Yeah, But Does Your Tune Work ONLINE? (Possible Future Hassle for Tuning Community?)

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SS_1182

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It has now been confirmed that I am not the only tuner experiencing this.



The online physics in this game are different than the offline ones. And tunes that are setup offline with zero lag are simply not the most effective ones to be used competitively in online races.



I think we as tuners should start making a distinction about whether our tunes were created in online lobbies (personal lounge or otherwise), or offline.



Online physics create a greater degree of oversteer. Tunes that seemed just fine offline will oversteer like mad at times online (search the tuning threads for Motor Sport Elise '99). And the issue here is that GT5's A-Spec races have a very short replay value, which means they will surely to die off in a hurry within months. So the other remaining options are for PD to release a lot more offline content, or naturally the game will shift in a great degree toward online racing. If it goes online to the extent that I believe it will, all of the work put into offline tuning setups will require significant modification.



As a test, take any tune you are proud to have created. Drive it around Nordschleife OFFLINE. See how it handles. Now take it ONLINE and do the same. The differences in physics are undeniable.




Just curious to hear feedback on this issue. I suggest we deal with it now, because it's bound to come up sooner or later with the way this game has been designed, and TBH as a serious online racer I already don't waste my time with any tunes that were created offline because they oversteer online. Some are manageable with tweaking (so I might as well tune them myself online), but many are not.



Thoughts?
 
I did notice it, but it never really had an effect on my tune... I just set up a Lotus Esprit V8 with no rear wing, took me ages...

Time to try it online. Ill get back to you :)
 
I know there's a lot of talent around here for tuning, and let's face it, the future of GT5 really is going to be in the online community. I think that if we can really bolster some enthusiasm for improving drivers' online competitiveness through this tuning forum it could help to get the ball rolling. The online is definitely enjoyable right now, but I see it as a mere skeleton of something that could really be interactive. There's really almost nothing to it at the moment, but at least the community can really do a lot through creating their own events, etc. Once the community really starts competing and they set up the online reward system better, I really think the need and desire for great tunes is going to take off as well.
 
I noticed it too.did an Ford GT LM Spec II Test Car setup offline and it was a blast but online i couldnt accelerate out of corners on 4th gear !!
In the next update PD should impilment the "save setup" function from prologue.so that you can switch to offline/online setup.
But I will do my future setups online since there is the "real" competition.
 
Online you have variable tire wear and your fuel depletion also affects handling. In offline races this is not the case. I personally think that variable tire wear and fuel depletion are what causes the different handling we experience online. In offline races these aspects remain constant....
 
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Blitz187
Online you have variable tire wear and your fuel depletion also affects handling. In offline lraces this is not the case. I personally think that variable tire wear and feul depletion are what causes the different handling we experience online. In offline races these aspects remain constant....
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I have to disagree. I experience the change immediately upon hitting the track. The things you mention I also experience, but not until the 4th or 5th lap of a race.
 
I think the problem is most tunes here are borderline schizophrenic and overly dependent on race soft to "handle properly," start tuning for a lower tire grade offline, then if it doesn't handle well online, you have the option to bump up to the next tire grade.

Also it's rumored Kaz has a grudge against slams and added an algorithm to add 1/100th of lateral G-force for each mm of negative ride height given to an online tune. :sly:
 
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I agree with the OP.
All of the 'great tunes' I've reviewed offline, are different animals online.
Some more manageable than others, but some literally undriveable.
 
SS_1182
I have to disagree. I experience the change immediately upon hitting the track. The things you mention I also experience, but not until the 4th or 5th lap of a race.
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I had a long race on De La Sarthe with a group of people in an old school Alfa race car... And I made my setup offline... Used it with great succes online in the race for 17 laps of Le Sarthe and I didnt have that much difficulty except for the things I mentioned... I think this is one of those things that will simply remain a mystery.
 
Honestly I think it comes down to the connection, and lag.
I can't imagine why they would make two different versions of the physics.
 
Most of the tuning that I've done has been from my online lounge. This is extremely helpful because there is no noticable difference in physics between the lounge and the open lobby enviroment.

