Why so many underage users?

[Akira GT]

I joined at 14 (I was nearly 15 though) and I'm sixteen now but I do agree that alot of the younger users seem very mature for their age (I was very suprised when I saw that Jai was 13)

Although they are a couple of people I dislike on the forums because of immaturity (they are all 18+ though) so I don't believe age is the problem for immaturity.

 

[mattythedog]

All this would be solved if people just told the truth. If youre not 13 just dont make an account until you are. You can still browse the forums, you just cant have an account. Me, Im 13, 14 in January. I think im quite mature, though Im dont know what you think.

 

[Camaroyenko]

I got into some crap with the COPPA on another site.. I joined here when I was 12, but started posting at 13, which will be 14 in a few days.

Ditto. Sad thing is, I spilled the beans and I was being the mature one in the situation.



I might try to go join that forum again-nah, forget it.

 

[Pyle_PMG]

Is it just coincidence then that your PSN name isn't dissimilar with a user that used to frequent these forums and eventually got banned for immaturity?

Purely coincidental sir.

 

[homeforsummer]

I'd suggest that members shouldn't really worry if other people see them as immature or not. The best defence against this is simply to have a little think every time you post and consider whether you'll be coming off badly to everyone else or not.

The other way of approaching this of course is to a) only post when you feel it necessary and not simply use the forums to chat, and b) try and ensure that each and every post is contributing to the forums.

Doing both of those things? You're probably posting maturely.

Purely coincidental sir.

Coincidental also then that you've - since I pointed it out - made it only available via PM.

There's no shame in it since your posting style is clearly very different from that member's was. But if you had been that member, a thread like this might be considered a little hypocritical.

 

[mattythedog]

What was that user called?

 

[Vince_Fiero]

By requiring people to be over 13, GTP commits no offense* under COPPA regulations. Anyone who tries to join GTP who is under 13 and lies to join the site is themselves committing an offense under COPPA regulations if they do not provide us with signed parental consent and is breaking the AUP. We will ban - and have banned - such members.


*It's a US federal law, so the (wrong) US spelling applies.

I do understand the arguments:
1) there are external rules
2) it is to protect these kids
3) this is a private place, if we ban it is our right
....

still it is more a matter of maturity (some young users can be sufficiently mature) and individual rights (we exclude you because you belong to this group)

In this whole thread we find it normal to discriminate for our own comfort and that is a dangerous thing.
Banning is discriminating, but on the basis of not contributing to the community as expected, that I find a lot easier to defend.

P.S.: irrelevant but I joined when I was 37

 

[Pyle_PMG]

I'd suggest that members shouldn't really worry if other people see them as immature or not. The best defence against this is simply to have a little think every time you post and consider whether you'll be coming off badly to everyone else or not.

The other way of approaching this of course is to a) only post when you feel it necessary and not simply use the forums to chat, and b) try and ensure that each and every post is contributing to the forums.

Doing both of those things? You're probably posting maturely.



Coincidental also then that you've - since I pointed it out - made it only available via PM.

There's no shame in it since your posting style is clearly very different from that member's was. But if you had been that member, a thread like this might be considered a little hypocritical.

Exactly why I am not that member.

 

[Famine]

still it is more a matter of maturity (some young users can be sufficiently mature) and individual rights (we exclude you because you belong to this group)

Not really, no. We want to continue providing this site. We can't do that if we're shut down under federal law.

Questions of maturity levels are irrelevant. Sufficiently immature members of any age will suicide-by-cop themselves off the site. We simply cannot allow underage users, regardless of how valuable they could be to the site because they would get the site closed.

 

[Akmuq]

All this would be solved if people just told the truth. If youre not 13 just dont make an account until you are. You can still browse the forums, you just cant have an account. Me, Im 13, 14 in January. I think im quite mature, though Im dont know what you think.

I think you're mature, you don't seem to get into stupid arguments.👍

__________

When a user get's banned for being under 13, is it a temporary ban until they're 13, or is it permanent?

 

[homeforsummer]

What was that user called?

It's not too important, but if you must know it's similar to CHILLYsmallitaliancar.

 

[Pyle_PMG]

I think you're mature, you don't seem to get into stupid arguments.👍

__________

When a user get's banned for being under 13, is it a temporary ban until they're 13, or is it permanent?

I am pretty sure it is permanent... But don't take my word for it if your life was on the line.

Maybe a mod can answer that question?

 

[Hun200kmh]

My own son registered to gtplanet when he was only 11 now he is 15 and I'm still more worried about his FB account than I ever was (even when he was 11) with him having an account here.

 

[Carbonox]

I was just a month over 12 when I first registered to a forum (non-GTP) and don't understand the point of any age limits in internet forums where the main point of discussion is a game series that all are allowed to play.

