The NSX is making a return...

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I agree. I personally feel like they chose the right configuration for the NSX...it's a baby 918 basically and in that way a fitting tribute to the original car in ethos. I don't think the original NSX was designed to be "analog" because what we know as analog today was the only way back then. In reality, the NSX had a very high level of technology - VTEC, aluminum unibody, etc.

The problem with the new car is that it wasn't impactful enough. I don't think they did a particularly good job marketing it. It was a little too middle-America and not enough Ayrton Senna. It takes effort to remember that the car even exists. I also don't think they did a particularly great job on the interior styling, it doesn't look like a supercar in there to me. If you compare it to the C8 (or C7 for that matter) it looks expensive. If you compare it to the 918, it looks like a bargain - I think they didn't do an adequate job of transmitting that message. All that being said, the original NSX didn't exactly fly off the shelves either - Acura's best year was under 2,000 units and most years were under 500 units, not much different from the new car. So maybe at the end of the day any NSX is going to be a niche product and we should be happy Honda decided to build it at all.
You mention "middle America" but nobody in middle America can afford it - it was priced solidly in supercar territory. And you're right that the interior isn't great but the GT-R's isn't either but they still sell several times as many as the NSX does despite what you believe was the "right configuration", i.e. hybrid technology. In fact, the GT-Rs sales remained stable through its first eight model years. I think the proof that the NSX was the wrong configuration or wrong ethos is that it never sold anywhere near expectations - fewer than 1500 units and averaging a mere 277 a year. You're not giving the first NSX nearly enough credit because its sales arc was very similar to other hot but aging supercars, especially the R35. The new car's best year, 2017, beat the archaic GT-R by literally 3 cars at a time when the R35 was already ten years old. In fact, I think the GT-R is its prime market competition, particularly the Nismo, and it continues to trounce the NSX's sales despite being virtually obsolete. You also mention the C8 - while the NSX is a more highly engineered machine, it doesn't perform much better overall than either a base GT-R (virtually no difference in any measure) or a C8 (which is nearly 1/3 the price).

People blame the NSX's slow sales on its price but I don't think that's the problem. NSX is a glorious name, Honda is a top tier engineering company, and they should be able to create and sell a supercar as well as any other brand, especially Nissan, but they utterly failed despite being in a price bracket that sells reliably - the Huracan sold over 2,000 units in the US in 2019. Nissan took the turbocharged AWD giant-killer formula and applied it to the R35 undistilled, Chevy took the V8 out the front of a Corvette and put it in the back of a Corvette, Dodge put a stonkin motor and some new headlights on the Viper every few years, Lamborghini made a Lamborghini, Ferrari made a Ferrari, Porsche made a Porsche, etc. Honda did not make an NSX, they made some weird robot thing that nobody asked for and nobody wanted. That's why its a failure, and that's too bad because its actually a good car that nobody wants. People didn't want a "good car", there are already plenty of those. They wanted an NSX.

Edit: The most NSX-like car to hit the market since the old NSX was the Ford GT and it sold so well at an astronomical price that they had to extend its production.
 
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I'd say the most NSX-like car to hit the market since the old NSX was the R8, but that probably makes the belly flop of the NSX look worse.
 
The original is my favourite car of all time, the new one is meh when I first saw it and honestly I don't feel sad at all that it's ending production. They really missed an opportunity by not making a pure RWD non-hybrid version. Or even shove the V10 from the HSV-010 mule that we saw running around the Nurburgring so many times before it got canned. Maybe someone can make the ultimate project car by transplanting a LFA V10 instead? 💡

I'd say the most NSX-like car to hit the market since the old NSX was the R8, but that probably makes the belly flop of the NSX look worse.

In terms of everyday usability while combining supercar performance, the R8 fits the bill. But it's still too techy and not analog enough in my opinion. The Lotus Evora or Alpine A110 would be the closest modern car that I could think of. Analog, simple, lightweight, decent enough as daily driver and reasonable price.
 
