The Le Mans General Discussion Thread

[R5]

Any team that's worth a crap will continue to race harder and win more money by finishing better.

But the paradox is that richer factory teams will win the prize money, Meaning non-factory teams can't earn prize money to finish better so the factory teams win more and gain more money and extend a gap...

It goes on really.

 

[CodeRedR51]

Was this artist rendering ever posted cause I can't seem to find it and the other forums have it being relatively new so...

It's not exact obviously but if it does look mainly like this then I think it may be the best looking car next to the Porsche for me.

@R1600Turbo blink once for yes and twice for no if this is pretty much the real deal

@Furinkazen posted it in the WEC thread. Maybe accidentally, I dunno.

 

[Holdenhsvgtsr]

You have no clue how the racing business works then. Absolutely no clue. Ask any team if more prize money would allow them to get faster and more reliable. They all will say yes. Any team that's worth a crap will continue to race harder and win more money by finishing better. More prize money is never a bad thing in racing.

Email Colin Turkington he could do with your advice.

 

[cnd01]

But the paradox is that richer factory teams will win the prize money, Meaning non-factory teams can't earn prize money to finish better so the factory teams win more and gain more money and extend a gap...

It goes on really.

How many factory teams are in LMP2 or GTE-am? That's where prize money would be. No point in paying factory teams in more/less factory only classes.

 

[R5]

How many factory teams are in LMP2 or GTE-am? That's where prize money would be. No point in paying factory teams in more/less factory only classes.

Increasing just 2 classes prize money will cause uproar in LM P1, GTR PRO, and LM P3. Factory Dominated or not, you have to treat all categories equally.

 

[cnd01]

Increasing just 2 classes prize money will cause uproar in LM P1, GTR PRO, and LM P3. Factory Dominated or not, you have to treat all categories equally.

I highly doubt it. The ALMS only paid privateer teams even in factory classes like their GT class for years. Never saw factory teams leaving because it wasn't fair

 

[R5]

I highly doubt it. The ALMS only paid privateer teams even in factory classes like their GT class for years. Never saw factory teams leaving because it wasn't fair

I'm gonna mark this as irrelevant... mainly Because there aren't just factory teams in the categories, and these are the ones needing the increased prize money remember?

 

[Holdenhsvgtsr]

I'm gonna mark this as irrelevant... mainly Because there aren't just factory teams in the categories, and these are the ones needing the increased prize money remember?

Should we also tell him that the team that won't both GTE AM in WEC and Le mans was a factory team?

 

[cnd01]

I'm gonna mark this as irrelevant... mainly Because there aren't just factory teams in the categories, and these are the ones needing the increased prize money remember?

It's totally relevant because privateer teams in classes designed for factories are few and far between to begin with. Classes aimed at privateer teams are what need the money. Without being easy to make a profit, a series depends solely on the incredibly wealthy am driver and auto manufacturers. That's never been a successful strategy long term because the economy will crap the bed from time to time.

Should we also tell him that the team that won't both GTE AM in WEC and Le mans was a factory team?

The GTE-Am champion was funded by an am. It makes a hill of beans what the team name is and if they happen to be the team used to run the factory program. By that logic, CORE Autosport is a factory PC team in IMSA...

 

[Holdenhsvgtsr]

.


The GTE-Am champion was funded by an am. It makes a hill of beans what the team name is and if they happen to be the team used to run the factory program. By that logic, CORE Autosport is a factory PC team in IMSA...

Who funded it?

 

[SK8RBOI]

Don't all teams get a serten amount of mony given to them each season like in F1? From what I remember its what all the mony fus was about.

Factory teams don't just throw money at a team, they have to have some sort of finatial encentive, don't they?

 

[Holdenhsvgtsr]

Don't all teams get a serten amount of mony given to them each season like in F1? From what I remember its what all the mony fus was about.

Factory teams don't just throw money at a team, they have to have some sort of finatial encentive, don't they?

Nope, they can sell more cars the only prize money in WEC iirc is €30,000 if you win the Le Mans race and Michelin offered a €1,000,000 prize if you met certain challenges but no one did so it carries over till next year.

 

[cnd01]

Don't all teams get a serten amount of mony given to them each season like in F1? From what I remember its what all the mony fus was about.

Factory teams don't just throw money at a team, they have to have some sort of finatial encentive, don't they?

In the GTE-Am class, factory teams rent and sell cars to ams and privateers to get some ROI off of their development. That's why AF Corsa had an armada at Le Mans this past season. Sometimes they use their own engineers and crew. Others are separate teams. Either way, the factory team does not put the millions of dollars into the Am program that it puts into the Pro category for obvious reasons. Paying the am program good prize money even if it is the same team that runs the works program gives the factories the ability to charge less to rent and make more money with more cars either rented or sold on the grid. It's a win-win for the factory, privateer team, and both pro and am drivers

 

[Holdenhsvgtsr]

Don't all teams get a serten amount of mony given to them each season like in F1? From what I remember its what all the mony fus was about.

