The Formula 1 calendar development threadFormula 1

prisonermonkeys · Jul 20, 2010

While we know plenty about the push for America to re-join the calendar and their return for 2012, it seems momentum is gathering in that other Cold War superpower - Russia - for a race to be established. Jenson Button and Vitaly Petrov were in Moscow doing a PR event over the weekend, and it seems that there is enough interest for a bid to bring the Russian Federation to the calendar.

Jenson Button endorses Moscow Grand Prix

Jenson Button says he thinks it would be a good idea for Formula One to host a Russian Grand Prix after the McLaren driver gained the feel of driving round the Kremlin for a promotional event on Sunday.

For a third year in a row, Bavaria Moscow City Racing [BMCR] organised the show in the centre of Moscow to introduce Russians to the sport.

"This is not a day of work, it's a day of enjoyment," said Button after performing a few laps around the Kremlin walls.

"I've always wanted to visit Moscow. I haven't seen much of the city as we only arrived two days ago. It would be a good idea [to have a Grand Prix here] as I definitely want to come back."

Moscow officials said they are close to securing a deal to host a race in the capital city after negotiations with commercial supremo Bernie Ecclestone gathered pace.

"A city like Moscow deserves its own grand prix," said Derk Sauer, an official with Bavaria City Racing. "The contracts have not been signed yet, but a major step has been taken."

Ecclestone himself said only last week that having a race in Russia was his priority. Moscow official Vladimir Makarov said Hermann Tilke will devise an ultra-fast street circuit with the Kremlin in the background.

"It would be just like Monaco, a race around the city centre with the Kremlin in the background," added Sauer.

Story

Now, granted, this could be just the usual PR spin. But something makes me think otherwise: the Russian demonstration event has been going for a few years and Bernie Ecclestone has said a Russian Grand Prix is his priority right now. Although he seems to be interested in Sochi as a venue, this sounds like a pretty serious bid since Hermann Tilke has apparently already been called in and Russian news services have already run a proposed layout which apparently looks like this. Russia has always been The One That Got Away from Bernie; he tried to get it going as early as 1982 becaus he wanted Formula 1 behind the Iron Curtain. When that didn't pan out, we got the Hungarian Grand Prix. And he's tried at least twice (once at Nagatino Island, once in St. Petersburg) to get the race up and running. But right now he really seems to be pushing for it.

More to the point, what's with the sudden expansion in the calendar? Between Abu Dhabi, South Korea, India, America and now potentially Moscow, Rome and South Africa, we're looking at seven new races in as little five years. The last mass expansion to the calendar was in 2004 when two races - Bahrain and Shanghai - were added. What's going on?

ROAD_DOGG33J · Jul 20, 2010

I like how Button says that he wants a Grand Prix there since he wants to come back to the city.

astrosdude91 · Jul 20, 2010

This huge expansion means the sport is getting bigger, so it's a good thing in my opinion. Though I'm not a fan of the proprosed layout.

prisonermonkeys · Jul 20, 2010

astrosdude91
This huge expansion means the sport is getting bigger, so it's a good thing in my opinion.

I think it may be something a little bit darker. I think Bernie knows that he's eighty years old, and that moreover, he's starting to feel it. He knows that his days are numbered, and I suspect he may be trying to create a full and proper World Championship to leave behind when he's gone.

astrosdude91
Though I'm not a fan of the proprosed layout.

Actuallu, Moscow's streets are incredibly wide. After all, the Soviets used to hold those massive military parades where they showed off the rank and file and all those portable missile launching platforms. So I think that despite the traditional street circuit approach with the ninety-degree bends and all, a lot of the corners are going to be much faster than they appear. There's a video of Button and Petrov having a go down along the waterfront on YouTube; the second half shows Petrov taking on a few corners in the Renault three-seater. There's some wide, textured streets that even appear to have slight degrees of banking to them in places. The hairpin near the end of the lap is a by-product of the challenge presented by street circuits: namely, you're limited by the geography. They had to get the circuit up from the waterfront onto the bridge to complete the lap and still come in under the maximum lap distance.

However, I don't know how genuine this is. Tilke apparently hasn't arrived in Russia yet (he was said to be in New York, and before that, Austin), so it could just be something the news channels cooked up on their own.

Alex. · Jul 20, 2010

You guys are discussing a layout and for the life of me I do not see one.

