The tweaking advantage

[BradKinder]

I hardly look forward to seeing your results, onboy... If you think that the difference between tire wear on and tire wear off is not the exact same difference between real and surreal.

Also, other ...person, you think that a .2 (what, degrees?) difference of some angle of a tire is going to make any sort of difference when the car is being driven at maximum pace? Man, when they ditched all the cool camera angles with GT5 it really made people forget how much these cars are slipping...

The difference between .2 and 0, supposing 0 is your calling, is nil.

More clutter. If you tweaked every option in the FC suspension and can only offer me 1.8 seconds for a lap of the Circuit of Sarthe, why bother?

There are 10 mile tracks, one mile tracks, ovals, ect in this game. Tell me more about what you accomplished. Especially the (lap time after FC suspension tweaks) \divided by\ (lap time before FC suspension tweaks).

These percentages will be very interesting to many people.

I currently believe that merely breaking in an engine will far outperform any tweaks anybody can make to the FC suspension.

Just changing the suspension settings, right? Your answer is "an average of 1.8 seconds per lap" can be gained by changing individual settings. I have tuned over 100 cars (need to get them all posted) and the average gain is around 1.8 seconds for just suspension settings. I have written a whole tuning guide about what each setting does and how to tune it so I don't feel the need to restate all of that here. Use the search button.

Secondly, I don't know why anyone would want to limit their tuning to just changing suspension settings when there is far more to gain by learning to tune the LSD and the brakes. But if you truly want to go slower than everyone else, it's your choice.

 

[Onboy123]

I hardly look forward to seeing your results... If you think that the difference between tire wear on and tire wear off is not the exact same difference between reality and surreal.

Also, other ...person, you think that a .2 (what, degrees?) difference of some angle of a tire is going to make any sort of difference when the car is being driven at maximum pace? Man, when they ditched all the cool camera angles in GT5' it really made people forget how much these cars are slipping...

The difference between .2 and 0, supposing 0 is your calling, is nil.

You think I don't know the difference? I've lost many races due to the tyre wear. I also know that the difference between a drag run made with tyre wear on and off.

Ok, if you think the difference between the rear toe set at 0.2 degrees and at 0.0 degrees is nil, drive a car with it at 0.20 (default for FC suspension), then alter it to 0. The difference in the handling is more noticeable with some cars than others. If you can't feel it, do this other test. Get a 500+hp car, reset the FC suspension to default, do a drag run from the start of SSR7's tunnel to the end. Then zero the toe and go for another drag run. The top speed should be higher with it at zero. So to say this adjustment makes no difference at all to the car just shows how ignorant you are.

Also, tone your attitude down. You're lucky we ain't all having a go at you. Don't take this forum and our tolerance for granted, you're walking on thin ice already.

More clutter. If you tweaked every option in the FC suspension and can only offer me 1.8 seconds for a lap of the Circuit of Sarthe, why bother?

There are 10 mile tracks, one mile tracks, ovals, ect in this game. Tell me more about what you accomplished. Especially the (lap time after FC suspension tweaks) \divided by\ (lap time before FC suspension tweaks).

These percentages will be very interesting to many people.

I currently believe that merely breaking in an engine will far outperform any tweaks anybody can make to the FC suspension.

The bold word just confirms my thoughts that you really are a stuck up, spoilt little git. As said before, you're walking on thin ice. Compounding the issue with your 'elitist' attitude only draws more of the wrong kind of attention to you. Be it 1.8 seconds or 18 seconds, it's faster.

And to the last sentence, a mere 20 or 30 horsepower won't be able to out-do a good suspension setup on a tight twisty track. And if you must continue with this, how about you provide the results? After all, if you believe that a car that's broken in will beat a car with a good setup, I think we all need some proof before we can take you seriously.

 

[killerjimbag]

More clutter. If you tweaked every option in the FC suspension and can only offer me 1.8 seconds for a lap of the Circuit of Sarthe, why bother?

Let me understand this? If I adjust my suspension and take 1.8 seconds off 1 lap, in a 10 lap race,how far back would you be?
Lets put this into a realistic term for you. Do you own a car? Your recommended
tire pressure is 32 PSI.If you run this PSI you will get 32 MPG driving your car.
So now drop your PSI to 15 PSI and see what mileage you get? Yeah I get your point, loosing 3.2 MPG,more tire wear and basically throwing money out the window,why bother?

 

[Motor City Hami]

More clutter. If you tweaked every option in the FC suspension and can only offer me 1.8 seconds for a lap of the Circuit of Sarthe, why bother?

Who said Circuit of Sarthe? That is not a typical track in GT5. Most tracks in the game are closer to 1:30 lap times. No matter what track you pick, 1.8 seconds a lap faster than you will put you 9 seconds behind in a 5 lap race and 54 seconds behind in a 30 lap race.