As mentioned in the OP, it indeed makes sense to tune for online. The bonus is that a fast and stable car tuned for online use will only be more potent in A-spec.
 
This has always been true.

Prologue was the same.

Cars do handle slightly different on line.

If your only tuning off line , Your in trouble. Then you have the effects of fuel and tire wear also.

Test all tunes on line, and adjust accordingly.
 
CloneHead
Honestly I think it comes down to the connection, and lag.
I can't imagine why they would make two different versions of the physics.
Click to expand...



I don't think they designed it that way. I think it's just what happens when you figure in network connections that set those physics up. But the thing about it is that I experience the difference in physics even when I am the room host, so I can't blame it on bad connections. Even if my connection was really bad it should be fine for me as host, but it isn't.




budious
I think the problem is most tunes here are borderline schizophrenic and overly dependent on race soft to "handle properly," start tuning for a lower tire grade offline, then if it doesn't handle well online, you have the option to bump up to the next tire grade.

Also it's rumored Kaz has a grudge against slams and added an algorithm to add 1/100th of lateral G-force for each mm of negative ride height given to an online tune. :sly:
Click to expand...




Hmm, I definitely consider that a rumor at best. Try slamming the Impreza RM down to -50/-50 and tell me that it still doesn't hug the road like a monster.

And I also don't really see the value in tuning for lower grade tires for two reasons. First of all, I never use them online. I might use racing hard tires when I'm in a Super GT-only race and that's what's agreed upon, but otherwise I've never had to change to anything other than racing soft. And while the idea that tuning for lower grade tires and then experiencing some sort of boost when you add racing softs seems good in theory, it's not really a good idea either imo, because I personally want to tune my cars for exactly how I'd be experiencing the physics of the game. If anything, I'd use different tunes for softs and sports respectively.



Blitz187
I had a long race on De La Sarthe with a group of people in an old school Alfa race car... And I made my setup offline... Used it with great succes online in the race for 17 laps of Le Sarthe and I didnt have that much difficulty except for the things I mentioned... I think this is one of those things that will simply remain a mystery.
Click to expand...



Not to disrespect your argument, but I think that La Sarthe is a tough track to judge this by. It's mostly straights without any real technical sections or significant elevation changes.
 
SS_1182
Not to disrespect your argument, but I think that La Sarthe is a tough track to judge this by. It's mostly straights without any real technical sections or significant elevation changes.
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Ummm... wouldnt it affect every track/car combo if it was really an issue? I'm aware there are inconsistencies between online and offline. All I was saying is that I havent had to deal with them badly yet, as in needing to go back and change settings and such.

And I dont know what Le Sarthe youve been racing but the Porsche Curves is technical enough for me... Also a VERY bumpy circuit I might add...
 
La Sarthe is just bumpy, it's not a very technical course. The bumps are mostly in the straights anyway which is hardly an issue.

I've always tuned online in my own lobby. Online is where tunes matter anyway, because really, who cares about tuning offline? Tuning in your own lobby is also quicker than doing it in practice/arcade mode since you can just jump back out into the lounge, adjust the settings, jump back into the track and test again without any sort of loading whatsoever. The only reason I can think of for people tuning offline is for the GTP registry time trials.... but time trials isn't really fun for me.
 
budious
I think the problem is most tunes here are borderline schizophrenic and overly dependent on race soft to "handle properly," start tuning for a lower tire grade offline, then if it doesn't handle well online, you have the option to bump up to the next tire grade.
Click to expand...

Not really. There are plenty of tunes made for Sport: Soft.

Adding better tyres haven't made it much better for me.

Main problem I have with the online physics is corner exit: The rear feels stiff (like it should) then all of a sudden it's soft = Loss of traction -> Oversteer. It's really annoying and unpredictable.
 
I only race tuned car online and never really had a problem, I'm using big garage tune tho most of the times. I'm using a DS3 too.
Sure there's a bit more oversteer online but that can be corrected with trottle control. Oversteer on FR/MR will be there if you use sport tyres on anything wiht more than 300 HP. Same in real life really. Try to get a FR car and smash the accelerator at apex, you'll see the result.
 