Factory teams don't just throw money at a team, they have to have some sort of finatial encentive, don't they?

Sorry sk8r was slightly out on my figures found the regs hidden on my laptop

3) Prize money
a/ General Classification:

1st : € 40,000 2nd : € 25,000 3rd :€20,000 4th : € 15,000 5th : € 12,000

b/ Classification per Category: Competitor classified 1st in each of the four categories: € 10,000c/ Other Competitors (per classified car): € 7,000
Important: according to the French tax legislation, the amount of prize money for Competitors resident outside France will be subject to a withholding tax of 15% unless they benefit from a special international agreement which they have to produce.

Entry Fee
a) Deposit on entry fee:
€ 4,600 (excluding French taxes not refundable)
To be paid by Tuesday 28th January 2014 at the latest:
a/ Paid by bank transfer only;
b/ Payment: written proof from the bank with the
Competitor's and Principal's names is mandatory.
b) Participation fee:
€ 50,000 (excluding French taxes – deposit € 4,600 excluding
French taxes) = € 45,400 (excluding French taxes)
To be paid by Friday 18th April 2014 at the latest:
(After this date, the Competitor’s invitation will be withdrawn).
- By all Competitors who are invited by the Selection
Committee and the reserve Competitors ;
- By means of bank transfer only.
This fee includes:
1/ Entry fee : € 25,000 (excluding French taxes)
Should a car be excluded after scrutineering, the entry fee
will not be refunded.
2/ Advance on technical expenses and supplies:
€ 25,000 (excluding French taxes).
This includes: fuel, obligatory equipment supplies (**),
obligatory services (see Technical Appendix and Competitors’
Guide).
(**) To be returned in good condition at the end of the event.

 

[TDZdave]

That's extraordinary pathetic, no wonder why stuff all teams jump the ditch to race over there, could imagine its the same in reverse

 

[Holdenhsvgtsr]

That's extraordinary pathetic, no wonder why stuff all teams jump the ditch to race over there, could imagine its the same in reverse

The entry fees actually went up this year to €52,000 prize fund is still the same.

 

[TDZdave]

The entry fees actually went up this year to €52,000 prize fund is still the same.

Just like life, raise the cost of living without raising minimum wage, that's truly pathetic

 

[Holdenhsvgtsr]

Just like life, raise the cost of living without raising minimum wage, that's truly pathetic

Wanna see what happens if you pull your entry?

This is the 2015 regs

b) Participation fee:€ 52,000 (excluding French taxes – deposit € 4,600 excluding French taxes) = € 47,400 (excluding French taxes)To be paid by Friday 3rd April 2015 at the latest:
(After this date, the Competitor’s invitation will be withdrawn).- By all Competitors who are invited by the Selection Committee

and the reserve Competitors ;- By means of bank transfer only.

This fee includes:
1/ Entry fee : € 27,000 (excluding French taxes)

Should a car be excluded after scrutineering, the entry fee

will not be refunded.
2/ Advance on technical expenses and supplies:

€ 25,000 (excluding French taxes).This includes: fuel, obligatory equipment supplies (**), obligatory services (see Technical Appendix and Competitors’ Guide).

Mr krohn please read section a

41.F – General conditions concerning entries
a) Transfer of an entry: not permitted.The Organiser will take back the entry from a Competitor who is unable to honour his invitation (at the discretion of the Selection Committee of the 24 Heures du Mans).

b) Withdrawal

Any officially declared withdrawal is irrevocable. In this case:
1/ For Competitors who are invited to take part in the official

Practice Sessions of the 2015 24 Heures du Mans race (see

Appendix X), the entry fee will not be refunded;
2/ Should the withdrawal be declared prior to Tuesday 14th April 2015 at midnight, the entry fee, i.e. € 27,000 (excluding French

taxes), will be refunded by half (i.e. € 13,500);
3/ After midnight April 14th, the total amount of the entry fee

will be kept by the organiser;
4/ Any withdrawal declared after Thursday 7th May 2015 =

penalty of € 50,000 to be paid to SSP ACO bank account, and possible exclusion of any request of entry forms sent to the Committee of the 24 Heures du Mans 2015 (except if judged as “force majeure” by the ACO Sports Committee).

5/ In all cases, an amount of € 4,600 (excluding French taxes as the deposit on entry fee) will be kept, except for Competitors not selected by the Selection Committee and who have taken part in all 2014 races - FIA World Endurance Championship - Tudor United Sports Cars - European Le Mans Series (€ 2,300 excluding French taxes will be refunded).

c bis) The category of a selected car cannot be changed, except with agreement of the ACO Sports Committee (upon a written request) exclusively for LM GTE Pro and LM GTE Am Categories.

The specifications of a car cannot be changed after January 27th 2015, except in case of "force majeure" or additional value, appreciated by the ACO Sports Committee.

Test Day

Participation fee: € 11,500 (excluding French taxes)Advance on technical expenses and supplies: € 2,500 (excluding VAT + VAT in force).

