Windows Vista, Mac OS X Leopard, & Ubuntu "Edgy Eft"

[Pako]

That's unfortunate Pako. Have you tried installing the 32-bit version instead? Performance-wise it may not be ideal, but it might work.

Oh and I hope you're not planning on getting rid of Windows soon... from looking at your thread, I can only imagine the gaming experience on that thing

Not at all...It's more of a "Can I do it..." thing. I don't 'need' Ubuntu but I thought It would be cool to dual-boot and try to start using it for the regular stuff and just game with XP. Besides...it's cool to say that you use Linux.

I've actually been running RH 7.x on my web server for a couple years now. It's all SSH terminal interaction. I find what I have to do then do it. Problem is every time I need to 'do anything' I have to pull my notes out or hit the forums again.

Haven't tried Windows Vista Yet. Will report back if I do, crossfire compatibility seems slim, but ATI already has a Catalyst driver out, so maybe there's hope.

 

[jimihemmy]

I finally got it installed and I have to say that I am impressed with it.....

I've only messed around with it for about 30 minutes, but it looks like a Linux distro with all that we know, love (hate?), and are familiar about in Windows.....

I'll have more impressions later....

 

[Iceman]

Can Vista be dual booted with XP x64?

 

[xsquizet-drifte]

-Is your computer Vista ready?
If you call a p2, with 128mb of ram and a 5gb hd ready, i think not

-Will you upgrade or just wait until you purchase new PC that already comes w/ Vista?
I am getting a computer built

-Are you running XP, or still running a previous version of Windows?
previous version windows 2000 professonal

-Do you use any other OS?
nope

-Have you checked out Internet Explorer 7 Beta, Windows Defender, or Windows Media Player 11?
yes but can't use any of them because of my current os

-Have you already used a developers' build of Vista? If so, what did you think of it?
nope wish i could

 

[Pako]

Can Vista be dual booted with XP x64?

As soon as I can get my hands on a Vista x64 Iso, I will be able to let you know.

I'll see if BitTorrent can deliver.

 

[dougiemeats]

I added a more discrete disclaimer under the link for the Vista Beta. I don't want anyone losing any important files when trying out Vista. I will now continue my showcase of the 3 upcoming operating systems.

Your Digital Life

There are some that view a computer simply as a tool to get work done. There are many, however, that want to add "fun" into the equation. Let's look at how these next generation operating systems will help you create, store, organize, and share your digital life.

Mac OS X Leopard: Apple currently includes the iLife software suite with every new Mac. The applications are closely integrated, making it easier to create your photo, music, and movie masterpieces.

-iPhoto
-iMovie HD
-iDVD
-iTunes
-iWeb
-GarageBand
-Front Row (not included in iLife but is included in every new Mac, except the Power Mac)

Windows Vista: Microsoft will also provide applications for your photos, music, and movies. Most of these apps will come with Vista but some will only be included in the Premium or Ultimate versions (I don't know much about "Monaco," so it is a question as to whether or not it will be included in Vista).

-Photo Gallery
-Movie Maker HD
-DVD Maker
-Windows Media Player
-Code-name "Monaco" (music-making program similar to Apple's GarageBand)
-Media Center

Ubuntu Edgy Eft: This is where I feel that Ubuntu (and other Linux distributions) are lacking. While one can make the argument that there are many good music/media players and photo managers for Linux, there are only few that really stand out and many of the applications feel "unfinished." This is not Ubuntu's fault however. Proprietary formats and DRM are a couple reasons why Ubuntu doesn't have an "iLife" or a "Media Center." Features for Edgy are still being decided on, so Ubuntu may have something for us in October. Until then, I think this is one of the many reasons Linux has yet to see adoption from many consumers. This is only my opinion. Please feel free to express yours.

 

[DuckRacer]

I think if you get the premium version of vista, it should have all of MS Office, so you won't have to buy it.

As with Ubuntu having no media suite, well, you have to remember Ubuntu is free. You have to pay for OSX, you have to pay for XP, and even though that they both have prices, you have a lot more compatability.

IMO, Linux is a good operating system to try out, or to use for servers. I don't think it's the best for the average person, though.

 

[KieranMurphy]

Bah.

I made 2 attempts to download the ISO for the 64-bit version from Microsoft's website. The link to install a Java applet didn't work. It just opened up a page that told me an applet would be installed, but nothing happened, so I just used Firefox's inbuilt downloader. On both occasions it got to just under 20% and Firefox crashed. When I restarted Firefox, the download wouldn't restart.

I'll just wait until Monday and make a copy of the disc we made at work or download another copy at work.