Ardius · Jul 20, 2010

Its obscurely linked in ludes' opening post.
http://www.gmap-pedometer.com/?r=3894297

There has been talk of a Russian GP for a long time now, as you have covered in the OP ludes. This is no different, perhaps Petrov will help it happen but I don't see much evidence its any more likely than it has been before.
To answer your closing question - whats going on is Bernie is getting people to pay for F1 and increase the global reach of the sport. Nothing new and nothing wrong. I'm not entirely sure what you are really asking for there. What's wrong with the calendar expanding? Is it really surprising considering the fantastic seasons of Formula 1 we are currently having and the increased amount of prominent drivers from many of these countries? We are finally getting Russians, Poles, Indians, Malaysians, etc coming into the F1 and motorsport in general. Its not surprising the money is finally appearing for the calendar to expand into these territories.

Bernie badly wants to get into Russia as its a huge country still without a race of any kind. Just the same as hosting a race in the USA or China. He's cracked the Asian market now, with the bigger interest thanks to the Malaysian, Chinese, Sinapore and now Indian and Korean GPs. Now we have the US coming back....Russia and Africa are all thats left really - and Bernie has mentioned in light of the World Cup that he wants to go back to South Africa too.

I'm interested to see if we slowly start to see races going back to local times if the audience starts spreading more evenly, rather than being the European-centric series it has been for so long. Or dare I say races start to be set to allow Asian audiences to see races at peak TV time rather than European?

Famine · Jul 20, 2010

At the expense of Monaco?

Alex. · Jul 20, 2010

Cheers Ardius, I think with a unique wide track we could see some decent racing on that layout, no matter which direction (clockwise or counter) it took.

Ardius · Jul 20, 2010

^Bernie's just getting the Monagasques to pay up, although I doubt he will get much out of them as they will surely realise their race is the most popular and most-watched in the championship. And they have already taken a hardline with the WRC, once again preferring to stick to the IRC for next year's rally calendar.

I doubt Bernie will ever drop Monaco. Can you imagine the uproar from the sponsors?

Bernie didn't drop the British GP after all, he was the big winner in that one (as usual). I often wonder what will happen to F1 when Bernie leaves us. I fear for the worst to be honest.

ROAD_DOGG33J · Jul 20, 2010

Famine
At the expense of Monaco?

The more old tracks they leave, the worse F1 gets.

Northstar · Jul 20, 2010

I can't see them leaving Monaco, mainly because everyone would be angry over it. Also, how would they cap the schedule at 20 when there will be 21(maybe 22) come 2012, are they going to cut a couple GP's?

PeterJB · Jul 20, 2010

Hopefully the crap ones like Bahrain and Valencia!

gtracedriver · Jul 20, 2010

Valencia is really boring. Hopefully the new location will be better. Moscow is a definite chance though. Even South Africa some plans are going on but who knows what will happen

NotThePrez · Jul 20, 2010

Cutting out Monaco probably wouldn't be the best idea since it has some historical significance with F1, as well as it's one of the top races in general. I'm interested to see how these new Grand Prix races would turn out in Korea and possibly Moscow.

Ardius · Jul 20, 2010

Justin
I can't see them leaving Monaco, mainly because everyone would be angry over it. Also, how would they cap the schedule at 20 when there will be 21(maybe 22) come 2012, are they going to cut a couple GP's?

China, Japan and Turkey all have their contracts run out after 2011.
Bernie has hinted they may do 25, though the teams said 20 is a sensible figure.

speed157
Cutting out Monaco probably wouldn't be the best idea since it has some historical significance with F1, as well as it's one of the top races in general.

Not just that, but many sponsorship deals are done in Monaco and being the most-watched race gives it the highest value for the sponsors and their TV time.
I think I'm right in saying its the most popular motorsports event that takes place in the year - I'm pretty sure it gets more viewers than even Le Mans.

I also seem to remember it was voted pretty highly even against other sporting events in the UK such as the Olympics, football and Wimbledon.

Danny · Jul 20, 2010

I'm not sure how I feel about Moscow or the potential dropping of Monaco.

Monaco has become a bit of a sacred cow, maybe dropping it wouldn't be such a bad idea...

JohnBM01 · Jul 21, 2010

The one thing I've always wondered about going to these multiple venues is in stuff like travel costs and such. I guess I'm looking at all of this from a financial standpoint. Regardless, I'm excited for Abu Dhabi, South Korea, and India. I know I heard in the past of a proposed Grand Prix venue in Russia before. I'm guessing that could either be a street course race in the beautiful city of Moscow, or maybe some proper race track venue in or around Moscow.

