Time for Change? (UK General Election)

[Famine]

I'm sorry to see him go, personally, despite my rather cruel joke earlier!

I'm not.

That said, I'm not exactly jumping for joy Cameron's got in. He is, to use British vernacular misrepresented as American, a fanny. And, in the extremely sage words of The Daily Mash, Clegg (our new deputy PM, as I predicted last Friday) is an unmitigated charlatan.

 

[ExigeEvan]

I can't see how a LD/Tory coalition is going to last...

 

[Sphinx]

I can't see how a LD/Tory coalition is going to last...

We don't know if there is one as yet. I think we'll hear either way after Cameron meets the Queen.

 

[Touring Mars]

Well, an anagram of Cameron is romance

 

[ExigeEvan]

We don't know if there is one as yet. I think we'll hear either way after Cameron meets the Queen.

Tory minority government maybe!? Wahooooo

 

[lbsf1]

David Cameron is now Prime Minister of Great Britain.

 

[Famine]

I can't see how a LD/Tory coalition is going to last...

I can't see how it can't.

Remember the political compass I posted? Notionally all three parties are to the authoritarian right - Tories more right and Labour more authoritarian. There's not a lot of uncommon ground here - and the Lib Dems are nearer the Tories than Labour. Cameron's idea of "Big Society" is, actually, an old Liberal ideal. Remember the gags about Blair being the most successful Tory Prime Minister?


I've had to laugh as I've been driving the new car home today listening to people on the radio saying the Tories shouldn't be allowed to make a government because "the majority of people voted centre-left". No, 88% of people voted Lib/Lab/Con, which is right - and not even centre-right. Same ideas, similar execution, different colour ties.

 

[Aldo]

I guess the Queen is not thrilled either - Eastenders is coming on!

The Queen will actually be watching "Poirot" on ITV3 though...

 

[ExigeEvan]

I can't see how it can't.

Remember the political compass I posted? Notionally all three parties are to the authoritarian right - Tories more right and Labour more authoritarian. There's not a lot of uncommon ground here - and the Lib Dems are nearer the Tories than Labour. Cameron's idea of "Big Society" is, actually, an old Liberal ideal. Remember the gags about Blair being the most successful Tory Prime Minister?


I've had to laugh as I've been driving the new car home today listening to people on the radio saying the Tories shouldn't be allowed to make a government because "the majority of people voted centre-left". No, 88% of people voted Lib/Lab/Con, which is right - and not even centre-right. Same ideas, similar execution, different colour ties.

Regardless of political spectrum they've both offered different solutions to the same problems.

If they're the same political spectrum, and it's for the same end then I'm sure they'll all get along nicely and do whatever the conservatives want to do. Until LD start to wonder what's in it for them...

Tax issues alone should be more than interesting.

 

[Sphinx]

No, 88% of people voted Lib/Lab/Con, which is right - and not even centre-right. Same ideas, similar execution, different colour ties.

Well, yes, but there is still a huge difference between them. Lib, Lab pro Europe, Con's Eurosceptic's for example.

 

[MatskiMonk]

Well, Con-Lib coalition with Cameron at the helm is a done deal it seems, guess that gives us a fair stab at "change"

 

[Touring Mars]

Quite bizarre that, even without electoral reform, the Lib Dems have managed to secure a good chunk of Cabinet seats, despite gaining the support of just 1/5th of the British population, while Labour, with 10% more of the vote, are nowhere to be seen! So much for PR!

 

[Famine]

I wish I'd put money on the cabinet positions on Friday. I'm three for three - Cameroon as PM, Clegg as DPM, George Dawes as Chancellor. I've got Hague up for Home Secretary, if anyone fancies a flutter.

Regardless of political spectrum they've both offered different solutions to the same problems.

[...]

Tax issues alone should be more than interesting.

Well, yes, but there is still a huge difference between them. Lib, Lab pro Europe, Con's Eurosceptic's for example.

I don't think they're that different. Aside from minor technical differences they essentially have the same basic outlook on most things.

There are issues that make the Lib Dems more liberal and the Tories more authoritarian. There are issues that make the Tories more right wing and the Lib Dems more central. But I think the fundamental difference between Clegg and Cameron is no bigger than the fundamental difference between extremes within their own parties.

 

[Seismica]

Quite bizarre that, even without electoral reform, the Lib Dems have managed to secure a good chunk of Cabinet seats,

He's already chosen his cabinet? Obviously the Conservatives had to give up some high ranking cabinet positions, but do we have any details on who is doing what?

Vince Cable for Chancellor!!!!!! Please!

 

[Touring Mars]

He's already chosen his cabinet? Obviously the Conservatives had to give up some high ranking cabinet positions, but do we have any details on who is doing what?

Vince Cable for Chancellor!!!!!! Please!

George Osbourne has just been confirmed as Chancellor... Cable would have been a much better choice IMO, but not exactly a great shock there.