KM.

 

[GT4_Rule]

You can download the Vista Beta 2 on CNET as well as Microsoft.com but its 3GB in size and if it screws up your settings and programs, then it's your own fault. Too bad, I would've liked to download it and tried it...

Is it possible to have Win XP and Vista, both on the same HDD and choose which one to boot to?

 

[KieranMurphy]

I dunno. I'm gonna put it on my better computer, but instead of having it live alongside XP on the same HD, I'm going to install it on a spare hard disk I have. That way there's no risk of it screwing up my PC.


KM.

 

[dougiemeats]

OK, I have the ISO. Now I need a Vista capable PC... (Now I wish I would have waited and purchased an Intel iMac)

jimihemmy, Pako, KieranMurphy, and anyone else giving Vista a test drive:

Be sure to keep us updated (that is, if you get it running) with your impressions of Vista. 👍 Hopefully, I can get my computer upgraded by the time the Release Candidate comes out.

 

[Pako]

Well I got the x86 ISO but I just got this link to work:
http://download.windowsvista.com/preview/beta2/en/x86/download.htm

and am downloading the x64 version right now. I'd prefer to try and get that install going instead. Will post impressions once installed.

 

[Burnout]

So far I haven't had any major problems with any of the Vista install so far... I did have on BSOD though. :-D

Do tell us how the 64-bit install goes, Pako. So far all of my installs have been 32-bit.

 

[Pako]

Well, I see that Windows hasn't improved their RAID support. I can't install it due to lack of drivers for my RAID that I run for the system drive. I suppose I could always install a standards IDE drive, but if I can't even get my RAID going I have very low expectations to get anything going right. If anyone is looking for the x64 or x86 ISO and can't get it let me know.

 

[jimihemmy]

Well, let me expand on my first impressions.....

So far, I like it...alot. I've always been interested in a Linux system but didn't know where to start. Over time I've dabble with a few distros here and there, but never got fully into Linux.

Vista looks like a Linux distro to me. A very nice one.....but with all the Windows stuff that I am familiar with which makes it easier for me to use. My main problems with Linux has always been the command line and programs....

I am very unfamiliar with the command, so I don't want to kill my cpu using cmd when I don't know what I'm doing. In Windows, you don't even think of the command line. The Linux programs all have names that I don't know and it takes a while to figure out what it would be in Windows.

That said...it seems Vista is going for people like me: interested in linux, scared to use it fully. So they make Vista the Windows Linux....probably with the same old security holes though...

So, far my only problem is when running WMP11, my cpu seems to slow to a crawl. It does not seem to happen with using Winamp or iTunes...I don't know if its a WMP11 issue or just my cheap, first time I built one on my own compter.....

let me just say....it definitely looks better than previous versions on Windows.
My next mission is to try to get it to dual boot on my main machine (which seems to work better) and see how vista does there...give me a few days for that though...


thats it for now

 

[KieranMurphy]

The prevous installation we tried at work was a dodgy computer. I got it up and running in about 45 minutes on another PC today. It wasn't a great PC - 2.6Ghz Celeron, 1Gb RAM, 80GB IDE HD.

It's very pretty looking and has lots of impressive visual effects, but I never got the chance to use it properly. I took a copy home so I think I'll install it on one of my PCs tonight and take IE7 for a test drive on the 'net.


KM.

 

[dougiemeats]

Pako - No luck, huh?

jimihemmy - Interesting. I liked how you compared it to a Linux distro. Every review I have read in internet or news articles have compared Vista to OS X Tiger, and I'm glad it's compared to something else for a change.

KieranMurphy - About the visual effects: Are they worth running full-time? Or is it something a person will like for a little while but end up going to classic-look? I say this because after using my Mac for a while I get tired of them. I feel relieved when I use Ubuntu (I don't have any of the 3-D stuff installed) or XP because of the simple look without the fancy stuff. Good luck getting it running on your PC at home:tup:

 

[jimihemmy]

jimihemmy - Interesting. I liked how you compared it to a Linux distro. Every review I have read in internet or news articles have compared Vista to OS X Tiger, and I'm glad it's compared to something else for a change.

I can't compare to OS X for I have no access to a Mac (or any other Apple computer for that matter). So, Linux is the only thing I can compare it to. There is a distinct difference visually between XP and the Linux distros I have seen.
I would think that if you did not see the Windows logo or program names, you could have a hard time telling it wasn't Linux.