I feel for you. You are so lost and clearly don't understand tuning in GT5. Good luck fighting for mid pack finishes.

 

[killerjimbag]

Who said Circuit of Sarthe? That is not a typical track in GT5. Most tracks in the game are closer to 1:30 lap times. No matter what track you pick, 1.8 seconds a lap faster than you will put you 9 seconds behind in a 5 lap race and 54 seconds behind in a 30 lap race.

I feel for you. You are so lost and clearly don't understand tuning in GT5. Good luck fighting for mid pack finishes.

Don't even bother anymore.Wow.

 

[Onboy123]

So……while we're at it, let's just run through what the OP is like.

He thinks 1.8 seconds is like something to lose down the back of a sofa. (Clearly it is not. I set you off in a Citroen 2CV 1.8 seconds behind me for 10 laps of even a tiny track like Autumn Ring Mini, at the end of 10 laps, you'd be 18 seconds down. Is that something to scoff at?)

He thinks a difference of 0.2 degrees in toe = nothing. (Again, much?)

Now you see why we don't take you seriously? Learn about some GT5 tuning basics before you come back.

 

[BradKinder]

You blame the tire wear, when tires are a standard setting for any car, for a loss, and then try to convince me how your feelings about something should interest me?

Here's the deal, GTPNewbies...

When I say tire wear off is stupid and is for newbies, it is. If you argue with that... you are stupid, and you are a newbie. You are allowed to use tire wear off, enjoy it, mention you enjoy it, and not argue with me.

You are not allowed to offer me tuning advice while deliberately being ambiguous about your realism settings (or any settings at all) after I express my joy at playing GT5 with full realism options set.

You are not allowed to slander me, for any reason, in any way. You are allowed to point out contradictions I might make, only then if after you correctly state the relevant point. If you are lazy, just don't post and hopefully I'll correct myself or somebody else will be constructive.

I despise playing GT5 when tire wear is off or SRF is allowed. When people must know why I don't care for them when they play the game without realism... It is because they're not only wasting my time, they are cheating themselves out of a rather rewarding, true-to-life, simulation of a very expensive gentleman's sport.

Also, this is public forum. It is here to be taken for granted. My wishes are clear as day, written just fine. Enjoy answering my questions. You either do that, or you complainers are disgustingly true to the hypocrite you describe.

I'm glad you mention top speed will increase with a toe angle adjustment to, or towards 0. But does that translate to faster lap time on a real circuit like Suzuka? Are toe adjustments absolute? When the suspension is in motion, perhaps the toe angle is more commonly 0 when the setting is actually -.2. I don't know that much, does anyone else?

[hoping people will only post if they have accomplished what I have asked and have data to show everyone]

You think I don't know the difference? I've lost many races due to the tyre wear. I also know that the difference between a drag run made with tyre wear on and off.

Ok, if you think the difference between the rear toe set at 0.2 degrees and at 0.0 degrees is nil, drive a car with it at 0.20 (default for FC suspension), then alter it to 0. The difference in the handling is more noticeable with some cars than others. If you can't feel it, do this other test. Get a 500+hp car, reset the FC suspension to default, do a drag run from the start of SSR7's tunnel to the end. Then zero the toe and go for another drag run. The top speed should be higher with it at zero. So to say this adjustment makes no difference at all to the car just shows how ignorant you are.

Also, tone your attitude down. You're lucky we ain't all having a go at you. Don't take this forum and our tolerance for granted, you're walking on thin ice already.

 

[killerjimbag]

So……while we're at it, let's just run through what the OP is like.

He thinks 1.8 seconds is like something to lose down the back of a sofa. (Clearly it is not. I set you off in a Citroen 2CV 1.8 seconds behind me for 10 laps of even a tiny track like Autumn Ring Mini, at the end of 10 laps, you'd be 18 seconds down. Is that something to scoff at?)

He thinks a difference of 0.2 degrees in toe = nothing. (Again, much?)

Now you see why we don't take you seriously? Learn about some GT5 tuning basics before you come back.

There is no sense in this discussion anymore.Maybe we could start a new forum,why bother tuning if you only moderately drop your lap times.

 

[Motor City Hami]

Brad - what account is this for you? How many times have you been banned so far on other account names?

 

[killerjimbag]

You blame the tire wear, when tires are a standard setting for any car, for a loss, and then try to convince me how your feelings about something should interest me?

Here's the deal, GTPNewbies...

When I say tire wear off is stupid and is for newbies, it is. If you argue with that... you are stupid, and you are a newbie. You are allowed to use tire wear off, enjoy it, mention you enjoy it, and not argue with me.

You are not allowed to offer me tuning advice while deliberately being ambiguous about your realism settings (or any settings at all) after I express my joy at playing GT5 with full realism options set.

