- 3,817
- @ Suzuka Circuit in GSR Spirit. ^_~
- GTP_CAMikaze
Tell that to the MotoGP riders when they were in Doha, Qatar a couple of weeks ago.
2009 Bahrain Grand Prix
- Thread starter zujo 19
- 218 comments
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- 10,373
- Manchester
- Ardius_
What? The Toyota's are well up to pace..
Glock has finished in the points in two races now where he started from the pitlane. Trulli had a bad race in Shanghai but it isn't his best track by any means and he isn't a brilliant wet driver in the first place.
But in dry conditions without rediculous amounts of safety cars, the Toyota's are going to be up there. They are not even that weak on strategy, at least not as much as Williams is right now.
I think Trulli and Glock could easily hold up their own against the likes of Button, Vettel, Webber and Barrichello - I'm starting to get the distinct impression people are under-rating this team, especially Glock somehow.
- 3,118
- Sunnyvale, CA
- GTP_Vaxen
Just a quick note (somewhat off topic):
Our own Christhedude (aka Christopher Zoechling) will be racing in the Speedcar support races at Bahrain this weekend.
Discuss here and give your support to Chris!
Our own Christhedude (aka Christopher Zoechling) will be racing in the Speedcar support races at Bahrain this weekend.
Discuss here and give your support to Chris!
- 10,837
- Belgium
- bramturismo
Agreed.
Also, don't forget that Toyota is one of the three teams that has been testing in Bahrain during the winter period, so they know what to expect from their tyres and setups already. I don't think we don't need to consider the other two teams who tested there as well in for a win...
- 924
It would go to show that prestige and a big name aren't everything in the "new" F1. Brawn, the 11th-hour team, charges to the top of the constructor standings. Williams and Red Bull get really strong showings in all the races, Toyota is working strong, STR get a couple of points... while Ferrari is floundering in their dust.
- 7,719
Never liked Bahrain. Dull, point-and-squirt type circuit... Lets hope the mixed field this year will make things slightly more interesting - and lets hope for a calm race, to let us analyze car performances properly.
Now that's a good expression.
Yet they qualified on pole, a massive 0.4s faster, in completely dry conditions.
It's just an issue of track-by-track differences. Last two years, we had McLaren and Ferrari exchange places based on their handling of the kerbs, and the Ferrari's aerodynamic efficiency advantage in 2007, compared to the McLaren's superior mechanical grip - and then the situation reversed in 2008. The Red Bull cars simply suited that track better...
Yep. He was massively unimpressive there - though it's been said to be down to engine-problems in the rain.
Aye. We had that same rainstorm a few days earlier.
They tested here - but barely: Sandstorms completely prevented them from running for three whole days.
Still, that's an advantage in their favour (and Ferrari's and BMW's).
Sutil was running 6th just like he was 4th at Monaco last year - due to the rain and his calm driving, not the car's pace.
The diffuser won't be enough to lift them over Q2 pace at best.
Pace-wise, the Ferraris are far faster than their points-tally suggests. They've simply had one bad decision after the other, coupled with one long streak of bad luck. Massa was competitive at Malaysia until he pitted for Inters just before Wets became necessary, and his car stopped while in 3rd place, on a one-stopper.
Now that's a good expression.
Yet they qualified on pole, a massive 0.4s faster, in completely dry conditions.
It's just an issue of track-by-track differences. Last two years, we had McLaren and Ferrari exchange places based on their handling of the kerbs, and the Ferrari's aerodynamic efficiency advantage in 2007, compared to the McLaren's superior mechanical grip - and then the situation reversed in 2008. The Red Bull cars simply suited that track better...
Yep. He was massively unimpressive there - though it's been said to be down to engine-problems in the rain.
Tell that to the MotoGP riders when they were in Doha, Qatar a couple of weeks ago.
Aye. We had that same rainstorm a few days earlier.
They tested here - but barely: Sandstorms completely prevented them from running for three whole days.
Still, that's an advantage in their favour (and Ferrari's and BMW's).
Sutil was running 6th just like he was 4th at Monaco last year - due to the rain and his calm driving, not the car's pace.
The diffuser won't be enough to lift them over Q2 pace at best.
Pace-wise, the Ferraris are far faster than their points-tally suggests. They've simply had one bad decision after the other, coupled with one long streak of bad luck. Massa was competitive at Malaysia until he pitted for Inters just before Wets became necessary, and his car stopped while in 3rd place, on a one-stopper.
- 33,155
- Hammerhead Garage
What do you think of turns nine and ten? They're probably the highlight of the lap since they're so important; turn nine in particular. You have to brake and turn at the same time to set the car up properly for turn ten. I think it's a lot like the twelve-thirteen-fourteen sequence at Sepang where no two drivers take the exact same line.
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It's an interesting double-apex, that's true. That, and the sweeping turns 11-12 complex are the highlights of the track - but the rest are all hairpins. That, and the completely bland surroundings - miles of asphalt, with some sand at the edges - make the track dull, in my opinion. The exemplary Tilkedrome: Lots of straights and low-speed corners surrounded by miles of runoff at a generic location.
- 3,207
But with significantly less fuel. Pretty much all fan-made fuel corrections I saw seemed to suggest an order ofYet they qualified on pole, a massive 0.4s faster, in completely dry conditions.
1. Rubens
2. Button
3. Trulli
in Shanghai. The only time they have been as fast is Shanghai in Q2. Red bull has proven to be the best car in the wet, but they have not proven to be as fast as the Brawns in dry conditions. Though they arent far off.