I just sometimes don't get why people get so over-obsessed with "protecting the children". Maybe I'm just naive, but I still don't get the point of any "13 year limit".

 

[David]

I was just a month over 12 when I first registered to a forum (non-GTP) and don't understand the point of any age limits in internet forums where the main point of discussion is a game series that all are allowed to play.

I just sometimes don't get why people get so over-obsessed with "protecting the children". Maybe I'm just naive, but I still don't get the point of any "13 year limit".

The content of the website has nothing to do with it. In any other real life context a 12 year old (hell even a 17 year old) can't fill out a form or participate in many activities without a parent/guardian signature, whether its for school, sports, clubs, work, or is medically related. Not everyone is a horrible criminal, but there are some bad people out there and unfortunately thats usually the last thing a 12 year old is thinking about on the internet. If I ran a forum I wouldn't want the Fed's to shut me down, and I certainly wouldn't want a predator to attack a child using information they found on my site.

 

[Carbonox]

I could as well ask, how does turning 13 make you any different than what you were at the age of 12 years and 364 days? In no way. That's a big loophole in age limits, same goes for the limit of 18 years when buying violent games. I fail to see a 17 year, 364 day old dude who is too immature to play GTA, suddenly become mature enough on his 18th birthday.

 

[Famine]

I was just a month over 12 when I first registered to a forum (non-GTP) and don't understand the point of any age limits in internet forums where the main point of discussion is a game series that all are allowed to play.

I just sometimes don't get why people get so over-obsessed with "protecting the children". Maybe I'm just naive, but I still don't get the point of any "13 year limit".

The point of the law is to prevent websites collecting personal information (name, e-mail address, hobbies) of minors - and to prevent them from giving it out. What goes on at the site isn't really relevant, as simply by signing up you're giving us your e-mail address and IP address. If you fill out your profile accurately, you give us your birthday, your hobbies, your favourite few things, your locations... This is all stuff that can be used to identify and locate, target advertising at or impersonate you.

I could as well ask, how does turning 13 make you any different than what you were at the age of 12 years and 364 days? In no way.

By that argument, being 16 + 0 is no different to being 15 + 364 (365 in a leap year), yet the former is "legal" and the latter gets you put on a sex offenders' register. Moreover, 15 + 364 is no different to 15 + 363, which is no different to 15 + 362, which is ... (insert long chain of successively smaller by 1 day) ... no different to 0 + 1.

Same for driving, serving in the military, smoking, drinking alcohol or owning firearms.

 

[Jahgee]

I'll be 14 in exactly one week, I didn't discover this website until like a month ago, so no threat of my underageness

 

[mafia_boy]

It's not just that the members joining are under 13, it's that their IQ's combined are under 13 and there lies the problem. I agree with some of the sentiments given from people, and I've copped some of the disrespect too from these new guys. Now in the past under normal circumstances, if someone made a stupid comment in the tuning (and now drag) forum, I would respond by telling them off in an AUP friendly way and be on my way because they understood the point, but lately when I make a simple comment with a point to it, it gets dissected and attacked by a pack of people who have no idea on comprehending what I said, let alone how to reply to what I've said.

To me personally, it seems that we've had a lot of moderators become "Staff Emeritus" in the recent past and that gap of moderator staff has allowed the quality of posting to drop because to coin a phrase; "there aren't enough sheriff's in town to deal with the cowboys". It's not that the staff aren't doing their job because I know that's not the case, whenever I ask something it's dealt with very promptly in 99% of cases.....but I asked daan something the other day and got no response which was unusual in itself as he responds very promptly to things, so I know that they're busy as with dealing with muppets ruining the site as it is without having to deal with requests.

Because of this, I feel that there aren't enough people to uphold the site's quality in my eyes right now. But on the plus side, I know there are plenty of people who would love to step up to the plate that in the past might not have been considered as moderator material because now, at this time, they want to keep the integrity of GTP being upheld as the forum it was and not let it slowly sink into a pit of immaturity and stupidity.

I hope you guys take this into account and have a look around at some of the more quality and/or long term members who would be willing to step up to the plate and rebuild the numbers in the moderator team. 👍

 

[Celicaas]

15 here turning 16 in the Next month wow I Thought jai was an older guy well he is little sorta

 

[Korza]

I was 11 or 12 when I first joined GTPlanet (now I'm 16). Does the COPPA apply in countries other than the US?

 

[PAPPACLART]

Please do. I mean, if you think that other users ignoring the AUP and being warned, infracted and banned is a defence against ignoring the AUP.