I think one of the key elements of the original NSX's success was that Honda made a more comfortable and practical, yet still credible supercar rival to Ferrari and Porsche when neither of the Europeans were at the top of their game. The landscape in the late 2010s was completely the opposite in that respect; the second gen NSX didn't necessarily bring anything significant that was novel or otherwise light-years better than the competitors to the table, and thus never lived up to that NSX lore.
 
That's the original. I think they set out to make a new car.
New Sportscar eXperimental.
Agreed, many people seem to be ignoring what the name actually means. I think the car will be appreciated more once more people take it for what it is, since per reviews by Chris Harris, Matt Farah and numerous others, it really is not a bad car at all.
 
the second gen NSX didn't necessarily bring anything significant that was novel

Well, if you think about it this way. The second-generation NSX was designed to compete against the likes of the Ferrari 458 (which Honda cut up to study), the Lamborghini Huracan, the Audi R8, the McLaren 650S and so on. Out of the cars that the NSX was designed to compete with, it was the only one with a hybrid system.

I also don't get this belief that an NSX needs to be some sort of Honda Lotus to be considered worthy of bearing the name. If any of you remember, Ferraris and Porsches were a lot lighter, smaller and less powerful back in the 90s than they are today. Then they all put on weight, started making much more power and we have stuff like the 992-generation 911 and F8 Tributo now. You know what else did that? The NSX. It's just called moving with the times.

Even a new Lotus Elise (RIP) is larger, heavier and more powerful compared to its initial version.

It's a shame the NSX seems to be set for a discontinuation because it really was one of my favourites from the last decade.
 
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In terms of everyday usability while combining supercar performance, the R8 fits the bill. But it's still too techy and not analog enough in my opinion. The Lotus Evora or Alpine A110 would be the closest modern car that I could think of. Analog, simple, lightweight, decent enough as daily driver and reasonable price.
I don't think that takes into account how the industry has advanced since the 90s, though. I mean certainly the Evora is probably an even closer 1:1 modern representation of the NSX in terms of direct performance than the R8 is; but I think when scaling up to the 2010s the R8 is more in line with what the original NSX was in terms of its competitors.



Though it's a somewhat facile comparison, I'd admit, since the Corvette isn't a noodle chassis full of Camaro parts, the 911 isn't nearly 30 years old and the V8 Ferraris no longer perform like they only have 2/3rds of their quoted power.


If any of you remember, Ferraris and Porsches were a lot lighter, smaller and less powerful back in the 90s than they are today. Then they all put on weight, started making much more power and we have stuff like the 992-generation 911 and F8 Tributo now. You know what else did that? The NSX. It's just called moving with the times.
964: ~3050 pounds
964 Turbo: ~3300 pounds
993: ~3100 pounds
993 Turbo: ~3400 pounds
996: ~3100 pounds
996 GT3: ~3050 pounds
996 Turbo: ~3500 pounds
997: ~3200 pounds
997 GT3: ~3250 pounds
997 Turbo: ~3500 pounds
991: ~3200 pounds
991 GT3: ~3200 pounds
991 Turbo: ~3550 pounds

348ts: ~3300 pounds
F355: ~3300 pounds
360 Modena: ~3300 pounds
F430: ~3350 pounds
458 Italia: ~3350 pounds
488 GTB: ~3400 pounds

C4 ZR-1: ~3500 pounds
C4: ~3300 pounds
C5: 3300 pounds
C5 Z06: 3100 pounds
C6: ~3300 pounds
C6 Z06: ~3200 pounds
C7: ~3400 pounds


NSX 3.0: ~3000 pounds
NSX-T 3.0: ~3100 pounds
NSX-T 3.2: ~3100 pounds
NSX Zanardi: ~3000 pounds
NSX-T facelift: ~3100 pounds
NSX second generation: ~3900 pounds



One of these is not like the other ones.
 
