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Worst_Driver
I always run the wide wheel/offset for the looks not for performance but with BOP on and tuning prohibited I’m sure it doesn’t improve on track performance.

Short practice sessions during the week are the key !
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Changing the wheels does affect the cars with BOP on and tuning prohibited, unfortunately. That is why you noticed the ill effects of the larger wheels on the Mangusta.
 
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Marcus Garvey
Sort of how after all this time most don't understand the effects of the different settings of grip reduction off the racing line, slipstream, tyre wear multiplier, etc.
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Can you talk a bit more about grip reduction off the racing line? More interested in the subtle differences as you gradually move farther away.
 
JamCar0ne
Seemed like half our grid didn't have all the cars.
#changethetireformula
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You raise a good point there, but we still could change the tire formula. Maybe if the brand central road cars wouldn’t be on RH tires they would get picked more.

We were only 4 drivers in D1. Last week I said our grid was a throwback to GT4 but now we are down to GT PSP grid. Still there were some moments of close racing between us but we had good participation with one division even if sometimes not everyone had the required cars.
 
It's certainly possible, with attendance taking this hit, which could be down to the current combo set more than anything else, that we'll collapse down to 1 division again next month. We'll have to see how it goes the next 2 weeks.
 
Scores for 2/18 copied to data.

February 19th Standings.png
 
Worst_Driver
IMPORTANT: Do not put wide wheels and wider offset on the Mangusta. The wheels rub in the wheelwells, block the steering and it makes the car undriveable as the Mangusta has lots of body roll and needs all the room in the wheelwell.

Once I reverted back to stock width and offset, the car returned to its stock handling. Wheel diameter doesn't seem to impact the handling.

@Buffalo_DRD @CANOWORMS1 @Skills you guys might want to change your wheel width and offset, by looking at your photos you might encounter the same problem I just had while practicing.
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I use BBS wheel on my acquired liveries and will change the diameter for looks, but I have never changed width or offset. Not the case in the real world; I put wider wheels and tires on a Honda Prelude in the 80s and folded the fender well due to clearance issues, which worked just fine, except for the excessive rust 10 years later. 😄
 
I have said before that I don't care what is done with the tire model. Someone is going to like it and someone isn't. The last time I checked, being able to adjust to what you're given is a skill that is necessary for racing. That's just my opinion and I can see how some don't like to be taken out of their personal comfort zone.

I do feel that we probably need to revisit the use of LCD and UCD cars. The spirit of the change to allow them even if they were not currently available was to not have them always be one and done selections. What has happened is that we have people choosing cars that are not currently available for purchase and then we have people that don't have the cars and can't buy them and can't race that combo. How many of those that can't race one combo don't bother to show up at all that night? Feel free to discuss this one but there will be a change for the start of the next season.
 
JLBowler
I have said before that I don't care what is done with the tire model. Someone is going to like it and someone isn't. The last time I checked, being able to adjust to what you're given is a skill that is necessary for racing. That's just my opinion and I can see how some don't like to be taken out of their personal comfort zone.

I do feel that we probably need to revisit the use of LCD and UCD cars. The spirit of the change to allow them even if they were not currently available was to not have them always be one and done selections. What has happened is that we have people choosing cars that are not currently available for purchase and then we have people that don't have the cars and can't buy them and can't race that combo. How many of those that can't race one combo don't bother to show up at all that night? Feel free to discuss this one but there will be a change for the start of the next season.
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That skill goes both ways. Adjusting to a realistic and proper tire compound and handling. While you might not care about the tire model, many people, who race every sunday, across multiple skill levels do care. We run way too soft tire compounds making road cars a bit boring and dull. Even in the daily races (mostly A) or the time trials, the tire compounds picked by PD are much harder than what we use. There are a couple of interesting cars in brand central but they become boring with the SNAIL tire that's why UCD and LCD cars seems to be more popular. Tire compounds for race cars are OK though, the main issue is with road cars. In a ideal world we could just run the stock tires or at least no slicks on road cars. That change would make Brand Central cars more popular and interesting IMO.

Take the recent 700+Hp AMG GT that we raced on Monza, why bother picking a road car if it handles and reacts like the equivalent GT3 version ? Sure it may be easier to handle but it's just normal that a 700+hp RWD road car requires throttle control, slides around and is a handful to drive around any track.

I agree with you for the LCD and UCD cars, they should be picked only if they are available come sunday night by using this site. Atleast, everyone had the chance to acquire it during the first week if it survives another one. I'd be OK with going back to one and done if the tire formula changes making Brand Central cars more appealing.

https://ddm999.github.io/gt7info/ Also, this site should be a reference for any prize winner if they want to pick LCD and UCD cars.
 