You are not allowed to slander me, for any reason, in any way. You are allowed to point out contradictions I might make, only then if after you correctly state the relevant point. If you are lazy, just don't post and hopefully I'll correct myself or somebody else will be constructive.

I despise playing GT5 when tire wear is off or SRF is allowed. When people must know why I don't care for them when they play the game without realism... It is because they're not only wasting my time, they are cheating themselves out of a rather rewarding, true-to-life, simulation of a very expensive gentleman's sport.

Also, this is public forum. It is here to be taken for granted. My wishes are clear as day, written just fine. Enjoy answering my questions. You either do that, or you complainers are disgustingly true to the hypocrite you describe.

I'm glad you mention top speed will increase with a toe angle adjustment to, or towards 0. But does that translate to faster lap time on a real circuit like Suzuka? Are toe adjustments absolute? When the suspension is in motion, perhaps the toe angle is more commonly 0 when the setting is actually -.2. I don't know that much, does anyone else?

[hoping people will only post if they have accomplished what I have asked and have data to show everyone]

Ok,maybe it's just me or the other people on here that actually have a clue about tuning a car.You are correct in your last statement,you don't know that much.

 

[Johnnypenso]

In all my years online, I've ran into lots of guys like the OP, your typical flamer/troller. Why does anyone bother responding to him? It's such a waste of time. Can you not tell from his answers in this thread what kind of person you are dealing with? Would you give this person in real life the time of day? He wants you to do all the work while he sits back an easy chair, flinging insults, belittling people and criticizing every idea or suggestion anyone has.

Wake up!! Go and stick needles in your eye, it'll be more fun and more productive than this...lol.

 

[Jaywalker]

Brad - do you work at it or does it come naturallY?

 

[Onboy123]

You blame the tire wear, when tires are a standard setting for any car, for a loss, and then try to convince me how your feelings about something should interest me?

Here's the deal, GTPNewbies...

When I say tire wear off is stupid and is for newbies, it is. If you argue with that... you are stupid, and you are a newbie. You are allowed to use tire wear off, enjoy it, mention you enjoy it, and not argue with me.

You are not allowed to offer me tuning advice while deliberately being ambiguous about your realism settings (or any settings at all) after I express my joy at playing GT5 with full realism options set.

You are not allowed to slander me, for any reason, in any way. You are allowed to point out contradictions I might make, only then if after you correctly state the relevant point. If you are lazy, just don't post and hopefully I'll correct myself or somebody else will be constructive.

I despise playing GT5 when tire wear is off or SRF is allowed. When people must know why I don't care for them when they play the game without realism... It is because they're not only wasting my time, they are cheating themselves out of a rather rewarding, true-to-life, simulation of a very expensive gentleman's sport.

Also, this is public forum. It is here to be taken for granted. My wishes are clear as day, written just fine. Enjoy answering my questions. You either do that, or you complainers are disgustingly true to the hypocrite you describe.

I'm glad you mention top speed will increase with a toe angle adjustment to, or towards 0. But does that translate to faster lap time on a real circuit like Suzuka? Are toe adjustments absolute? When the suspension is in motion, perhaps the toe angle is more commonly 0 when the setting is actually -.2. I don't know that much, does anyone else?

[hoping people will only post if they have accomplished what I have asked and have data to show everyone]

No. This is the deal. The thread's been reported, Mods will take action. And really? Taking it to personal attacks? Stupid? Newbie? Yea, I'm stupid and newbie enough to be writing about the cars I drive in the game while passing my exams with flying colours. Yea, I ain't that smart. And you know what they say right? Treat others like they treat you. As of now, all I've seen you do is treat others with that hatefully vulgar mouth of yours. So why should we 'offer' you anything other than what amounts to a lot of spam and a bloody beating?

Let me tell you though, I do agree with you on one thing. SRF FTL. As for tyre wear? 50/50, I'm stuck with it for practice mode, but I do races in arcade and online with it off.

 

[BradKinder]

If you're 1.8 seconds faster at qualifying than me for a lap of... ****, ANYWHERE... I could follow and pass you any time I wanted. At the end of the race it makes no difference whatsoever. Newbie. Why are you wasting my time with this nonsense? Are you into endurance time trials? WTF?

Then you start rambling about MPG? Seriously?

I respect your enthusiasm, but you are not getting the point. I'd like to see the most extreme amount of improvement made only through FC suspension tweaks. The purpose is to gain an understanding of GT5, in simulation mode, for pure head-to-head racing purposes. It is not to debate that you once had a lap time of something, and then you had a lap time of something -.8. That's negligible stuff.

I want to hear that somebodys 2 minute lap dropped to 1'50. Due to excellent tuning for a specific course. And whether that tune is workable at other tracks. (from FC suspension defaults to FC suspension custom)

More clutter. If you tweaked every option in the FC suspension and can only offer me 1.8 seconds for a lap of the Circuit of Sarthe, why bother?

