2014 NASCAR Thread

[GTPorsche]

Good one today! close standings from 8-16th after that race:

Kez 2097
Logano 2096
Harvick 2090
JJ 2080
Kyle B 2077
Dale Jr 2077
Gordon 2070
Kenseth 2057
Edwards 2057
Dinger 2056
Kahne 2055
Newman 2055
____________
13. Hamlin 2049
14. Biffle 2049
15. Kurt B 2047
16. Almirola 2045


then why are you replying to my post (the one to @Justin) in the first place?
I know Bill Elliott used #9, but, since he never raced for Hendricks, it's unlikely that HMS would "fight" for the rights to #9 with RPM.
If you step into a discussion, make sure you know the topic talked about before replying


LTR? and of course your post gets 2 likes lol

You quoted me.

Directly.

https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/2014-nascar-thread.290527/page-242#post-10092682

In a post where the person you are discussing wasn't involved.

Maybe it's you who need to know what they're doing before replying.

 

[Cale]

Larson has more top fives and top 10s than 9 of the Chase drivers.

 

[JMoney]

So we are 3/4ths of the way through the season, and the two top drivers in both wins and points drive Fords.

When was the last time THAT happened?

 

[MustangRyan]

So we are 3/4ths of the way through the season, and the two top drivers in both wins and points drive Fords.

When was the last time THAT happened?

I know it's wrong, but it feels like 1992.

 

[RVDNuT374]

Larson has more top fives and top 10s than 9 of the Chase drivers.

Which is why the Chase is a steaming pile of 🤬, but that's an entirely separate discussion. Also, NASCAR will make a "secret" rule change to stop the Fords from winning, given that a certain team and GM are more than likely in France's pocket.

 

[The Bman]

Also, NASCAR will make a "secret" rule change to stop the Fords from winning, given that a certain team and GM are more than likely in France's pocket.

Why would they screw over drivers that are legitimate contenders? If was happening, you would have heard the outcry of many a driver.

I used to believe this kind of stuff a couple years back but for 🤬 sake, NASCAR would never screw over it's own drivers. There would be too much backlash from the drivers negatively impacted. How about those "fake" debris cautions? Does anyone watching the sport ever consider that debris could build up along the walls, or that the drivers wouldn't easily notice the debris while going over 180 mph?

 

[RACECAR]

Hello, Jesse Ventura.

 

[RVDNuT374]

Why would they screw over drivers that are legitimate contenders? If was happening, you would have heard the outcry of many a driver.

I used to believe this kind of stuff a couple years back but for 🤬 sake, NASCAR would never screw over it's own drivers. There would be too much backlash from the drivers negatively impacted. How about those "fake" debris cautions? Does anyone watching the sport ever consider that debris could build up along the walls, or that the drivers wouldn't easily notice the debris while going over 180 mph?

NASCAR and GM have had a "close" relationship through the years, similar to the Ferrari-FIA relationship. For example, the current head of the appeals board is a former GM executive who tends to strongly side with NASCAR 99.999% of the time, even when no blatant cheating is discovered on the car. Another example, in 1990 when a "illegal" carburetor spacer that was found to have no advantage whatsoever was discovered on Mark Martin's Ford, the penalty was 46 points. Martin lost the championship by 26 points. The drivers aren't allowed to speak their minds about anything to do with secret rule changes or "fake cautions" without risk of severe penalties. As for the "phantom debris" cautions, shouldn't fans be suspicious when a caution comes out for debris, but it is never shown on TV. That sounds a lot like competition cautions to me, thrown at opportune times to give the rest of the field a chance if the drivers are too spread out. I'll stop here before the thread completely disintegrates into a "Does NASCAR Fix Races" thread.

 

[The Bman]

NASCAR and GM have had a "close" relationship through the years, similar to the Ferrari-FIA relationship. For example, the current head of the appeals board is a former GM executive who tends to strongly side with NASCAR 99.999% of the time, even when no blatant cheating is discovered on the car.