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Worst_Driver
That skill goes both ways. Adjusting to a realistic and proper tire compound and handling. While you might not care about the tire model, many people, who race every sunday, across multiple skill levels do care. We run way too soft tire compounds making road cars a bit boring and dull. Even in the daily races (mostly A) or the time trials, the tire compounds picked by PD are much harder than what we use. There are a couple of interesting cars in brand central but they become boring with the SNAIL tire that's why UCD and LCD cars seems to be more popular. Tire compounds for race cars are OK though, the main issue is with road cars. In a ideal world we could just run the stock tires or at least no slicks on road cars. That change would make Brand Central cars more popular and interesting IMO.

Take the recent 700+Hp AMG GT that we raced on Monza, why bother picking a road car if it handles and reacts like the equivalent GT3 version ? Sure it may be easier to handle but it's just normal that a 700+hp RWD road car requires throttle control, slides around and is a handful to drive around any track.

I agree with you for the LCD and UCD cars, they should be picked only if they are available come sunday night by using this site. Atleast, everyone had the chance to acquire it during the first week if it survives another one. I'd be OK with going back to one and done if the tire formula changes making Brand Central cars more appealing.

https://ddm999.github.io/gt7info/ Also, this site should be a reference for any prize winner if they want to pick LCD and UCD cars.
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Show me one driver that takes a real car to a real track and doesn't want as much grip as possible. Everything in the quoted post is your opinion and that's fine but stop trying to present your opinion as empirical evidence that something is wrong. Its just something that you don't like and if changed to what you want, there is going to be someone else that will feel exactly the way you feel about the current state.
 
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JLBowler
Show me one driver that takes a real car to a real track and doesn't want as much grip as possible. Everything in the quoted post is your opinion and that's fine but stop trying to present your opinion as empirical evidence that something is wrong. Its just something that you don't like and if changed to what you want, there is going to be someone else that will feel exactly the way you feel about the current state.
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Lets put RS tires on all cars then and we will have the most grip available, just like a driver who would take a real car to a real track would do...

It isn't my opinion it's just a known fact that tire compounds used on road cars by PD in the official events are atleast one or two compounds harder than what we use in the league. Race A mainly features road cars on anything from CS to SS tires depending on the car. Take the most recent time trial with the 190E, the tire compound used is SH versus the current tire formula on SM and the stock tires are CS. Here is another example, this week's daily race A with the FD RX7 is on SH tires and our tire formula puts that car on SS tires. Stock tires are SH for that car.

I have yet to hear someone say that the current tire formula works with road cars. The physics have changed a lot since then and it would be a good thing to change the tire formula so that it makes sense.
 
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Once again. I don't care what the tire formula is. I know that whatever it is, someone isn't going to like it. I will not be spending any effort on changing it so if it's going to change, someone else is going to have to do the work which means you need to get someone else from the BoD to take up your cause.
 
JLBowler
Once again. I don't care what the tire formula is. I know that whatever it is, someone isn't going to like it. I will not be spending any effort on changing it so if it's going to change, someone else is going to have to do the work which means you need to get someone else from the BoD to take up your cause.
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Already did a couple of weeks ago. @JamCar0ne suggested something as well.
 
So about this tire formula thing. I get that some folks like slippery cars. The problem with cars of that nature is they induce more mistakes from the majority of racers. Not one driver that raced in D2 last night made it through either race in round 1 without an outcome altering mistake.

GT6 and Sport had an entirely too complex "formula". That could be put down to the in game "classification" of the cars.
1708372242235.png

Not sure that even got enacted. Not that it matters.

GT7's formula, if what I'm finding is what's being used, is much simpler.
1708372353043.png


Perhaps some adjustments can be considered within the current tire ranges but, it will still require a BoD member to take up the "cause". Keep in mind, any changes to this chart need to consider what can be tolerated/accepted by the majority of SNAILs. It ain't about what you and I and Jamcar would like.

If I had my way, there'd be no car on any paved track with less than SM. I don't care for car/tire combos that try to swap ends whenever the weight bias changes. What you, @Worst_Driver , call boring and dull, I call balanced and well behaved.
 
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@Dragonwhisky Glad to hear your point of view. My goal is that everybody from every skill level has fun. I can suggest something if you are open to a proposal. Thank you for listening !

Last sunday's first combo was quite a handful even in D1 but we have to keep in mind that the De Tomaso is a mid engine, american V8 powered, late 60's italian supercar. It would have been difficult to handle on any tire and it was a lot to handle even on the current tire formula. To be honest, I was quite surprised to learn that my suggestion was picked. I enjoyed it a lot but that's because I love to slide around. I admit the De Tomaso case is an odd one but I think we can tune the tire formula for road cars closer to what PD uses in their public events.