It was a joke, as one up for me if it indeed was deemed that GTP were harbouring under aged members

There's two declarations you make when you first go to sign up on GTPlanet. The first is that you have read and agreed to the AUP. The second is that you are 13 or over. After that, anyone who puts a date of birth in their profile while signing up that would make them under 13 cannot join. They can of course lie about all three of these things, but then:

Its been a few years since I signed up to GTP, so don't remember, but yes easy to get around and very hard to police unles of course said member was silly enough to advertise the fact of there true age.

By requiring people to be over 13, GTP commits no offense* under COPPA regulations. Anyone who tries to join GTP who is under 13 and lies to join the site is themselves committing an offense under COPPA regulations if they do not provide us with signed parental consent and is breaking the AUP. We will ban - and have banned - such members.

If considering the above, what the hell is the point of COPPA, if it is clear that they can not police the whole interweb to ensure that under age members are not signing up to sites that they should not be? Is it just another QUANGO (as the Daily Mail would put it) group that does very little but create jobs?

 

[Lucas]

By that argument, being 16 + 0 is no different to being 15 + 364 (365 in a leap year), yet the former is "legal" and the latter gets you put on a sex offenders' register. Moreover, 15 + 364 is no different to 15 + 363, which is no different to 15 + 362, which is ... (insert long chain of successively smaller by 1 day) ... no different to 0 + 1.

Pedobear logic.

 

[niky]

Truth is... "underage" varies wildly from country to country or state to state. You can still legally get married at under sixteen (as low as fourteen) in some countries.

Laws often pick an arbitrary age because it's impossible to police anything which states "Thou shalt not have sex with or court persons or personages who lack the wit and common sense to engage in consensual relations with other adults..."

Whereas it's easier to police where you set an arbitrary cut-off like "sixteen years, irregardless of leap years and persons born on February the twenty ninth."

I was 11 or 12 when I first joined GTPlanet (now I'm 16). Does the COPPA apply in countries other than the US?

Applies to websites operated from the US or which "knowingly" target US children. GTPlanet is an American website, so the rules apply here.

For non-US sites... Kind of a gray area there. We don't actually have to worry about it on our local forums and sites (which, thanks to the extreme popularity of MMORPGs, have a lot of under 13 users) because they're targeted at local users only... and the Feds would have to prove that we're targetting US children with banners like: "Free candy inside for underage American children!"

Do note: Under-13 users from the US can join whatever forum they want by providing false information, which renders this law mostly moot... at least until they require every single internet user to have an access card that stores their personal information, which would actually make it easier for predators to find young targets.

 

[Famine]

If considering the above, what the hell is the point of COPPA, if it is clear that they can not police the whole interweb to ensure that under age members are not signing up to sites that they should not be? Is it just another QUANGO (as the Daily Mail would put it) group that does very little but create jobs?

COPPA is the name of the law, not a group... The Children's Online Privacy Protection Act. It's also unlikely to be a QUANGO, given that it's a US Federal Law...

The point of COPPA? It's:

The point of the law is to prevent websites collecting personal information (name, e-mail address, hobbies) of minors - and to prevent them from giving it out. What goes on at the site isn't really relevant, as simply by signing up you're giving us your e-mail address and IP address. If you fill out your profile accurately, you give us your birthday, your hobbies, your favourite few things, your locations... This is all stuff that can be used to identify and locate, target advertising at or impersonate you.

 

[PAPPACLART]

COPPA is the name of the law, not a group... The Children's Online Privacy Protection Act. It's also unlikely to be a QUANGO, given that it's a US Federal Law...

The point of COPPA? It's:

Ah ok understood. So who enforces the actual Law, just the government - FBI etc?

I thought it was another Government group/agency specifically responsible.

 

[Famine]

It's a Federal Law so it'll be the FBI.

(think of the FBI as being like the UK's CID but rather than belonging to one police force they're employed at a national level).

 

[Pupik]

When a user gets banned for being under 13, is it a temporary ban until they're 13, or is it permanent?

It's a permanent ban, as we can't effectively un-ban an account unless a ban is set to expire. We can't prove an account belongs to a user via email or another user, because that destroys the point of banishment in the first place. Besides, The Law states we shouldn't have that information in the first place, so we are not supposed to retain it.

Also, why should we believe a user that "suddenly turned 13", when they already lied to everyone and the contract in the first place? They should only re-join our site when they comply with the law.

Basically, we have to be zero tolerance on this issue. No exceptions...don't bother trucking out an "but I'm more mature than most members" excuse. Eventually, we'll figure it out if anyone's lying, and then its game over at GTP.

This is the law, and everyone has to follow it...just because I may be considered more mature than most senior citizens doesn't entitle me to Social Security benefits, until I am 62.5 years old.

 

[Dennisch]

So everyone who signed in when he was 12 should actually be banned.

 

[Camaroyenko]

So everyone who signed in when he was 12 should actually be banned.

I'm screwed...