Then explain to me why Hendrick Motorsports, Stewart-Haas Racing, and Richard Childress Racing have been hit by penalties and suspensions in the past few years.

Another example, in 1990 when a "illegal" carburetor spacer that was found to have no advantage whatsoever was discovered on Mark Martin's Ford, the penalty was 46 points. Martin lost the championship by 26 points.

Martin's team bolted the spacer instead of welding it. Due to not being welded (what most teams did that year) didn't hold up efficiently.

The drivers aren't allowed to speak their minds about anything to do with secret rule changes or "fake cautions" without risk of severe penalties.

Tony Stewart. Dale Earnhardt, Jr. There have been more drivers than just the two most popular speaking up about the truth without penalty.

As for the "phantom debris" cautions, shouldn't fans be suspicious when a caution comes out for debris, but it is never shown on TV. That sounds a lot like competition cautions to me, thrown at opportune times to give the rest of the field a chance if the drivers are too spread out.

I was at Richmond a few weeks ago. Two debris cautions were called out, both where I couldn't see the debris. But when the blowers went against the wall, I had seen debris flying off of the barriers.

The networks not showing the debris doesn't automatically translate to "phantom caution". There has to be debris for them to call the caution.

 

[cnd01]

Which is why the Chase is a steaming pile of 🤬, but that's an entirely separate discussion. Also, NASCAR will make a "secret" rule change to stop the Fords from winning, given that a certain team and GM are more than likely in France's pocket.

Nah, NASCAR is too busy ruining sports car racing in America as per the internets

 

[Jahgee]

 

[Johnny1996]

 

[RVDNuT374]

Then explain to me why Hendrick Motorsports, Stewart-Haas Racing, and Richard Childress Racing have been hit by penalties and suspensions in the past few years.

Fair enough. You win that part of the argument.

Martin's team bolted the spacer instead of welding it. Due to not being welded (what most teams did that year) didn't hold up efficiently.

Still, a part that had no performance advantage did not deserve a point penalty that screwed Mark out of the championship.

Tony Stewart. Dale Earnhardt, Jr. There have been more drivers than just the two most popular speaking up about the truth without penalty.

Phoenix Spring Race 2013: Denny Hamlin got a $25K fine for saying Gen-6 cars were impossible to pass in, which was and is still the truth.

I was at Richmond a few weeks ago. Two debris cautions were called out, both where I couldn't see the debris. But when the blowers went against the wall, I had seen debris flying off of the barriers.

Little bits of rubber, hot dog wrappers, and empty water bottles well out of the racing groove do not constitute "debris cautions" by any means.

The networks not showing the debris doesn't automatically translate to "phantom caution". There has to be debris for them to call the caution.

The networks should show the "debris" so fans at home don't become suspicious.

 

[The Bman]

Still, a part that had no performance advantage did not deserve a point penalty that screwed Mark out of the championship.

It still violated a rule.

Phoenix Spring Race 2013: Denny Hamlin got a $25K fine for saying Gen-6 cars were impossible to pass in,

The Gen-6 cars were just coming out. For a driver to lash out against a new yet major concept gives the sport bad recognition, and also makes the manufacturer's involvement in the Gen-6 cars seem pointless, further hurting NASCAR. It wasn't a major fine, either.

which was and is still the truth.

Debatable. If only for the increased aerodynamics making clean air even more important which results in the leader pulling away without trouble.

And take note that this is only the second year of the Gen-6 car being used. The Car of Tomorrow was making significant improvements from it's inception, and the 2011 and 2012 (last year of the CoT) were two of the most competitive seasons ever.

Little bits of rubber, hot dog wrappers, and empty water bottles well out of the racing groove do not constitute "debris cautions" by any means.