Cameron will pick his cabinet shortly, but the Lib Dems will almost certainly get several cabinet seats as a result of a formal coalition. As for Famine's predictions, I reckon it's a bit early to be taking your betting slip to the bookies... Clegg hasn't been confirmed as deputy PM just yet... he may even be leader of the House of Commons, apparently! Also, I hope you didn't write George Dawes on your betting slip

 

[lpb-nissan-gt-r]

Well we are officially ConDemed(LOL) can someone explain this to me? I saw a poster saying tories are bringing back national service for 16 year olds is this true? will I have to do it( im 16)? and what will I have to do if I do?

 

[Seismica]

Well we are officially ConDemed(LOL) can someone explain this to me? I saw a poster saying tories are bringing back national service for 16 year olds is this true? will I have to do it( im 16)? and what will I have to do if I do?

That is not true. At least, it wasn't in their manifesto... Who knows what they'll do.

 

[ExigeEvan]

Well we are officially ConDemed(LOL) can someone explain this to me? I saw a poster saying tories are bringing back national service for 16 year olds is this true? will I have to do it( im 16)? and what will I have to do if I do?

That is not true. At least, it wasn't in their manifesto... Who knows what they'll do.

I think it means if you're not in employment or full time education you'll be expected to do community service sort of things.

 

[Touring Mars]

It's not totally untrue...

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/politics/article7091616.ece

 

[Famine]

Also, I hope you didn't write George Dawes on your betting slip

He's a bay-beh! He's a bay-beh!

 

[Sphinx]

But I think the fundamental difference between Clegg and Cameron is no bigger than the fundamental difference between extremes within their own parties.

Of course, but it's a different ball game when those fundamental differences/ extremes are influencing policy as we have now. There is no doubt that the Tory cabinet will contain an array of eurosceptic's, Hague, Clarke and Cameron himself, Remember Cameron's stance in relation to the Lisbon Treaty?

Just confirmed, Hague, eurosceptic, to be Foreign Secretary. That's the difference. 👎

 

[Touring Mars]

Just confirmed, Hague, eurosceptic, to be Foreign Secretary. That's the difference. 👎

Yep, there's the first official facepalm of the evening... I cannot stand Hague, and I can't think of a worse choice to be "our man overseas"

Is it just me, or did the BBC get the same guy who wrote the music for Final Fantasy XIII to do the music tonight?

 

[Moglet]

It's not totally untrue...

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/politics/article7091616.ece

The link doesn't work. If it is at least partially true, I'm in support of it. It'll kick a lot of the little ***** into line.

 

[Jondot]

Just confirmed, Hague, eurosceptic, to be Foreign Secretary. That's the difference. 👎

Yep, there's the first official facepalm of the evening... I cannot stand Hague, and I can't think of a worse choice to be "our man overseas"

Could be worse.

 

[Seismica]

It's not totally untrue...

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/politics/article7091616.ece

Quote from that article:

"When they first mentioned this to me, all I heard was 'national service' and I thought 'Oh, my God, they're bringing it back"

Yep, exactly my reaction.

It is not compulsory though, they are just offering the chance.

 

[wainwj]

Could be EVEN WORSE...

 

[Stevisiov]

The link doesn't work. If it is at least partially true, I'm in support of it. It'll kick a lot of the little ***** into line.

Funny how would support it given that you never had to do it, I wonder if you'd say the same thing if you were 16...

Which is all moot anyway if I interpreted that article correctly. Its some sort of optional community service by the sounds of it. I can't see many takers.

 

[TheCracker]

Well we are officially ConDemed(LOL) can someone explain this to me? I saw a poster saying tories are bringing back national service for 16 year olds is this true? will I have to do it( im 16)? and what will I have to do if I do?

You've heard of Afghanistan right?

 

[MatskiMonk]

The link doesn't work. If it is at least partially true, I'm in support of it. It'll kick a lot of the little ***** into line.

Hmm, we could just end up with military trained chav's! Having said that.. might make highly effective minesweepers

 

[Famine]

Of course, but it's a different ball game when those fundamental differences/ extremes are influencing policy as we have now.

Extremes rarely influence policy. They are, after all, extremes.

Even less so in Coalition - which is all about compromise.

There is no doubt that the Tory cabinet will contain an array of eurosceptic's, Hague, Clarke and Cameron himself, Remember Cameron's stance in relation to the Lisbon Treaty?

Was it "say you'll have a referendum on it to appease everyone, but sign it anyway and pretend you'd never even heard the word 'referendum'"?

If you are anti-something and form an alliance with someone who is pro-something and you need to depend on their help to get anything done, you both put aside your anti/pro sentiment and compromise. Even if Cameron was an isolationist and Clegg supported us being a member of the USE, the fact they have to work together means that they either have to find a middle ground (for a stable coalition) or not deal with the issue at all (for a short-term one, prior to another election).

Now, oddly, the Tories have more common ground with Labour than Labour do with the Lib Dems. They have more common ground with the Lib Dems than they do with Labour. With two of the three having to cooperate for a government, ConLib is the only one that makes sense. The differences will either be smoothed out (which is good for most of us) or put off to the next parliament (which won't be as good, but should be much shorter term).

Just confirmed, Hague, eurosceptic, to be Foreign Secretary. That's the difference. 👎

Damn. I was running three for three there.

Still, we could do worse. Like someone who'd sell out our national interests easily. Sceptics generally require more convincing before they deal, and get a better deal for themselves (or us, in this case).