Blitz187
Online you have variable tire wear and your fuel depletion also affects handling. In offline races this is not the case. I personally think that variable tire wear and fuel depletion are what causes the different handling we experience online. In offline races these aspects remain constant....
Click to expand...
this

In offline your tires are always 0 sec old. You have warm 0 sec tires, or fresh 0 sec tires.
Online after 1 sec there's a difference. You have warm x sec tires, or fresh x-y sec tires.

You can't compare these two.

Also, the console may have complete algorythm resolution offline and fast resolution for online play, but the general results are somehow the same : if you have a **** setup offline that will be a **** setup online. If you have a good setup offline, that will be a good setup online. To my knowledge there's no "online = bad setup / offline = good setup" apart drift setups.
Online you can't mix drift setups with road setups because your tires will fade out too fast.
 
I still don't buy that the tuning is different online and off. I haven't noticed any issues or differences with my tunes, but I will admit that I haven't done a back to back test. I also don't see any "real" results posted here by any of you claiming that there are differences.

I am going to take my best tuned car and run 10 laps offline and 10 laps online with the same setup. Lap times will tell.

Then I am going to take a car that I have spend less than 5 min tuning and do the same thing. Lap times will tell.
 
Motor City Hami
I still don't buy that the tuning is different online and off. I haven't noticed any issues or differences with my tunes, but I will admit that I haven't done a back to back test. I also don't see any "real" results posted here by any of you claiming that there are differences.

I am going to take my best tuned car and run 10 laps offline and 10 laps online with the same setup. Lap times will tell.

Then I am going to take a car that I have spend less than 5 min tuning and do the same thing. Lap times will tell.
Click to expand...



I'm telling you man, I literally spent 4 hours the other day working on my EVO RM tune in an online lobby. By the time I was finished with it, it still had a vapor of oversteer. I took it offline and it had understeer, and it seemed that the offline LSD settings were more effective as the car was pushing back on me more. I also think this is more pronounced in some cars than others, again see the threads on the Motor Sport Elise.
 
thank god for this thread, I thought I was going mad lol, Many times ive set up a car and fine tuned it to perfection, then taken it online and been all over the track like a drunk driver! why oh why have pd done this????
 
I am not a tuner but I have used several tunes from different tuner garages. Online most work flawlessly and I can use them without question. Going into online (my lounge) and they become very unpredictable especially in the lower gears.

I have noticed the biggest issue with the bigger HP cars - like the ZR1 with RM. You can also see it in the lower hp cars as well. I have recently used the Elise 111 R with race mod from RKM Motorsports (the "Romeo" tune) and offline I can regularly do 1-2 seconds faster than when I am in "my lounge". Same track, same car. The biggest issue is I have found is the acceleration from corners. I can make the elise literally spin out coming out of corners online but not offline.

In my experience, there is a difference between online and off...
 
Most of my setups now work at least acceptably well online as I've started to actually pay attention to it.

That said, if you tune a car for every last tenth offline, it will feel somewhat poor online. I feel this is likely due in no small part to fuel weight. Example: My RGT is pretty damn good offline, perhaps with a bit of oversteer through all parts of the corner. Take it online and, well, it understeers like mad. More weight in the nose than it's set up for means more stress on the front tires when cornering (when it's already set to stress them more than normal to curb the oversteer and make better use of available grip), resulting in understeer.

Then you have my original RX-7 setup... Slightly understeery on corner exit, slightly loose on entry (when offline). Take it online and it oversteers everywhere by way of more stress on the rear tires. The current one is perfectly balanced online (IMO) but is a bit tight offline (though slightly quicker than previously).

So honestly, either way you do it (online tune vs offline tune), you'll get different results for either. An offline setup going online will probably want slightly more rear spring rate on FR/FF/FAWD cars, slightly more front spring on MR/RR/MAWD/RAWD to compensate for fuel weight.
 

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