KieranMurphy - About the visual effects: Are they worth running full-time? Or is it something a person will like for a little while but end up going to classic-look? I say this because after using my Mac for a while I get tired of them. I feel relieved when I use Ubuntu (I don't have any of the 3-D stuff installed) or XP because of the simple look without the fancy stuff. Good luck getting it running on your PC at home:tup:

not speaking for KM...but I'm sure I will run it for a while because it just looks 'cool' to me since all I've had is XP.....I'm still working my way to Ubuntu (thanks for the tips)

 

[KieranMurphy]

The visual effects are pretty cool looking and not at all distracting. It's not the kind of thing I'd bother turning off unless performance was an issue. It's just eye candy and may not be worth the while if you've got a budget PC that barely meets the specs.

I'm backing using my main PC with WinXP at the moment. I can't get audio working with Vista. I downloaded the NForce audio drivers beta version for Vista but it gave me an error about it not instalilng properly the first time and every time I try since it seems to try to install and doesn't give another error message, but Vista insists that I've got no audio devices installed.

Internet Explorer 7 has tabbed browsing so has caught up with the rest of the world, but in my brief fiddling about but I got frustrated while trying to customise it. There didn't seem to be any STOP button that you could put on the toolbar for example. I'm too used to Firefox so I got bored with it IE 7 after a short while, and downloaded the latest version of Firefox which worked fine with Vista.

One thing I've noticed about both Ubuntu and Vista is that they have antialiased fonts as default in the GUI. Now that I'm back in XP, it looks stark and ugly with these naked aliased fonts. But I've seen antialiasing in XP screenshots before - how do I turn it on?


KM.

 

[dougiemeats]

I think the "Stop" button will always be to the right of the address bar.


For the fonts in XP, right-click the desktop and go to Properties. Then go to Appearance > Effects.


In addition to that, you can try: http://www.microsoft.com/typography/cleartype/tuner/Step1.aspx

Hope that helps. 👍

 

[Midnight Runner]

.

But I've seen antialiasing in XP screenshots before - how do I turn it on?


KM.

1. right click on desktop,hit "Properties"
2.click appearance tab
3. click effects button
4. click the second tick in the dialog "Use the following method....."
5. select ClearType.
6 Click OK.
7. click apply,close dialog,
8. ENJOY.

 

[F1GTR]

Thanks for that Dougiemeats, everything is SO much clearer!

 

[KieranMurphy]

1. right click on desktop,hit "Properties"
2.click appearance tab
3. click eddects button
4. click the second tick in the dialog "Use the following method....."
5. select ClearType.
6 Click OK.
7. click apply,close dialog,
8. ENJOY.

Awesome. Thanks, that's so much better. I was already getting a headache from switching over from a week of Ubuntu/Vista and their lovely smooth text. I never knew that such a thing existed in XP.


KM.

 

[dougiemeats]

No problem GTRacer4

I have a question to the Vista beta testers:

I've used IE7, WMP11, and Defender in XP and I've noticed that they have hidden the menus (File, Edit, View, Tools, etc.) by default. I like how the windows look a lot "cleaner" because of this and you can show these menus by hitting the 'Alt' key but...

Is it hard getting used to the fact that they are hidden by default in most applications (not counting 3rd-party apps)?

 

[jimihemmy]

No problem GTRacer4

I have a question to the Vista beta testers:

I've used IE7, WMP11, and Defender in XP and I've noticed that they have hidden the menus (File, Edit, View, Tools, etc.) by default. I like how the windows look a lot "cleaner" because of this and you can show these menus by hitting the 'Alt' key but...

Is it hard getting used to the fact that they are hidden by default in most applications (not counting 3rd-party apps)?

Speaking about IE7 only....

I never really noticed that they were gone. I usually don't use those menu buttons. My mouse has left and right side buttons that I use for 'back' and 'forward'. I'm already used to the 'refresh' and 'stop' button being next to the address bar. And the 'tools' option being on the far right was easy to find and use.

just my impressions.......

 

[GT4_Rule]

I'm actually enjoying the clean interface of IE7. Back, Forward, address bar, Stop, Refresh. That's all I need. If you need the File, Edit, etc menus simply press ALT and it shows up.

 

[GilesGuthrie]

I've done some preparations for installing the Beta 2 of Vista, including downloading the 4GB ISO file for the 64-bit edition.

You guys who are concerned about dual-booting need to go check out a product called VMWare (linky). You can download a beta of their "Server" product, free of charge. There is a program to deliver light-use-class VMWare products free of charge on a semi-permanent basis, but I have yet to fully explore this.