- 3,817
- @ Suzuka Circuit in GSR Spirit. ^_~
- GTP_CAMikaze
And speaking of black cats, I'm wondering if they'll be keeping an eye out for them at the track this weekend - not just the paddock.
- 7,719
Q2 is where the true pace shows. On top of that, Button himself said they couldn't beat them this weekend - regardless of weather.
The performance of each car varies from track to track - we see that every year. Overall, the RBR might be slower on most circuits - but at Shanghai, they were a step ahead.
- 33,155
- Hammerhead Garage
I'm sorry, I'm failing to see what Ferrari has that make them a candidate for third. Let's face it: the only time the F60 has been high in the timing sheets this year is when they have gone out early in a session, or after a one lap hard burn in practice and qualifying. They simply don't have the consistent race pace the way the Brawns, Red Bulls and Toyotas have. And given their performance in Shanghai, I'd say the McLarens are zeroing in on that consistency, even if the car isn't anything to write home about. Hell, Toro Rosso's STR-4 is basically the shame chassis as Red Bull's RB5, and even if Buemi and Bourdais aren't as quick as Vettel and Webber, they still have the hardware. And I think it will only be a matter of time before Williams luck out and actually convert practice and qualifying pace into something useable. Massa might have been running high in Shanghai before his retirement, but the safety car played into his hands and I'm quite sure he was running a late-stopping strategy at the time. As for Raikkonen, he struggled with tenth.
Basically, I haven't seen any compelling evidence to suggest a Ferrari can consistently finish with both cars in the points, but less land a podium. Domenicalli believes the team is going to suffer in Bahrain because they'll have had just five days between the end of the Chinese Grand Prix and the start of practice in Bahrain to get their act together. If Massa lands on the podium this weekend, you can bet that the result is a product of luck and a few key results going their way. Because right now Brawn, Red Bull and Toyota are in a class of their own, while Williams, Toro Rosso and McLaren are looking to sew up the difference. And where does that leave Ferrari? Ahead of Force India and Renault - and let's face it, that's really not very difficult - and the BMW-Saubers, who have been struggling just as much, but have bee getting results through tactics and pit strategy. Ferrari will be lucky to finish in a position that isn't double-digits.
Basically, I haven't seen any compelling evidence to suggest a Ferrari can consistently finish with both cars in the points, but less land a podium. Domenicalli believes the team is going to suffer in Bahrain because they'll have had just five days between the end of the Chinese Grand Prix and the start of practice in Bahrain to get their act together. If Massa lands on the podium this weekend, you can bet that the result is a product of luck and a few key results going their way. Because right now Brawn, Red Bull and Toyota are in a class of their own, while Williams, Toro Rosso and McLaren are looking to sew up the difference. And where does that leave Ferrari? Ahead of Force India and Renault - and let's face it, that's really not very difficult - and the BMW-Saubers, who have been struggling just as much, but have bee getting results through tactics and pit strategy. Ferrari will be lucky to finish in a position that isn't double-digits.
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- Philippines
The worry is whether BMW-Sauber can actually package a full 2009 spec car around Robert Kubica. With his Shanghai woes being due to the lack of ballast to balance out his height when the KERS is in there... maybe the FIA will make an exception and allow them to run a longer, lower car just for him?
Ferrari is bad this season, but not exactly terrible. I wouldn't count on seeing them anywhere near the podium this race, though... Definitely Brawn-Redbull... Toyota is a maybe, if they can hold it together. Everyone else is a longshot, but Ferrari's is a bit longer than most.
Ferrari is bad this season, but not exactly terrible. I wouldn't count on seeing them anywhere near the podium this race, though... Definitely Brawn-Redbull... Toyota is a maybe, if they can hold it together. Everyone else is a longshot, but Ferrari's is a bit longer than most.
- 33,155
- Hammerhead Garage
Well, it's beginning. Half an hour into the first session, and Bourdais just psoted the first lap time of 1:38.697. Raikkonen is the only other person on the circuit.
Tired Tyres
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- West Yorkshire
- Tired_Tyres
- Tired Tyres
Hamilton was fastest with Heidfeld, Kubica, Rosberg, Button and Kovalainen completing to top six.
http://www.formula1.com/results/season/2009/807/6617/
full listing of the first session.
http://www.formula1.com/results/season/2009/807/6617/
full listing of the first session.
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- 33,155
- Hammerhead Garage
I hope this isn't a Renaissance period for the likes of McLaren and BMW. I want teams like Brawn and Red Bull to keep winning, dammit. But considering that Hamilton, Heidfeld and Kubica are so far ahead of Rosberg and Button, I suspect they're running very light. It's only been a week since Shanghai, so it's unlikely they'll have developed anything dramatically new in that time.
- 1,537
- GTP_Soundtrack
Ferraris toped second Malaysian Friday practice too, so this is no real indication. Looks like Lewis/Mc are working hard thought.
- 10,837
- Belgium
- bramturismo
Looks like Toyota is already working on their race setup seeing as they were at Force Indias pace...
- 5
- Liffonmelsmork
If you're in the UK you can watch live video with commentary on the BBC website. If you're not in the UK, I think you can watch highlights videos of each session.
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- Hammerhead Garage
Wow, if this were qualifying and the first session had just ended, there would be some major scalps taken: Kubica, Massa, Heidfeld, Kovalainen and Raikkonen.
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