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Well, if you think about it this way. The second-generation NSX was designed to compete against the likes of the Ferrari 458 (which Honda cut up to study), the Lamborghini Huracan, the Audi R8, the McLaren 650S and so on. Out of the cars that the NSX was designed to compete with, it was the only one with a hybrid system.

I also don't get this belief that an NSX needs to be some sort of Honda Lotus to be considered worthy of bearing the name. If any of you remember, Ferraris and Porsches were a lot lighter, smaller and less powerful back in the 90s than they are today. Then they all put on weight, started making much more power and we have stuff like the 992-generation 911 and F8 Tributo now. You know what else did that? The NSX. It's just called moving with the times.

Even a new Lotus Elise (RIP) is larger, heavier and more powerful compared to its initial version.

It's a shame the NSX seems to be set for a discontinuation because it really was one of my favourites from the last decade.
Because of the hybrid technology, the car has quite a unique ability in that it can transform from a relatively quiet and comfortable car often moving on electric power alone to a proper performance car with torque vectoring and instant torque from the electric motors. You can see that versatility quite well from the onboards in this review:
 
it really is not a bad car at all.
Nobody ever said it was a bad car. That's never been the argument against it. It's a great car and it has been a great car ever since it debuted.

But that doesn't matter because it's not desirable. It being a great car first and foremost was arguably its downfall. Nobody wanted a great car, those already existed on the market. Get a 911 or an R8 or GT-R if you want a great car that can do anything in any weather. But what didn't exist on the market was an NSX and that's what Honda failed to deliver. Simple, light, nimble, connected, and fun. The original NSX was basically a bigger, faster, supercar Miata, and that's why people love it. Nobody loved it because it was docile. Nobody loved it because it was good, they loved it because it was rad.

The current Supra is going to suffer the same fate. It's really good, but 30 years from now nobody will love and desire them. They'll just be like a Genesis Coupe or something, good but forgotten. People will still yearn for the MK5 Supra 30 years from now. They will however be talking about the R35 GT-R, because unlike this new NSX and Supra, the R35 embodied the essence of a GT-R perfectly, and still does 12 years after its introduction.
 
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Nobody ever said it was a bad car. That's never been the argument against it. It's a great car and it has been a great car ever since it debuted.

But that doesn't matter because it's not desirable. It being a great car first and foremost was arguably its downfall. Nobody wanted a great car, those already existed on the market. Get a 911 or an R8 or GT-R if you want a great car that can do anything in any weather. But what didn't exist on the market was an NSX and that's what Honda failed to deliver. Simple, light, nimble, connected, and fun. The original NSX was basically a bigger, faster, supercar Miata, and that's why people love it. Nobody loved it because it was docile. Nobody loved it because it was good, they loved it because it was rad.
Being docile and good was also part of its charm, though. It was a strong sports car competitor with the added reliability & ease of use of that came with being a Honda.

To this day, I believe it's still a fairly easy car to maintain outside 1 or 2 big things you likely have get a shop involved with every few years; @Danoff can probably verify that to be sure.
The current Supra is going to suffer the same fate. It's really good, but 30 years from now nobody will love and desire them. They'll just be like a Genesis Coupe or something, good but forgotten. People will still yearn for the MK5 Supra 30 years from now. They will however be talking about the R35 GT-R, because unlike this new NSX and Supra, the R35 embodied the essence of a GT-R perfectly, and still does 12 years after its introduction.
I think it's early to make such predictions. The beloved NSX you're referencing went through a similar period where no one really wanted one, esp. with people balking at their high costs towards the car's end for failing to evolve as quickly as Porsche & Ferrari did into the current century. Now-a-days, people are more than happy to fork over 6 figures for a NA2. NSX-Rs are now $200-300 thousand+ cars, which is something nobody surely would have ever thought a NSX would achieve 20 years ago.

I do think the current NSX will be unable to accomplish what its predecessors did, but I feel that's going to come down to Honda just basically ignoring it. When it finally came around, it was just sort of "meh", & it hasn't helped that in its 5 years on the market, I don't recall Honda ever doing anything special to make it more enticing. It's as if after all its development issues, Honda was pleased to just get it out on the market and then refuse to drop any more money into it beyond what appears to be a modest handling update in 2019.