Let me break down each of them;

• Rubber can get caught inside of the car if one were to run over it, resulting in internal mechanical damage.
• Hot dog wrappers and other paper products are known to get stuck on the grilles of cars and make them overheat, or enhance aerodynamics significantly. Take Dale Earnhardt, Jr. at the Daytona 500 for example; had that garbage bag not got stuck on his grille, he wouldn't have been able to take off and pull away from the rest of the pack, and if that bag got stuck on his car earlier that race, he would have battled overheating issues all day which likely would have resulted in a blown engine due to the constant slipstreaming.
• Empty water bottles would get smashed by a 3,400 lbs stock car. NASCAR remains concerned that they can affect a car if one were to hit the bottle. And remember that most water bottles have a label wrapped around them which can get stuck on the grille, resulting in overheating.

The networks should show the "debris" so fans at home don't become suspicious.

The networks show what the networks want. NASCAR has minimal influence over the broadcasts of FOX, TNT, and ESPN (and soon NBC), so they don't need to show the debris every caution called for that reason.

 

[RACECAR]

Are you trying to make us lose sleep, Jahgee?

 

[Gerarghini]

The Gen-6 cars were just coming out. For a driver to lash out against a new yet major concept gives the sport bad recognition, and also makes the manufacturer's involvement in the Gen-6 cars seem pointless, further hurting NASCAR. It wasn't a major fine, either.

What, if anything, happened when Kyle Busch gave the new CoT's a bad name back in the 2007 Bristol race (Which i think was the first race in the new CoT)? Did NASCAR do anything about it?

 

[meek]

First off I don't understand why KB sits ahead of Dale, it must be due to finishing order from this race. ESPN had it Dale then KB and then Sport Center had it to the way you currently do. Oh well it doesn't matter.

kinda does, we might have a tie(s)!

My standings/Sports Center uses the Chase races only for tiebreakers, ESPN/jayski uses all the 28 races so far.
I'm not sure how tiebreakers work, but to me, the first 26 races only helped set the Chase grid and results, like standings, don't carry over.

nascar.com has KB ahead of Dale Jr, too, as well as Kenseth ahead of Edwards (despite Jr's 3 wins to KB's 1, and CE's 2 wins to Kenseth's none), and Kahne above Newman (KK's best is 13th, Newman's 15th).
Seems to confirm the results in Chase races only are used for tiebreakers.

As for the likes...who really cares, likes don't mean anything and people clutching to it as some knock against them doesn't mean much. Your talking point that he replied to and your explanation now given doesn't match and wasn't the idea even I got of it until after you've now explained it.

GTPorsche still doesn't get it lol

You quoted me.

Directly.

https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/2014-nascar-thread.290527/page-242#post-10092682

In a post where the person you are discussing wasn't involved.

Maybe it's you who need to know what they're doing before replying.

I quoted you after you replied to a post I made to @Justin, where we were talking about the fact Hendricks would have no interest in fighting for the rights to #9 with RPM, since Bill Elliott never raced for HMS, and, seeing RPM intends to run 2 cars next year, HMS would need another number for Chase Elliott.

Larson has more top fives and top 10s than 9 of the Chase drivers.

That wasn't true when the Chase started.

11 drivers had more top 5's, all of them are in the Chase.
11 drivers had more top 10's, out of them only Bowyer didn't make the Chase.

Even using the previous year's system (Top 10 in standings get in + wild cards), Larson still wouldn't have made it!
Everyone knew the rules, he didn't have a win and ended 16 points behind Biffle for the last qualifying spot.

Larson will get there, and probably win multiple titles, he's 22! got hot too late (that's also true for his teammate)... 2 top 3's in 26 first races, then 2 more in the last 2 races.

 

[GTPorsche]

Don't know if anyone is aware of it, but NASCAR has recently started uploading full length races on their youtube channel.

 

[The Bman]

What, if anything, happened when Kyle Busch gave the new CoT's a bad name back in the 2007 Bristol race (Which i think was the first race in the new CoT)? Did NASCAR do anything about it?

One of my points was that NASCAR allows for more free criticism than people say. Denny Hamlin I believe has been the only driver-critic to be penalized for making negative remarks (which is hypocritical considering Kyle Busch's circumstances).

I wouldn't consider a $25k fine to be a severe penalty, either, considering the drivers make much more than that in a single race.

