autosport, a game that's supposed to be only slightly leaning towards sim but still with an arcade flavour and it's referring to online racing:

Impact Ratings

These are still in GRID Autosport but we’ve made a few changes. In particular they now change over a larger number of races. As a result you won’t see the less rapid fluctuation in the rating that you did in GRID 2.

Drive Clean Award

There is a much better incentive for clean racing in GRID Autosport than it was in GRID 2. With buying and selling cars occurring with greater frequency in Autosport you’ll certainly want that money.

Impact Collisions

A collision between a player with a bad rating and a player with a good rating will affect the player with the bad rating more.

Penalty Ghosting

While under a penalty a player will find themselves ghosted. This should stop anyone from getting a penalty in order to hold up the traffic behind them. In short it stops them using their car as a blockade.

Collision Weightings

These have been fine tuned to make it much harder to take someone out, we’ll go on record to say it’s the most well refined it’s ever been.

Stationary on-track

Parking yourself on the track without moving will get you disqualified, do it repeatedly and you’ll be automatically removed from the session.

Kick-Rejoin

If you kick a troublemaker from a lobby they will not be able to rejoin.

Custom Cup (Custom playlists) Search

We’ve vastly improved the Custom Cup search functionality, to allow players to find sessions that suit their tastes better. If you want to race without collisions or damage, this will be much easier to find compared to GRID 2.

Full Damage

This is set to on as default in GRID Autosport, including official playlists. If you ram someone, chances are you’ll take yourself out of the race. With the mechanical damage system in play you won’t be able to abuse your car continuously.

Damage Done Costs $$$

You have to pay for damage done to cars, players that don’t race cleanly will find their progress hampered because they are always having to pay for repairs. More on this in the coming weeks. And yes, it's on PS3.

Damage Model

The new damage model definitely helps, cars are stable and planted on the tarmac, it’s not like GRID 2 where cars drifted at incredible speeds all the time, and the slightest knock would send them out of control.

 

[VBR]

@Johnnypenso - I really don't like Codemasters, but I have to admit that does sound quite promising.

 

[fredyellowone]

DriveClub delayed to... 7 October.

God.
Help.
Us.

 

[pyrates]

DriveClub delayed to... 7 October.

God.
Help.
Us.

Which year?

 

[fredyellowone]

Which year?

LOL! This year, at least.

 

[sparkytooth]

LOL! This year, at least.

I thought the year was coming in a future update.

 

[napalmhardcore]

@Johnnypenso - I really don't like Codemasters, but I have to admit that does sound quite promising.

Just curious. How far back do you go with Codemasters titles?

 

[VBR]

Just curious. How far back do you go with Codemasters titles?

Tried demos as far back as PS2, & demos on PS3. Bought one of their F1 games & hated it, traded it in for GT5 at launch.

 

[napalmhardcore]

Tried demos as far back as PS2, & demos on PS3. Bought one of their F1 games & hated it, traded it in for GT5 at launch.

I've been gaming for around 25 years. Codemasters have made some great games. They've made some utter crap too, but through the PS1 and PS2 era, I personally think they were amazing (for racing games).

The reason I asked is, if your experience was based on only PS3 era games, I'd say fair enough. But if your experience went back to the PS1 days, I'd have asked you what you were playing (other than GT) that was better.

 

[bluecharger]

Question for the "other games" folks: How about for someone who liked Dirt, not so much Dirt2? While I wasn't nuts about the limited cars (GT HAS spoiled me for that, after all), Dirt WAS the first game to EVER make me LIKE driving French cars (CitrOWN! PeugYO! Oui Oui! RowROUGH!). Note: I do not, and don't ever plan on buying a wheel/pedals rig. Any suggestions?

 

[napalmhardcore]

Question for the "other games" folks: How about for someone who liked Dirt, not so much Dirt2? While I wasn't nuts about the limited cars (GT HAS spoiled me for that, after all), Dirt WAS the first game to EVER make me LIKE driving French cars (CitrOWN! PeugYO! Oui Oui! RowROUGH!). Note: I do not, and don't ever plan on buying a wheel/pedals rig. Any suggestions?

Personally I didn't like the first Dirt because of the handling, but I did really like the courses. I might be able to suggest some rally games, but it depends on what you liked about the first Dirt.

Edit: Thinking about it, I may need some more info, like is it necessarily a rally game you're after and what systems do you own?

 

[VBR]

I've been gaming for around 25 years. Codemasters have made some great games. They've made some utter crap too, but through the PS1 and PS2 era, I personally think they were amazing (for racing games).

The reason I asked is, if your experience was based on only PS3 era games, I'd say fair enough. But if your experience went back to the PS1 days, I'd have asked you what you were playing (other than GT) that was better.

For me, it was the unrealistic physics coupled with the fact that the FFB felt dreadful through a wheel. Codemasters FFB is some of the worst I've ever felt, & for me that's a game breaker. I tried the DIRT 2 demo with a DS3 & thought it was fun, plugged in my wheel & it felt awful. No good FFB = no sale for me.

 

[napalmhardcore]

For me, it was the unrealistic physics coupled with the fact that the FFB felt dreadful through a FFB wheel. Codemasters FFB is some of the worst I've ever felt, & for me that's a game breaker. I tried the DIRT 2 demo with a DS3 & thought it was fun, plugged in my wheel & it felt awful. No good FFB = no sale for me.

Yeah, I must admit Codemasters FFB isn't the best IMO. I think it was you I spoke to recently about the fact that I had to use settings that made absolutely no sense. I was able to get it feeling reasonable but I've felt much better.

For steering set-up, it should really work out of the box like Gran Turismo (hey something positive about GT) or have a decent set-up screen. For example, on GTR evo there is an indicator at the bottom of the screen. When you turn the wheel or press the pedals it shows you exactly what is happening. So if you set the sensitivity to 50% and turn the wheel, you can see it is a linear response, put it lower and the centre becomes less sensitive but towards full lock it becomes more sensitive. Likewise, go higher and the centre becomes more sensitive but towards lock it becomes less sensitive. You can also adjust the curves and sectors. This makes setting up wheels with a low steering lock very customisable.

Probably my favourite system of the sims I've played was LFS. The reason being, you set your wheel to max rotation in the profiler and for each car it tells you the optimal steering lock. You then just simply change it in game. The problem with many sims is that they don't tell you what the real cars steering ratio should be, so you have to search for real world values or just use what feels right to you. The problem is that I like to simulate as close to reality as possible, which means using what I think is right may not represent what the actual car handles like.

I've seen people on Youtube that have been playing something like one of the GTR games. They have obviously just set the wheel to 900 degrees and started driving without adjusting the ratio in the car set-up. It looks like they are steering a boat. What's worse is I think they are under the impression that it is more realistic.

 

[VBR]

@napalmhardcore - If I remember correctly, you could also change the steering lock in degrees in Richard Burns Rally on the PS2. That was my favourite go to game for realism. After playing that everything else seemed liked arcade nonsense to me, even GT's rally mode.

 

[napalmhardcore]

@napalmhardcore - If I remember correctly, you could also change the steering lock in degrees in Richard Burns Rally on the PS2. That was my favourite go to game for realism. After playing that everything else seemed liked arcade nonsense to me, even GT's rally mode.

RBR is an insanely good game. It's also another one where I've seen people use some very odd settings.