The Supra still has time to avoid such a fate, and the fact Toyota seems to have addressed its first MY issues is a good sign. If Toyota drops a manual into it as teased, its future should be safe. It's interesting you note the R35, though. I don't think the R35's continued success is as much to do with being a proper successor as its complete take over in the tuner scene. It's found huge success at becoming a QTR mile drag car & remains one of the strongest competitors in that scene alongside the Mk. IVs & Huracans. But, the Mk. V is slowly creeping into that arena as well as many guys are starting to find proper times with it. I think the quickest is high 8s on 950Hp which is commendable for being this early into the scene & creates some promise. If the Mk. V finds similar success as the R35, it'll remain just as relevant.
 
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I think it also helps that the R35 was (along with the STI) the last of that "type" of car left on the market and had been for quite a while until the Supra came out; which went a long way towards wiping away the first few years of the car's life when the R35 got a lot of crap itself for also being a lardass that was allegedly boring to drive.



Also Nissan updated it.
 
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I think it's early to make such predictions. The beloved NSX you're referencing went through a similar period where no one really wanted one, esp. with people balking at their high costs towards the car's end for failing to evolve as quickly as Porsche & Ferrari did into the current century. Now-a-days, people are more than happy to fork over 6 figures for a NA2. NSX-Rs are now $200-300 thousand+ cars, which is something nobody surely would have ever thought a NSX would achieve 20 years ago.
Not even 10 years ago, a decently maintained early '90s NSX could be bought for under $28K, more ragged examples going for as low as $20K. After car culture started pushing more into the mainstream and the collector's bubble expanded to include the '90s, prices shot up in a hurry as first time collectors started seeing them as rare exotics that could be had for far less than the usual unobtainable '60s and '70s fare.

I do think the current NSX will be unable to accomplish what its predecessors did, but I feel that's going to come down to Honda just basically ignoring it. When it finally came around, it was just sort of "meh", & it hasn't helped that in its 5 years on the market, I don't recall Honda ever doing anything special to make it more enticing. It's as if after all its development issues, Honda was pleased to just get it out on the market and then refuse to drop any more money into it beyond what appears to be a modest handling update in 2019.
I feel like Honda realized the R35 had already eaten their lunch and they were never going to steal market share away from its European counterparts, but there was so much investment and fanfare surrounding the car that they couldn't just cancel it, so it's just been... there.
 
The beloved NSX you're referencing went through a similar period where no one really wanted one, esp. with people balking at their high costs towards the car's end for failing to evolve as quickly as Porsche & Ferrari did into the current century.
It's funny thinking about this really. I can only speak for the UK market, but basically none of the bubble era Japanese sports cars did great here. All were considered too expensive and not desirable enough - my RX-7 is one of fewer than 200 UK-market examples sold across just a two-year period - for a car that was produced for a decade! Mazda had to drop the price from £32k to £25k (about £67k to £53k in 2020 money, or $92k to $73k at current exchange rates) and it still didn't sell. NSXs were £52k in '92 over here, so two thirds more expensive at launch, and predictably those didn't sell great either.

It's difficult to really judge how the current NSX will be seen itself in another two or three decades. The old one was obviously appreciated in its day but I guess few would have anticipated it becoming some legend of the era, particularly as back then Japanese stuff was often considered a bit short on character.

I suspect the current one will go through a similar process - and judged in context of what cars are like in 30 years time, it may well look way more appealing than it does today too.
 
I suspect the current one will go through a similar process - and judged in context of what cars are like in 30 years time, it may well look way more appealing than it does today too.
With the automotive landscape slowly but definitely shifting towards making mild hybrids and EVs the new normal, I would reckon any petrol-only performance vehicle is going to become quite desirable even 10-15 years from now, regardless of how it's thought of today.
 