Anyway, the "VM" in VMWare stands for Virtual Machine. So you install VMWare on your computer (there are Windows and Linux versions available), and you then create a virtual computer using your system's physical resources, into which you can install and run whatever you want. Including dodgy beta versions of operating systems. You can choose to make your machine's resources available, including RAM and disk, and you can choose whether to make other hardware available directly, sandboxed, or virtualised. You can also run more than one virtual computer simultaneously, so you can (if you have enough RAM) run an entire network virtually.

VMWare provide custom images of standard machines for you to use, but I haven't yet investigated this. And I do know that you can create an image of a VM, so that if you destroy it in some way you can just reload the image.

As I say, it's very much dependent upon how much memory you can have, but I would say that 1GB RAM is quite cheap compared to having to rebuild a computer just to repartition it, or because your dodgy beta OS has trashed it.

As a technology, it's totally awesome, especially for what we're talking about here. If I get really into it, what I might do is create a really basic Linux build on my computer, and then just choose my OS to run through VMWare. Of course, it's accelerating my desire for the second GB of RAM!

Oh, and I noted that MS state on the Vista download site that "you may not be able to upgrade from the beta product to the final version. A clean install may be required". Nice.

Anyway, once I have my VM set up, and have Vista installed in it, I'll let you know what I think.

 

[GT4_Rule]

I want the Beta Vista badly...but 64MB of video memory and (already stretched) 512MB of memory doesn't help my cause...as well as 7GB free space on my HDD.

 

[Pako]

I've done some preparations for installing the Beta 2 of Vista, including downloading the 4GB ISO file for the 64-bit edition.

You guys who are concerned about dual-booting need to go check out a product called VMWare (linky). You can download a beta of their "Server" product, free of charge. There is a program to deliver light-use-class VMWare products free of charge on a semi-permanent basis, but I have yet to fully explore this.

Anyway, the "VM" in VMWare stands for Virtual Machine. So you install VMWare on your computer (there are Windows and Linux versions available), and you then create a virtual computer using your system's physical resources, into which you can install and run whatever you want. Including dodgy beta versions of operating systems. You can choose to make your machine's resources available, including RAM and disk, and you can choose whether to make other hardware available directly, sandboxed, or virtualised. You can also run more than one virtual computer simultaneously, so you can (if you have enough RAM) run an entire network virtually.

VMWare provide custom images of standard machines for you to use, but I haven't yet investigated this. And I do know that you can create an image of a VM, so that if you destroy it in some way you can just reload the image.

As I say, it's very much dependent upon how much memory you can have, but I would say that 1GB RAM is quite cheap compared to having to rebuild a computer just to repartition it, or because your dodgy beta OS has trashed it.

As a technology, it's totally awesome, especially for what we're talking about here. If I get really into it, what I might do is create a really basic Linux build on my computer, and then just choose my OS to run through VMWare. Of course, it's accelerating my desire for the second GB of RAM!

Oh, and I noted that MS state on the Vista download site that "you may not be able to upgrade from the beta product to the final version. A clean install may be required". Nice.

Anyway, once I have my VM set up, and have Vista installed in it, I'll let you know what I think.

If you get it to work and share a "How To" it will probably be worth lots of rep points to ya.

VMWare sounds like a viable options and if you can install it once already booted, the raid issue I have now may not be an issue at all. I'll wait and see how your go it works out first.

 

[jimihemmy]

well, let me start with some background info....

I have 2 computers...1 pre-built, 1 I built my self...
Without listing all specs....
pre built:

2.4 Pentium 4
1 gb ram
ATI 9600 SE video card

I built:
2.24 Celeron
2 gb ram
Mad Dog video card (I forget which)

I originally put Vista one the one I made since I use it as a 'tester' machine. That is where my first impressions where from.

So last night, I used a spare 40 HDD and did a clean OEM install on my pre-built machine (my main computer). Installed Partition Magic and made a 13 GB partition. Then I did a clean install of Vista on the new partition.

I then tested Vista on my main machine and I have to say I am now very, very impressed with it. The clear glass look, they way the windows kind of 'zoom' when opening and closing. And I experienced none of the problems I was having on my tester. No stuttering, no slowdown, no massive cpu usage using WMP11, no nothing...it was great!

I then installed BootMagic on this machine so I can dual-boot...it works like a charm with no issues. If you decide to go this route...install BootMagic before your second OS...it will make things alot easier.

Which brings me to another question (probably for a different thread though)....
Why is my 'tester' having these performance issues? Could it be the video card? It works fine with XP but not Vista. Could it be that a Celeron is really that bad? I got it because it was cheap...maybe I should have forked out a little more for a P4.....