Not to go too far off-topic, but I've been hearing about maybe F1 racing in Poland, Bulgaria, perhaps also around Rome. It's great to see more F1 venues. That is even if the tracks are Tilke-screw jobs or follow-the-leader race tracks. More venues mean more challenges and more action.

prisonermonkeys · Jul 22, 2010

I haven't heard anything about Poland, but I do know there were plans for a Bulgarian Grand Prix. The government in Sofia set aside some land on the Black Sea coast for the race to be run, but the organisers had been hoping for financial aid to go with it and had to abandon their plans. There has also been serious talk about Rome and even a circuit map thrown around, but the exact status of the project is unclear.

Peter · Jul 22, 2010

Jamaica 2013? No, never can and never will happen. But if Moscow is coming in, please, out with Valencia.

prisonermonkeys · Jul 22, 2010

PJ-FFL
But if Moscow is coming in, please, out with Valencia.

Did you even read the article? There has been nothing to suggest that Moscow will replace any of the current events.

Seismica · Jul 22, 2010

interludes
Did you even read the article? There has been nothing to suggest that Moscow will replace any of the current events.

Who cares? Out with Valencia, you don't need to replace it with anything 💡

Or perhaps bring back Imola?

Ardius · Jul 22, 2010

Seismica
Or perhaps bring back Imola?

I concur. 👍 We should have both Nurburgring & Hockenheim, Imola & Monza and Suzuka & Fuji on the calendar. Now..just got to find some sponsors

.

ROAD_DOGG33J · Jul 22, 2010

Ardius
I concur. 👍 We should have both Nurburgring & Hockenheim, Imola & Monza and Suzuka & Fuji on the calendar. Now..just got to find some sponsors .

I could do without Fuji, but yes

Alex. · Jul 22, 2010

260px-Korea_international_circuit.svg.png

Can someone suggest to me where the overtake points are? Maybe turn 3...(Korea)

SaberFire · Jul 22, 2010

Looks like it'll turn out to be another Valencia to me; looks interesting on paper, but not particularly exciting. I'll reserve judgement until race actually happens, though

Peter · Jul 23, 2010

The Korean track is still under construction, correct? And the race is in October. Are they almost done constructing the track? Will they make it in time?

Northstar · Jul 23, 2010

PJ-FFL
The Korean track is still under construction, correct? And the race is in October. Are they almost done constructing the track? Will they make it in time?

This was just posted on Speed.com today.

The FIA's Charlie Whiting arrived in Germany after a visit to the site of the inaugural Korean Grand Prix. There has been ongoing speculation about the circuit's readiness for its late October race date, but Briton Whiting said the venue is of "the highest standards". "I was fully satisfied with the inspection," he added, despite English journalists last week finding the actual track layout devoid of asphalt. "There is still work to be done," acknowledged Whiting, "but the circuit should be ready in good time for the first Grand Prix."

Link(About half way down)

Not sure what else needs to be done, but laying asphalt doesn't take that long, probably a month at most to pave a track that size.

JohnBM01 · Jul 25, 2010

I think more important than the inclusion of South Korea and India is more Asian venues. Here's some perspective. These are ALL the Asian venues when I first started watching F1 in 1999: Malaysia (Sepang) and Japan (Suzuka).

Look now with the inclusion of some of today's venues, and I'm sure I may forget one):
* Turkey (Istanbul Park, or is this considered an Asian course?)
* Bahrain (Bahrain International Circuit)
* United Arab Emirates (Yas Marina Circuit)
* India (Jaypee Group Circuit)
* Singapore (Marina Bay, there's also a possibility of a permanent track in Changi in Singapore)
* China (Shanghai International Circuit)
* South Korea (Korean International Circuit)
* Malaysia (Sepang)
* Japan (Suzuka and Fuji (I could do without the Tilke'd-up Fuji myself)).

I'm disappointed there isn't as much racing within the Americas (including the United States), but there's a lot more racing in Asia (including the Middle East). It's just great to see a lot more of Asia in racing in addition European, North America, South America, and Australia. You can debate about the quality of competition and diversity among the tracks. However, more tracks are always welcome.

That is encouraging news for the South Korean track, by the way.

Ardius · Jul 25, 2010

SaberFire
Looks like it'll turn out to be another Valencia to me; looks interesting on paper, but not particularly exciting. I'll reserve judgement until race actually happens, though

Valencia was getting people excited as it looked like it would produce lots of overtaking. :lol:

Korea seems to have been met with a resounding "meh". Probably due to Valencia, Singapore and Abu Dhabi failing to meet expectations.

I actually think this makes it quite hopeful, people aren't hyping it this time so maybe it will be good for once.

prisonermonkeys · Jul 25, 2010

If you're referring to the Moscow layout, that seems to have been put together by someone other than Tilke, or anyone who might be in a position to make an official layout. Or maybe it is an actual proposal; I have no way of knowing, but I thought I'd include it anyway.

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