 

[Jahgee]

http://www.foxsports.com/nascar/sto...for-2015-092314?cmpid=tsmfb:fscom:nascaronfox
Ban on testing, group qualifying at the 500, Power reduced from 850 HP to 725 HP, 6 inch spoiler, rain tires at Sonoma & Watkins Glen, Qualifying Round times shortened

 

[AMPMROCKETFANN]

Rain Tires: Good, glad the series is going in the right direction. just needs more road courses

Testing Ban: Looks like it'll be just like current F1; One team gets a remote advantage and no one else can catch up, then eventually it gets to point where entire manufacturers start sucking (for real this time)

Reduced HP: Aw, Dayum. That is all.

 

[MustangRyan]

The reduction in power means they are basically just driving Nationwide series cars. Are the Xfinity cars going to also lose power?

 

[Jahgee]

Michael Waltrip has made it to the next week of Dancing With the Stars

 

[Gerarghini]

Irrelevant somewhat, but I've been playing NASCAR manager and look who made it to the final round and who didn't.

Ambrose I recall had his win at the Glen and the pole there, but Biffle had a more stronger season.

 

[GTPorsche]

The reduction in power means they are basically just driving Nationwide series cars. Are the Xfinity cars going to also lose power?

They would have to drop to about 600hp. There's no way they'd leave them at the same power output as the Cup cars next year.

 

[CodeRedR51]

Don't know if anyone is aware of it, but NASCAR has recently started uploading full length races on their youtube channel.

News link:

http://www.nascar.com/en_us/news-me...youtube-team-up-full-length-race-replays.html

 

[GTPorsche]

Looking at some of the new rules...

Roller valve lifters to replace flat valve lifter
Lower rear differential gear ratios targeting 9,000 RPM

Those two should improve engine efficiency and lifespan.

Minimum vehicle weight drops 50 lbs. via ballast reduction (2014 weight: 3,300 w/o driver)

Lighter is better, even if it's only a small percentage drop.

Rain tires on road courses, similar to rules in place for the NASCAR XFINITY Series and NASCAR Camping World Truck Series; mandatory wipers, defogger and rear flashing rain light installed for the event weekend

About damn time.... If the Whelen Euro Series can run a race in the rain at Tours Speedway, NASCAR should be able to do the same at Martinsville as it's flat enough, maybe even flatter than Tours. That's asking too much though....

 

[meek]

View attachment 229230

ETX produced another gem I see! (Gilliland 10 wins )

Power reduced from 850 HP to 725 HP

I don't like that, we're gonna have some 4 hours races, the Coca Cola 600's gonna last 5... I do hope it brings better racing.

Tandems back at plate races?

They would have to drop to about 600hp. There's no way they'd leave them at the same power output as the Cup cars next year.

or they will leave them the same, and then there's a real point in Xfinity as a development and better talent estimation (looking at you, Stenhouse, Biffle, Dale Jr, etc...) Series.
Races will remain shorter.

According to this, they'll still be a bit lighter (by 50lb) with less (50-75) HP and a shorter (105 to 110") wheelbase than new Cup cars.

If the Whelen Euro Series can run a race in the rain at Tours Speedway, NASCAR should be able to do the same at Martinsville as it's flat enough, maybe even flatter than Tours. That's asking too much though....

Martinsville 12° in turns
Tours 10.5° in turns 1-2, 9° in turns 3-4
http://hometracks.nascar.com/NWES_new-tours-speedway-ready-to-roll

Agreed though, they could be running at Martinsville in the rain, and maybe Richmond (14° in turns, .75mi) and Loudon (12° turns, 1.058mi), too.

 

[cnd01]

Rain tires are a great idea! Now all we need are more road courses

 

[Gerarghini]

ETX produced another gem I see! (Gilliland 10 wins ).

I choose Gilliland to crew chief over and it doesn't matter who you choose as it's stupid easy to gain wins if you're patient enough.

Plus it doesn't hurt that I made him OP as hell