Let me understand this? If I adjust my suspension and take 1.8 seconds off 1 lap, in a 10 lap race,how far back would you be?
Lets put this into a realistic term for you. Do you own a car? Your recommended
tire pressure is 32 PSI.If you run this PSI you will get 32 MPG driving your car.
So now drop your PSI to 15 PSI and see what mileage you get? Yeah I get your point, loosing 3.2 MPG,more tire wear and basically throwing money out the window,why bother?

 

[cactusOnR]

Hi Brad,
I think the big problem here is your attitude to everyone.

I have an opinion of FC suspension and it affects to lap times from my testing that prove the benefits of tuning the suspension make.
But I have no interest in sharing any of with with you due to your terrible attitude through out this whole thread.

You could as others have said do the test yourself within a mew minutes.
Add the FC to a stock car. race round a track 10 times.
Pick a tuners set up add it to your car run the same track 10 times and see what the lap time differences are.

Good luck finding out what you want to know.

 

[Johnnypenso]

You guys are like moths to a flame...lol. Why does anyone bother?

 

[BradKinder]

I fail to understand everyone's enthusiasm towards posting that they aren't going to post.

You're all raping my perfectly legitimate thread. I don't care how much you love your tuning sub forum cartel, or anyone in it. There are thousands of people who log on here. Most are interested, some may like me. I don't care if you hate me. I DO CARE IF YOU CONVINCE OTHERS TO HATE ME.

I am not creating hate threads. I am offended. Whether you think I'm offensive in my own thread does not matter. That you want these threads to go on multiple pages, when the very first one could have already had 9 different legitimate answers tells me to need to be beaten until you're just strong enough to limp away and die comfortably far enough away from my discussion.

Get out unless you have a nice thing to say about gains made exclusively through FC suspension tweaks!

 

[Onboy123]

You guys are like moths to a flame...lol. Why does anyone bother?

Because he has attitude problems and we don't appreciate it.

Edit: @ OP.

U mad, bro?

 

[cactusOnR]

I know I shouldn't have bothered. I shouldn't have bothered even reading this thread.
Trying hard to stay away now.

 

[sylar2009]

You are not allowed to slander me, for any reason, in any way. You are allowed to point out contradictions I might make, only then if after you correctly state the relevant point. If you are lazy, just don't post and hopefully I'll correct myself or somebody else will be constructive.

Ok i'm a long time lurker, fairly new poster and so am aware my opinion may not carry much weight, but seriously, who do you think you are? The community here at GT planet is fantastic and if extremely knowledgeable people are taking up their time to answer a frankly vague question you posed and you then proceed to completely disregard anything they say, what was the point in asking?

Secondly what gives you the right to effectively demand answers and advice? As i said the community here is great and people will generally give up information without hesitation but when you show the kind of attitude and smugness that you have so far, well i'm surprised anybody bothered to respond to you.

Congratulations sir, you have ground my gears today

 

[tris_73]

I know I shouldn't have bothered. I shouldn't have bothered even reading this thread.
Trying hard to stay away now.

Little bit like a car wreck isn't it. Hey Onboy et al. Johnnypenso I think has the best idea. Let it go.

 

[killerjimbag]

If you're 1.8 seconds faster at qualifying than me for a lap of... ****, ANYWHERE... I could follow and pass you any time I wanted. At the end of the race it makes no difference whatsoever. Newbie. Why are you wasting my time with this nonsense? Are you into endurance time trials? WTF?

Then you start rambling about MPG? Seriously?

I respect your enthusiasm, but you are not getting the point. I'd like to see the most extreme amount of improvement made only through FC suspension tweaks. The purpose is to gain an understanding of GT5, in simulation mode, for pure head-to-head racing purposes. It is not to debate that you once had a lap time of something, and then you had a lap time of something -.8. That's negligible stuff.

I want to hear that somebodys 2 minute lap dropped to 1'50. Due to excellent tuning for a specific course. And whether that tune is workable at other tracks. (from FC suspension defaults to FC suspension custom)

Ok I'm going to make this real simple.I am online right now.Get in a Nascar leave it stock and we will do 10 laps at Daytona,then you can stick your foot in your mouth and cut off your fingers so you can't type anymore.

 

[Onboy123]

BradKinder has now been successfully added to your ignore list. You will now be returned to where you were.

👍 for that.

 

[killerjimbag]

I'm waiting,specific track,same cars and I will show you the point we are trying to make.Come on.

 

[Famine]

While the thread starter's question is valid - how much of a difference does suspension tuning on its own really make - his attitude towards other members have ensured that it's never going to actually go anywhere.

And we're done.