In terms of reaching the widest skill levels, I think that PD has nailed it with road cars in daily race A and the time trials. The esports sweaty racers are in Race B and C with GR3 and GR4 race cars and A is mostly DR D to A with the rare A+ from time to time.
 
Worst_Driver
@Dragonwhisky Glad to hear your point of view. My goal is that everybody from every skill level has fun. I can suggest something if you are open to a proposal. Thank you for listening !

Last sunday's first combo was quite a handful even in D1 but we have to keep in mind that the De Tomaso is a mid engine, american V8 powered, late 60's italian supercar. It would have been difficult to handle on any tire and it was a lot to handle even on the current tire formula. To be honest, I was quite surprised to learn that my suggestion was picked. I enjoyed it a lot but that's because I love to slide around. I admit the De Tomaso case is an odd one but I think we can tune the tire formula for road cars closer to what PD uses in their public events.

In terms of reaching the widest skill levels, I think that PD has nailed it with road cars in daily race A and the time trials. The esports sweaty racers are in Race B and C with GR3 and GR4 race cars and A is mostly DR D to A with the rare A+ from time to time.
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I would disagree with PD "nailing" anything regarding anything in the Daily races with the traffic I see in the daily race thread. It's the same there as appears here. Some like some of the choices PD make, others, not as much. Without the hard data on who participates in either the DR or TT arena, comparison to SNAIL is fairly irrelevant. Same in the TT thread, although the TT thread seems generally more positive than the DR thread. PD have the same problem we do. Finding a "balance" with regulation. Arguably, I am not an authority on either Sport mode. I did the dailies long enough to get my BS rating and bailed on that entirely. I do the TTs from time to time when a combo interests me.

I will agree, the Mad Hungarian, which is what I call that Mangusta, even if it ain't from Hungary, has oodles of decel oversteer and a smattering of lift off understeer, and by that I mean an insane amount of lift off, is a bit of an outlier. Still, it's indicative of what a "loose" car creates in the way of racing with varying degrees of skill involved. As I heard long ago, don't recall where, "loose is fast, and dangerous. Tight is slow, and safe". Customizing the balance between loose and tight for each and every driver is beyond a tricky business and more than edges into the realms of arcane magics. Do you recall what happens to amateur mice when they dabble in the arcane?

Oh, you can propose all you like. I'm not the one(s) the proposal needs to interest however. And I'm not talking about only the BoD either. Ideally, if I was making the call here, I'd like to see 3 proposals to present to the board and, if approved, put it to a vote of all active SNAILs. Don't know if things change in SNAIL in that fashion these days. Something else to consider whilst yer fleshin' out thet thar proposal, administrative overhead. More is most definitely not better in that area.
 
Dragonwhisky
I would disagree with PD "nailing" anything regarding anything in the Daily races with the traffic I see in the daily race thread. It's the same there as appears here. Some like some of the choices PD make, others, not as much. Without the hard data on who participates in either the DR or TT arena, comparison to SNAIL is fairly irrelevant. Same in the TT thread, although the TT thread seems generally more positive than the DR thread. PD have the same problem we do. Finding a "balance" with regulation. Arguably, I am not an authority on either Sport mode. I did the dailies long enough to get my BS rating and bailed on that entirely. I do the TTs from time to time when a combo interests me.

I will agree, the Mad Hungarian, which is what I call that Mangusta, even if it ain't from Hungary, has oodles of decel oversteer and a smattering of lift off understeer, and by that I mean an insane amount of lift off, is a bit of an outlier. Still, it's indicative of what a "loose" car creates in the way of racing with varying degrees of skill involved. As I heard long ago, don't recall where, "loose is fast, and dangerous. Tight is slow, and safe". Customizing the balance between loose and tight for each and every driver is beyond a tricky business and more than edges into the realms of arcane magics. Do you recall what happens to amateur mice when they dabble in the arcane?

Oh, you can propose all you like. I'm not the one(s) the proposal needs to interest however. And I'm not talking about only the BoD either. Ideally, if I was making the call here, I'd like to see 3 proposals to present to the board and, if approved, put it to a vote of all active SNAILs. Don't know if things change in SNAIL in that fashion these days. Something else to consider whilst yer fleshin' out thet thar proposal, administrative overhead. More is most definitely not better in that area.
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I’ll think about it as I already made two proposals in the past and nothing happened. I was thinking about a poll with two proposals.
Option 1: we keep the current formula.
Option 2: new one
Option 3: open to suggestions.


In the meantime, I will probably keep picking weird UCD and LCD cars like the Mangusta that breaks the tire formula when I have the opportunity. ;)

As for the daily race thread, 90% of people posting are waaaay too focused on their DR and not enough on having fun. Also, most of the posts are avout races B and C and very little about Race A. They seem to prefer racing the same META Gr3 and Gr4 week after week after week.
 
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