To this day, I believe it's still a fairly easy car to maintain outside 1 or 2 big things you likely have get a shop involved with every few years; @Danoff can probably verify that to be sure.

That seems like a fair assessment. It's very reliable for what it is, but not accord-level reliable. I don't put a ton of miles on, so I haven't really gotten to see a lot of that first hand.
 
Drove behind the new NSX yesterday. The one I saw was red and man that paint looks cool. You don't get a good feel for the proportions ins a lot of these photos, but it's low and wide, supercar looking in person for sure.

But what are they doing with that paint? It has a strange sort of depth and intensity to it. You can kinda tell in this shot:

Tesla-Model-X-Acura-NSX.jpg


The one on the left is red. The one on the right is... different depths of red depending on sunlight and viewing angle.

Well I gotta say... it makes an impression. It was as though all of the cars around it were flat boring 2D cars and it was living in a 3D world. It caught my eye from a long ways off.

I haven't seen enough of the new NSX in the premium paint to tell if it's better than Mazda (there's no way it's worse), but somehow mazda is doing something amazing with (at least) their red paint. I saw a new red audi drive past the other day and thought... man that paint sucks compared to any red mazda.

What's up with mazda's red paint?
https://insidemazda.mazdausa.com/the-mazda-way/design/soul-red-crystal/

I'm sure you folks have noticed how amazing mazda red paint has been the last few years. The factory color that immediate springs to mind as being comparable is the NSX red.
 
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I haven't seen enough of the new NSX in the premium paint to tell if it's better than Mazda (there's no way it's worse), but somehow mazda is doing something amazing with (at least) their red paint. I saw a new red audi drive past the other day and thought... man that paint sucks compared to any red mazda.

What's up with mazda's red paint?
https://insidemazda.mazdausa.com/the-mazda-way/design/soul-red-crystal/

I'm sure you folks have noticed how amazing mazda red paint has been the last few years. The factory color that immediate springs to mind as being comparable is the NSX red.
I've seen that NSX paint up close but you're right that Soul Red is in another league. It's got the same quality as a custom paint job except it blends that depth with a more mature hue. I like their blues as well but they're not nearly as deep as Soul Red and they're not available on most trim levels. A 3 Hatch in Eternal Blue would be nice. Blows my mind how car companies don't allow every color on every trim - you're literally dunking bare chassis in paint, what's the holdup.

vehicle-image-JM3KFBEY5M0341327-01.jpg
 
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Not like I'm going to buy an NSX tomorrow, but a rwd version would be cool. Make a lightweight NSX. Similar to the NSX GT3.
 
I'm kind not having a go at Americans but they shouldnt have let Americans design the car.

I'm putting it out there that the original NSX is well loved and worked as a halo but did it make any money? Or was it just kept in production for a decade plus because of.... "tradition".

I feel like we've seen a few ways in the last 20yrs how manufacturers make sure their 'legacy' and heritage models live on.

The R32-34 Skylines -> R35 GTR. This was a technological challenge that meant that Nissan spent billions developing the R35 however it meant that complexity and cost skyrocketed.

The Supra A80 -> A90 BMW. Lower cost option.

300zx/350/370z -> 400z. A really good fairly low cost option allround where they recycled the drivetrain.

C30/32 NSX -> hybrid current NSX. IMO a bad update that created a car that alienated fans and didnt attract a new audience.


See where this is going? Toyota and Nissan wanted to aim the Z and Supra as a lower cost 'sport' category.

Nissan went with the 'super sport' option which meant the price eventually went over $100k.

Honda went the hybrid supercar route. They shouldnt have done this.
 
I'm kind not having a go at Americans but they shouldnt have let Americans design the car.
I'm not sure the car would have faired any better had it been designed by someone of a different nationality considering they were ultimately tied to doing whatever the top brass wanted.
 
Apparently the NSX is going out with a Type R bang. That badge would sell these things as fast as they could make them.
I honestly don't know why they didn't go with Type R either.

Though to be fair, the original NSX had a Type S variant aswell.
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