Prize fund

3) Prize money
a/ General Classification:

1st : € 40,000 2nd : € 25,000 3rd : € 20,000 4th : € 15,000 5th : € 12,000


Classification per Category: Competitor classified 1st in each of the four categories: € 10,000c/ Other Competitors (per classified car): € 7,000
Important: according to the French tax legislation, the amount of prize money for Competitors resident outside France will be subject to a withholding by the applicable rate (15% in 2014) unless they benefit from a special international agreement which they have to produce.

 

[TDZdave]

That's ripe, though I believe that V8SC penalty for withdrawing from a championship event after entry is upwards of 100,000 AUD

 

[Holdenhsvgtsr]

That's ripe, though I believe that V8SC penalty for withdrawing from a championship event after entry is upwards of 100,000 AUD

BJR were told they would be fined 150,000 AUD is they didn't make it to the Aus GP

 

[TDZdave]

BJR were told they would be fined 150,000 AUD is they didn't make it to the Aus GP

Going off topic, but sounds about right, that's actually an expensive race, I'm led to believe that no prize money is given for that event at all,

 

[Holdenhsvgtsr]

Going off topic, but sounds about right, that's actually an expensive race, I'm led to believe that no prize money is given for that event at all,

Or points ether although I heard they are looking to make it a points race.

 

[TDZdave]

Th

Or points ether although I heard they are looking to make it a points race.

They have been saying that for more then 10 years,

Speaking of Australia, if the WEC were to come, where would they go?

 

[Holdenhsvgtsr]

Th
They have been saying that for more then 10 years,

Speaking of Australia, if the WEC were to come, where would they go?

I'd have my money on Phillip Island.

 

[TDZdave]

I'd have my money on Phillip Island.

That would be fantastic, but the pit lane just isn't for cars, but the pit facilities are great,

Bathurst has the greatest most adequate pit lane but the circuit will never get a full FIA grading without serious changes to the top of the Mountain,

I'd personally like to see LMP at Adelaide again, or even the full champ car circuit at the gold coast,

 

[cnd01]

Surfer's Paradise would be great. Barbagallo would be great too, but I don't know how the facilities or safety of the track is

 

[Holdenhsvgtsr]

That would be fantastic, but the pit lane just isn't for cars, but the pit facilities are great,

Bathurst has the greatest most adequate pit lane but the circuit will never get a full FIA grading without serious changes to the top of the Mountain,

I'd personally like to see LMP at Adelaide again, or even the full champ car circuit at the gold coast,

What with those kerbs in turn 1 ? that would be interesting

 

[TDZdave]

Those kerbs are around the same height as those stupid pyramids that they have at Tetre Rouge, however when the ALMS came they wanted the Kerbs to be shaved down a fraction but not flat, not that they came back anyway, but V8SC said don't, for the same reason the ALMS didn't want them removed entirely, But I don't see the problem, no F1 driver was ever worried about them to much,

 

[Holdenhsvgtsr]

Those kerbs are around the same height as those stupid pyramids that they have at Tetre Rouge, however when the ALMS came they wanted the Kerbs to be shaved down a fraction but not flat, not that they came back anyway, but V8SC said don't, for the same reason the ALMS didn't want them removed entirely, But I don't see the problem, no F1 driver was ever worried about them to much,

It would be interesting to see how many would try to straight line it.

And also who would attempt to take turn 9 flat.

 

[DK]

Sorry sk8r was slightly out on my figures found the regs hidden on my laptop

3) Prize money
a/ General Classification:

1st : € 40,000 2nd : € 25,000 3rd :€20,000 4th : € 15,000 5th : € 12,000

b/ Classification per Category: Competitor classified 1st in each of the four categories: € 10,000c/ Other Competitors (per classified car): € 7,000
Important: according to the French tax legislation, the amount of prize money for Competitors resident outside France will be subject to a withholding tax of 15% unless they benefit from a special international agreement which they have to produce.

Entry Fee
a) Deposit on entry fee:
€ 4,600 (excluding French taxes not refundable)
To be paid by Tuesday 28th January 2014 at the latest:
a/ Paid by bank transfer only;
b/ Payment: written proof from the bank with the
Competitor's and Principal's names is mandatory.
b) Participation fee:
€ 50,000 (excluding French taxes – deposit € 4,600 excluding
French taxes) = € 45,400 (excluding French taxes)
To be paid by Friday 18th April 2014 at the latest:
(After this date, the Competitor’s invitation will be withdrawn).
- By all Competitors who are invited by the Selection
Committee and the reserve Competitors ;
- By means of bank transfer only.
This fee includes:
1/ Entry fee : € 25,000 (excluding French taxes)
Should a car be excluded after scrutineering, the entry fee
will not be refunded.
2/ Advance on technical expenses and supplies:
€ 25,000 (excluding French taxes).
This includes: fuel, obligatory equipment supplies (**),
obligatory services (see Technical Appendix and Competitors’
Guide).
(**) To be returned in good condition at the end of the event.

Well, I guess there's no chance anyone can enter a Subaru Impreza wagon with those fees.